New OOS Options on Platforms with Shielddropping

[dashdancedan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZEGAflZ-U4&t=13m31s

 

[Brookman]

mango is ******** good x 3000

 

[Metameme]

Dash Dance Dan! I remember you from gunz! Like 2 years ago lol on DR or Trinity?

 

[dashdancedan]

Yeah, I played on DR lol

 

[Pi]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dan1Kplweo8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvKMEVu0mhU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLu5972oPZc

[collapse=info]
pressing shield on the 4th frame will result in the shield coming out on frame 5

cannot input dash the opposite way until frame 4 of your initial dash (wont' dash if inputted sooner)

cannot turn sooner than frame 5

turn lasts for 1 frame before dashing in opposite direction

the smoke of the dash comes out on frame 4

cannot shield during turn animation, can buffer it during turn animation

if you shield and hold a direction on the dash frame directly after the turn frame, or if you inputted and held them durning the turn frame, you will buffer a roll

you must wait for 1 dash frame to pass before you can input your shield & direction

rolls buffer for 3 frames from when you input the direction

this applies to your initial dash.

subsequent dashes, IE dash dancing, or pivoting require you to be dashing for 1 frame before shielding, otherwise a roll will be buffered if you continue to hold the direction

you can however, input a direction, then shield on the next frame if you have allowed the control stick to reset to neutral

spot dodges also buffer for 3 frames

you cannot shield drop sooner than the 5th frame of any given dash, initial or subsequent

inputting shield before frame 4 will result in a roll or a spot dodge
inputting the shield drop on frame 4, frame 5 will be wait, and frame 6 will be 'pass', you're free to do whatever after this

cannot shield drop out of shieldhitstun, or hitlag

must pass through the threshold for shield dropping coming from above
this means no going from angled shield down into shield drop

can input shield drop, just the diagnal input, no more than 5 frames before you're out of shieldhitstun, can be inputted in shieldhitlag, and shieldhitstun

if you input sooner than 5 frames before you're out of hitstun, nothing will happen

buffering rolls/spot dodges applies, so there is only a 2 frame window to 'buffer' a shield drop in this fashion

if you are not angling your shield horizontally, you can re-adjust to the horizontal position to start your shield drop, as long as you do so 3 frames before shieldhitstun ends

so for example, if mario fsmashes your shield, you go through 9 frames of shieldhitlag, then 10 frames of shieldhitstun. So 19 frames total of being stuck in your shield

if you were in neutral position, you need to press right or left before frame 16, otherwise it will buffer a roll,

if you want to buffer the shield drop, you'll have to have your control stick positioned horizontally by frame 14-16, then on frame 15 you have it in the shield drop angle, that will buffer, and is the soonest you could start buffering

someone else can double check all this and correct me but this all i got so hf[/collapse]

 

[KirbyKaze]

I like that you explain how to do it with a supplementary video on input. Not just "look at what I can do!"

Makes it way more accessible.

Imma start practicing.

 

[Pi]

bump .

 

[Bones0]

u mirin'?

Yeah... u mirin'.


Also, dashing into shield is easy mode. Don't cop out and go around pretending you can shield drop for real.

 

[dashdancedan]

I am bumping this for new info in the first post.

 

[TheGoat]

How do you get those hitboxes to show? Just a debug menu?

 

[dashdancedan]

Debug menu -> change "master" to "develop" -> in game hit R + right on the dpad

 

[oukd]

nice...i guess this means you really need to have your controller ridges properly angled for consistent drops.

lol reading rockcrock's quote. ive been shielddrop shining more than jumpshining nowadays and it feels op as ****. i just need to start applying shai drops...

also with peach, shielddrop fc aerial is faster than float oos fc aerial by a good margin. you even land back on the platform lol

also mdva has the highest concentration of consistent shielddroppers i swear

 

[AXE 09]

V3ctorman is the best at shield dropping. Absolutely incredible

 

[Wake]

Nah, I'm the best at it.

 

[thespymachine]

Yoshi: no shield stun + shield drop = awesome

 

[Superspright]

Hey guys...I've been saying this for a while: THE SHIELDDROP HAS THE SAME TIMING AS CROUCHING ON A PLATFORM WITHOUT FALLING THROUGH.

Much easier to figure it out if you're not spot-dodging for an hour. Try to crouch as fast as you can on a platform without falling through. Once you can do that at least 10-15 times in a row without falling through try shielddropping. It is VERY easy now, isn't it?

Also, you can use 45 degree angles for shielddrop. You just can't go all the way to the edges.

 

[onionchowder]

More Info 01/21/2013
On a 0 - 255 scale, 128 being in the middle, 0 on the bottom and left and 255 on the top and right, Shield dropping works in the vertical range from 75 - 73 and in the horizontal range from 75 - 73 and 182 - 180. You have a 1 - 5 frame window to move from (vertical ranges) 128 - 106 to 75 - 73 in order to shield drop. Any slower and from any lower ranges (e.g. 100 -> 74) and you will just move your shield down. This means you have a 5 frame buffer window to shield drop. So in other words, you can do the shield drop input 5 frames before the end of shieldstun and you will drop on the soonest possible frame of being out of shieldstun.

As a reference, the lower corner ridges of your control stick are at 61 (down), 54 (left) and 199 (right)

Can someone explain that bolded bit to me?

 

[dashdancedan]

I accidentally two post

 

[dashdancedan]

On a 0 - 255 scale, 128 being in the middle, 0 on the bottom and left and 255 on the top and right

and by ridges, I mean these

The corner of your controller where it stops moving if you push it there.

 

[Bones0]

I feel awesome because I correctly deduced that you shield drop at the bottom ridges, and I also predicted that shield drops had a 3-frame buffer (so I was off by 2 frames).

Also, pretty much everything superspright said was wrong, so ignore that.

 

[dashdancedan]

Actually you don't shield drop at the bottom ridges. The bottom ridges are actually lower than the point where you want to do the input. The ridges are at 61 and the shield drop range is 75 - 73.

 

[rjgbadger]

i literally just started practicing shield drops tonight

mad easy, feels a similar angle to fox's firefox regrab but you know, dowwn

 

[Hax]

shield dropping will be big in 2013

 

[Bones0]

Actually you don't shield drop at the bottom ridges. The bottom ridges are actually lower than the point where you want to do the input. The ridges are at 61 and the shield drop range is 75 - 73.

Not to disagree with the guy using AR, but are you sure? I tested this before, and I just tested again to be sure. I can shield drop without my stick going past the bottom-left and bottom-right ridges. Only way I'm wrong is if my stick is not only accidentally going past the ridge, but going past it by 12 degrees. How big of an error is 12 degrees on the stick? Are you testing this with the stick all the way pressed against the ridges? Because that's how I'm doing it.

shield dropping will be big in 2013

Pretty sure if your Falcon gets any faster by adding in shield dropping you'll break the sound barrier.

 

[KrIsP!]

Shield drop knee, shield drop rest, dd shai drop falco dair. Could be a big momentum shift in the game. Or just be sweet to watch random knees.

 

[PB&J]

Rock Crock is the best @ Shield dropping.

I have been practicing with icies with shield dropping and it is pretty cool.

 

[TheCrimsonBlur]

I've been seeing more and more players implement shield dropping

At APEX I was surprised how many random ppl knew how to do it

 

[dashdancedan]

Not to disagree with the guy using AR, but are you sure? I tested this before, and I just tested again to be sure. I can shield drop without my stick going past the bottom-left and bottom-right ridges. Only way I'm wrong is if my stick is not only accidentally going past the ridge, but going past it by 12 degrees. How big of an error is 12 degrees on the stick? Are you testing this with the stick all the way pressed against the ridges? Because that's how I'm doing it.

The way I tested it was:

Frame 1: Shield up, stick in neutral position
Frame 2: Shield up, stick at x position

When x was at <73, fox sidestepped, when x was at 75-73, fox shielddropped, and when x was at >73 the shield would just move down, no shielddrop. I tested it again using different starting shield positions and frame differences between inputs.

True you may be able to functionally shielddrop by going straight to the ridges in your hand motion, but that's only because in that 5 frame window you would have had to move from whatever acceptable neutral shield position to the 75-73 range. If you were to go from neutral to the ridges before the end of that 5 frame window without having being in the 75-73 range for at least 1 frame, you would most definitely not shielddrop.

 

[KrazyKnux]

Psh, everyone knows how to shield drop and claims they're good at it. Don't believe the hype, no one actually makes good use of shield dropping except Axe and V3ctorman despite it being the most useful underused techniques.

Needless to say, I'm good at shield dropping and actually apply it

Maybe this will get Kage The Bull's attention, and he'll learn to shield drop for once.

 

[PB&J]

Rock Crock,Gatzhu, and Wizzy make good use of shield dropping. You should watch them play sometime. I barely apply it but im going to keep practicing it over and over.

 

[rjgbadger]

yeah i defs cant use it yet in matches but its mad easy to perform. is the main perk from shield-dropping just being able to fall through a platform while dashing, on top of it being 2 frames faster?

 

[KrazyKnux]

Falling through while dashing is definitely really useful. The fact that it's 2 frames faster is cool in theory I guess, but I can't imagine the 2 frame advantage is really all that useful (maybe for float cancels OoS or something obscure. Could anyone with more theory elaborate?)

Imo, the real advantage comes from just being able to drop through while shielding, which the opportunity arises fairly often. In Marth vs. Fox matches, when the Fox is on the platform and the Marth is below, I often see Marth repeatedly utilt a shielding Fox. But the utilt has enough lag that the Fox can just shield drop through and dair/bair and start his own comboing. Changing from getting pressured to pressuring is really awesome. That's just one example but you can probably watch any match and say "he should have shield dropped ______ there."

 

[rjgbadger]

shield drop landing uair is pretty fly too ive been practicing that on a dummy to start uair chains (fox)

also for falco its really cool to shield-drop and shine and wavedash back on the platform and full hop bair

 

[dashdancedan]

Hey I found a new method of shield dropping where you don't need to tap down to the exact shield drop zone

Method 1
Frame 1: Neutral (or above neutral) stick position
[any amount of frames with no movement]
Frame 2 - 5: Stick in shield drop position

Method 2
Frame 1: Neutral (or above neutral) stick position
[any amount of frames with no movement]
Frame 2: Stick slightly above shield drop position
Frame 5 - 7: Stick past (lower) shield drop position, can be all the way at the bottom.

Method 2 is probably what people who do a quarter-circle motion are doing

 

[WHA?]

Dammit, i have a controller that i can shieldrop easy peasy no problem with, but i cant do reverse b moves (like reverse needles cancels)

Didint know the controllers are picky on this. Also on some controllers its easier to shieldrop on one side than other sides.

 

[SAUS]

Shield dropping is looking more and more important. As a Link main, it may give me some actual OOS options. Thank you, everyone, for posting the details on how to do shield drops :D