squirrels4ev
Smash Apprentice
https://m.reddit.com/r/smashbros/co...hilles/?utm_source=mweb_redirect&compact=true
While the ability to catch items during FallSpecial or airdodge isn't new I don't think the majority of players that don't main Peach/Link/YL knew about this so it's more like a public reveal. The juicy bits in here are that we now have access to item catch boxes for all characters and can see the size of the bomb's box. If we look at the bomb's catch box compared to it's hitbox below, we can see that the safest places to catch a bomb appear to be from above and below the bomb, and that it is hardest to catch a bomb coming directly at you. While this is what appears to be the case, if we look at the actual cast's item catch boxes, we can see that aiming for the head is usually the ideal, and that some characters have a harder time catching items than others.
I took a look at the top 8 characters, as well as Ganon, Samus, Luigi, and Link, and grouped them into tiers based on 3 criteria. First, the ability to catch items thrown at the character from the front whilst the caharcter is standing. Second, the ability to catch items thrown from the front/above whilst the character is crouching. Lastly, I ranked how safe each character's head is during stand. I chose those mid tiers because they seem to be the most commonly seen ones, and I threw in Link for reference for people who are used to the feel of Link's catch boxes after maining him for so long.
Standing (ability to catch items)
Top: Peach, Sheik, Marth, Link (accounting for Hylian Shield's unique collision box)
Mid: Falcon, Ganon, Link (not accounting for Hylian Shield), Samus
Bottom: Fox, Falco, ICs, Luigi, Puff
Crouching
Top: Sheik, Marth, Puff
Mid: Samus, Link (w/ or w/o Hylian Shield), Falcon, Peach, Ganon
Bottom: Luigi, ICs, Fox, Falco
Standing (safety of the head)
Top: Puff, ICs
Mid: Link, Falcon
Bottom: Samus, Fox, Sheik, Luigi, Peach, Marth, Falco
Terrible: Ganondorf
Something I found somewhat interesting was the size of Marth's crouching item grab box from behind. This box is actually large enough for Marth to viably run cancel at any point during his dashdance to attempt to catch an item and do so somewhat reliably if he is able to predict the item throw. Marth's item throw is so slow that most Marth players won't try to catch an item. Sheik's reverse crouching box is also good but not as good as Marth's. Both characters are more likely to shield and wavedash out than anything else, but I thought these facts were worth pointing out to the interested mind.
I think the most relevant thing I learned from these new item grab boxes is that If you ever catch a Fox or Falco blindly trying to CC you it's quite easy to hit them with bombs for free because their catch boxes are so bad even when crouching.
Comments or concerns? Would it be worthwhile to add more characters to this rough tier list or to take a closer look at the actual sizes of these boxes for a more accurate list? Let me know!
While the ability to catch items during FallSpecial or airdodge isn't new I don't think the majority of players that don't main Peach/Link/YL knew about this so it's more like a public reveal. The juicy bits in here are that we now have access to item catch boxes for all characters and can see the size of the bomb's box. If we look at the bomb's catch box compared to it's hitbox below, we can see that the safest places to catch a bomb appear to be from above and below the bomb, and that it is hardest to catch a bomb coming directly at you. While this is what appears to be the case, if we look at the actual cast's item catch boxes, we can see that aiming for the head is usually the ideal, and that some characters have a harder time catching items than others.
I took a look at the top 8 characters, as well as Ganon, Samus, Luigi, and Link, and grouped them into tiers based on 3 criteria. First, the ability to catch items thrown at the character from the front whilst the caharcter is standing. Second, the ability to catch items thrown from the front/above whilst the character is crouching. Lastly, I ranked how safe each character's head is during stand. I chose those mid tiers because they seem to be the most commonly seen ones, and I threw in Link for reference for people who are used to the feel of Link's catch boxes after maining him for so long.
Standing (ability to catch items)
Top: Peach, Sheik, Marth, Link (accounting for Hylian Shield's unique collision box)
Mid: Falcon, Ganon, Link (not accounting for Hylian Shield), Samus
Bottom: Fox, Falco, ICs, Luigi, Puff
Crouching
Top: Sheik, Marth, Puff
Mid: Samus, Link (w/ or w/o Hylian Shield), Falcon, Peach, Ganon
Bottom: Luigi, ICs, Fox, Falco
Standing (safety of the head)
Top: Puff, ICs
Mid: Link, Falcon
Bottom: Samus, Fox, Sheik, Luigi, Peach, Marth, Falco
Terrible: Ganondorf
Something I found somewhat interesting was the size of Marth's crouching item grab box from behind. This box is actually large enough for Marth to viably run cancel at any point during his dashdance to attempt to catch an item and do so somewhat reliably if he is able to predict the item throw. Marth's item throw is so slow that most Marth players won't try to catch an item. Sheik's reverse crouching box is also good but not as good as Marth's. Both characters are more likely to shield and wavedash out than anything else, but I thought these facts were worth pointing out to the interested mind.
I think the most relevant thing I learned from these new item grab boxes is that If you ever catch a Fox or Falco blindly trying to CC you it's quite easy to hit them with bombs for free because their catch boxes are so bad even when crouching.
Comments or concerns? Would it be worthwhile to add more characters to this rough tier list or to take a closer look at the actual sizes of these boxes for a more accurate list? Let me know!
