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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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I mean, assuming the only issue is the title, I'd imagine the ESRB wouldn't care too much about the content.

But in the end, the whole thing's stupid. America not liking M-rated titles didn't stop Nintendo from adding the Mii Costumes, and it won't stop them from adding a fighter.
Agreed. the content itself won't matter and the whole thing is pretty silly as a concept. I was just wondering if a name drop for the later titles would matter or if it's just the logo. It's hard to imagine Sakurai talking about the Izuna Drop without name dropping some of the newer stuff.
 

Hydreigonfan01

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It would overall lessen Smash as a crossover by putting all the focus straight on Ryu himself rather than the Ninja Gaiden franchise. I honestly think that they'll just go for a tamer Koei Tecmo IP.
Riley just stop being pessimistic, everytime you keep on saying "This fighter will never get in due to such and such" and that's all you do.
 

N3ON

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I feel like some of these arguments are pretty forced.

"If they use the old logo they won't be able to represent the newer games"
.... since when has that been a thing? The logo is the sticking point, the moveset has freedom to operate within the confines of the game like normal.

"It would be awkward if a character used moves from a game that the logo didn't represent".
I think it would be more awkward to unnecessarily trim established parts of a character simply to fit a logo. Mario has the FLUDD but the Super Mario logo isn't the one they used for Sunshine.

"Smash Bros x character isn't as hype as Smash Bros x series".
Perhaps not, but it's not worth losing the character over.

"How do they promote a character with these ESRB restrictions?"
It's not a logo and another series' gameplay that drives Smash promotion, it's the trailer and the character themselves. Use the character name loophole if need be, and refrain from showing gameplay from the home series.
 
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RileyXY1

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I'm taking that risk. I know there aren't any patterns but going for it anyway.

2019: Banjo
2020: Steve
2021: Master Chief

Also factoring in the relationship Nintendo and Microsoft have.
I don't know if Microsoft would want to put their biggest icon on the Switch without Nintendo putting their biggest icons on the XBox.
 

Goombaic

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So what's everyone's current predictions?

Mine are

78: Ryu Hayabusa
79: Cinderace
80: Master Chief
81: Rex
I still think Hayabusa, Toxtricity, and a BotW 2 character (likely Zelda at this point) are for sure getting in. As for the 4th character, I'm not sure at this point. I guess I'll have Sylux as my top guess, but the more time that goes by, the less I'm sure he's getting in. I thought Travis was going to be one of the first fighters in this pass but that didn't turn out so well. Lloyd/Tales of in general was one of my other initial predictions but I think all of the missing Mii costumes are going to be returning at this point.
 

RileyXY1

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I just think that we are gonna be getting Ryza instead, and Ryu Hayabusa will be just a Mii Fighter costume.
 

Shroob

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I thought you said this pass was going to skew younger than FP1. Ryza is much more in line with the FP1 picks than the likes of Min Min and Steve.
Eh, tbh, as someone who's been watching a friend of a friend play Ryza, this game is disgustingly wholesome.


Boring, but wholesome.
 

PacificFun

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Real talk though, I've given up trying to figure out how Smash operates with its character choices lol. The game always seems to end up surprising me in some way or another.
Same, I'm going back to just rooting for MWs
20200930_194057.jpg

I haven't had this mentality since Hero was announced. The Travis costume was the nail in the coffin.
 
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N3ON

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Eh, tbh, as someone who's been watching a friend of a friend play Ryza, this game is disgustingly wholesome.


Boring, but wholesome.
Frankly that's neither here nor there, if we're talking about to whom the choices will skew, it's about the target demographic of the series.

And I think you're going to get more overlap between Persona or Dragon Quest or Fire Emblem and Atelier than you would ARMS or Minecraft.
 
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"It would be awkward if a character used moves from a game that the logo didn't represent".
I think it would be more awkward to unnecessarily trim established parts of a character simply to fit a logo. Mario has the FLUDD but the Super Mario logo isn't the one they used for Sunshine.
My thought with this was never about how the character was implemented into the game, just how the presentation would turn out. Changing the logo might not be enough to keep the rating down on the presentation, depending on how strict the guidelines are.

Of course it wouldn't affect the moveset itself. That wasn't even the point.

Edit: I just don't exactly know how the ESRB thing works, so I was speculating as to whether naming the title is the thing that brings the rating up or if it's specifically the logo. It would be really difficult to keep a Ryu Hayabusa presentation at E10+ if naming the newer trilogy in any form would bring the rating up.
 
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MooMew64

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Eh, tbh, as someone who's been watching a friend of a friend play Ryza, this game is disgustingly wholesome.


Boring, but wholesome.
I really gotta try the series out at some point. Wholesome content is like, my #1 favorite thing, lol.

Anyways, Ryu would be neat but not gonna lie, kind of rooting for Ryza 'cause the game's main character is really heckin' cute.
 

Guybrush20X6

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Well the update drops next Saturday so we'll then be able to move on to the next stage of WTF Smash characters, the "I thought that direct was a fever dream but there it is on my screen." part.

I wonder what balance changes will come with it.
 

P.Kat

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Same, I'm going back to just rooting for MWs
View attachment 288255
I haven't had this mentality since Hero was announced. The Travis costume was the nail in the coffin.
Kat is definitely a character I'd love to see float into Smash. C'mon Sony, Microsoft got you beat 2-0 character wise step up your game.
 
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CureParfait

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Master Chief is the face of Microsoft and the XBox brand. It would be weird to have him on the Switch and not have Mario on the XBox.
I think Steve is currently the face of Microsoft given how much Minecraft's sales surpasses Halo's. Also Steve is more known than Master Chief with various of audiences.
 

RileyXY1

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I think Steve is currently the face of Microsoft given how much Minecraft's sales surpasses Halo's. Also Steve is more known than Master Chief with various of audiences.
Master Chief is still the mascot of Xbox, as Steve is multiplatform while Halo is Xbox-exclusive.
 

Sabrewulf238

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There's something I've been thinking about ever since we got the latest round of mii costumes....

I find it interesting (and also concerning) that we have four more dlc characters left....and we also have four third party mii costume items from Smash 4 that have yet to return. It seems like a trend now that every new round of mii costumes comes with a returning mii costume from Smash 4.

I guess technically it isn't four, but two of them are related to the Monster Hunter franchise...so it would be very surprising if they didn't show up together.

The mii costumes that have yet to return are: Chocobo Hat, Geno Hat & Costume, Lloyd Wig & Costume and the Monster Hunter mii costumes (Hunters Helm/Mail and Rathalos Helm/Mail)

So either the trend breaks (which to be fair, a trend breaking in regards to Smash wouldn't be unusual) and we get a new round of mii costumes without a returning costume (which would pretty much throw this whole idea out the window), the trend continues but the Monster Hunter costumes are brought back separately, meaning potentially one of the mii costumes is being upgraded (really it's Geno vs Lloyd here) OR the trend continues and the Monster Hunter costumes are released together. (which would mean all the remaining mii costumes mentioned above would return)

It does seem to line up fairly well. Though at the same time it could be argued that the idea that every single old third party mii costume will return could be wrong. Although I feel like it would be strange if the above mentioned mii costumes didn't return (unless it was for a good reason, like being made playable), considering so many of the other third party mii costumes have already returned.
 
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King Sonnn DeDeDoo

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The whole ESRB thing is less about the ingame content than it is used for the marketing videos.

For example Byleth's trailer gets E10+ through T rating due to the Three Houses logo in the video
e10plusT.PNG


But unless the DLC is doing something completely outlandish, its automatically assigned the ESRB rating of the base game.
esrb.PNG

Byleth didn't change the rating of the game, but by having the logo of a T rated game in their trailer made them have to mention the E10+ - T rating in the video. Nintendo probably doesn't want the "M rating" next to their smash trailer to avoid confusion. (Also sorry if this is an old argument haven't been on here in a bit)
 
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SKX31

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I thought you said this pass was going to skew younger than FP1. Ryza is much more in line with the FP1 picks than the likes of Min Min and Steve.
Hmm... for some reason that got me thinking about the alternate timeline where this Pass does skew younger than FP1:

FP6: Urshifu
FP7: Fall Guy
FP8: Kenau Reeves (Cyberpunk 2077)
FP9: FF XVI's main character
FP10: Everwild's main character
FP11: Pragmata's main character

Hoo boy that'd be a wild Pass. Includes a Capcom, S-E and Rare character too.

(Yes I'm using a lot of Sony / Microsoft stuff because Nintendo certainly won't show off their 2021 / 22 releases now.)

Well the update drops next Saturday so we'll then be able to move on to the next stage of WTF Smash characters, the "I thought that direct was a fever dream but there it is on my screen." part.

I wonder what balance changes will come with it.
It's going to be really difficult to predict before the patch drops (they did universally decrease projectiles' shield damage in 3.0 IIRC) but one thing they could do is to universally give characters a little better air speed or roll speed.

A number of characters are likely to get buffed, and there'll likely be further efforts to patch up the online as well as perhaps Minecraft blocks in stage builder.
 

N3ON

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My thought with this was never about how the character was implemented into the game, just how the presentation would turn out. Changing the logo might not be enough to keep the rating down on the presentation, depending on how strict the guidelines are.

Of course it wouldn't affect the moveset itself. That wasn't even the point.
That could get a bit awkward if he pulls moves or music from newer games.


I think Steve is currently the face of Microsoft given how much Minecraft's sales surpasses Halo's. Also Steve is more known than Master Chief with various of audiences.
The face isn't just about what makes the most money, it's about who you position as representative of your brand. Minecraft has always mostly been treated by Microsoft as its own sort of entity.

Mickey Mouse is the face of Disney, but I bet you these days Marvel and Star Wars make more. Mario is the face of Nintendo, but Pokemon is a more lucrative franchise.

I agree that Master Chief is the face of the Xbox. That doesn't inherently mean he's their biggest property.
 

Megadoomer

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So what's everyone's current predictions?

Mine are

78: Ryu Hayabusa
79: Cinderace
80: Master Chief
81: Rex
In no particular order...
-Geno
-Ryu Hayabusa
-Dante (though it could be Monster Hunter instead)
-Bandanna Waddle Dee (or another Nintendo character - I just can't see the rest of FP2 being third party)
I just think that we are gonna be getting Ryza instead, and Ryu Hayabusa will be just a Mii Fighter costume.
I don't get this line of thinking. At least with a company like Microsoft, there's a variety of valid options. (Banjo having long-time Smash demand, Steve being the face of Microsoft's biggest franchise, Master Chief being the face of the Xbox) Here, Ryu Hayabusa seems to be the main one, if not the only one, given his extensive history.

I'm not super familiar with Koei Tecmo's franchises, but aside from Dynasty Warriors (which uses real people or licensed characters), their big franchise nowadays seems to be Dead Or Alive, which Ninja Gaiden also overlaps with.
 
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PacificFun

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Kat is definitely a character I'd love to see float into Smash. C'mon Sony, Microsoft got you beat 2-0 character wise step up your game.
I love Lara Croft but if Kat got in against all odds, I'd cry probably. Master Cheif, Kratos, Goku, Kiki the Witch and Bob the Builder are getting in before Kat ever does.
-aln1sg.jpg
 

Flyboy

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I just think that we are gonna be getting Ryza instead, and Ryu Hayabusa will be just a Mii Fighter costume.
While there are many Koei-Tecmo reps possible, the fact that an Atelier character would literally have the same crafting mechanic as Steve is a giant blow to the series' chances. Shame because it is a cute series with great music and I thoroughly enjoy Ryza.

With that said, KT also has:

Dynasty Warriors/Hyrule Warriors - Their biggest series and has a Nintendo-specific spinoff with beloved characters from a popular IP in Zelda. Someone like Lu Bu would bring unusual and interesting mechanics to Smash.

Dead or Alive - A popular 3D fighting game that is still getting new games. Kasumi has a possible shot.

Nioh - Recent hit, and getting a sequel. Outside shot, but worth mentioning.

Fatal Frame - Maiden of Black Water got an AT and spirits and was a Nintendo game. We don't have a horror franchise in Smash. If Monster Hunter is back in the mix, so is Fatal Frame.

There is of course Ninja Gaiden and Ryu Hayabusa, and honestly after seeing Steve I think Hayabusa would be awesome - imagine the million-IQ plays we could see from a Steve vs. Hayabusa match, with Hayabusa able to scale the block walls!
 

Sestetz

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I feel like it's a guarantee Capcom will get another pick given their positive relationship with Nintendo. Personally I want Dante more but a character from Monster Hunter screams being more likely to me given all the releases its getting on the switch + it's already received plenty of content from nintendo via crossovers in the MH games and on Dragalia Lost.

Like as much as a lot of us want Dante all he really has going is Bayonetta already being featured in Smash, so they could most definitely limit the maturity. I can't really imagine us getting two capcom reps in this final 4 so the scale to me is leaning on a Monster Hunter being added to fight the Rathalos we already have in the game
 
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