New Sonic Video "Project"

[Espy Rose]

I'm going to be as blunt as possible.

I'm heavily considering making a tutorial/instructional video on all that is Sonic in Brawl. If you've ever seen the Advanced How to Play Video for SSBM, then you may see how I want this Sonic video to run.

Youtube's 10 Minutes limit shouldn't be a bother either, as we can simply separate the different sections of the overall tutorial video.

However, this is where you, the Sonic Boards community, can help me. Before this can even begin, we need to set up a list of what needs to be discussed.

Might as well start now. This video will only improve in quality if you guys help me and take part in this video's creations.

I wish to separate the video into 2 key parts, all which can be further split when need be:

1. Basics
-Quick showing of all of Sonic's moves, their properties, and how they function.
-SideB/DownB discussed.

2. Advanced
-Ground Movement (Dashing and Walking)
-Air Movement (Spinshotting, etc)

This is all I've had time to work on so far, and of course, it needs loads more work. Not only that, but what I've jotted down so far goes so deep on its own that it becomes absurd (Showcasing all of Sonic's general attacks alone will be quite the living hell, lol). However, I really want this to come to, and I'm hoping that you guys in the Sonic community can help make this happen.

All I need is the community's input on what should be in this video. Also, if people are willing to, to record themselves doing some of the more advanced abilities. I can also provide footage, but I'd like for others to try to contribute as well.

Oh, and perhaps even some in-match applications of certain moves would be a nice touch.

And to clarify:

The goal of this Sonic Tutorial Video is to teach up and coming Sonic players as much as possible about the ins and outs of the character, as well as to log the current forward progress we have made with Sonic as a community.

 

[infomon]

Oh yay!! So you're reviving and taking over this:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=206174

That's great news. I got busy and dropped off the face of vid-making, basically.

I'd like to help out in any way I can. I'd started at one point collecting vids along with the times at which something interesting happens that indicates some part of Sonic's gameplay; either minor or hardcore. I'll prolly post those here, even if they're prolly just links to youtube videos.

 

[Espy Rose]

Oh yay!! So you're reviving and taking over this:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=206174

That's great news. I got busy and dropped off the face of vid-making, basically.

I'd like to help out in any way I can. I'd started at one point collecting vids along with the times at which something interesting happens that indicates some part of Sonic's gameplay; either minor or hardcore. I'll prolly post those here, even if they're prolly just links to youtube videos.

It's good that you've found that thread. It makes for a good outline on which we can build upon.

We definately need examples of these moves being applied ingame, but right now the biggest issue for me is getting footage of just having Sonic executing the moves.

 

[infomon]

Oh, well I can prolly help with that.

Do you want like, just a vid with sonic using his jabs, tilts, etc. vs a CPU (set to human-control, so no DI) metaknight, showing something close to max-reach of the moves?

orrrr.... something more in-game, like to demonstrate setups and stuff?

I can post reasonable-quality vids of stuff online somewhere for you

 

[Blapius]

I will also offer to lend my Wii and video capturing capabilities to the needs of this project. Infzy's other post outlines a lot of essential components to this project, but I will add any additional necessities if I can think of some tomorrow.

Now tell me how to foxtrot pivot.

 

[infomon]

Now tell me how to foxtrot pivot.

From a foxtrot if you tap forward, you start an initial-dash forward; and an initial-dash can be instant pivoted (dash-dance). You can also F-smash and other stuff out of an initial-dash, which means you can effectively Fsmash right out of foxtrot if you're fast enough with the control-stick.

The foxtrot ("grind") seems really limiting if you don't realize it has numerous tricks which makes it about as powerful as a full-run / screech-stop. It's just more tech skill.

 

[JayBee]

mindgames: we need to explain the reasons that sonic can exploit the aspect of brawl that involves tricking your opponents. whether it be because of his similar moves, the cancels, the dashes...


talk about his edgegaurding game, his main focus on offense, and his primary defensive measures.

I think maybe u can add my 7 playstyles guide to this. its been up for so long, and it seems like its something the sonic boards believe is a solid indicator of how to measure advanced sonics.


His best moves:

His Worst moves:

What not to do:

...

idk what else right now. but we should also promote coming to the sonic boards for additional info that may not be put in the vids for whatever the reason... steak...

 

[infomon]

ergh Sonic... in a 10minute video I was barely able to explain the mechanics of side-B and down-B, lol. In fact, I wasn't even able to; my vid left out so much stuff, and was misleading on a few delicate aspects simply because I was short on time.

I'm going to be making a vid explaining where/how the spindash jump data works, so that ppl stop SD'ing all the freaking time. But I think the vid will be about 3-minutes in length just to do that.

My point is, Sonic has a lot of silly little aspects that need exploration. We've got a number of vids already created which target particular aspects; like Anthinus' vid about Dair's properties, Sonic's super-roll and SDP shieldgrab, etc. It might be best if we know how to separate these "AT" / move-property vids from a more descriptive "how 2 sonic" vid.

idk. It's a fine line, I guess.

 

[Anthinus]

I think infzy hit in the spot... There is too much stuff to talk about. The best way to do things here is metioning (or ignoring) the things less important and detailing the really relevant things. If we don't, probably we'll don't get the goal Puffball wants to reach: Teach people how to Sonic in a competitive way. There are 10 mins, so I think we have to distribute them very well before using the editing program. *Or we can make various tuts... O.o*

I'll try to make a little example of a plan before editing:

-Tut presentation (0:25)
-Ground Movement (0:05)
---Walking (mention) (0:10)
---Running *turnaround animation stuff, screech* (0:35)
-Grounded Attacks (0:05)
---Dtilt *IASA* (0:15)
---Ftilt *spacing, multihit* (0:15)
---Utilt *mention/ignore* (0:05)
---FSmash *stutter step, turnaround, etc* (0:30)
---USmash *Boosting stuff* (0:20)
---Dsmash *mention multihit, killing potencial* (0:05)
-Air Attacks (0:05)
---Fair *sweetspot, mix in combo, gimping, SH* (0:20)
---Dair *gimping potencial, used to fall fast* (0:20)
---Nair *metion* (0:05)
---Bair *range, priority, lag cancel, killing potencial* (0:20)
-Special Moves: (0:05)
---Spin Charge/Dash *How to use, unique characteristics *(0:30)
---Spin Roll *SRJ and its combo properties, VSRJ (mention)* (0:15)
---Uses *SDC, ASC, ASC Cancel* (0:30)
---HA *metion stuff quickly* (0:15)
---Spring *overall explain, increase distance, gimping, barrier, grounded spring* (0:30)
*Tut continues*...
...
...
...

Using that you'll have an estimate time for each section of the vid giving you order and saves you TONS of work (imagine you are editing this and when you are about begin the special moves part you have a 7 mins used already... You'll have to go back and quit stuff, clean and think how to make things fit properly. A real pain). People will learn easier if you only detail the most important stuff. The irrelevant stuff let them to explore it and realize why isn't so important.

In the EXAMPLE above I have an approximate time of 6:05 mins and lets say I ended using 6:55... There is a lot of time left to talk about SS, ATs, estrategies. Think about it guys, this method is good. We just have to detail what we want in and how much time we will use to explain it in the tut...

 

[infomon]

Hmmmmm... maybe we want to distinguish between:

how things work (short explanation videos; spinshots, Dair, invincible airdashes, Usmash invincy frames, spindash jump-data, etc.)

why to do things (when to use what moves in what situations; approaches, fakeouts, playstyle issues, different types of matchups, etc.)

Just a thought tho. I think puffy's idea was to emphasize the latter, but with explaining some of the former as need be?

One approach would be to make a video explanation of ROOOOY's moveset thread, but I think a lot of that would be long and needless.

 

[Boxob.]

I don't see how we'd be able to help, but if you find a way, you let me know.

Cause I can't list all the crap we know as sonic players, I kinda just play.

 

[Jim Morrison]

I learnt here how to SDSC, ASC, spinshot, apply some moves, when to side-b/when to down-b, how to recover and how to bair.

That's a start.

 

[Trillion]

it might have been mentioned and im being too lazy too go through all the responses, but make sure to include a lot of options that spin shot can lead into. if you need any input on that, I'm sure CiTH and Boxob will be only too eager to help lol. I think this is important because it seriously is an amazing technique with so many options.

 

[thecatinthehat]

There should be a section that teaches ppl how to counter d-tilt.

 

[JayBee]

hey, if you'd like a cool audio voice over, i think i can help.

 

[thecatinthehat]

Only if you sound like SamPanda, Kojin.

^_^

 

[JayBee]

i can sound like a movie announcer guy. everything in the vid will sound epic.

"In a world of Smash, you must fight to survive..."


btw, I own that phrase. i made it up. its MINE.

 

[Teran]

"In a world of Smash, you must fight to survive..."

"...many paths will lead to deception, and pain. But for those that take away your Steak, and betray you, their Day of Reckoning... will come."

 

[Espy Rose]

Kojin, that'd actually be pretty cool.

Of course, I'll still have small text explanations here and there (unless your voice is REALLY good), but having someone talking rather than taking time having text on screen would give us more time to do other things overall.

 

[Jim Morrison]

you could talk while having the vid running.
*shows bair*
Now back air is a good move for spacing blablabla.

 

[JayBee]

If i can, i'll get you a sample of my voice so u be the judge.
continuing the line...

"However, those who walk the path of True Steak, will find enlightenment..."

or something like that.

wow that was bad...

 

[AquaTech]

I can't help make it in any way, but this sounds like a really cool idea.

Although be sure to consider your audience. If this is aimed at up and coming Sonic players, a 30 minute video tutorial might be a little much. I would try to keep it under 15 minutes if I were you.

 

[JayBee]

they are trying to make it 10. good f'in luck...

 

[Super_Sonic8677]

I think to be realistic," Basics" and "advanced" will need to be two parts each. There's just too much stuff.

 

[Anthinus]

Kojin, that'd actually be pretty cool.

Of course, I'll still have small text explanations here and there (unless your voice is REALLY good), but having someone talking rather than taking time having text on screen would give us more time to do other things overall.

You can put voice and text together without wasting time. That way will look better and will be easier to understand IMO.

they are trying to make it 10. good f'in luck...

It's hard but I think they'll can cover the most relevant stuff in that time.

BTW, If you need something from me Puffball, just let me know. I'll be glad to help you. If you need dair stuff I have mountains of steak.

 

[Espy Rose]

Actually Anthinus, I feel like you could be a good help with the outlining of the video. The style in which you did it looked to be quite effective in and of itself.

I think to be realistic," Basics" and "advanced" will need to be two parts each. There's just too much stuff.

This is actually something I was considering. 10 Minutes explaining the Basics and 10 for Advanced might actually be plausible.

As I said, the 10 minute limit of youtube shouldn't be a hindrance.
Actually, I want to also make a Rapidshare version alongside the youtube one for download.

However, for the sake of the youtube version, we should continue to focus on the 10 minute limit when it comes to each segment.

But again, the 10 minute thing is no big deal if we split it into sections.

-----

BTW, this is all outlining shiz. At most, I'll only be focusing on outlines and the like until the WDS is over. Then I'll put my full focus on this project.

---

PS: Those willing to help me:

-It would be nice if you had some sort of messager (preferebly YIM), or Skype. I'd actually implore those who wish to help to get Skype if possible, so when production actually starts, we can exchange information at a much faster speed.

Even so, the Xat chat could also definately be a possibility.

 

[Camalange]

I like this idea, but I am definitley for the vote of a "Basic" and "Advanced" guide. I don't know how I can help, but I'm hear if you need meh ;o

 

[Blapius]

From a foxtrot if you tap forward, you start an initial-dash forward; and an initial-dash can be instant pivoted (dash-dance). You can also F-smash and other stuff out of an initial-dash, which means you can effectively Fsmash right out of foxtrot if you're fast enough with the control-stick.

The foxtrot ("grind") seems really limiting if you don't realize it has numerous tricks which makes it about as powerful as a full-run / screech-stop. It's just more tech skill.

Well, don't I feel foolish. Thanks for the info, infzy.

Also, I am wondering if a lot of footage from videos such as infzy's Side/Down B video or SonicOrochi's Lightspeed Guide could be reused for this project. There's a ton of "tutorial" footage already out there of good quality, so why not utilize it? Even if not using the same footage, we can at least model ours after existing pieces.

I also think that three 10-minute installments are not out of the question. A half-hour to learn almost all there is to know about the mechanics of a character doesn't seem a lot to ask, personally.

1. Basic Moveset (A/B Button, Grabs, Aerials; discuss hit-boxes/hurt-boxes and frames)
2. Properties (Movement of all kinds, Spacing, Spin Cancels, Avoiding lag on Aerials, etc.)
3. Advanced (All the acronyms in the book, Spinshots, etc.)

I think there is enough information in each of those categories to easily fill 10 minute blocks without being redundant or boring. And if we're going for thoroughness, we shouldn't limit ourselves needlessly. If someone doesn't have the patience to sit down, spend 30 minutes, and miss "According to Jim," then I'm sorry, they don't deserve to learn Sonic.

 

[Sagen du Smash]

Oh Espy please PLEASE make this. I love Sonic in Brawl and I want to improve my skills. I'm talking offline of course (Sonic on Wifi is BLERGHHH HARD TO PLAY AS...)