MK Nado Notes

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Jun 3, 2015
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71
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Michigan
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Lukeduke5456
#1
A few notes I created for MKs that don't particularly use Nado. It covers setups into the move, the mentality you need when using it, and info on the move itself. This is meant to just be kind of a laid back general guide so it won't be super in depth if you're expecting that. Leave a like if you find it helpful and if anything could be added (I.e. Nado setups that you have created and that work), leave a reply then describing what you've found.
http://pastebin.com/aUbB2jie
 

New_Dumal

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2012
Messages
1,075
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NewTouchdown
#2
Nice, I think it should have more to it, but it's good that you got this covered.
Tornado is your best friend when people DI up+away your DThrow, or generally against some certain characters.
I know this enters into the "confirmed setup" section that you said was not your objective, but a lot of MK starting their road forget about this.

Now some interesting things I would like to discover:

It's possible to trap suicide people with tornado ?
I always wanted to test this, but never could. I will give a example:
You're against a Sonic (oh, the pain) or Megaman, people who recovers mainly vertically.
Your opponent is not in the percent a Dair or Bair would generate a kill as a airdodge punish so you use Nado and drag them to under the stage. They probably will need to tech because tornado have a reasonable base knockback, take some damage and will be into a awful spot to recover even if they tech. You will die, but you were up a stock.
Is this viable ? I already killed a Cloud dragging him to far from the stage with tornado, but I understand that exist a lot of moves that could achieve this same kill without killing myself, it was done to style in a friendlies.
A tornado under the stage can generate a untechable knockback if you forces MK with mashing ?

Does Tornado cancel Yoshi's mid air jump heavyarmor ?
I already canceled his armor with a footstool, but the timing with tornado would be even easier.

What happens if a recovery move beat you off the Nado ?
I mean recoveries like Coryn UpB, Fox Ilusion/Fire fox. Sometimes when you trade with a multihit move while recovering you take a giant hit stun that can kill you. This happens between Super Jump and MK's Bair for example.
Maybe Nado can stop some bothersome recoveries to gimp.

The probably best use of Tornado until now is punish airdodes, add damage after Bair->Dtilt lock, and cover ledge options.
If there's a potential to gimp dragging people away, it would be very cool.
The Nado is the MK special who travels more horizontal distance at the end (More than Drill Rush and even more than Fox Ilusion in comparison).
 
Joined
Jun 3, 2015
Messages
71
Location
Michigan
NNID
Lukeduke5456
#3
Nice, I think it should have more to it, but it's good that you got this covered.
Tornado is your best friend when people DI up+away your DThrow, or generally against some certain characters.
I know this enters into the "confirmed setup" section that you said was not your objective, but a lot of MK starting their road forget about this.

Now some interesting things I would like to discover:

It's possible to trap suicide people with tornado ?
I always wanted to test this, but never could. I will give a example:
You're against a Sonic (oh, the pain) or Megaman, people who recovers mainly vertically.
Your opponent is not in the percent a Dair or Bair would generate a kill as a airdodge punish so you use Nado and drag them to under the stage. They probably will need to tech because tornado have a reasonable base knockback, take some damage and will be into a awful spot to recover even if they tech. You will die, but you were up a stock.
Is this viable ? I already killed a Cloud dragging him to far from the stage with tornado, but I understand that exist a lot of moves that could achieve this same kill without killing myself, it was done to style in a friendlies.
A tornado under the stage can generate a untechable knockback if you forces MK with mashing ?

Does Tornado cancel Yoshi's mid air jump heavyarmor ?
I already canceled his armor with a footstool, but the timing with tornado would be even easier.

What happens if a recovery move beat you off the Nado ?
I mean recoveries like Coryn UpB, Fox Ilusion/Fire fox. Sometimes when you trade with a multihit move while recovering you take a giant hit stun that can kill you. This happens between Super Jump and MK's Bair for example.
Maybe Nado can stop some bothersome recoveries to gimp.

The probably best use of Tornado until now is punish airdodes, add damage after Bair->Dtilt lock, and cover ledge options.
If there's a potential to gimp dragging people away, it would be very cool.
The Nado is the MK special who travels more horizontal distance at the end (More than Drill Rush and even more than Fox Ilusion in comparison).
For your first question, don't go for Nado to drag your opponent under the stage, it's just as lol. I do it for fun in friendlies but that's it. Just go for the semi spike of drill or drill them into the bottom blastzone if you see the opportunity and you're a stock up.

Second, no it doesn't cancel yoshi super armor during his jump, but the super armor shouldn't last long enough for him to go straight through it 9 times out of 10, making it able to catch him out of his jump depending on how he uses it.

Lastly, Nado does not have a spike property like you're talking about to trade with recoveries. Nado edge guards are really just MU dependent bc many recoveries will just beat it out or avoid it. But some MUs, it's just really good at catching certain recoveries like pika QA for example.
 

IcantWin

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 1, 2006
Messages
269
Location
CT
#4
I would like to add that a pretty underutilized 'tech' would be to simply look at your opponents hands while you have them in the D-throw animation to see how they DI. It works 100% of the time. Oatmeal and I have been optimizing our ground play and right now D-throw into Nado racks a crispy 25%. Better yet? It's guaranteed regardless of DI if you're fast enough AND can be used twice assuming you grab -> nado at 0%. I like this a lot as it puts most of the midweight (eg. Marth) at perfect % to start an up air string out of dash attack or a poorly DI'd dthrow (see my earlier statement about looking at your opponents hands during d-throw).

Caught your local Bowser in an up air string at early % and want more of that precious %? Use Tornado after an up-air to catch them off guard, it works on heavies and is super consistent for racking. I'll try to provide you more information with videos come Tuesday when we hold our weekly.

Optimization right now for MK only means the character will get better, and while a lot of people have placed MK lower on the tier list because of his changes, I believe that with time we'll see an increase.

Cheers
~ Baroness
 
Joined
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Messages
71
Location
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NNID
Lukeduke5456
#5
I would like to add that a pretty underutilized 'tech' would be to simply look at your opponents hands while you have them in the D-throw animation to see how they DI. It works 100% of the time. Oatmeal and I have been optimizing our ground play and right now D-throw into Nado racks a crispy 25%. Better yet? It's guaranteed regardless of DI if you're fast enough AND can be used twice assuming you grab -> nado at 0%. I like this a lot as it puts most of the midweight (eg. Marth) at perfect % to start an up air string out of dash attack or a poorly DI'd dthrow (see my earlier statement about looking at your opponents hands during d-throw).

Caught your local Bowser in an up air string at early % and want more of that precious %? Use Tornado after an up-air to catch them off guard, it works on heavies and is super consistent for racking. I'll try to provide you more information with videos come Tuesday when we hold our weekly.

Optimization right now for MK only means the character will get better, and while a lot of people have placed MK lower on the tier list because of his changes, I believe that with time we'll see an increase.

Cheers
~ Baroness
Yeah, oats does like to look at people's hands when Dthrowing, which is quite funny to me tbh, but yeah it does work. I usually just react to the DI bc it's not that hard to react to DI out of MK's Dthrow imo. But also, I was trying to avoid true setups with Nado like stated in the guide as but I'll say this now that Dthrow > Nado is true on is pretty much true on all characters regardless of DI that aren't a fast faller iirc. Thanks for adding your notes none the less, be sure to find more stuff and keep it posted.
 

TKD

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
1,589
Location
Tijuana, México
#6
As far as I know, nado is the easiest way in the game to condition the opponent into letting you trump them, and that's its most important use.

Remember not to trump as soon as possible (which would look as though both chars grabbed the ledge almost at the same time) because the trump activates once they've been hanging for 20 frames, so an ASAP trump can be reacted to. Also, trumping too late won't give you enough frame advantage to guarantee a hit. So the best timing for a ledge trump is a midpoint around 10 frames since they ledgegrab.

But yeah, the only way to avoid getting nadoed is literally for the opponent to let you trump them. Combined with the raw power of MK's bair, I think this makes MK's ledge coverage one of the most dangerous in the game. Also, MK Kirby and double MK teams cover all options if one trumps and the other nados.
 
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