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List of Fox's Changes

Skarfelt

Skarfelt

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Skarfelt
These are all of the observable changes/notable things about Fox! Feel free to suggest anything else that you’ve noticed. This is still a WIP.



Attributes
Initial Dash: 2.4 -> 2.09 (1st -> 17th)
Fall Speed: 2.05 -> 2.1
Gravity: 0.19 -> 0.23
Air Speed: 0.96 -> 1.11 (39th -> 32nd)

Misc
Short Hop: 24 frames
Short Hop Fast Fall: 17 frames
Full Hop: 37 frames
Full Hop Fast Fall: 27 frames

Damage Changes
Jab1: 2 -> 1.8
Jab multihits: 0.7 -> 0.6
FTilt (high): 8 -> 7
Fair1: 2 -> 1.8
Fair2: 1 -> 1.3
Fair3: 0.6 -> 1.8
Fair4: 0.8 -> 2.8
Fair5: 3 -> 4.8
Up Air2: 11 -> 10
Aerial Illusion: 3 -> 5
Grounded Illusion: 3 -> 8
Firefox multihits 2 -> 1.8
Firefox final hit: 14 -> 16
Firefox final hit (late): 8 -> 10

Frame Data Changes
Dash Attack FAF: 36 -> 32
Nair FAF: 42 -> 39
Fair FAF: 50 -> 44
Grounded Illusion FAF: 70 -> 55
Shine startup: 6 -> 3
Shine FAF: 41 -> 37
Standing Grab FAF: 29 -> 37
Dash Grab FAF: 36 -> 45


Observations and Opinions

Jab
  • Jab1 and Jab2 now have locking properties.
  • Not enough hitstun to do any mixups on-hit
  • Rapid Jab Ender now causes tumble at 0%*
  • *the tip of the Jab Ender doesn’t cause tumble, so holding Jab may be risky
  • Can be held for longer to do more damage

Dash Attack
  • Combos better as either a result of that or KB changes

Up Tilt

Forward Tilt
  • BKB dramatically increased, so much so that it no longer locks (either that or the angle is changed, but it seems like the former)
  • Can now combo off the move at very low%; you can actually do FTilt to DTilt, or FTilt to DA

Down Tilt
  • Entire hitbox pops up now
  • Very high BKB means it can combo into everything even from 0%
  • Has a reverse hitbox that can be comboed off (need video footage of this)
  • Can combo into imagination, but best followups are Fair/Nair

Up Smash
  • Hitbox significantly bigger, can sweetspot BF platforms

Forward Smash
  • Significantly stronger (kills Mario at the edge of FD at 89% with DI

Down Smash
  • Seems unchanged, might hit lower but that might just be magnet hands being nerfed

Nair
  • God move
  • Combos into everything and out of everything, same as before but lower landing lag makes it godly
  • Will check shield stun values for SH and FH next

Bair
  • Hurtbox doesn’t shift until first active frame, so there’s no vulnerability hurtbox extension
  • Hitbox seems different somehow; not exactly sure, but it feels like the move's hitbox is a bit further down and closer to Fox, then thinner at the tip
  • This means it can hit some chars rising that couldn't be hit before, but only when Fox is close

Uair
  • Hitbox seems thinner

Fair
  • Has a landing hitbox that we never ever ever want
  • Lower landing lag means that you can do SH Fair, get the final hit, fast fall, then combo into Uair
  • Can still do dragdown Fair stuff from a shorthop

Dair
  • Pretty garbage
  • Can do AC Dair while fast falling much easier
  • AC Dair still combos into imagination, but Fair/Nair are probably the best
  • Mutlihits pop grounded opponents up; if you whiff the landing hitbox, you can actually combo this into Up Smash
  • Landing Dair doesn’t get the hitlag thing from Smash 4, so followups are super rare

Blaster
  • Fires faster between lasers

Illusion
  • you already know
  • Grounded Illusion way better, higher damage and lower lag makes it more practical
  • You can immediately drift after aerial Illusion

Firefox
  • Significantly bigger hitbox
  • Significantly higher BKB
  • Readjusted damage so it's mostly in the final hit

Shine
  • Active frame 6 -> 3
  • Invulnerability on frames 2 and 3
  • BKB increased, so you can Shine Spike (but it's normally quite bad)
  • Only Shine Spike if they lose their jump; if you do Fair Spike to Shine, pretty much everyone can still just DJ back and you lose all stage control
  • To true Fair Spike into Shine, you have to SD (from run off Fair)
  • Still not good imo


Some bread and butters using new combo routes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_f7hbJP6FA&lc
 
Last edited:
leejaybird

leejaybird

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Didn't watch the video, but the first hit of Up Air has fixed knockback, so it can true combo into up smash at any percent.
 
BradLeeTee

BradLeeTee

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Mar 16, 2015
Messages
66
Loving this iteration of Fox so far, those DTilt combos are pretty sexy. My only complaint is fast fall FAir is extremely difficult to pull off now, I can only seem to get it to work a quarter of the time. Also shine having frame 2 invulnerability is a pretty big deal isn't it, seems like it'd be great for breaking out of combos
 
Last edited:
Skarfelt

Skarfelt

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Skarfelt
Updated the thread with damage and frame data changes. Also gonna post shield stun stuff here, as it's important but not technically a change. They're based off what I counted, so they may be wrong. First value is shield stun, second is the value OoS

Jab1: 3 (-12)
Jab2: 2 (-16)
DA: 11 (-16)
DA(late): 8 (depends, earliest is -16)
FTilt high: 7 (-11)
FTilt: 6 (-12)
FTilt low: 7 (-11)
UTilt (sweet): 8 (-16)
UTilt (sour): 7 (-17)
DTilt: 8 (-12)
FSmash: 10 (-22)
DSmash: 10 (-36)
USmash: 11 (-36)
Nair: 4 (-3)
Nair(late): 3 (-4)
Bair: 5 (-4)
AC Bair: 5 (-5)
Uair1: 3 (-10)
Uair2: 4 (-9)
Dair: 2 (-15)
AC Dair: 2 (-8)
Fair: 3 (-15)
Blaster: 2 (-lol)
Aerial Illusion: 3 (-26)
Grounded Illusion: 3 (-26)
Shine: 3 (-31)


EDIT: Updated the OP with some stuff (FAF on aerials that were changed, fixing some speculation for some moves, tested FSmash KO% etc.)

EDIT2: Forgot soft Nair, it has 3 frames of shield stun
 
Last edited:
DavemanCozy

DavemanCozy

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Dr3amSm4sher said:
I feel like getting "late" AC bairs is impossible now. Did they change bair?
Click to expand...
They changed the autocancel window to frame 18 instead of 15, so it's a bit harder to do late AC b-air now. This is offset a bit with the reduced landing lag (9 frames instead of 15) and the increase in falling speed though.
 
DavemanCozy

DavemanCozy

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From:
smashboards.com

Official - v10.1.0 Patch Notes

Welcome to the official Patch Notes thread for v10.1.0 of Ultimate. https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/54095 Due to a lack of significant quantifiable balance changes (IE: frame data, minimal knockback angle changes), simply use the Competitive Character...
smashboards.com smashboards.com
:ultfox:Fox
  • Forward Air:
    • Made hits link more reliably
    • Increased hitbox size of first to fourth attacks
  • Down Air:
    • Made hits link more reliably
    • Increased hitbox size of all attacks
Click to expand...
The increased size makes F-air drag downs easier, as well as his d-air combos easier
 
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