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Social Mr. Game & Watch Social - The Flat Zone

ROBnWatch

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Trying to get some decent G&W stuff into the Miiverse stage background, since most are stick figures or bad handwriting. I saw one of these already, so there can't be too many G&W things so far. I could flood it if I really wanted to.
Lol, go right ahead.
 

Kofu

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Anyone know how the game determines how many units of oil an attack gives when absorbed? I think it could be 3(x*2.5)<=20 per unit or something, but I could be wrong.
If memory serves, it's every 10 percent. If a projectile does less than 10 percent, it will fill one level. 10 or over but less than 20, it fills two. 20 or over fills three (and is a OHKO).

The multiplier for the default attack is 2.8, by the way.
 

AirshBornely

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So I got my dad one of these today as a late birthday present/Fathers Day gift. Wasn't cheap of course... as they are rare.:urg: But was worth it. ^^


Anyway, Mr. Game & Watch is one of my mains!
 
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ROBnWatch

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So I got my dad one of these today as a late birthday present/Fathers Day gift. Wasn't cheap of course... as they are rare.:urg: But was worth it. ^^


Anyway, Mr. Game & Watch is one of my mains!
Not bad.
 

Lunix7

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So I got my dad one of these today as a late birthday present/Fathers Day gift. Wasn't cheap of course... as they are rare.:urg: But was worth it. ^^


Anyway, Mr. Game & Watch is one of my mains!
Wow that's an awesome gift! So old school! Also welcome aboard. :4gaw: is such a fun character to use.
 

Mr. Escalator

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Okay, I'm going to sacrifice my recent tournament placements as Olimar to represent G&W this weekend. Wish me luck boy-os!
@ Neb Neb I'm baaaack
 

ROBnWatch

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I ordered a Game & Watch last week. It came in yesterday:
Nice.

It's gonna be hard to get that G&W Amiibo, especially since it's the only one that comes with multiple poses...and I'm going to need to get a Japan R.O.B. one because only Japan gets the red and white Famicom one...

That and I need to wait for the Villager to be re-stocked...the Ness Amiibo is going to be rare...and I can't find Greninja anywhere.

It's just my luck that the 5 Amiibo I want are going to be the hardest things ever to get...
 

Mr. Escalator

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Ha! Bro... I called for back-up months ago. But best of luck this weekend. How have you been placing with Oli?
Very well! Lots of Top 8 placements in general at tournaments - last PR season got a first place in a 26 man tournament, and placed third in a 45 man tournament as well as a 40 man tournament. I'm placed as the #2 player in NH, for what that's worth (not much heh).

What got me thinking of picking up G&W again was at the last tournament I ran my team took first place in 3v3 VIP, and I played G&W throughout that. I was wrecking, and I been practicing G&W. With that and the buffs he just got, I decided to give back to you guys. Dtilt thoooooo

I'll report the results!
 
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Mr. Escalator

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Double post heh, feel free to delete -

BUT G&W DTILT THO, perfect setup into edgeguards as well as a pocket kill move <3
 
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Neb

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I need to see it myself. I lent my console for a little while, so its impossible for me. If someone could capture it used as ^ describes, I'd really appreciate that. I am too curious.

And Esc. Boy, it sounds like you've come a long way. So good to hear about your success! All the more impressed if you can pull it off with G&W ;)
 
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ROBnWatch

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I'm pretty hyped for the Game & Watch amiibo. I wonder how many poses it will have?
I think it has 4. One of his official SSB4 artwork, one of him using the 9 Hammer, one of him with his parachute (looks more similar to his Melee Neutral Air than his Up Special), and one of him with his bell (looks like his Brawl official artwork).

You can see for yourself here:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gaD3Srk_Yc4
 

Kofu

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Very well! Lots of Top 8 placements in general at tournaments - last PR season got a first place in a 26 man tournament, and placed third in a 45 man tournament as well as a 40 man tournament. I'm placed as the #2 player in NH, for what that's worth (not much heh).

What got me thinking of picking up G&W again was at the last tournament I ran my team took first place in 3v3 VIP, and I played G&W throughout that. I was wrecking, and I been practicing G&W. With that and the buffs he just got, I decided to give back to you guys. Dtilt thoooooo

I'll report the results!
Game & Watch feels like he's so close to being viable IMO. The DTilt buff is one that I didn't really think he needed but it ended up being really useful. Another buff that I hadn't considered until recently but would be nice would be speeding up the transition from jab one to the jab loop because a lot of characters can interrupt it as it is now.

I think it has 4. One of his official SSB4 artwork, one of him using the 9 Hammer, one of him with his parachute (looks more similar to his Melee Neutral Air than his Up Special), and one of him with his bell (looks like his Brawl official artwork).

You can see for yourself here:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gaD3Srk_Yc4
Okay, I knew it showed several ones but I couldn't remember what all they were.
 

Furret24

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I feel that if G&W got a few more buffs in power and lag, he could definitely be a viable character, specifically in some of his aerials and smash attacks (though the ability to hit with U-Tilt outside of low percent combos would be nice too). His D-Air is very unsafe to use due to it's long ending lag without the power to compensate (it doesn't reliably KO until past 150%) while his F-Air could use some power buffs to make it more like it's previous incarnations (though you could argue it's lag buff can compensate for this). His F-Smash's sweetspot could stand being bigger while his D-Smash's sourspot is too weak considering how big it is.

I hope I don't sound too demanding here.
 

JustKindaBoredUKno

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Of course you don't sound too demanding. We have every right to want our character to be at least half-way viable.

All I want are one or two options that are safe on shield. Every good character has multiple, we have literally nothing. Literally, not one single move is safe on shield against characters who are worth their weight. Jab can be interrupted, grab range hilariously short, sour spots ridiculously weak, one super situational and hardly reliable kill set up, zero ways to reset to neutral, the rage mechanic puts us at a disadvantage, the new ledge mechanics completely destroy everything G&W was built for...

For god's sake bucket doesn't even absorb a good number of explosions LIKE ITS SUPPOSED TO. (bowser jr's up-b and toy, DHD's can, etc)

They obviously spent way more time designing his quirky new appearance than they did spending time on making him a playable character. And its pretty obvious all the way through the character.
 

ROBnWatch

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Of course you don't sound too demanding. We have every right to want our character to be at least half-way viable.

All I want are one or two options that are safe on shield. Every good character has multiple, we have literally nothing. Literally, not one single move is safe on shield against characters who are worth their weight. Jab can be interrupted, grab range hilariously short, sour spots ridiculously weak, one super situational and hardly reliable kill set up, zero ways to reset to neutral, the rage mechanic puts us at a disadvantage, the new ledge mechanics completely destroy everything G&W was built for...

For god's sake bucket doesn't even absorb a good number of explosions LIKE ITS SUPPOSED TO. (bowser jr's up-b and toy, DHD's can, etc)

They obviously spent way more time designing his quirky new appearance than they did spending time on making him a playable character. And its pretty obvious all the way through the character.
And I don't even like his new quirkiness all that much. :/
 

Splooshi Splashy

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For god's sake bucket doesn't even absorb a good number of explosions LIKE ITS SUPPOSED TO. (bowser jr's up-b and toy, DHD's can, etc)
Wait what, Bucket fails against those?! No wonder I've not been troubled by G&Ws too much as either Jr or DH. Without such a powerful anti-energy tool to threaten their arsenal with, he probably can get lamed out by the two, were they to try camping him out, especially DH.

However, I'm not one to abuse the lame-out capabilities of Jr & DH, since I play an aggressive rushdown style with them (and virtually every single character in Sm4sh, for that matter). While I may do half the work of approaching me for you this way, my speedy ranged disjoints (especially Jr's) don't make it THAT easy to get in on me, especially if my arsenal is out there on the field, serving as cover fire for my approaches (especially DH's). At least your range and especially speed on your A button moves can compete with ours, and the windboxes of DTilt & UAir can wreck havoc on my expectations. Your Chef can also stuff my shorthop approaches, forcing my Jr to try sneaking a Mecha under your flapjacks while I'm Side B Jump Cancelling over them, and my DH to try to block some of them off with Gunmen before continuing to approach you.

I thoroughly agree that Jr's Up B & Mechas, as well as DH's Cans should be Bucket-able. They're explosions that LOOK like they'd fill it up (Especially DH's Can & Jr's Up B), but they don't. Were such fillings possible, he'd have a solid answer to their arsenal. But as it stands, G&W has to respect their arsenal more than he should have to.
 

Sixell

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JustKindaBoredUKno said:
For god's sake bucket doesn't even absorb a good number of explosions LIKE ITS SUPPOSED TO. (bowser jr's up-b and toy, DHD's can, etc)
Here's a list of what moves should be bucketable (on contact or indirectly), but aren't:

- Star Bits
- Abandon Ship
- Mechakoopa
- Super Missile
- Homing Missile
- Aether (both Ike and Roy)
- Trick Shot
- Wild Gunman (fire bullet only)

Also, if bombs can be bucketable on contact, all missiles should be including and especially Lloid Rocket.
 

ROBnWatch

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Here's a list of what moves should be bucketable (on contact or indirectly), but aren't:

- Star Bits
- Abandon Ship
- Mechakoopa
- Super Missile
- Homing Missile
- Aether (both Ike and Roy)
- Trick Shot
- Wild Gunman (fire bullet only)

Also, if bombs can be bucketable on contact, all missiles should be including and especially Lloid Rocket.
By "Aether" you mean they're Nuetral Specials, correct? Because neither of their Up Specials (Roy's not even being named Aether) have any sort of thing that I would consider "Bucketable".
 
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Sixell

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Yeah, I meant their neutral specials since they're basically explosions/blasts of fire.
 

Kofu

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Here's a list of what moves should be bucketable (on contact or indirectly), but aren't:

- Star Bits
Default Star Bits aren't technically a projectile AFAIK. Weird but explains why we can't absorb them.

- Abandon Ship
- Mechakoopa
- Super Missile
- Homing Missile
I agree with these. Lol.

- Trick Shot
Technically it is, but only when it explodes on its own and not on hit. Strangely the same thing applies to Clay Shooting.

Also, if bombs can be bucketable on contact, all missiles should be including and especially Lloid Rocket.
Someone doesn't like Villager, lol. There seems to be some limitation on the projectile hitting and interrupting Oil Panic before we get to absorb the projectile at hand in a lot of cases.

Of course you don't sound too demanding. We have every right to want our character to be at least half-way viable.

All I want are one or two options that are safe on shield. Every good character has multiple, we have literally nothing. Literally, not one single move is safe on shield against characters who are worth their weight. Jab can be interrupted, grab range hilariously short, sour spots ridiculously weak, one super situational and hardly reliable kill set up, zero ways to reset to neutral, the rage mechanic puts us at a disadvantage, the new ledge mechanics completely destroy everything G&W was built for...

For god's sake bucket doesn't even absorb a good number of explosions LIKE ITS SUPPOSED TO. (bowser jr's up-b and toy, DHD's can, etc)

They obviously spent way more time designing his quirky new appearance than they did spending time on making him a playable character. And its pretty obvious all the way through the character.
It's clear that we have slightly different perceptions of the character, but I agree that we could use moves that are safe on shield. You actually point out a few things that others don't (like jab being interruptible) which is nice. I disagree that we lack a way to reset to neutral though, Fire is pretty good at it.

The thing is that Game & Watch seems to be "balanced" around his two very powerful specials, Judge 9 and Oil Panic. He doesn't need safe KO moves when he can OHKO people with two attacks, right? That seems to be the design philosophy anyway. I could see him being a lot more usable in FFAs with his large, lingering disjoints to interrupt other characters and to snag multiple kills with the aforementioned moves. Unfortunately that leaves him unable to safely get kills a lot in 1-on-1s.
 

Splooshi Splashy

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*Recalls a G&W player actually being able to fill up his bucket off of shot-up Clays* Oh yeaaah, that actually IS possible. :o No wonder I don't use Clays too often against him, aside from punishing openings from a distance.

As someone who frequents FG FFA & Teams, he definitely is more usable in those settings, due to those large, lingering disjoints that actually have some speed to them. DTilt & UAir can certainly shake up folks (including KOs! Try UAiring Puffs & Mewtwos when they're at around 90+%), and Chef's surprisingly good at providing cover fire for your partner in Teams (raining flapjacks can also disrupt whole crowds from a distance in FFAs). NAir can build damage on a bunch of people at once, DAirs are sneakable, and FTilt, Jab, FAir, & BAir can shove out entire crowds. His Smashes are quick single hits that definitely don't require much holding time to secure KOs with, unlike Zelda's & Jr's. Judge 9 & Oil Panic are definitely hype crowd-clearing moves that'll get folks to be all like "YOOOO!1 8O" and save & even send replays.
 

Sixell

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I think the least that can be done is to fix the jab and fix the D-tilt hitbox. It's great that the D-tilt hitbox expands to a point that's sorta in front of the manhole, but the part of the manhole that's closest to GW has no hitbox. At the very least, that area should be some sort of sourspot.
 

JustKindaBoredUKno

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None of G&W's moves hit close to G&W. Thats why Oli is like a 90/10 MU. The only way to shake pikmin is to leave yourself wide open for more pikmin.


I disagree that we lack a way to reset to neutral though, Fire is pretty good at it.
Fire is a great recovery move. Actrually, no, it used to be great. It can now be easily intercepted at its peak and can be punished easily, Fire is now an OK recovery. And it does absolutely nothing to reset the neutral, because you need to actually resume fighting stance on ground, which G&W can't do.

DAirs are sneakable
Dairs are highly, HIGHLY punishable unless your postlag ends before you land. Anyone with any experience in the MU will literally just WAIT for you to use it. It's probably one of the easiest ways to punish G&W for the kill.

His Smashes are quick single hits that definitely don't require much holding time to secure KOs with[
His fastest smash is frame 15, with down smash. For comparison, Captain Falcon, Ganondorf (ties), Lucario (ties), and palutena are the only characters who don't have a smash faster than that. His smashes are NOT quick and saying that they are seriously needs to stop..
 
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Furret24

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Didn't they remove the lingering hitboxes to most his moves (notably F-Smash)?

Though this would explain why win rates with G&W in FG FFA's and Team's are much higher (about 40%) than my 1-on-1's (29%). Yeah, i'm not very good at Smash.
 

Furret24

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His fastest smash is frame 15, with down smash. For comparison, Captain Falcon, Ganondorf (ties), Lucario (ties), and palutena are the only characters who don't have a smash faster than that. His smashes are NOT quick and saying that they are seriously needs to stop..
What about how his smash attacks can be difficult to KO with? F-Smash's sweetspot may be powerful, but it only makes up a third of the hitbox. It's sourspot doesn't start KOing until around 130%-140%. Same goes for D-Smash, but the sourspot is bigger and doesn't start KOing until 170%. U-Smash is his best KO option, being his fastest KOing and has invincibility frames, but it's range is mediocre at best and the attack itself somewhat laggy. Atleast it doesn't have a sourspot.
 

Kofu

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None of G&W's moves hit close to G&W. Thats why Oli is like a 90/10 MU. The only way to shake pikmin is to leave yourself wide open for more pikmin.
Uhh USmash is a pretty easy way to get Pikmin off. If not, dash attack, NAir, and UAir seem to do the trick. I'll hold off on commenting about the MU proper since I don't know enough about it.

Fire is a great recovery move. Actrually, no, it used to be great. It can now be easily intercepted at its peak and can be punished easily, Fire is now an OK recovery. And it does absolutely nothing to reset the neutral, because you need to actually resume fighting stance on ground, which G&W can't do.
It's still pretty good for its distance and relative flexibility. And the fact that he's still able to act after using the move (and even use his double jump if he uses an aerial first) work in his favor IMO. It's not great but it can do the trick. Game & Watch is far from being the worst at landing.

Dairs are highly, HIGHLY punishable unless your postlag ends before you land. Anyone with any experience in the MU will literally just WAIT for you to use it. It's probably one of the easiest ways to punish G&W for the kill.
He was referring to FFAs in which case he could easily be right. That said, DAir is seriously lacking in meat for a stall-then-fall aerial.

His fastest smash is frame 15, with down smash. For comparison, Captain Falcon, Ganondorf (ties), Lucario (ties), and palutena are the only characters who don't have a smash faster than that. His smashes are NOT quick and saying that they are seriously needs to stop..
Yeah, his smashes have slow startup and aren't fast (USmash is the third slowest USmash, only Lucas's and Ike's are slower). I think his point was that they hit once and thus have no chance of people falling out of them (though sourspots suck). On the flip side, USmash is only 38 frames total, 22 of which have partial body invincibility. That puts it as one of the shortest duration smashes if not THE shortest and also one of the safest, tiny hitbox notwithstanding.
 

Splooshi Splashy

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I was definitely referring to FFAs when I said that DAirs were sneakable, because very often will folks be too focused on each other to notice you in the air attempting to ram the key into them on your way to the floor. Its KO power is sorely lacking, but at least you'll build decent damage with it and split up folks doing so.

I should've specified what parts of his Smashes were quick. Whoops. Their start-up is definitely slow, as their frame data proves. It's their endlag and lack of holding time (which I really should've referred to as hit-to-launch time; Think Mario's Smashes in that as soon as their one hit connects, they immediately launch folks) that are fast in comparison to other characters. In FFAs and FG Teams, those two traits are important for not only securing KOs (FFAs count who KOs someone, so the faster you can send folks flying with a Smash, the better for ensuring that you're the one who KOs someone and not another person), but also staying safe after KO-ing someone, since it's very likely that somebody's going to be closing in on you while you're trying to KO someone. Seeing as how the Watch is one of the lightest characters around, being able to act quickly after Smashing someone is a blessing that'll help him stick around.
 
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Mr. Escalator

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I've been waiting for the tournament results to go up from the tournament on Sunday, but it's been taking too long so I'll just tell you all how my G&W of under one week did!

I'm not sure how many people entered singles, but it was probably 32+ or so. I placed tied for 5th as G&W in that! I ended up getting a hard bracket as my crewmate got seeded well and I ended up facing the best player in Western Massachusetts Round 3 in Winners (BelaC, who ended up winning the whole thing). I did really well, but I was fighting his pocket Ryu and not his main Luigi - I may have been able to take him but whatever, still picking up G&W. Then, I climbed through losers and ended up having to fight the other best player in NH who's part of my crew. I wrecked his Sonic Game 1, and he barely took it on SV Game 2 - the problem was that I CP'd Delfino and I ended up getting killed early to the transition. Anyway, I got knocked out and he took second place in the tournament.

Phew, well at any rate my G&W surprised a lot of people, and I felt very in control in my matches! I think I'll be taking some tournaments once I fine tune some things with the Master of Two Dimensions.

Oh, and I took first place in Doubles, convincingly. G&W + Roy combo 2strong. G&W remains as the best Doubles Partner <3

Anyway, I'm convinced- I'll stick with G&W again. Expect some content from me!
 

ROBnWatch

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Not doubting your G&W + Roy combo for doubles but...

 
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