Layton takes the case! The Professor Layton for Smash Ultimate support thread!

GoodGrief741

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I was reading the old comments here and from what I've seen Level 5 hasn't done their usual October announcements yet?

Also I've watched the anime and it's fun, but that's because I expected the characters to act like that, I hope it's not the same in the next game tough.
So the anime's fine but here's my rant on why the game should be different. In the game it felt like they're set up for character development or at least explaining why they act like they do but they had to leave it to the next game because you can take the cases in any order. So they end up feeling like caricatures by the end, because at the start when trying to follow the train of thought they're really interesting, but by the end nothing's happened and you just feel drained and start taking everything at face value.

Kat likes eating, nothing wrong with that. Stops at shops in the middle of an investigation. Not as fine. It would be fine if it was as an excuse to question someone there without having to explain why she wants to go there and most of the time you do get more information so it feels fine, but since she doesn't tell that that's the reason even to the only two people who have to endure the trip every time you start to question if it is just luck. Ernest seems to think that she knows what she's doing but then half the time he looks as confused as everyone else.

She says she uses instinct and that makes an interesting dynamic with her adversary who uses pure logic. Instinct is just using logic but filling the blanks which would explain why she wins against someone who expects a proof to explain every step of the mystery when it's just not possible. But we can't see her tought process and the only times when she actively goes to the most likely place to have clues are when Ernest or Sherl suggest it. So it does feel like Emiliana's right and it's just luck.

Ernest is my favorite character but I like him most when he's not just showering Kat with praise every second. He doesn't do it that often but still enough that after the third time any time is too much. It would be fine if it was left for the really impressive parts. Plus he doesn't get to solve anything in the main story so all the bonus puzzles where he gets praised back (no really it happens) are lost because everyone skipped puzzles because of the lower quality, so it feels like Kat low key hates him or likes the praise because she's a Narcissist but doesn't care otherwise. And I really don't think that's the case.

Basically it feels like Kat solves everything with no effort even though she's running around all the time and that Ernest did all the work when searching for clues but he helped so quietly that he feels useless.
They should be a fun team but their relationship feels wrong from both ends. One while having none of the negative reactions (yet) feels like a nice guy waiting to happen and the other just seems to be using him.

Because he doesn't even get paid. It would make sense if they stated that she hopes he stops helping her but again it's just left like that. If she really is so nice the explanation could be that she wants him to focus on his studies or the agency just isn't big enough to pay him and maybe he gets the living expenses paid for but Sherl just points out that he really should get payed and we're supposed to accept that he's so annoying he deserves this.

You can never tell what she thinks about anyone and the only way to know anything is by her actions.
There's maybe two scenes that save her from feeling like an Ice Queen.

Sherl doesn't help, he always points every unexplained thing out which makes it feel way worse. I think it would be fine if those things didn't happen often since the other games still had stuff like that, but while it's not really that common it feels like it is because Sherl points it out every-single-friggin time!

Plus I think the interface for clues spoils everything even with the red herrings.

So I think what they were going for is this: Katrielle doesn't like to waste time by putting all her reasoning into words, Ernest knows it.
She doesn't like to show emotions all the time because I guess something happened we don't know anything yet.
Ernest is basically a co-founder of the Agency and lives there so he's fine with not getting payed until the affairs really start going.
Kat realises that her methods make her seem untrustworthy so she starts explaining why she does things.
Sherl is our point of view and the reason we know that she does use logic when investigating (he did ask if she goes to eat as an excuse once but it was never mentioned again, now it needs to be answered).
Emiliana realises what instinct really means while showing her how to appear professional so they help each other.
Because right now it feels like a children's story with a title that implies a twist ending that makes it enjoyable for adults, but where the last part is unreadable and you'll have to wait for a reprint to know if the twist ending is really there or the printer had a stroke and tried to print another story onto it.

Basically I hope I explained what I think they were going for and why it could be great but why it doesn't work if they don't explain anything. Just any scene that implies there's something more instead of basing everything on the fact that something feels off and that the writers are supposed to be better than this.
Yeah, I also felt playing the game that Kat basically lucked out and guessed everything. I guess with the Prof., he gave out his explanations, so it didn’t feel that way. But when Kat basically made a guess and turned out to be right, I felt the game bent over backwards to praise her. She definitely felt a bit Mary-Sue-ish to me.
 
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Yeah, I also felt playing the game that Kat basically lucked out and guessed everything. I guess with the Prof., he gave out his explanations, so it didn’t feel that way. But when Kat basically made a guess and turned out to be right, I felt the game bent over backwards to praise her. She definitely felt a bit Mary-Sue-ish to me.
It's just that it feels like she's smart but reasonably, not in a Mary Sue way, but the writers didn't feel like they needed to show it and it backfired horribly. But that might just be my need for more female protagonists taking. Because I'm a pretty young girl but still old enough to remember when there weren't a lot of good protagonists yet and how much it hurt realizing the wasted potential and how negative it can be. Because I'm one of those who thinks media helps shape society just as much as promoting the sane diversity in reality. So a new protagonist makes a big and potentially good difference and I hate seeing it go wrong for stupid reasons like writers assuming they have to write in a completely different way which makes it feel fake and impossible when it's just the writer's mindset being wrong. I was saying all of this because I don't take Mary Sue accusations lightly with how bad writers are with female characters in most genres. Thankfully the Layton series seemed to be an exception but now this happened and I don't know anymore. They had great characters but they didn't really do much, but that wasn't really a problem since no one except the Professor and Luke really did much and then in the prequels Emmy and also Aurora I guess got to help. But now that doesn't feel like enough anymore if that's what they do with a more important character.
 

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Can we just never use the term "Mary Sue" again because the roots of it is rooted in sexist fan circles and it just gets thrown around in ways that don't even make sense considering it was supposed to refer to a fan self-insert, not "any competent female character".

Like I know Mystery Journey has major writing issues but I do really enjoy how Kat is handled in the anime more. Like to me the problem with Mystery Journey is not Katrielle herself by a long shot, just the explanations and pace of the game and the mysteries therein. The anime resolves that to me and also emphasizes the fun of Kat as a character.
 

GoodGrief741

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Can we just never use the term "Mary Sue" again because the roots of it is rooted in sexist fan circles and it just gets thrown around in ways that don't even make sense considering it was supposed to refer to a fan self-insert, not "any competent female character".

Like I know Mystery Journey has major writing issues but I do really enjoy how Kat is handled in the anime more. Like to me the problem with Mystery Journey is not Katrielle herself by a long shot, just the explanations and pace of the game and the mysteries therein. The anime resolves that to me and also emphasizes the fun of Kat as a character.
I apologize, I didn’t know there were sexist connotations in the term. Thanks for the education.

I guess the problem I have with Kat’s character could have to do with the mysteries. Regardless, in a mystery game, I think those are very much linked.

I should probably watch the anime though.
 
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Can we just never use the term "Mary Sue" again because the roots of it is rooted in sexist fan circles and it just gets thrown around in ways that don't even make sense considering it was supposed to refer to a fan self-insert, not "any competent female character".

Like I know Mystery Journey has major writing issues but I do really enjoy how Kat is handled in the anime more. Like to me the problem with Mystery Journey is not Katrielle herself by a long shot, just the explanations and pace of the game and the mysteries therein. The anime resolves that to me and also emphasizes the fun of Kat as a character.
I agree, I just have a problem with her character because she feels different in the anime and I think it's just because with everything animated the upbeat personality is more noticeable, but it really feels like sometimes she's exaggerating it in the game, not that much in the anime because it's even more lighthearted. In the game when she's not super interested in something (which is always only food) it seems like she doesn't care about anything and it just feels like she's an Hollywood Bipolar
 
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Admittedly, while the storylines in the Layton series have been quite fun and engaging, I do agree that when it comes to the character department in the Layton series, things tend to fall quite a bit flat.

The original Layton trilogy had this issue where the writers seemed to have the constant need to emphasise the Sherlock and Watson dynamic between Layton and Luke, that they more or less completely neglected to develop other characters within that group, or looking for whatever excuse they could find to throw them to the wayside.

Flora is probably the most blatant example of this, which bums me out quite a bit as I did enjoy her character and design and the implications that the ending of Curious Village brought in when I first finished it, but after that it seemed like the writers were looking for any excuse they could find to write her out of the plot, no matter how tacked on it was. To this day there are still a lot of Layton fans crying out for her return and to be given her due as a proper character in her own right rather than a plot device.
She kind of reminds me of Pokemon Trainer Leaf/Green and what she and her fans had to go through, exists once, then quickly thrown into the wayside in favor of focusing solely on Red and Blue despite fan outcry for her to come back which goes largely ignored for years until just this year, and it took Sakurai to bring her back from obscurity, not Gamefreak (Until Lets Go but who knows if that was a last minute thing after the praise Smash got for bringing back Leaf....)

Other characters I felt we could have probably learned a bit more of but didn't get that much screentime either where Don Paolo, Katia, Claire, Clive and Anton, the latter of whom was more or less all over the promotional material including the box art, but you don't really get to meet him until the end of the game...

The prequels improved on that aspect a bit by not fully focusing everything on Layton and Luke and giving other characters the chance to shine, but even that sometimes kind of felt a bit lacking and not fully fleshed out. Only to then throw a ton of plot twists one after another at the end of AL which then becomes a bit too much for a lot of players to take in.

With Kats game however, I still haven't gotten around to playing her game, but from what's being described, It does sound a bit like something I might not really enjoy too much, here's hoping they improve the dynamic between Kat and Ernest in the next game if they decide to bring them back.

Sorry for the wall of text and minirant by the way, might have gone a bit carried away. I still enjoy the series, but I can definitely see that it does still have its flaws, naturally. I still love most of the characters in the series, but I do also feel that they could have done more with a lot of them. Here's hoping they bring some back one day and flesh them out a bit more.
 
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With Kats game however, I still haven't gotten around to playing her game, but from what's being described, It does sound a bit like something I might not really enjoy too much, here's hoping they improve the dynamic between Kat and Ernest in the next game if they decide to bring them back.
Yeah the dynamic is already way better in the anime, like seriously if they could just start a trilogy on top of the Millionaire's conspiracy so they have the chance to get three games with good pacing and act like there's only the anime for MC they'd be golden. They still don't have much going on in the anime but Kat has a way more consistent personality and Ernest is his lovable not too praising self. It just feels like how it should have been where sure the story is still simple but with the complete dedication to humor it makes more sense and if works way better instead of going from good in half of the cases to complete tonal dissonance in others. I can't really tell you if there really were significant changes or if it's just because the comedy actually works now but the dynamic is way better and with the more mysteries you can see that Kat really is a good investigator. Even the episodes with cases from the game were better, tough I liked the Ratman one in the game more. It's just that the pacing makes more sense for the anime while they really need to fix some things in the game. Or at least change the clue list a bit because there's a reason the other games had no blank spaces for missing questions. I think that just doing something more like the Detective Conan Wii game would be great. It was fine not figuring out anything and watching the Professor explain everything when the mysteries were complicated but now they go from too easy to completely absurd so I think having you put the clues in place to solve them might make it more satisfying.
 
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So apparently dataminers managed to get their hands on the full version of the game due to some street dates being broken. So far only music files have been obtained though we'll probably know more about the game before long.

If you want to avoid any spoilers, especially in regards to World of Light, you might want to tread very carefully from here on out until release.

For now I'm just waiting for dataminers to decrypt all spirits data and see how many there and if there are any potential characters from Level-5 among them. I'll be sure to keep it all under spoiler tags if we do come to that point.
 

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A prototype for the Layton Nendoroid has been revealed recently.

(I hope we get a Katrielle Layton Nendo soon. I want one of hers more than Hershel personally)
I've been watching the anime series and thanks for convincing me to give it a try, it's really fun! I loved the characters in the game but I got a bit of tired of them by the end but in the series they're super fun! They still haven't had any moment where they get serious like I hoped from the game but it makes sense here so it doesn't bother me. And because it's animated I can see everything happening so that weird feeling of the protagonists being useless until the case is solved is completely gone! It's just really good, I think that really is what they were going for from the start. I still hope they do something different in the game because it doesn't work
 
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So this is the whole spirits list apparently.
https://pastebin.com/NCi8Af0N

It's by full names rather than file names but I'll trust that this is the whole lot.

Spoilers in case you don't want to know what's in (or isn't in)

I didn't scour the whole thing (There is more than a thousand apparently), but I did use the find option to check if there where any spirits from Level-5.

Layton doesn't seem to be among them, not even Jibanyan or any Level-5 character for that matter. (Phoenix Wright is also not listed from what I can see for those who are curious)
I don't know if this may mean something significant in terms of Level-5 content for DLC but hopefully they didn't get shafted entirely once again...

Also no Level-5 mii costumes in case you're curious (In fact, there are no third party mii costumes at all from what I've heard, not even the DLC ones from last game)

Well, back to hoping that we'd see Layton for DLC.
 
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So this is the whole spirits list apparently.
https://pastebin.com/NCi8Af0N

It's by full names rather than file names but I'll trust that this is the whole lot.

Spoilers in case you don't want to know what's in (or isn't in)

I didn't scour the whole thing (There is more than a thousand apparently), but I did use the find option to check if there where any spirits from Level-5.

Layton doesn't seem to be among them, not even Jibanyan or any Level-5 character for that matter. (Phoenix Wright is also not listed from what I can see for those who are curious)
I don't know if this may mean something significant in terms of Level-5 content for DLC but hopefully they didn't get shafted entirely once again...

Also no Level-5 mii costumes in case you're curious (In fact, there are no third party mii costumes at all from what I've heard, not even the DLC ones from last game)

Well, back to hoping that we'd see Layton for DLC.
I looked at all the names and didn't find anything new. But I found some other characters I like so Yay! Since it's SE I doubt I'll ever see Octopath tough. I really want to believe that they consider Level-5 important, because I can't think of any big companies that aren't already in so I have hope
 

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I am going be real here.

While I am still of the mindset that Japanese third-parties will be in the roster, I fear that Layton might have more competition with other third-parties. Among the Japanese franchises that are bigger and more iconic than Layton, there is:
-Resident Evil
-Monster Hunter
-Tekken
-Frogger
-Kingdom Hearts
-Tales Of (Taking account of Berseria's sales)

I feel that Sakurai may just stick to licensing characters from companies participating with their characters. I was really hoping that the base game would cover a few new third parties more than Simon to clean out Layton's competition, but it turned out that Simon was the only one present. With only 5 spots put forth for DLC newcomers, there might not be room for Layton, considering the possibility that first party Nintendo characters account for potentially a few of those spots. I just hope that a second pass happens, and I also hope that the third-parties above will be taken care of so that Layton has less competition. I am pretty much praying for a miracle at this point.
 
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I am going be real here.

While I am still of the mindset that Japanese third-parties will be in the roster, I fear that Layton might have more competition with other third-parties. Among the Japanese franchises that are bigger and more iconic than Layton, there is:
-Resident Evil
-Monster Hunter
-Tekken
-Frogger
-Kingdom Hearts
-Tales Of (Taking account of Berseria's sales)

I feel that Sakurai may just stick to licensing characters from companies participating with their characters. I was really hoping that the base game would cover a few new third parties more than Simon to clean out Layton's competition, but it turned out that Simon was the only one present. With only 5 spots put forth for DLC newcomers, there might not be room for Layton, considering the possibility that first party Nintendo characters account for potentially a few of those spots. I just hope that a second pass happens, and I also hope that the third-parties above will be taken care of so that Layton has less competition. I am pretty much praying for a miracle at this point.
To be honest, I personally can't really see any of the current five third parties getting more than one new series included via DLC (at least not in one season pass) which should cut down some of the potential competition for Layton, That said, we probably will be seeing a couple first party characters though.

I do agree that things might look better for the Prof if there was a second season pass at least.
For now I just hope Sakurai will include at least one or two brand new third party companies via DLC, and hopefully Level-5 would be one of them...
 
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Special thanks to Professor Pumpkaboo Professor Pumpkaboo for making me aware of this.



So an HD remake for Professor Layton and the Diabolical/Pandora's Box has just been announced!
I'm starting to feel more optimistic on the idea of us getting an HD collection of the original Layton trilogy for the Switch at some point down the line.

In the HD remake of Curious Village they added some extra scenes and collectibles for that game, what would you like to see them implement for this game though?

It's probably just wishful thinking, but I'd like to see them add the option to re-explore Dropstone after you visited Folsense, because in the original that area becomes permanently inaccessible. Perhaps it may not be possible to revisit it with Layton and Luke due to plot related reasons, but they can probably bypass that by letting you play as Flora instead with an additional bonus sidequest and puzzles you can solve there. (It would address the complaints people had about how she was handled in that game too) Maybe learn a bit more about Katia's family as well.

Just spitballing some ideas there, but it's good to know that the Layton series will still be active by next year.
 
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Special thanks to Professor Pumpkaboo Professor Pumpkaboo for making me aware of this.



So an HD remake for Professor Layton and the Diabolical/Pandora's Box has just been announced!
I'm starting to feel more optimistic on the idea of us getting an HD collection of the original Layton trilogy for the Switch at some point down the line.

In the HD remake of Curious Village they added some extra scenes and collectibles for that game, what would you like to see them implement for this game though?

It's probably just wishful thinking, but I'd like to see them add the option to re-explore Dropstone after you visited Folsense, because in the original that area becomes permanently inaccessible. Perhaps it may not be possible to revisit it with Layton and Luke due to plot related reasons, but they can probably bypass that by letting you play as Flora instead with an additional bonus sidequest and puzzles you can solve there. (It would address the complaints people had about how she was handled in that game too) Maybe learn a bit more about Katia's family as well.

Just spitballing some ideas there, but it's good to know that the Layton series will still be active by next year.
While I remember being unimpressed by the plot twist it still had some of my favorite locations, so that's great. I remember hearing first about the series thanks to this one, it had a lot of commercials here in Italy, though they may have been only targeted to children since I was like ten. I still hope that with this one more people that remember about the commercials will decide to try it. I was too little when it came out so I have to thank a friend for making me play it some years later, I don't think I'm the only one. There are a lot of Layton fans here in Italy and basically anyone who cares about the DS has heard of the series, but not that many keep up with the series enough to have heard about the remake. I think it would change if they ported the HD editions to switch tough, unless those DS kids quit gaming completely.
So yeah an HD collection would have some great timing. I saw Mistery Journey on Gamestop's shelf today but it was really high up so it wasn't that easy to notice. I hope that the sequel will earn the center placement, the cover does look cool so that alone would give it some more publicity. Probably more being on the switch. Maybe it did have commercials but I doubt it
 
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While I remember being unimpressed by the plot twist it still had some of my favorite locations, so that's great. I remember hearing first about the series thanks to this one, it had a lot of commercials here in Italy, though they may have been only targeted to children since I was like ten. I still hope that with this one more people that remember about the commercials will decide to try it. I was too little when it came out so I have to thank a friend for making me play it some years later, I don't think I'm the only one. There are a lot of Layton fans here in Italy and basically anyone who cares about the DS has heard of the series, but not that many keep up with the series enough to have heard about the remake. I think it would change if they ported the HD editions to switch tough, unless those DS kids quit gaming completely.
So yeah an HD collection would have some great timing. I saw Mistery Journey on Gamestop's shelf today but it was really high up so it wasn't that easy to notice. I hope that the sequel will earn the center placement, the cover does look cool so that alone would give it some more publicity. Probably more being on the switch. Maybe it did have commercials but I doubt it
Yeah I think Level-5 is mainly trying to target the casual audience who have mostly moved on to Smartphones after the DS and Wii era's, which is why they generally try to push the series on to smartphone platforms with their games lately.
However, they do know that a lot of Layton fans are also huge Nintendo fans which is why they do still make sure to release the series on to Nintendo consoles too, which is why LMJ also released for the 3DS and Switch (In Japan at least) which probably also helps on the idea that they are most likely planning to release an HD collection for the original trilogy once they get Unwound/Lost Future out of the way too as they have yet to announce a standalone Switch version for Curious Village HD, so they probably want to bundle them together once all three games have been remastered.

I've heard that the series was highly popular in Europe, most particularly in the UK and Spain (Which may be true as I do recall meeting a lot of Spanish Layton fans in the past) It's nice to know that the series did well in Italy too.
In regards to LMJ's marketing, I believe that game was the first one marketed completely in house (as in, Level-5 self published it even outside of Japan, rather than Nintendo doing it) so I don't know how well it was marketed, but I think Nintendo may have done a better job at giving the Layton series a bigger presence in the games industry though. But then again, the game still sold very well from what I've heard so I guess the games are notable enough to sell on brand recognition alone...
 
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On the topic of the original games, if you guys haven't seen this yet, it's pretty interesting and perhaps gives us some clues as to what constitutes that Layton magic. Some of it sadly won't be recovered (Akira Tago was very important) but there are lessons to learn. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UN8VMM2oAM&

It has to be said, they really nailed the genesis of the games. Some games, even great and groundbreaking games (Metroid, Zelda - as good as those entries are), didn't nail it first time but I think it's fair to say that Professor Layton did.

I do hope they keep supporting Nintendo - and vice versa. Layton, as a staple Nintendo DS franchise, will always feel at home on the hardware and I think the game would adjust to Switch marvellously, both in terms of the hardware and the potential audience. Layton doesn't really work on mobile but take some of that know-how to the Switch and that will be something very special.

One can hope.
 
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On the topic of the original games, if you guys haven't seen this yet, it's pretty interesting and perhaps gives us some clues as to what constitutes that Layton magic. Some of it sadly won't be recovered (Akira Tago was very important) but there are lessons to learn. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UN8VMM2oAM&

It has to be said, they really nailed the genesis of the games. Some games, even great and groundbreaking games (Metroid, Zelda - as good as those entries are), didn't nail it first time but I think it's fair to say that Professor Layton did.

I do hope they keep supporting Nintendo - and vice versa. Layton, as a staple Nintendo DS franchise, will always feel at home on the hardware and I think the game would adjust to Switch marvellously, both in terms of the hardware and the potential audience. Layton doesn't really work on mobile but take some of that know-how to the Switch and that will be something very special.

One can hope.
Oh yeah, I've seen that video before, been meaning to share it but never really had the chance to. It gives a good insight on how the series came to be and its definitely worth checking out.

Its definitely one of the few instances where the first entry kickstarted a series popularity in one go. Though maybe Hino should have heeded NoE's advice earlier in regards to the boxart as they really seemed to know how to market the game well, the way he did it in Japan was a bit odd by mainly highlighting the voice actors over the game itself...

Its unfortunate about Akira Tago though, hopefully he shared some insight with Hino on how to design good puzzles before his unfortunate passing. I think this may play in on how much the Layton series meant to Hino, why it was his favourite franchise and how happy he was that he managed to make the series as big as he did. He turned something that he enjoyed in his childhood into something big and even introduced the puzzles of the puzzle master that he looked up to to a wider audience.

It would be great if he managed to get Layton into Smash with Sakurai's help and introduce this series to an even larger audience than ever before.

And no worries, I'm sure they will continue releasing their games on Nintendo consoles as they know how popular the Layton series is to Nintendo fans too.
 
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Level-5 just released an overview trailer of the upcoming HD remake of the Elysian Box.

Nothing really new has been shown off yet (At least as far as I can tell) but I guess this is probably just a reveal trailer for now, we'll probably hear more about it at a later date if there is anything new included into the game. Or if it will follow the same set up as Curious Village and include a couple new cutscenes and collectibles.

Also, Level-5 just released this too.
Guess we're going to learn about the new main villain very soon, by next episode I believe so we can look forward to that.

A bit odd that they are revealing all of this before the next game is even announced, not sure what this may entail, do you think the next Game will still involve Kat or are we perhaps getting a new main protag while the anime handles the rest of her story? Guess we'll have to wait and see...

Eitherway, It's nice to know that we're starting to get more Layton news in, hopefully we will be hearing about the next entry soon.
 
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Joker gives me hope that Sakurai will be expanding to other Japanese gaming companies for characters. Technically, Atlus is of SEGA, but still. It gives me hope that Sakurai may have negotiated Level-5 for Layton. The only question now is determining the project plan matter cause I think Layton's chances will increase exponentially if it was decided this year, the year that Level-5 takes their relationships with other characters more seriously.
 

MegaMarioMan9

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I think our chances are looking good. If they’re going for popular third-party characters, Layton’s there, man.
Not just popular, but surprising too. Apparently these DLC characters are supposed to surprise us this time around, and I think this reveal can attest to that. Layton will have flown under almost everyone's radar if he ends up getting revealed.
 

GoodGrief741

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The idea that we could get Phoenix vs. Layton in Smash is wonderful. Like, it feels so possible now. Yes please.
You know, today I was hanging out with a friend talking about expectations for the Game Awards, and talking about the 2014 show I remembered Layton vs. Wright came out that year and told him all about it.

Fast forward after the Game Awards and now it looks like Layton vs. Wright could happen again?

If that isn’t prophetic I don’t know what is.
 

BluePikmin11

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Here are my current thoughts on Smash DLC speculation, specifically in regards to project plan dates.

I think Smash DLC characters were decided around the second half of 2016 taking Sakurai's word on Rex in the DLC project plan because of the XC2 announcement in January 2017 being too late and take the Japanese release of Persona 5 that came out on September 15, 2016.

There is no way Sakurai could have decided DLC earlier than the second half of 2016 without having to play P5 first to motivate his decision, especially in the case of third-parties. He may or may not have had early access to the game given his developer connections, so it is possible Joker could have been decided a month early around August, but given P5's lengthy playtime and Sakurai's comment on the issue in the Famitsu column, I think it is much more likely that his decision could have been done weeks or months after possible early access of the game. Joker could have been possibly decided around September to December 2016.

Right now, I do not think characters that debuted in Japan later than the announcement of Xenoblade 2 have a chance even in hell. Unless Sakurai clarifies further on the specifics behind Joker's decision and the direction Ultimate DLC will be headed in later Famitsu columns, this is what I firmly believe. I am open to the possibility of DLC being decided 2017 and 2018 though, so I am somewhat cautious of my theory.

So, I am kinda back on square one again. The possibility of Layton being decided in 2016 is real still and slightly increased, though not strong yet.
 

GoodGrief741

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Here are my current thoughts on Smash DLC speculation, specifically in regards to project plan dates.

I think Smash DLC characters were decided around the second half of 2016 taking Sakurai's word on Rex in the DLC project plan because of the XC2 announcement in January 2017 being too late and take the Japanese release of Persona 5 that came out on September 15, 2016.

There is no way Sakurai could have decided DLC earlier than the second half of 2016 without having to play P5 first to motivate his decision, especially in the case of third-parties. He may or may not have had early access to the game given his developer connections, so it is possible Joker could have been decided a month early around August, but given P5's lengthy playtime and Sakurai's comment on the issue in the Famitsu column, I think it is much more likely that his decision could have been done weeks or months after possible early access of the game. Joker could have been possibly decided around September to December 2016.

Right now, I do not think characters that debuted in Japan later than the announcement of Xenoblade 2 have a chance even in hell. Unless Sakurai clarifies further on the specifics behind Joker's decision and the direction Ultimate DLC will be headed in later Famitsu columns, this is what I firmly believe. I am open to the possibility of DLC being decided 2017 and 2018 though, so I am somewhat cautious of my theory.

So, I am kinda back on square one again. The possibility of Layton being decided in 2016 is real still and slightly increased, though not strong yet.
I think DLC was decided recently, between 2017 and 2018. There would have been no reason to add Joker before knowing what a global phenomenon Persona 5 would become. I think when Sakurai apologized about Rex on November 1, DLC had already been decided, or at the very least, Sakurai knew Nintendo wanted third parties only and thus Rex was out of the running.

If DLC was decided recently, with Layton’s Mystery Journey, the anime, and all them ports confirmed, we might be in a sweet spot.
 

BluePikmin11

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I think DLC was decided recently, between 2017 and 2018. There would have been no reason to add Joker before knowing what a global phenomenon Persona 5 would become. I think when Sakurai apologized about Rex on November 1, DLC had already been decided, or at the very least, Sakurai knew Nintendo wanted third parties only and thus Rex was out of the running.

If DLC was decided recently, with Layton’s Mystery Journey, the anime, and all them ports confirmed, we might be in a sweet spot.
Honestly, I think Persona 5's overall game quality alone would be enough to convince Sakurai to add Joker in Smash in late 2016. Sort of a Shulk situation with the game's quality playing a primary factor to inclusion in S4's base game, and sort of a Corrin situation with the assurance of localization with Fates for DLC.
 
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GoodGrief741

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Honestly, I think Persona 5's overall game quality alone would be enough to convince Sakurai to add Joker in Smash in late 2016. Sort of a Shulk situation with the game's quality playing a primary factor to inclusion in S4's base game, and sort of a Corrin situation with the assurance of localization with Fates for DLC.
Xenoblade had been out for a while though. Smash 4’s development began after March 2012, when KI:U finished development. By that time Xenoblade had come out in Japan, Europe and Australia, Project Rainfall had happened, and Xenoblade was a month away from release in the US.
 
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I've been a bit out of the loop, been getting stuck in with Smash Ultimate all day and unlocking all the characters until I come here and hear that Joker is confirmed as one of the five DLC characters? If what I'm reading above correctly, the following DLC characters will be surprise picks and characters that haven't appeared in Smash before?

On one hand, this is great news for the Prof, but on the other, I'm now feeling even more nervous in regards to wether or not he will be able to make it as one of the remaining four characters.

I guess at least thinking about it, I don't want to jump the gun but, I think we will most surely get at least someone from Level-5 as DLC. My mind says it will be Jibanyan, but my heart says Layton... OTL
At least both where highly demanded, most particularly during the ballot period and Sakurai and Nintendo seems to be in a good relationship with Level-5 and Hino so I think they have a good shot in getting at least someone for DLC.
Here's hoping...
 
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NintenJen

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Been a while since I posted here. I apologize for my absence. Rest assured I will still check on this thread from time to time (and I have) although with having two jobs now my time on the web is limited. So I may not comment here as much. :/

I want to state first that good things are happening to the Layton franchise, with Level-5 making the OT more accessible than ever through mobile and the anime running smoothly. Also, does anyone feel like Level-5 are releasing ports for the OT because they have something bigger to announce for Layton in the future? I mean, it would definitely work if it's for a Smash announcement. Making the games accessible to newcomers is a perfect way to introduce Layton into Smash. When Joker was revealed, I've seen some reactions where they're unfamiliar with the character even though Persona 5 was well received. It's also only on PS4 so far which limits availability, but there's a rumored Switch version coming. I assume Layton will probably get that same treatment if he's announced because he isn't as huge as say - Sonic or Mario.

If Layton is a DLC character, then newcomers can easily get into the games with their phones and tablets. Without them they would either have to emulate or buy the DS versions which are not cheap. (Although, I was able to get DB and UF for fair prices at GameStop.) Maybe it's a subtle way of Level-5 preparing Layton for Smash? It's either that or something else. Maybe a new game.

And with Joker being the next DLC fighter, my hopes for seeing Professor Layton have shot up. He fits the criteria Reggie was talking about at the Game Awards last night, with the DLC featuring characters new to Smash, characters people don't expect. Dark horse candidates, Joker was a perfect one, and Layton falls into that category. This makes me happy that Nintendo is willing to go more outside the box for DLC.

That, and the fact that Atlus was the next Japanese company to receive a rep. There's few companies remaining - Level-5 is one of them. I honestly think they are going to get a rep. They still have to do their Vision conference which hasn't happened yet (for some odd reason) but if it's being pushed back to 2019 then that could work out with the Smash DLC releases. Especially if they launch it in January since a Nintendo Direct is rumored for that month.

Of course there is no guarantee, but chances are looking good for Professor Hershel Layton! :D Bonus if he is in a double reveal with Phoenix Wright, oh that would be so amazing.

Unless Level-5 decides to go with Jibanyan as their rep, which is also possible... but we all want the good Professor instead, lol.
 
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Been a while since I posted here. I apologize for my absence. Rest assured I will still check on this thread from time to time (and I have) although with having two jobs now my time on the web is limited. So I may not comment here as much. :/

I want to state first that good things are happening to the Layton franchise, with Level-5 making the OT more accessible than ever through mobile and the anime running smoothly. Also, does anyone feel like Level-5 are releasing ports for the OT because they have something bigger to announce for Layton in the future? I mean, it would definitely work if it's for a Smash announcement. Making the games accessible to newcomers is a perfect way to introduce Layton into Smash. When Joker was revealed, I've seen some reactions where they're unfamiliar with the character even though Persona 5 was well received. It's also only on PS4 so far which limits availability, but there's a rumored Switch version coming. I assume Layton will probably get that same treatment if he's announced because he isn't as huge as say - Sonic or Mario.

If Layton is a DLC character, then newcomers can easily get into the games with their phones and tablets. Without them they would either have to emulate or buy the DS versions which are not cheap. (Although, I was able to get DB and UF for fair prices at GameStop.) Maybe it's a subtle way of Level-5 preparing Layton for Smash? It's either that or something else. Maybe a new game.

And with Joker being the next DLC fighter, my hopes for seeing Professor Layton have shot up. He fits the criteria Reggie was talking about at the Game Awards last night, with the DLC featuring characters new to Smash, characters people don't expect. Dark horse candidates, Joker was a perfect one, and Layton falls into that category. This makes me happy that Nintendo is willing to go more outside the box for DLC.

That, and the fact that Atlus was the next Japanese company to receive a rep. There's few companies remaining - Level-5 is one of them. I honestly think they are going to get a rep. They still have to do their Vision conference which hasn't happened yet (for some odd reason) but if it's being pushed back to 2019 then that could work out with the Smash DLC releases. Especially if they launch it in January since a Nintendo Direct is rumored for that month.

Of course there is no guarantee, but chances are looking good for Professor Hershel Layton! :D Bonus if he is in a double reveal with Phoenix Wright, oh that would be so amazing.

Unless Level-5 decides to go with Jibanyan as their rep, which is also possible... but we all want the good Professor instead, lol.
Oh don't worry about it, whenever you have the time, feel free to drop by.

You brought up an interesting point in regards to Persona 5 potentially getting a Switch port. The HD remakes of the original trilogy may be done in order to give new players easy and legal access to the games if Layton does get revealed and their interested in trying out the games and getting up to speed with the series.

I'm not familiar with the persona series myself but apparently Atlus dropped a hint before in regards to Joker and Smash, if this is true then what if the notebook we talked about a while back may have had a double meaning? Serving as both a sticker from the real life equivalent as well as being designed to look simple enough to serve as a subtle nod at the Layton series potentially getting some representation in Smash? I mean it wouldn't be the first time that third parties dropped hints in regards to Smash as I believe that there was a hint that Rodin would appear in Smash too in the Switch port of Bayonetta and he was then later confirmed to show up as an assist trophy.

I guess it remains to be seen.

Anyway, I believe Level-5 and Koei Tecmo are the few notable remaining Japanese third parties that haven't gotten anything yet in Smash Ultimate, so I think their very likely to get at least something in Smash Ultimate's DLC, level-5 especially as like I said, both Layton and Jibanyan have done very well in most popularity polls I've seen, especially during the ballot period so Sakurai and Nintendo have most likely at least considered them. Plus as you stated, they have yet to do their Level-5 Vision which they delayed for whatever reason, might be worth keeping an eye on. Besides even if nothing gets revealed, we will most likely be hearing about the new Layton game there anyway.
 
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BluePikmin11

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Y'all, the anime's recent episodes have been getting crazy lately.

I got Fullmetal Alchemist vibes from certain scenes in the episodes. The mystery has definitely developed into something really interesting, and explores some pretty mature territory with some pretty shockng plot twists. A shame that it will be weeks until the next story-based episode comes.

Like, every Layton fan needs to watch this anime as soon as possible.
 
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Y'all, the anime's recent episodes have been getting crazy lately.

I got Fullmetal Alchemist vibes from certain scenes in the episodes. The mystery has definitely developed into something really interesting, and explores some pretty mature territory with some pretty shockng plot twists. A shame that it will be weeks until the next story-based episode comes.

Like, every Layton fan needs to watch this anime as soon as possible.
Where I'm watching it they're still at episode 34 but I'm happy my good first impression from that one wasn't wrong
 
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