Noobicidal
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2008
- Messages
- 3,551
40:60 - Lucas' Advantage
This thread will be used to help keep match up discussion clean and concise. This series of threads will all be linked to the compendium.
With that said, this thread is dedicated to the Jigglypuff/Lucas match up. Let the discussion commence!
Match Up Summary
Lucas has a rather effective and safe spacing game, utilizing PK Fire (and all of its variants), F-Tilt (which also doubles as a killing move), and Fair (another killing move as well). PK Fire isn't too much of an issue for Jigglypuff due to her aerial mobility, and also due to the fact that, with proper spacing, PK Fire can be canceled out with Pound or any other aerial aside from Dair. Due to PK Fire's diagonal hitbox, Jigglypuff can't safely space Dair to cancel it.
Compared to most other match ups, we can't simply rely on getting Lucas off-stage in order to gimp him. Unlike his Mother counterpart Ness, Lucas has an amazing array of recovery options. Wave-bounced PK Fires, Magnet Pulls, PKT2, and the ability to use a tether recovery using Zair helps to maintain his off-stage longevity. PK Thunder also has the added benefit of not canceling itself out when the head comes in contact with another player. While this makes gimping as Jigglypuff significantly harder, we can still add anywhere from 10% to 40% if we manage to get Lucas off-stage.
Stage Picks and Bans
Yoshi's Island is the most preferred Neutral stage to take Lucas to. The naturally uneven ground can mess with Lucas' auto-cancel shenanigans, and due to the stage having walls all the way down to the lower blast zone instead of the usual "open" bottom, a poorly aimed PKT2 recovery can result in him bouncing off the wall and killing himself. The support ghosts can ironically enough hinder Lucas' recovery, such as pushing Lucas out of tether range, and destroying PKT2 upon contact.
As for non-Neutral stages, Castle Siege is a great counter pick against Lucas. The uneven land during the first transition helps to protect against PK Fire Spam, and the statues during the second transition will completely block PK Fire (until they are eventually destroyed). The third transition offers a MASSIVELY tilted landscape, and the dimensions are perfect for setting up gimps.
Brinstar is usually Jigglypuff's main counter pick (along with RC, of course), but Lucas can do nasty things there. When Jigglypuff is in contact with the vegetation there, her hitbox for Rest expands. That's great and all, but if Lucas chooses to abuse the vegetation, not only can he enjoy the benefits of enlarged hitboxes, he can make several of his moves have EXTENDED hitboxes, in terms of both size and duration. For example, if Lucas were to stand on one of the platforms and D-Smash the root connecting it to the stage, he'll be able to abuse it, without suffering any additional start up lag. He can also abuse the permeable floor, and use PKT2 to recover back on-stage, which opens up ANOTHER recovery option for him.
As for neutral stages, you'll want to steer clear of Battlefield. Lucas controls the stage a lot more effectively than we do, and he also has several tricks to abuse (Ledge jump FH Dair while landing on the nearest platform, for example).
Final Word
Lucas is a character who excels in spacing and recovering, which are two things that Jigglypuff does NOT want to deal with in a match up. Lucas has a safe and effective approach, and can kill Jigglypuff in a plethora of ways. Even though he can recover very well, this doesn't mean that we can't harass him in the process. As long as the Jigglypuff player doesn't get baited into a killing move or take unnecessary damage with PK Fire, Jigglypuff CAN win this battle. As is suggested in almost every match up, get Lucas off-stage and attempt to gimp him.
Relevant/Important Links
Lucas' Frame Data - http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=211307
The Lucas Match Up Thread - http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=246877
Projectile Canceling as Jigglypuff - http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=218940