Midwest [May 2, 2015] Sponsored by Buffalo Wild Wings and KTAR SPAU 4 Project:M and Smash4 (Livonia, MI)

[LOE1]

japanese ruleset sucks for wario tho

 

[JTsm]

japanese ruleset sucks for wario tho

You can make magic happen bby.

 

[AllyKnight]

when is it lol

 

[Zinoto]

SPAU - Ally bodies Zinoto with
SPAU2 - Ally clutches out Game 5 win vs. Zinoto.
SPAU3 - ???

I'm learning Elliot

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

Please Japanese ruleset, please.

There's no more of that stupid lose game 1 auto lose game 3 BS with Japanese stagelist.

If your character is bad on neutrals, you're character is just bad. If your playstyle needs gimmicky stages to make it work, learn to start outplaying people instead. I can guarantee my attendance if it's Japanese ruleset.

 

[Kel]

Are you guys gonna ban MK yet?

 

[Apasher]

MK is a bad character.

 

[Damittom]

If your character is bad on neutrals, you're character is just bad. If your playstyle needs gimmicky stages to make it work, learn to start outplaying people instead. I can guarantee my attendance if it's Japanese ruleset.

This is the best statement ever. And this is exactly why RC and Brinstar are terribad stages.

 

[clowsui]

if I make an appearance at this we should team julian

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Are you guys gonna ban MK yet?

Nope

Also, Japanese Ruleset is gay. I cant guarantee my attendance.

 

[Roller]

It's definitely not tho...



Even Gio says it's the best. And it's the ruleset that does the fewest favors, by far. (barring rulesets that ban him, obviously.)




I've said what Tutu said about a hundred times, so I agree with him.

 

[L_Cancel]

How much is it alike the actual Japanese rule set. Is banning of neutrals allowed? o.o

 

[Zinoto]

I liked the SKTAR ruleset. But I'm always for any ruleset that doesn't have :brinstar:.

 

[Roller]

I should clarify. I'm fine with any of the common variations of the Japanese ruleset. Like SKTAR's.

 

[L_Cancel]

Yeahhh, brinstar and RC gone is a much better world. XD

 

[What's The Point]

I propose that we make it so winner can't change character. It will never be a standard but it's a stupid rule.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Roller, MK is the best character in the game for a reason. He's not really buffed by the Japanese Ruleset...but he's not hindered by it either. And some characters like are benefited while others like are hindered. I'm really just speaking from a personal view. My character has -2/3s with a lot of the same characters who are helped by that ruleset. As if I need more roadblocks lol. And that's why I don't like the ruleset. I think its okay as a whole but in my opinion there are better rulesets. I do not enjoy playing in tournaments using the ruleset so I either have to use my secondary or just not enter. Not a big deal either way I hope everyone has fun...its just unlikely I will be here..

 

[Eddie G]

Zinoto, how difficult would you say it is to perform the banana infinite (with Diddy)?

 

[Apasher]

Japanese stagelist?

Going all at this.


EDIT: ...wait, **** that. Going /

 

[LOE1]

Apex ruleset is still the best in my opinion. like tech said, it benifits some chars, and ****s over others. Most of what i see, people that main chars that are good on the japanese ruleset are for it, and those who use chars that are bad on the japanese ruleset are against it.

at least about everyone agrees on the Apex ruleset

 

[Apasher]

Apex Stagelist with the addition of PS2, imo.

 

[Hot_ArmS]

banana infinite is so easy

 

[Zinoto]

IMO the infinite is a lot like the chain grab, instead of weight causing the animation to be different for each character it's their tripping animation. The infinite is just harder to actually get (grabbing is a lot easier than getting one of the banana set ups). Once you learn all the set ups you can do, it becomes significantly easier to pull off in tourney. Actually doing the inputs though isn't hard at all.

 

[JTsm]

Please Japanese ruleset, please.

There's no more of that stupid lose game 1 auto lose game 3 BS with Japanese stagelist.

If your character is bad on neutrals, you're character is just bad. If your playstyle needs gimmicky stages to make it work, learn to start outplaying people instead.

Pretty much this. In some way, this ruleset will help you define your play-style better, so if you do go to a Apex ruleset tourney, you'll be prepared skill-wise and (hopefully) you do know your counter-picks.

I am thinking of a compromise to have people decide to add in one stage, but I think that would defeat the purpose of what me and Tutu said above. We need more Japanese action in this state IMO.

Also, the SKTAR rule-set for doubles has APEX ruleset stages. So I don't know if that's an incentive to go. If not, oh well. lol. It's probably the best compromise I can give.

@Ally: It will either be in Oct or in Nov. Right now, I just have the date range of when it's going to be.

 

[TheMann]

If this is at EMU, my chances of attending are great. I'm always in the Ypsi area all my friends stay out there XD. So yup regardless of ruleset, good chance I'm showing up.

 

[Hot_ArmS]

there hasnt been a tourney at emu since....

since i bodied themann

 

[TheMann]

there hasnt been a tourney at emu since....

since i bodied themann

Lmao. Quoted for truth XD

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

D3 is not hindered by Japanese ruleset.

He just doesn't get benefits from manly stages.

ICs also do not benefit from Japanese ruleset, they are hindered by other stagelists.

The only people in this thread against Japanese or common forms of Japanese ruleset are the ones who play really campy/defensively and want stages that make it easier to run away on to be legal.

Like I said on my post before, learn a playstyle that involves outplaying your opponent instead of just running away and letting stages do your work for you. I mean come on tech you just called Ori out on being lazy about getting better and trying to gimmick people for wins instead of simply improving. Practice what you preach dawg.


For the record I am against Apex stage list, but its significantly better than what we had before.

My personal favorite variation of Japanese is FD, BF, SV, YI, Lylat, Pokemon 1 with a modified version of DSR that allows people to (unless stage banned) counter pick the stage struck to on game 1. That way you have enough for best of 5 sets.

 

[fZk]

I prefer a conservative stagelist, but any current ruleset is a vast improvement over the crap that we had for years with Brinstar and RC. I can't believe it took that long to do away with those broken stages, since then MK doesn't seem nearly as broken.

My personal favorite variation of Japanese is FD, BF, SV, YI, Lylat, Pokemon 1 with a modified version of DSR that allows people to (unless stage banned) counter pick the stage struck to on game 1. That way you have enough for best of 5 sets.

I like this quite a lot. Would this run with 3 starter stages (FD, BF,SV) plus 3 counter picks?

Zinoto, how difficult would you say it is to perform the banana infinite (with Diddy)?

The actual button commands of doing it are not hard at all, it took me about 20 minutes and I was already getting it to about 60~70% consistently in practice mode. Another half an hour and I wasn't droping it until 150~200% most of the time, now I can do it until my hands get tired. Now the setups for doing it are hard and require strict timing plus in an actual game you have to deal with move decay which means you have to keep it going for a much longer time. Also keeping it going in an actual tourney match I imagine is quite hard too.

 

[Damittom]

Tutu the more you talk about this subject the more i like you

 

[JTsm]

I like this quite a lot. Would this run with 3 starter stages (FD, BF,SV) plus 3 counter picks?

Yes.

10pingas

 

[Apasher]

D3 is not hindered by Japanese ruleset.

He just doesn't get benefits from manly stages.

ICs also do not benefit from Japanese ruleset, they are hindered by other stagelists.

The only people in this thread against Japanese or common forms of Japanese ruleset are the ones who play really campy/defensively and want stages that make it easier to run away on to be legal.

Like I said on my post before, learn a playstyle that involves outplaying your opponent instead of just running away and letting stages do your work for you. I mean come on tech you just called Ori out on being lazy about getting better and trying to gimmick people for wins instead of simply improving. Practice what you preach dawg.


For the record I am against Apex stage list, but its significantly better than what we had before.

My personal favorite variation of Japanese is FD, BF, SV, YI, Lylat, Pokemon 1 with a modified version of DSR that allows people to (unless stage banned) counter pick the stage struck to on game 1. That way you have enough for best of 5 sets.

Look, people are for the Japanese stagelist because there are just static stages. People have issues with the Japanese stagelist because....... there are just static stages.

The problem that people have with that is that and do VERY well on static stages. There are a few others, but I'm only listing them for emphasis because THEY ARE ALL TOP TIER CHARACTERS.

With a stagelist with only static stages, characters lower than them are hindered. THE TOP TEIR CHARACTERS ARE BENEFITTED BECAUSE THE CHARACTERS LOWER THAN THEM ARE HINDERED. I mean, why benefit the top tier characters when they already dominate the metagame? This game has an unbalanced cast of characters, and it's like people are forgetting that.

The Apex stagelist gives a balance between static and borderline stages without pushing the limits of borderline, and this gives more characters a better chance of winning, which is why people prefer the Apex stagelist instead of the Japanese stagelist.

/stole this fron Tech_Chase because I'm too lazy to quote. But that post of his DID change my views on stagelists for this game in particular.

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

uhhhhhhhhhh

japanese ruleset hinders mk in that it makes his matchups worse against like every char. no delfino or frigate as a CP makes it harder. and FD is broken for several chars.

he's still da bess but i think this set makes it closer with chars like ICs or diddy.

and yo, i ****ing hate when people just run away too. japanese ruleset makes it easier for me to chase and catch them

 

[SoulPech]

It makes more characters a little better with the Japanese Ruleset. Yeah..it hinders MK because...well it's MK, but I personally hate the Japanese Ruleset too because the characters I use fair better on CPs like Delfino and Frigate.

 

[Roller]

Jiggs' fair is just as bad on neutrals as it is on Delfino.

 

[Pimp Daddy Supreme]

looooooooooooooooooooooooool

soulpech just keeps gettin bodied

 

[Gifts]

@apasher Wut.... Sorry you don't get to rely on gimmicks such as wall infinites and walk off's that some stages produce in other rule sets. However you also do need to remember that say for example my character is loosing halberd and frigate which benefit my character also.




Inb4umaintoptierchsracter


Also, i agree with tutu... derek, i know you are better than that. :/

 

[Damittom]

How does having a flat static stage hinder any character.

Playing on Smashville does noting to harm DDD. It doesn't make Wario under perform. There are no gimicks that hurt you character.

However, playing on RC, Frigate, Castle Siege, ect. Hider characters. Some just aren't playable at top level on these stages due to advanced techniques that are nearly impossible to be performed to completion.

So stop saying the Japanese Ruleset hinders characters. If anything If buffs good characters that were hindered by the above stages.

And this is coming from the Game and Watch main.

Just cause I can beat Tutu on Brinstar does not make me think my character is good or that I know the stage better than Tutu. It shows me my character can take advantage of Brinstar's gimicks better than his.

 

[Apasher]

You are missing the point.

Static stages themselvs don't hinder characters. It's just that top tier characters have a huge advantage on static stages, and since they pretty much beat the majority of the cast, other characters like do poor. Having a stagelist with just static stages gives those characters a huge disadvantage.

I feel that the Apex stagelist just balances the game overall, because the cast in this game is s unbalanced that some chars actually NEED CPs.

 

[SoulPech]

How does having a flat static stage hinder any character.

Playing on Smashville does noting to harm DDD. It doesn't make Wario under perform. There are no gimicks that hurt you character.

However, playing on RC, Frigate, Castle Siege, ect. Hider characters. Some just aren't playable at top level on these stages due to advanced techniques that are nearly impossible to be performed to completion.

So stop saying the Japanese Ruleset hinders characters. If anything If buffs good characters that were hindered by the above stages.

And this is coming from the Game and Watch main.

Just cause I can beat Tutu on Brinstar does not make me think my character is good or that I know the stage better than Tutu. It shows me my character can take advantage of Brinstar's gimicks better than his.

It's going on personal opinion. Characters like Ice Climbers are amazing on flat stages because most characters don't have a place to run to (besides ledge) to escape the grabs. Same with Diddy and his banana throwing. When you have platforms, it makes the MU easier, however because of platforms and where they're located, some characters have difficulty to approach, mostly some mid and low tier characters. By putting in janky stages, like Frigate or Delfino, gives more of a fighting chance because it gives the rest of the cast more of a chance to approach.