Social Mr. Game & Watch Social - The Flat Zone

[ROBnWatch]

Classic on Intensity 0.0 with G-dubs is hilarious.

You can KO opponents with Manhole's WINDBOX there.

Give me a montage NOW! Lol.

 

[SFA Smiley]

I'm back expect some updates to the threads after i sleep

 

[ROBnWatch]

I'm back expect some updates to the threads after i sleep

Where the heck have you been?!?!?!

 

[deleted]

You're just full of fun facts. But no, didn't know about that one.

It sorta happened on accident in training when falcon atempted to up b on the ledge he missed and i used dtilt and ko'd him

 

[SFA Smiley]

Where the heck have you been?!?!?!

Busy. Which is also why i wasnt able to work on those threads again today.

#thestruggle

 

[ROBnWatch]

Busy. Which is also why i wasnt able to work on those threads again today.

#thestruggle

Lol.

 

[ROBnWatch]

Finally, my Iwata drawing (though super late) is complete:

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

Hello G&W mains, I got a question about G&Ws uair, does the toot toot have insane kbgrowth or are the windboxes affected by rage? I got this stupid ko on a friend while showing him the ropes of smash, didnt know how to explain it lol!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkm0Y6c2kfQ

 

[Furret24]

Hello G&W mains, I got a question about G&Ws uair, does the toot toot have insane kbgrowth or are the windboxes affected by rage? I got this stupid ko on a friend while showing him the ropes of smash, didnt know how to explain it lol!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkm0Y6c2kfQ

From my knowledge, the windbox has set knockback. Your kill was due to Mewtwo's double jump momentum causing him to go extremely high due to the windbox. I once killed a Kirby when he was ascending during his Up-Special with G&W's Up-Air doing that.

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

From my knowledge, the windbox has set knockback. Your kill was due to Mewtwo's double jump momentum causing him to go extremely high due to the windbox. I once killed a Kirby when he was ascending during his Up-Special with G&W's Up-Air doing that.

Cheers! I noticed that i caught him in the second jump but it sure gave a good laugh!

 

[Sinister Slush]

Smiley, you prolly don't remember me but a couple years ago I housed ya and you unfortunately left your camera/SD card between my couches.
Not 100% sure how I'd be able to, and even though I've had it for awhile now lol, just wondering if you'd want the files or not. Never thought to ask until now.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

Did we seriously not get anything out of this patch?

What the hell did we do to piss him off so bad? Why does he hate us?

 

[Furret24]

Did we seriously not get anything out of this patch?

What the hell did we do to piss him off so bad? Why does he hate us?

I think we did. Go to our thread about the patch.

 

[Molk]

Did we seriously not get anything out of this patch?

What the hell did we do to piss him off so bad? Why does he hate us?

We most certainly did get things out of the patch, at the very least another buff to bair's landing lag is confirmed, to the point where the landing hitbox true combos into nair, more to come most likely.

EDIT: whoops, apparently we didn't get anything and landing bair to nair was possible even in 1.08, dammit keep still having his 3DS version at 1.04 and getting us all excited ;_;.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

nah we got nothing. cool.

well hey, at least we can lock in as worst character in the game now.

 

[camden]

nah we got nothing. cool.

well hey, at least we can lock in as worst character in the game now.

Bro, Samus exists.

 

[Sixell]

nah we got nothing. cool.

well hey, at least we can lock in as worst character in the game now.

Excuse yourself because we did find no significant provable changes, but we discovered a true combo to judge 9. The worst character in the game wouldn't have such a potent kill combo at low percents. That's a "buff" to me. lol

 

[mario123007]

Excuse yourself because we did find no significant provable changes, but we discovered a true combo to judge 9. The worst character in the game wouldn't have such a potent kill combo at low percents. That's a "buff" to me. lol

Love that true combo LOL.

 

[Kofu]

Bro, Samus exists.

Samus isn't the worst. Zelda and Jigglypuff at least have claim to that before Samus does.

Also any combo to Judge is dubious because of Judge's unreliable nature. Still occasionally good to pull out.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

"potent"
1/9 all goes as planned.
7/9 you do something worse than an actual follow up
1/9 Give yourself 12% + whatever your opponent gets to punish you with, losing half your stock.

I exaggerate when I say the worst character. But bottom five is almost certain, especially after this patch.

 

[ROBnWatch]

At least we get 2% damage on the opponent with that last one. Lol

 

[Kofu]

"potent"
1/9 all goes as planned.
7/9 you do something worse than an actual follow up
1/9 Give yourself 12% + whatever your opponent gets to punish you with, losing half your stock.

I exaggerate when I say the worst character. But bottom five is almost certain, especially after this patch.

I don't think we're bottom 5. Possibly bottom 10 or 15. But I firmly believe that Game & Watch has a fairly strong base design that is mainly held back by a combination of his light weight and poor kill options. Unfortunately said combination is pretty brutal in a game with rage. I don't think we win a lot of match ups but I also don't think we lose many by a lot, either (our matchup spread feels mostly even). Bottom 5 characters don't get top 16 at Evo (matchup inexperience probably helped Regi but he showed that Game & Watch has potential). Really all we need are better kill options, better air-to-ground transitions (better autocancels or landing lag), and possibly a quicker jab to rapid jab transition.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

Matchup inexperience is the only way to take games off A-tier characters/highly skilled players. G&W has very, very exploitable weaknesses, the only saving grace is that they aren't completely obvious.

We don't need "better" kill options, we need one at all. D-throw to u-air can work when the stars are aligned, but its literally all we have. Each smash we have can be shielded into a punish. Each tilt we have can be shielded into a punish, or simply outranged aerially. But then again, every single move he has in his entire moveset can be punished on shield. Grab range is trash, after a certain percent even d-throw won't do anything for you, and in a game where half the cast can chuck you off the side of the stage to kill you at 120, our throws won't kill even at TWO HUNDRED.

And its not like our smashes are particularly powerful either. They all got nerfed from Brawl in one way or another. Sure you can bait up-smash on occasion, but only if the enemy's hitbox doesn't just completely overtake G&W to ignore his head and hit his body too. Sour spots are basically weak tilts when fully charged and jabs when not. They would provide great shield pressure if that mattered in this game. I understand why he would think he needed to nerf the knockback on the smashes, a Brawl G&W's u-smash with rage would be insane, but high level play doesn't allow you to live past 100 being that everyone has a guaranteed kill set up.

Aerials are great offstage, but ledge mechanics and the "everyone must recover" mentality Sakurai seemed to have this time around really diminishes the advantage we get out of that.

G&W is great on paper (no pun intended), but the mechanics of this game happen to work entirely against the fundamentals of the character, and Sakurai needs to open his eyes and see that.

 

[Folie]

He's not bottom 5 or even bottom 10. He has the tools to succeed that a lot of the "lower tier" characters lack. My results, people in the G&W community's results, the fact that a g&w main got top 13 at EVO, the fact the Gimr continues to place decently at S@X when everyone has seen videos of him playing and know his tricks does not concur with the idea that G&W is a bottom 5/10 character. If you're looking for a character with good and reliable setups, combos, safe options, etc like ZSS or something you're playing the wrong character.

If you want better results with G&W, I would recommend analyzing your own gameplay, or having someone else look at your gameplay to look for ways to improve it as opposed to just blaming Daddy Sakurai and giving up on any ambitions you have with the character.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

...who are you?

ONE G&W ever has taken ONE decent placing at ONE national where NO ONE had any G&W experience. #greatargument

I've watched GIMR's vids. Everyone plays piss poorly against him. Everyone constantly over estimates range, power, and cool down. That set against Nairo was DISGUSTING. Clearly missing 5 or 6 guaranteed kill-punishes. That match shouldn't have lasted half as long as it did, and it just proves my point that people just don't know how to play against him.

Bottom three in: Smash speed, aerial speed, and character weight. WOW WHAT A GOOD CHARACTER.

No one here has anything to offer as far as arguments other than "do better." There's no strategy discussion because there isn't anything viable. For ****'s sake the most exciting thing to happen for us in the past 3 months is "OMG BAIR TO JUDGE WORKS SOMETIMES." It's pathetic and embarrassing.

I dare any G&W main to go to Big House. Including GIMR or Regi. I promise you'd lose to every single person on MI's PR. $20 to any G&W who can beat anyone on MI's PR.

 

[ROBnWatch]

...who are you?

ONE G&W ever has taken ONE decent placing at ONE national where NO ONE had any G&W experience. #greatargument

I've watched GIMR's vids. Everyone plays piss poorly against him. Everyone constantly over estimates range, power, and cool down. That set against Nairo was DISGUSTING. Clearly missing 5 or 6 guaranteed kill-punishes. That match shouldn't have lasted half as long as it did, and it just proves my point that people just don't know how to play against him.

Bottom three in: Smash speed, aerial speed, and character weight. WOW WHAT A GOOD CHARACTER.

No one here has anything to offer as far as arguments other than "do better." There's no strategy discussion because there isn't anything viable. For ****'s sake the most exciting thing to happen for us in the past 3 months is "OMG BAIR TO JUDGE WORKS SOMETIMES." It's pathetic and embarrassing.

I dare any G&W main to go to Big House. Including GIMR or Regi. I promise you'd lose to every single person on MI's PR. $20 to any G&W who can beat anyone on MI's PR.

If you're gonna be such a flipping downer as you have been, then just flipping leave. You are of no support to us, and I haven't seen you come up with anything good we could use. Even if I haven't done much here, at the very least I haven't given up on the character. I'd rather talk about the good things about G&W and speculate how far up in the tier he COULD go, then whine, fuss, and complain about what he might turn out to be. We've also been noticed by a big name in the competitive scene. And yet you still say we're the worst character in the game. Tell me something, if we're THAT BAD, then WHY THE HECK WOULD ANYONE PAY ATTENTION TO US? I suggest that you just change your avatar and leave this thread. Because as far as I can see, all you're doing is being a little baby about the situation. And it sickens me.

Pardon that, but seriously, I think it's be best if you supported the good things about G&W that he does have, rather than the downsides of him. That's kinda why we're all here.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

Because any good player knows the flaws of their character. And going around spouting off about the one time your character has placed makes you look foolish. I'm realistic. G&W has a number of wonderful tools, I'd argue that D-throw is one of the best setups in the game, and that our off stage game may be the best in the game. But pardon me if I don't think going on about pseudo-combos is productive to anything.

I have no problem talking about real things, real strategy, and real problem solving, but there's not been one productive post in this thread in a long time.

And I've hardly given up on the character. I still use him 100%. Because one day Sakurai will give Mr. Game and watch the time of day, and we'll all be ready for it.

 

[ROBnWatch]

Because any good player knows the flaws of their character. And going around spouting off about the one time your character has placed makes you look foolish. I'm realistic. G&W has a number of wonderful tools, I'd argue that D-throw is one of the best setups in the game, and that our off stage game may be the best in the game. But pardon me if I don't think going on about pseudo-combos is productive to anything.

I have no problem talking about real things, real strategy, and real problem solving, but there's not been one productive post in this thread in a long time.

And I've hardly given up on the character. I still use him 100%. Because one day Sakurai will give Mr. Game and watch the time of day, and we'll all be ready for it.

Alright then. I was just getting sick of seeing negative posts from you (no offense). I was just making a case that we could be a bit more positive and cheerful about what we do have and what we've done instead of just focusing on the bad things. We good now?

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

For sure. However my challenge stands. Any G&W beats a MI PR at big house, $20.

I'm offering them $5 for any G&W main they two stock so they're excited

 

[Saikyoshi]

Speaking of money for G-dubs, pre-orders for the best Amiibo are opening this Saturday.

 

[Kofu]

Bottom three in: Smash speed, aerial speed, and character weight. WOW WHAT A GOOD CHARACTER.

It does less good to complain about weaknesses that most people are aware of than it does to try to be optimistic. I agree with you that Regi's placing was partially due to matchup inexperience and as people get to know what Game & Watch can do his effectiveness will decrease (unless we get delicious buffs). However, minor nitpick: we're far from bottom three in aerial speed (IIRC we're 12th overall?). Where we are lacking, however, is aerial acceleration where we are second to last. That can be remedied by dashing before a jump and we get among the best aerial weaving in the game to make up for our slow acceleration.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

I should've said "speed of aerial attacks", my apologies.

 

[ROBnWatch]

I don't pre order things and I've got no money right now.

...I guess I can wait.

 

[Kofu]

I should've said "speed of aerial attacks", my apologies.

Ah, okay. I thought you meant actual air speed and I was like "NO"

But is that really the case? Startup seems pretty average overall. I could kind of see duration, seeing as none of our aerials autocancel from a short hop, but that's mainly a combination of a low short hop and bad autocancel windows. Ike has two autocancel aerials but all of his aerials last an absurdly long time if not autocanceled.

His poor short hop game is probably one of my biggest pet peeves about his current design though.

 

[Furret24]

While I was screwing around in a For Fun match the other day, this happened.
(Skip to 01:51)

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

I like how the devil just kinda blinked away.

And yeah, at least from last patch, Falcon and palutena are the only two characters who don't have a smash attack the same or faster than one of G&Ws (falcon and palutena) and then G&W is second in aerials, (once again, Falcon, which may be what forces this match up to our favor)

In other news I'll have four G&W amiibo when they release. Anyone jealous?

 

[StripedNinja]

I think people are exaggerating how bad G&W is. He gets a LOT out of grab, more than most, and has something that will combo up to like 80. Back air is safe on shield which is big and up smash is a very good kill option with its invincibility frames. Landing up air can combo into up air at any percent and the toot toot ho-ha is something that becomes decently reliable with practice. Forward tilt can kill at higher percents if needed, he has good edgegaurding game, good damage output, decent combos. Not terrible at all. I can see him being low tier but I would put him at mid tier, he's a lot more technical than you would think.

 

[Furret24]

I think people are exaggerating how bad G&W is. He gets a LOT out of grab, more than most, and has something that will combo up to like 80. Back air is safe on shield which is big and up smash is a very good kill option with its invincibility frames. Landing up air can combo into up air at any percent and the toot toot ho-ha is something that becomes decently reliable with practice. Forward tilt can kill at higher percents if needed, he has good edgegaurding game, good damage output, decent combos. Not terrible at all. I can see him being low tier but I would put him at mid tier, he's a lot more technical than you would think.

Not all that much. He can get a lot out of a grab, but his grab range is pretty bad. Up Smash, while strong, is rather slow and requires a read land due to it's poor range. Up Air does not reliably hit both times even with practice. I will agree that Back Air and Forward Tilt are pretty solid though.

He's still bottom tier though. He may be great at racking up damage, but it's very difficult to KO with G&W due to his smash attacks being slow and either having bad range or huge weak sourspots and his other kill options outside of Forward Tilt and Down Tilt (which KO at 140%) being situational. The rage effect doesn't do him favors either.

His low weight coupled with his slow fall speed make him one of the easiest characters to kill in the game. I find myself dying before 100% rather often, especially against the heavies, which G&W is lucky to get past 75%.

While I do think G&W isn't bottom tier, he's still bottom 10/15 and far from being Mid-Tier. Hopefully, we'll get buffed someday and Mr. Game and Watch will rise again.

 

[StripedNinja]

Not all that much. He can get a lot out of a grab, but his grab range is pretty bad. Up Smash, while strong, is rather slow and requires a read land due to it's poor range. Up Air does not reliably hit both times even with practice. I will agree that Back Air and Forward Tilt are pretty solid though.

He's still bottom tier though. He may be great at racking up damage, but it's very difficult to KO with G&W due to his smash attacks being slow and either having bad range or huge weak sourspots and his other kill options outside of Forward Tilt and Down Tilt (which KO at 140%) being situational. The rage effect doesn't do him favors either.

His low weight coupled with his slow fall speed make him one of the easiest characters to kill in the game. I find myself dying before 100% rather often, especially against the heavies, which G&W is lucky to get past 75%.

While I do think G&W isn't bottom tier, he's still bottom 10/15 and far from being Mid-Tier. Hopefully, we'll get buffed someday and Mr. Game and Watch will rise again.

The trick to hitting up air is jumping into it. It doesn't hit both times at a certain point because to reach your opponent you have to activate it after the jump at which point youve passed the threshhold, as it is a pretty small window. And year you'll probably need a read with up smash but a read is almost always required in getting a kill and up smash can answer a lot of situations. Any situation where your opponent is going to attack you and basically any landing option is covered by upsmash and you can do it out of shield. Its all about learning those invincibility frames.
That being said I see where you're coming from, for how easy he is to kill he should have the kill potential of like the heavyweights. Still, Game and watch has a lot of creative tools.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

Except without fullbody invincibility, a lot of moves just trump the invincibility. A move large enough to envelope all of G&W (like Ike's fair) breaks it no problem. Then there's also certain moves like Marth's Fair that baits a u-smash and just follows with a punish.