Ness's weak spot

Joined
Feb 21, 2015
Messages
523
Location
Long Island, NY
3DS FC
3282-4624-0341
NNID
Infinite901
#1
What's Ness's weakness? I have a friend that I can beat fairly easily unless he's Ness, and I just can't figure out what to exploit on him.
 

Signdog

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 16, 2015
Messages
20
Location
USA Ohio
#7
if he is going to pk thunder off stage to recover and you know hes about to throw it out you could jump just above him and you would take his pk thunder away, yeah you'll walk away with some percent but you'll also have a dead ness

if hes pk thundering to follow you around and try to hit you with it then just roll or air dodge away and punish him while he is still in the pk thunder animation
 

MeBoy

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 20, 2014
Messages
17
Location
Aurora, IL
#8
Jumping into his PKT while he's recovering is the best way to edgeguard Ness for a lot of characters. This can be dangerous if you don't know exactly when he is going to PKT, failing to predict his point of recovery can result in getting PKT2'd. Sometimes it's just better to dash dance on stage and punish him during the last 35 frames of PKT2 (Ness is invincible during the first 7 frames)

If you're playing a character with a counter (particularly Marth/Roy), I'd opt just countering his recovery. Countering PKT2 will kill Ness relatively early (so good w/ Roy) and it isn't very hard to land, especially if the Ness' recovery game is predictable.

If you can get the spacing down, you can counter his PKT2 with a disjoint and then go from there. Keep in mind his intangibility during the first 7 frames.

Once again, the safest way to punish his recovery is to just DD on stage and punish the lag time on his landing. You should always get the punish if they choose to recover onto stage/platform

If the Ness can sweetspot the ledge with PKT2, however, just let them. There's no sense edgeguarding a PKT2 sweetspot due to the invincibility frames and the potential PKT2 onto stage mix up if they've been sweetspotting. Sweetspotted Pkt2 gets Ness onto ledge for free
only time I'd opt to edgeguard a Pkt2 sweetspot is if they sweetspot from afar, which nobody ever does. Pretty difficult and Ness loses his invincibility frames once he gets to the ledge so it's not good (only time I use it is for a trivial mix up/woah reactions)
 

BuddyBooNW

Smash Rookie
Joined
May 30, 2015
Messages
10
#10
I don't like his weight. He is just floaty enough to combo like crazy with most other characters. I wish he was a tad more heavy.
 

Steak1ey

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Boulder, CO
3DS FC
2380-3765-3357
#12
Sure hope you're being sarcastic.
Nah I'm not. His recovery is more than viable. Partnered with sweetspot expertise and the invincibility frames at start, pkt2 is nothing to underlook. And if you have your double jump (don't lose it in the first place!) you're getting back on stage lol.
 

Psi Sig

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 15, 2014
Messages
262
Location
Poughkeepsie
#15
and what happens when they ledge hog? it's not hard to time, and you can only sweetspot from above or level with the ledge. Missing the ledge will give that 20 frame recovery. Not to mention any disjoint will wreck you, and they're are characters without one whose smash attacks will trade. Ness' is alright, but its far from good. Anyone who knows the match up will punish
 

DHD

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jun 24, 2015
Messages
44
#16
and what happens when they ledge hog? it's not hard to time, and you can only sweetspot from above or level with the ledge. Missing the ledge will give that 20 frame recovery. Not to mention any disjoint will wreck you, and they're are characters without one whose smash attacks will trade. Ness' is alright, but its far from good. Anyone who knows the match up will punish
Edge Cancel your PKT2 on a platform. You'd be surprised how quickly you can get away with a back-air after PKT2.
 

Steak1ey

Smash Cadet
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Boulder, CO
3DS FC
2380-3765-3357
#17
every recovery is punishable in the way you described psi. Ness has a lot of options for a tricky recovery, obviously if your opponent reads you you're gonna get got, but your options are no doubt there. Ness's recovery is not his struggle; it's definitely his range. Neutral against chars with good range is a difficult task.

Another weak point is floaties. He does not have much on floaties combo-wise, so you HAVE to play his hard neutral at all times. The only floaty I don't have too many problems with is Zelda, especially if she bases her game around Dins Fire (Magnet in, wavedash out, punish her if she tries to punish your magnet, super easy to react to)
 

gumbo100

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jun 9, 2015
Messages
5
#18
If Ness has to up-b from below ledge offstage Ness should be dead. It's incredibly easy to gimp him if he is rising from ledge height. The only exception to this would be on a stage with a wall Ness can grind up and sweet spot but this is incredibly hard and still punishable with some disjoint or a read. Also PKT2 isn't the only component to his up-b. You've gotta consider how easy it is to eat a PKT1 with a wellplaced needle, arrow, other projectile, or simply your character.
 
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