King K. Rool early moveset discussion

[KingZing]

Beautiful

What does the announcer say thoguh, just King Rool? -.-

 

[Putuk]

Beautiful

What does the announcer say thoguh, just King Rool? -.-

Check out the english version of the video!

The announcer clearly says "KING KAY-ROOL!" in the localized version!

 

[SmashShadow]

It seems the cannonball might do significantly more damage after having been sucked up by the blunderbuss. That last hit did 17.9% damage.

 

[K~G|Spacejam]

Alright boys heres the damage of moves shown from new vid (for 1v1s)

Bair - 20%
Fair - 14.7% - 9.1% (Sour spot?)
Nair - 12.6% - 8.4% (?)

Bthrow(?) - 11.5%
Uthrow - 16.8%

Crown toss return - 6.3%
Cannon 45degrees - 17.9%



nair and fair either had sour spots or were partly staled

 

[meleebrawler]

Are you KIDDING ME? Alright there's too much going on, I got hyped as **** when I saw this. Also holy crap K. Rool is HUGE!

EDIT: OKAY so, Back throw has K. Rool slamming the opponents, dragging them on the ground and then tossing them behind for 11.5 damage, returning hit of the crown deals 6.3 damage, Back air is a huge back punch that deals 10 damage, Forward Air deals 14.7 damage and can combo into Kannonball (which deals a wtf 17.9 damage??), which kills heaviweights at 86%??? Up air is a crown headbutt, the crown can be picked up by opponents (sigh), Up throw's animation acts like Charizard/Kirby/MK Up throw and lands on platforms, PIVOT GRAB LOOKS HUGE, Nair is a belly splash similar to Dedede with little endlag that deals 12.6 damage i think?, jab is a two hit jab with AMAZING range, and finally down air is double leg stomp with like, no end lag too? I think I got it all?
EDIT2: UPTHROW DOES 16,8%??

Back air does 20%. Also I'm not sure we saw the full jab combo.

Looks like the crown doesn't follow K. Rool (or whoever happens to throw it) when returning. It returns to his head immediately upon despawning or after a second when going offscreen. Imagine the shenanigans possible by throwing it backwards and attacking in tandem with it's return.

Also keep in mind this match had a smash ball, so 1v1 modifier likely wasn't in effect due to items. Nair is likely a sex kick.

 

[Dε√ilj∦o]

Back air does 20%. Also I'm not sure we saw the full jab combo.

Looks like the crown doesn't follow K. Rool (or whoever happens to throw it) when returning. It returns to his head immediately upon despawning or after a second when going offscreen. Imagine the shenanigans possible by throwing it backwards and attacking in tandem with it's return.

Yes thats right, idk why I said 10. But 20% Is ****ing huge. Seeing the animation, maybe this back air could have a spiking hitbox? The motion looks similar to Mario's fair... But so does Ganondorf's but this one doesnt spike. Just saying it could be a possibility.

I'm... Honestly still disapointed with the Crown. For how long it takes for K. Rool to throw it, it would have been nice for it to be an item opponents cannot pick like Link's boomerang. I'm also not convinced by Blunderbuss... While it seems to deal massive damage and could lead to jank setups like we saw here, the fact that it looks like you're actually forced into the succion doenst look gread for him.

 

[Untouch]

Looks like the blunderbus cannonball has super armour too, snake throws the grenade at it and it doesn't stop like Jr's cannonball would.
Also since hazardless isn't off (the logs appear) I don't think this is the 1v1 mode, damage might not be scaled.

 

[New_Dumal]

I'm not disapointed at the crown at all.
This footage confirms K.Rool can move during the move, allowing frame traps.
The fact it turns to be throwable is also more positive than negative IMO.
If K.Rool himself is able to pick as a item, he got a z-drop trap and a glide toss. Link's boomerang was never that bad of a move,his other options that drags him down.

The Nair probably can't be used into a serious 1v1, hoping to be better than Dedede's one.

Blunderbuss looks... bad.
It's cool that the cannon ball keeps on screen time enough to K.Rool combo something into it, but the move itself looks like a Giant commit. There's not a single time where only the shot or only the suctions happens. That's alarming.

Good jab.

I wanted to see the tilts, UpB and more throws. UThrow is so weird. It's ok when Charizard,Kirby and Mk UThrows people and goes upward offscreen,but K.Rool?
Well... this throws have great shenanigans and doubles-play, so let's see ... I liked the footage and hope for something more coming next.

 

[Dε√ilj∦o]

Nair is a belly Splash meleebrawler . You can see it throughout the footage.
Nair looks decent to me? Dedede's Nair isn't bad and is a good combo starter, comboing tool and out of juggle option. K Rool's looks just as fast, but maybe with more endlag, but far more reach.
I love Up Throw. The fact that it deals a massive 16 damage AND puts the opponent above you is huge.
For now the only tilt we haven't seen is forward tilt. But honestly? I'm so hyped with this footage.
I think that if K. Rool takes his crown back, he puts it on his head automatically and can't use it as an item à la banana, metal blade etc. We'll have to see.

 

[Untouch]

I'm kind of mixed on the blunderbuss.
The cannonball eating up projectiles is going to be very nice, was one of Jr's biggest problems. If there's a way to cancel the suction it'll be a solid option there.

 

[Dε√ilj∦o]

I'm kind of mixed on the blunderbuss.
The cannonball eating up projectiles is going to be very nice, was one of Jr's biggest problems. If there's a way to cancel the suction it'll be a solid option there.

I really hope there is indeed a way to act out of the suction that wasn't shown here. I don't know the fact that we'd have to commit to it for all the animation just looks... Mediocre and make the move unnecessarily bad for no reason. Maybe we can at least jump out of it.

 

[C-G]

Krown facts

1) If you throw it and you miss the return, it spawns like an item

2) K Rool cannot pick up his crown like an item. It returns to his head

3) It will enter item state upon contact with terrain or if it goes offscreen.

SPECULATION: If K Rool magnetically attaches the Krown when it's in it's item form, maybe he does so if someone tries to hit him with the Krown when it's an item. I could see the crown being an item just as price for such a powerful tool, especially seeing how it sets up for combos stupid hard.

 

[Goodstyle_4]

The Nair probably can't be used into a serious 1v1, hoping to be better than Dedede's one.

Why not? It has a fat hitbox and comes out in 7 frames, looks pretty safe to land with. Also does 12%. Not bad at all.

 

[C-G]

RE: Blunderbuss

The K Rool player seems to be the type to not test whether suction is mandatory or not. I still suspect we'll see an option to cancel

Also, it seems that K Rool sucked up his own Cannonball since it was so close. Either that or the Grenade explosion. Which could be decent in both cases.

 

[meleebrawler]

Did anyone see if K. Rool attempted to airdodge or aerial the crown in order to catch it? Maybe it only returns to his head automatically if he simply touches it.

 

[G-Guy]

Krown facts

1) If you throw it and you miss the return, it spawns like an item

2) K Rool cannot pick up his crown like an item. It returns to his head

3) It will enter item state upon contact with terrain or if it goes offscreen.

SPECULATION: If K Rool magnetically attaches the Krown when it's in it's item form, maybe he does so if someone tries to hit him with the Krown when it's an item. I could see the crown being an item just as price for such a powerful tool, especially seeing how it sets up for combos stupid hard.

Where have you seen fact 2? I cannot seem to find the instant in the video.

I see 3 crown throws in the entire thing;

1st: at roughly 0:15

K Rool throws it off stage. Upon returning, you see that it has a small downwards angle, therefore it lands on the stage and stays there as an item, until snake picks it up and throws it upwards (note that the crown has gravity, because it starts to fall down a far bit above the highest Kongo falls platform)


2nd at 0:58

The crown gets perfect shielded by Snake, flies offstage and returns. All the while, K Rool applies shield pressure with his jab.
Note here that the crown returns to K Rool after he ended his jab animation. No opportunity here to catch it mid air.


3rd at 1:16

K Rool completely misses the catch and the crown flies off stage.


That’s everything I could find crown wise. It‘s still not clear if it can be used as an Item by him or not, though...

 

[C-G]

Where have you seen fact 2? I cannot seem to find the instant in the video.

1:21. The crown spawns a decent ways away from K Rool, a touch further than you would be able to pick it up. The Krown instead warps onto K Rool's head. You wouldn't get into range to grab it as an item.

 

[G-Guy]

1:21. The crown spawns a decent ways away from K Rool, a touch further than you would be able to pick it up. The Krown instead warps onto K Rool's head. You wouldn't get into range to grab it as an item.

Ah, I see what you mean.

It‘s kinda hard to completely „Rool“ out the possibility, though. Maybe the warping only happens in this very instant, where the crown respawns, it is aerial.

What about the crown that lies on the ground, though?

 

[Untouch]

Some frame data analysis.
DAir (or NAir, can't tell): Comes out on frame 7 (guess, doesn't hit snake right away), lingers for at least 4 frames, landing lag of either 12 or 13 frames.

UAir: Comes out on frame 7 or 8 (snake appears to dodge it, this is going on visuals alone), landing lag of either 14 or 15 frames (he gets hit, can't tell if the animation was over yet here, this is another guess).

BAir: Comes out on frame 17

 

[C-G]

Two more things of note in this fight

1) The Final Smash for KRool has a hitbox during the startup animation. Important to know if FSMeter becomes a thing

2) The animation of K Rool catching up his Krown and placing it on his head (as shown in his reveal) is absent in this trailer. This may lend credence to being 'immune' to his own Krown as stated earlier, but if so, means there's a small stun animation when he catches it of a few frames instead of an actual hitbox.

Some frame data analysis.
DAir (or NAir, can't tell): Comes out on frame 7 (guess, doesn't hit snake right away), lingers for at least 4 frames, landing lag of either 12 or 13 frames.

It's Nair. We see his Dair very briefly. It's a double foot stomp that at 1:21

 

[Untouch]

His hitboxes seem very large, this is a VERY good thing, for some reason many of the heavyweights in smash 4 had pitiful hitboxes.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I wonder if his U-Air has different properties depending on whether he has his crown on his head or not, would seem like it'd at least have a slightly smaller hitbox without it.

 

[SenSx]

I'm worried about K.Rool's blunderbuss.

It just seems terrible so far, from what we know and can see of course.
You are forced to have the aspiration after the shot, you can't cancel it.
It seems you can't suck right away, you have to shoot first.
When you get the canon ball back, the only way to shoot seems to be upward.
Besides this is probably the only way to shoot upward, you first have to catch the ball back or a player.

All of these actions require way to specific conditions that limit the possibilities, and slow down an alwready slow character.

Although the crown might be better than I expected.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Yeah I'm of the opinion blunderbuss looks potentially bad while crown looks pretty good, even if K.Rool can't use the crown itself as an item.

 

[C-G]

They both cover the same angle as a projectile. It'd make more sense if the Krown was the projectile of choice vs approaching, close combat ranges while the Blunderbuss's durability and reflect capabilities are used to win projectile wars.

 

[Untouch]

If the blunderbuss can suck up the cannonball when it hits an enemy it might be useful for some close range combos, it looks like it does a lot of damage.

 

[S_B]

Can we talk about the fact that his Dair looks to be the same as Ganon's, but without making him go stupidly shooting downward like Bowser or Ridley?

 

[Untouch]

Actually looking at the blunderbuss frame by frame is really confusing.
Snake throws a grenade at it and it just freezes in place, it isn't even hitlag because the rest of K Rool's animation plays, then the grenade explodes and damages snake but not the cannonball. I don't know if the cannonball works like the Gordo where you can knock it back (please no), or if you can suck it up back when it starts to fall (this looks like what's happening here).

It also slightly bounces up when it hits the grenade but quickly arcs down, so maybe it doesn't eat projectiles? Also the cannon was fired exactly where snake was, but I don't know if that was a coincidence as it doesn't look like it can be aimed.

 

[meleebrawler]

Yeah we might be better off not trying to zone with the blunderbuss so much as using it as an interesting close range mixup.

If I remember correctly Snake's grenades do have hurtboxes, so maybe we aren't looking at typical projectile interaction here.

 

[Deleted member]

i just hope we can use the blunderbuss without the suction, or vice versa and use the suction without the canonball.

 

[SenSx]

If the blunderbuss can suck up the cannonball when it hits an enemy it might be useful for some close range combos, it looks like it does a lot of damage.

Yeah we might be better off not trying to zone with the blunderbuss so much as using it as an interesting close range mixup.

If I remember correctly Snake's grenades do have hurtboxes, so maybe we aren't looking at typical projectile interaction here.

Those are actually good points.
Contrary to what I first though, Blunderbuss might be built for close range....and of course long range coward shots on people busy fighting each other :D

 

[C-G]

I suspect that the Blunderbuss 'sucked up' the explosion of the grenade and that's what triggered the second shot

 

[S_B]

I feel like we're looking at the BB the wrong way. My guess is that we're meant to pull it out at med range in order to bounce it off of something, inhale the cannonball, and then quickly fire it into the opponent.

I don't think we're going to want to use it as a zoning projectile after all, though the fact that the cannonball seems to demolish other projectiles is amazing...

 

[mynameisBlade]

He looks amazing!!! Can't wait to play this game.... (sucks when he is KO'd he doesn't make the "OOF" sound) Damn. Was hoping he'd get that like Megaman got his unique death animation. K. Rools would have just been a sound, but I still am psyched.

 

[Mysteltainn]

I wouldn't worry so much about the Blunderbuss just yet; we know next to nothing about it. The players didn't seem overly concerned about min/maxing their actions, either, so there's a good chance there's a lot more to it. It'll be interesting to see King K. Rool in competent hands to utilise his tilts, Krown Toss and Blunderbuss in scenarios that the player is confident in, rather than this player who throws things out pretty willy-nilly.

The demonstration at around 0:30 is something to be excited about though. Even if it rarely connects (and if it does it deals ****-tonnes of damage!), the amount of pressure that's going to cause people who try to recover high is going to be a real problem, and a good thing for K. Rool IMO.

Only thing that disappoints me is the lack of footage of his Helipak and no classical "Uuuooofff" when he dies.

 

[Thundross]

Looks like his crown throw really does cause people to flip around on the return hit.

 

[mynameisBlade]

Do you guys think this is what we will get instead of Sakurai explaining his move set?..

 

[Untouch]

Frame data on the DAir is confusing, I can't tell if the little spin is his double jump or part of his DAir, looks to be about 18 frames of landing lag though.

Also in regards to the crown, it was flickering before it disappears, I think it just despawned normally.
Also why does K Rool shine occasionally? Is it just a particle effect with the jewel on his cape?

 

[Dε√ilj∦o]

Dair is a double foot stomp. I'm pretty sure the spin is part of his double jump animation.
The occasional shine might be the new feature making players having the advantage during a match shine from time to time.
Man I just took a nap and dreamed about the footage we got lol. I hope we get more because watching this one again doesn't get boring. I'm way too hyped and K. Rool looks so promising.

 

[Untouch]

I'm thinking that you CAN pick up the crown, the only thing right now that suggests otherwise is how it respawns when thrown off the edge.
I wonder what makes it throwable, hitting enemies on the way back? Can you catch it? If its only the first case, setups might be hard here.

Also with the crown when he "picks it up", it was missed by K Rool and went off the stage, it never became an item so it may not have been treated as an item yet.