• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Social Let's Hit the Climax! Bayonetta on Super Smash Bros. Ultimate - Social Thread

blackghost

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 9, 2015
Messages
2,249
50 percent isnt much in this game. most bayo combos only get 30-40 percent. top tiers in ultimate can get 60 plus. peach can do 70 from a grab. same with pichu. lima, zack, and tamim are just that good and if they just played their peaches instead of bayo theyd win a large events.
 

Call_Me_Red

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2018
Messages
420
Location
Yeehaw, Texas
I'm so confused how to win with Bayo. What do I do in neutral? Spam side b? What do I to kill? Spam back air?

I get she has combos but she has literally nothing else. And sometimes the platform will just straight up stop your combo and it feels like it's unavoidable. She is so frustrating to play as, but God I love it.
 

Ulk

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 10, 2016
Messages
55
Location
Germany
50 percent isnt much in this game. most bayo combos only get 30-40 percent. top tiers in ultimate can get 60 plus. peach can do 70 from a grab. same with pichu. lima, zack, and tamim are just that good and if they just played their peaches instead of bayo theyd win a large events.
Outdated post, but I also need to add that low tiers reaching higher levels in competitive play in the hands of top players isn't anything special. Outside the hands of those top players, Bayonetta is nothing more than any other low tier in this game.
 

Phoenix_is_OK

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Messages
103
Well guys we lost Lima. Our last Bayonetta player seems to be Geist. Hopefully Nintendo sees this as a sign that "hey, maybe this character needs to be fixed just a bit"

Absurd landing lag, zero throw pressure before 160%, zero shield pressure, absurdly laggy smashes that have more endlag than Ganon's but kill much later, Smash Attacks clank with everything, moves that people fall out of/ can tech out of (side B, Up tilt, side tilt), laggy bullet arts, Fsmash blindspot, frame 8 counter with a full second of endlag that only works past 90%, you can get outprioritized in your own counter, witch twist doesn't ledge snap, no charge drop, gutted kill moves from previous game (see: Nair and Uair), Fair has 12 frames of landing lag for some reason, techable jab, etc etc etc.

Fix literally any of those things, and she has a chance. But as is, the character is absolutely terrible. You have to outplay your opponent 70% of the match to win.
 

Call_Me_Red

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2018
Messages
420
Location
Yeehaw, Texas
Well guys we lost Lima. Our last Bayonetta player seems to be Geist. Hopefully Nintendo sees this as a sign that "hey, maybe this character needs to be fixed just a bit"

Absurd landing lag, zero throw pressure before 160%, zero shield pressure, absurdly laggy smashes that have more endlag than Ganon's but kill much later, Smash Attacks clank with everything, moves that people fall out of/ can tech out of (side B, Up tilt, side tilt), laggy bullet arts, Fsmash blindspot, frame 8 counter with a full second of endlag that only works past 90%, you can get outprioritized in your own counter, witch twist doesn't ledge snap, no charge drop, gutted kill moves from previous game (see: Nair and Uair), Fair has 12 frames of landing lag for some reason, techable jab, etc etc etc.

Fix literally any of those things, and she has a chance. But as is, the character is absolutely terrible. You have to outplay your opponent 70% of the match to win.
Really all I want is some solid kill options. Bair is fine, but when it's the only reliable tool it become predictable. I would love a F throw buff, and for smash attacks to be more consistent. I can live with her mediocre combo game, or her decades of end lag, and even her lack of neutral if she just gets kill options. Please Sakurai, it's time to go vroom.
 

ぱみゅ

❤ ~
Joined
Dec 5, 2008
Messages
10,010
Location
Under your skirt
NNID
kyo.pamyu.pamyu
3DS FC
4785-5700-5699
Switch FC
SW 3264 5694 6605
I personally would only like for her combos/specials to link better into themselves, and reduce her special lag a bit to make it more aligned with the game's general flow.
I am fine if she struggles to kill since she'd rack up percents better, and Witch Time would become a niche defensive option with similar purposes as her Smashes (though a slight duration buff wouldn't hurt).


Her grab game as of right now seems fine; if anything make Uthrow set up for juggles better, but right now it feels ok: Fthrow is a late killer, Dthrow is a (rather inconsistent) combo starter, and Bthrow can be used for sending the opponent offstage.

And she does have shield pressure, which is specially good against opponents on a platform. Against grounded opponents you can kinda pressure them, but your normals are slow and your specials induce tons of lag so... yeah... always ban FD.
:196:
 
Last edited:

Wunderwaft

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 21, 2019
Messages
3,458
How do you actually fight Snake as Bayonetta?
This match up feels like a complete curb stomp.
 

ぱみゅ

❤ ~
Joined
Dec 5, 2008
Messages
10,010
Location
Under your skirt
NNID
kyo.pamyu.pamyu
3DS FC
4785-5700-5699
Switch FC
SW 3264 5694 6605
The matchup is a nightmare.
I am not sure what your best options are though, everything is unsafe.
Just make sure to NEVER lose grenades or C4s from sight.
Bayonetta's best tool period is ABK, but most of his moves beat it anyway.
And be careful with platform pressure, he can pull a grenade and hide in his shield to stay safe while making you explode.
But landing is his weakest attribute, try to capitalise on it by throwing attacks and keeping yourself low to the ground.
You might want to chase him offstage, that's fine but always remember he has tons of mixups, some potentially lethal.
Uair (and Bullet Arts) is probably the best tool against Nikita, but isn't 100% certain.
And yes, it feels impossible to approach to him,


Welcome to the average matchup of a low tier vs a top tier (or polarising high tier).
:196:
 
Last edited:

Megadoomer

Moderator
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Jun 28, 2013
Messages
10,254
Switch FC
SW-0351-1523-9047
https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/45405

Bayonetta seems to have gotten a decent amount of buffs in this patch.

Neutral Attack 1: Increased the amount of time hit detection lasts.

Flurry Attack Finish: Extended launch distance.

Dash Attack: Extended launch distance for the high-damage range.

Up Tilt Attack: Made it easier to hit multiple times.

Down Smash Attack: Increased the amount of time hit detection lasts.

Side Special: Reduced vulnerability when landing.

Up Special: Reduced vulnerability when landing.

Down Special: Increased the amount of time counter detection lasts. Increased the amount of time Bat Within’s detection lasts. Increased the recovery speed of Witch Time's duration.

I'm particularly glad that her dash attack was buffed; it seemed practically useless compared to how it was in Smash 4.
 

Phoenix_is_OK

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Messages
103
https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/45405

Bayonetta seems to have gotten a decent amount of buffs in this patch.

Neutral Attack 1: Increased the amount of time hit detection lasts.

Flurry Attack Finish: Extended launch distance.

Dash Attack: Extended launch distance for the high-damage range.

Up Tilt Attack: Made it easier to hit multiple times.

Down Smash Attack: Increased the amount of time hit detection lasts.

Side Special: Reduced vulnerability when landing.

Up Special: Reduced vulnerability when landing.

Down Special: Increased the amount of time counter detection lasts. Increased the amount of time Bat Within’s detection lasts. Increased the recovery speed of Witch Time's duration.

I'm particularly glad that her dash attack was buffed; it seemed practically useless compared to how it was in Smash 4.
Fair 1 2 into Jab looks like a kill confirm. This is good ****
 

ぱみゅ

❤ ~
Joined
Dec 5, 2008
Messages
10,010
Location
Under your skirt
NNID
kyo.pamyu.pamyu
3DS FC
4785-5700-5699
Switch FC
SW 3264 5694 6605

Erotic&Heretic

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 27, 2013
Messages
3,676
Location
France
The reduction of landing lags with the Afterburner Kick and Witch Twist is a godsend. It was worse than Smash 4, now it's on par when doing one attack, and it's even better than Smash 4 when doing ABK x 2 + Witch Twist x 2.

39 frames of landing lag instead of 50, it's so noticeable.
 

Guybrush20X6

Creator of Lego Theory
Joined
May 22, 2012
Messages
15,882
NNID
Guybrush20X6
3DS FC
4253-3477-4804
Switch FC
SW-2140-7758-3904
It'll be interesting to see if people who previously dropped Bayonetta will pick her back up again.
 

Call_Me_Red

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2018
Messages
420
Location
Yeehaw, Texas
It'll be interesting to see if people who previously dropped Bayonetta will pick her back up again.
Personally I'm giving her another chance. I forgot how fun she was, and now I feel like the meta has advanced and we have slightly more kill power. It feels good, honestly.
 

ぱみゅ

❤ ~
Joined
Dec 5, 2008
Messages
10,010
Location
Under your skirt
NNID
kyo.pamyu.pamyu
3DS FC
4785-5700-5699
Switch FC
SW 3264 5694 6605
Witch Time is threatening again and having new kill options like Dash Attack is a godsend.

But she still is a combo-oriented character whose combos don't always work and opponents often fall from them, and none of her kill options are safe.
At least she doesn't feel hopeless like she used to, that made her fun to play as once again.
:196:
 

Call_Me_Red

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2018
Messages
420
Location
Yeehaw, Texas
Witch Time is threatening again and having new kill options like Dash Attack is a godsend.

But she still is a combo-oriented character whose combos don't always work and opponents often fall from them, and none of her kill options are safe.
At least she doesn't feel hopeless like she used to, that made her fun to play as once again.
:196:
Hella agreed. I'm actually having fun playing as her again. I still get the nagging in the back of my head that she's not worth the time, but then I do a sweet combo off the side and it feels better again.

Idk, I know the buffs weren't perfect, but jab being able to kill along with the Witch Time buff makes me believe.

So guys, it's been almost 2 weeks since the buffs. What's everyone's opinions?

I feel like Bayo is vastly improved, and now that everyone's over the initial nerf from ssb4, we can move on with what we actually have. I still think Bayo is lacking in certain departments, mainly ending lag and priority. But I think in the right, well trained hands she can be a real threat.
 

Kokiden

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
782
Post patch she's a bit better. Less end lag on her specials does help, and WT improving a bit means I can actually use it in my arsenal now lol.

That said, viability wise, in the right hands, I think she can do ok, as Captain Zack demonstrated at SnS. Not great. Just ok.

You'll need a secondary though. She's still not good enough to solo main.
 

KatKit

Smash Lord
Joined
May 7, 2014
Messages
1,628
Location
The Sass Realm
Pre-patch, I thought she was decent... not as over-tuned as she used to be, but not terrible or anything. After the recent adjustments, I think she's totally viable, especially in the right hands and in certain matchups; she's pretty solid. I know it's anecdotal evidence, but every committed Bayonetta player I've run into online is crazy good (and the buffs only made them scarier). In time, I think more people will start picking her up again.
 
Last edited:

Call_Me_Red

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 29, 2018
Messages
420
Location
Yeehaw, Texas
Pre-patch, I thought she was decent... not as over-tuned as she used to be, but not terrible or anything. After the recent adjustments, I think she's totally viable, especially in the right hands and in certain matchups; she's pretty solid. I know it's anecdotal evidence, but every committed Bayonetta player I've run into online is crazy good (and the buffs only made them scarier). In time, I think more people will start picking her up again.
I can't help but feel like she has some hidden, unlocked potential that's only untapped because nobody plays her. Idk, I guess we gotta play her more to find out.
 

Kokiden

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
782
I can't help but feel like she has some hidden, unlocked potential that's only untapped because nobody plays her. Idk, I guess we gotta play her more to find out.
Captain Zack's Twitch stream lately has him playing Bayo only. He's got some sick combos in that. I think he's the best person to learn from right now, aside from personal play that is.
 

Phoenix_is_OK

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 17, 2019
Messages
103
I don't think she is viable yet, but she isn't in the worst position either really. She's a hard character to succeed with and Zack is starting to achieve some awesome feats with her, but the cracks are showing. He's carrying the character. With that said, I feel we are close to winning some tournaments now. Assuming we get buffed during the next patch, we could be a tournament contender again.
 

Kokiden

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
782
I don't think she is viable yet, but she isn't in the worst position either really. She's a hard character to succeed with and Zack is starting to achieve some awesome feats with her, but the cracks are showing. He's carrying the character. With that said, I feel we are close to winning some tournaments now. Assuming we get buffed during the next patch, we could be a tournament contender again.
They’re being extremely cautious and conservative with a Bayonetta.

The fact that it took this long to get any decent buffs means they’re going to be monitoring her results closely to make sure she doesn’t dominate.

I think it will be awhile before we see a decent patch again.
 

Kokiden

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
782
https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/platinum-games-explains-bayonetta-3s-e3-no-show/

In case anyone was wondering.

Development is going well, and they think it’s a bad PR move to reveal something at every E3. Just because they’re not showing it doesn’t mean it’s not going well.

It’s going to be a big title that will have a different structure from its predecessors.

A part of me is worried about that. I hope it ends up being a great title despite the structural change.
 
Last edited:

Megadoomer

Moderator
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Jun 28, 2013
Messages
10,254
Switch FC
SW-0351-1523-9047
https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/49877

Patch 8.0 is out, and Bayonetta seems to have gotten some buffs. I'm not sure how big of an improvement most of these are, but her side special has "reduced vulnerability", her up tilt has increased attack speed, and her up special shortened the distance that an opponent can move with hitstun shuffling when repeatedly hit (which sounds like it means that it's harder to escape from, but I'm not sure), among other improvements.
 
Last edited:

Kokiden

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
782
Yes! She finally got buffed.

Something is better than nothing, so I'm glad for that. Can't wait to try them out later.

I think reducing lag is a big improvement for her. She was already so slow to begin with, or maybe I'm jumping the gun lol. Have to give her a go after this patch first!
 

Kokiden

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 24, 2019
Messages
782
Welp Bayonetta still remains as disappointing as ever even post patch.

Funny since she got a "big buff" and she's hardly improved. This is probably as good as it's going to get for her unfortunately. WT remains atrocious and her priority when exchanging blows is 90% her getting overcome.
 

Altais

Smash Champion
Joined
Nov 14, 2007
Messages
2,083
Location
Starbase, where no turtle has gone before.
I still wish they would restore her to her former Smash 4 glory, without making her overpowered. Mine idea is that the higher the enemy's damage percent, the more hitstun Bayonetta's attacks deal, thus making her combos harder to escape. This way, opponents at 0% can easily escape and not be dragged up into the blast zone at the start of the match. Although, I don't know how hard that would be to implement.
 

Megadoomer

Moderator
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Jun 28, 2013
Messages
10,254
Switch FC
SW-0351-1523-9047

Here's hoping that the update is substantial, as opposed to another "we're working on it!" with no signs that they're actually working on it. (no screenshots, trailers, gameplay, etc.) I want to get my hopes up, but it's been three years since the announcement with absolutely no new info.
 
Last edited:

ぱみゅ

❤ ~
Joined
Dec 5, 2008
Messages
10,010
Location
Under your skirt
NNID
kyo.pamyu.pamyu
3DS FC
4785-5700-5699
Switch FC
SW 3264 5694 6605
"Development is going fine"
My only relief will be if they do confirm a Switch pro and Bayo 3 has special capabilities with it.
:196:
 

Megadoomer

Moderator
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Jun 28, 2013
Messages
10,254
Switch FC
SW-0351-1523-9047
Bayonetta 3 finally has a trailer!

Though I'm not sure if Hellena Taylor is voicing Bayo in the game, going by this Tweet:


The game's scheduled for a 2022 release.

Not sure if the new enemies are different versions of angels, or if they're based on something in Japanese mythology. I'm pretty sure the person who sliced the release date at the end is a redesigned Jeanne, going by the stuffed animals attached to the sword. I'm not a fan of Bayonetta's redesign, but maybe it will grow on me, and I'm sure they'll have the option to choose her Bayo 1 and 2 outfits.
 
Top Bottom