My Opinion?

Matador

Maybe Even...Utopian?
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#1
By the way, I think I should let you guys into my mind a little bit...

I stopped listening to purely negative, uninformed opinions of Mario back in like...'09. Smashers...ALL smashers are extremely fickle. Sonic was the 5th worst character in the game and "justifiably so" because you could just dtilt and he would be completely shut down. Now where is he? "Randoms" of the character beating the top players of Europe in a match-up he loses, apparently.

Where was Ike before San came around? Where is he now? Where would he be without San's results?

Look at Kirby. He was top of mid for a LONG time because of Chu and Chu alone. Chu quits, then he begins steadily dropping...Chu comes back for one tourney and now people are talking about him being legit again? GTFOutta here.

I believe in what Monk is saying with his thread. There is NO WAY anybody's getting anywhere without understanding that Mario is a limited character and there's some things that you won't be able to do like everyone else in the game. But this thing about what Mario CAN'T do and what match-ups CAN'T win? Nobody knows that. People used to say the same things about just about every character on the roster at one point or another. It only takes ONE person with the drive, resources, and time to make a difference with this character. Don't be discouraged by the opinions of others. Take them into account, but don't accept anything that any smasher says as irrefutable fact unless you can back it with your own experience and ideas.

There isn't a Mario out using the character to his full potential. The number of Marios on par with Boss's '08 Mario is very few, if any at the moment. I dunno why that's the case, but it clearly is. Until there is someone who can do that, Mario WILL NOT MOVE. Make that person you. Practice, study the game, study match-ups, play, lose, and learn from GOOD players. If you can't drive, learn to drive to get to where you need to go. If you have no job, get a job to deal with tourney expenses. That's what it'll take.

**** everything else. Seriously.
 

Coolwhip

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#3
I love this thread....This is something i always say to myself.
Thank you matador, you hit the nail on the head with this one.
 

Fuujin

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Double posting in ur threads.
#4
Okay all trolling aside (which is VERY rare, especially while I'm on the Mario boards)
I have to agreee with this thread.
I honestly think Mario has the tools to make it into mid tier, possibly just barely, but he doesn't feel as bad as everyone below him and he seems on par with like PT, Ness, maybe Sheik.

Flame needs to go to some USA tournaments.
 

Matador

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#5
What characters do you think Mario is better than?

:059:
I think he's at least on par with some of the characters in F. The absolute highest that I feel Mario could shoot for in the current metagame is ROB's. Right below that spot or that spot exactly.

Realistically, he could prolly go where Luigi is right now.
 

Cezz624

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#7
Really Matador, that really brought a tear into my eye. I agree with you that most Mario mains aren't using all of Mario's potential, including me. Mario is a balanced character, so Mario has to contently mix his game plan in order to keep your opponent from reading you easily. Maybe because I'm not as good as any of you other Mario mains, but for me, that is a really hard aspect about using Mario, changing your play style every minute and adapting to it very quickly before your opponent catches onto you. You really need to know your positives and negatives in the match up and really now how your opponents play style works.
 

Z'zgashi

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#8
Monk got it right when he said Mario is a balanced character in a game of broken characters. Mario is balanced, yes, but balanced isnt average in this game, its below average. Albeit, I think Mario has potential to leave Low Tier, I really dont see him doing it anytime soon, especially when the two characters who I DO think Mario has potential to pass (Ness and PT) have FOW and Reflex running around and repping them mad hard, when Mario doesnt have anyone doing anything of that caliber.
 
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#9
Thank you for understanding what I said kind sir


also...I'm going to to a write up about where I believe Mario stands in the future tier list...just to let you guys know I think he will be out of low tier...but it's not going to be as high as matador would like to think
 

Matador

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#11
Thank you for understanding what I said kind sir


also...I'm going to to a write up about where I believe Mario stands in the future tier list...just to let you guys know I think he will be out of low tier...but it's not going to be as high as matador would like to think
I mean...Mario is clearly a bad character compared to the cast as a whole. My opinion of where he's capable of going is obviously pretty optimistic...but at the very least, he can sit somewhere at the bottom of F.

Either way tho, it's speculation. My point is that it's hard to measure potential when barely anyone uses him at high level nowadays.
 

steep

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#12
What is everyone's opinion on playing Melee to get better at Brawl? I'm serious here. Boss has amazing reads and plays Melee, and M2K plays Melee, as well as a lot of other top level smashers. By forcing you to think/react faster, couldn't playing Melee help us play Brawl?
 

Matador

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#13
Not only melee, but plenty of other games can get you better at Brawl. I have no doubt in my mind that if Boss played SF, he'd be a tourney threat quick, just cuz he knows how to read people. Those skills transfer over.

Melee definitely, since it has so many similarities to Brawl. Just know what you're trying to improve upon.
 

ThatGuy

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#14
What is everyone's opinion on playing Melee to get better at Brawl? I'm serious here. Boss has amazing reads and plays Melee, and M2K plays Melee, as well as a lot of other top level smashers. By forcing you to think/react faster, couldn't playing Melee help us play Brawl?
It helps, a lot. Most of my smash career was founded off of Melee. Unfortunately, it takes a lot more time and dedication to get good at Melee than Brawl. I would say it would take about 6 months to a year of active play (tournaments, (bi-)weekly fests, techskill practice in a dark basement, research) for you to have any noticeable impact in your Brawl play. Playing other fighters will also help broaden your scope of thinking, however bear in mind that Smash is a very different kind of fighting game (Brawl moreso than Melee), and a lot of important mechanics in other fighters will not apply.
 

steep

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#20
Check, check, and check. I just have never played a game competitively before and I am working hard to catch up with people who have tons of competitive experience. I am practicing a lot and going to every tourney I can though. Also, I'm a trumpet performance major in college so as I go through life I definitely learn some humility lessons.
 

Gadiel_VaStar

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#22
I don't know about you guys. But you can count on me. I'll try to rep Mario again as best as I can.
Bo is amazing with Mario. Mario is a good character, not the best, but it really all comes down to beating the character and player behind them. Any character can do well. Mario--it's definitely a bigger hill to climb, but still possible due to his mixups and what not. He's still not one of the better characters, so if you're trying to get him to mid-tier...I wouldn't worry too much about that. I don't think it's going to happen, and also the most important thing is...IT's NOT IMPORTANT!!! Player skill > Character choice.
 

HeroMystic

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#23
There isn't a Mario out using the character to his full potential. The number of Marios on par with Boss's '08 Mario is very few, if any at the moment. I dunno why that's the case, but it clearly is. Until there is someone who can do that, Mario WILL NOT MOVE. Make that person you. Practice, study the game, study match-ups, play, lose, and learn from GOOD players. If you can't drive, learn to drive to get to where you need to go. If you have no job, get a job to deal with tourney expenses. That's what it'll take.

**** everything else. Seriously.
This is basically all anyone needs to read if they want to make Mario a better character.

I've clearly been negative for quite awhile about Mario's metagame because I was practically the only one trying to do this. It's a self-centered perspective, but that's how it feels like. In fact, it feels like this thread is two if not three years late to the party, and while I can clearly go into detail about it, I won't.

I have college, I have to fight against my Mom to go anywhere because she naturally fears for my safety, but the biggest culprit is I got tired of trying. Reality is too strong for this case, and I'd rather save my money and play other games.

What used to be a thriving character board is now dead as ****. A hype train comes in to get Marios pumped but frankly it goes nowhere. I've seen this pattern happen a lot. All I can say is I hope this time is different, but I expect the worst case scenario anyway.
 

Naisora

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#26
the legendary Matador...man, even though im a no name noob in these boards...ive really learned to respect alot of the things the people post here. I remember A2Z would make so much smart posts relating to mario and ****

...back on topic, I agree with Matador that alot of the rankings of a character, influence on a character, is based on the people who play it. like he said, when the game first came out people treated Ike like ****, and after San came and started wrecking **** with him, not only did Ike's rankings on the tier list improve, people thought of Ike more as a "valid" character. so the same thing can be applied on mario in the idea that just because people talk smack on the character and ****, they shoulden't be discouraged. maybe one day this legendary player will step up and start getting top 3 with mario in high level tournaments? lmao, you never know man. very nice thread matador...very nice board. seriously. too bad its not as active as it used to be...

-Expect the unexpected...-
exactly

oh yeah, sorry for the bump...

****, i forgot how gay this forum was on its censoring... shakin mah head...
 

boss8

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where ever I please,im a f***in boss!!
#27
so after u guys Fthrow at 0% on floatys.....jus throw out a full hop fair....the chances of them hitting it are rare...but its better to have a chance at hitting then jus doing an Fthrow...lol

also fludd after Fthrow wrks also....

spam fireballs when at distance-

your Ftilt,nair,utilt,up-b are all godlike use them wisely-

dthrow up-b is amazing,even wrks for baiting airdodges-

pivot Fsmash is an INCREDIABLE tool,ive been abusin this move lately it helps me get alot of sweetspot Fsmashes,and it moves u out of distance,so your pretty safe-

double jab(backup throw a reverse fireball xD) double jab(grab) full jab combo double jab(Ftilt) all are amazing strings...

yea i was playing mario for about 6 hours straight...i think i leveled up about 4 times xD

my mario is amazing...but no where near godlike..


speed space and zone out your opponent...and have a little fun...it is a game afterall =]

i agree with alot of what matador said....i need some new vids up...LOOL =P 08
 

TMario

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#28
I know like, all you other Marios know this already,

and I know this is old news but...

I just found out how awesome SH dair is. I LOVE SH dair!!
 
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#30
That was a heartwarming post, but get over it. Mario is horrible. If you like Mario, then play as Mario. That's all there is to it. There is no evidence whatsoever that Mario has any potential to eclipse anything beyond the very worst characters in the game. You want to talk about Boss' 08 Mario? Boss himself will tell you that Mario is horrible.

Just enjoy the game and quit worrying about pointless things like Mario's tier rank.

:phone:
 
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#32
Thanks. Sorry to see that the board kinda died. Ya know, if you really want to improve Mario's results, we can't just talk and hope for tournament wins. We need to get some games going. Problem is, the MD/VA scene is 100% Melee AFAIK, and Pittsburgh is the same, though I have found an awesome Brawl crew there. I know that Boss is also in VA. Maybe the three of us could meet up once in a while and try to figure things out. I could host in VA.
 

Matador

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#33
My problem is and always has been transportation. I'm down for whatever, whenever as long as I can get there.

But yeah, I think MD/VA may be converting to Melee, lol. It's w/e to me though.
 
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