ITS ALIVE! Yoshi CP Stage Discussion Thread! (yeah, I have ideas. <3)

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#1
YOSHI CP STAGE DISCUSSION!



Oh we need a new one and you know it. I'll do everything in my power to keep you guys and this thread active.

We're only talking CP's and then Neutrals in another thread aw yeah. two discussions at once.
I have my own computer now. I can update better, Faster, and easier. Let's do work.

[collapse=MC-Killa's old thread]ok, scince the old ones dead and ive stopped working on the IC's mtchup thread im kinda bored now, so i wanna make a thread for stage discussion for yoshi,here youll find what stages are good/bad for yoshi,what stage you should take your opponet, and what stages to avoid.

by going in neutral order(neutral stages first,then CP stages) using this format:

*yoshi's general advantage on a stage(Do's)
*general disadvantage(Dont's)
*character advanatage(on a certain character) on a stage(if any)
*disadvantage
*what chars. to take to the stage
*what chars you should avoid taking to said stage
*Overall(on a scale of 1-10 with 10 being awesome)how would you rate this stage for Yoshi?
*summary(i suck at theses so guys help out)

so shall we begin then?


Yoshi's Island [Brawl]
*general advantage:its a Yoshi stage, xD, there is no anvil edge, the edges have nice slants, the platform can give us a down b slide, and DR is really easy on account of the slopes.

*general disadvantage:shyguys block eggs sometimes, the tilting platform can mess up CGs on the chars we have them on..

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:7/10

*Summary:a wildcard stage, if you're not sure about fighting a certain character,just go here,this is your best neutral stage, on the defensive, shyguys block projectiles and some attacks, the random platforms that pop up like to play with your luck just hope it dosent come out at the wrong time.

Battlefield
*general advantage:

*general disadvantageretty small stage can limit movement at times

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:other characters have more/better options than yoshi when it comes to the small space and platforms
click this too see more about vsing MK on this stage
*what chars. to take to this stage:Marth?ICs,Falco

*what chars you should avoid taking here:MK,Snake,GW,DDD,Samus, ZSS,Luigi

*Overall:5/10

*Summary:this stage is about prefrence, if youre the type of yoshi that mindgames with defenseve movements, then this stage is for you,if youre the type that needs lots of movement and spacing and dont prefer this somewhat cramped stage, stay as far away from this stage as possible
Smashville
*general advantage:flat stage for camping

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:snake, pika, and samus outcamp you here, and the moving platform makes MK even more campy

*what chars. to take to this stage:Marth,G&W,Ganon,Sheik

*what chars you should avoid taking here:MK,Pikachu,Samus,Falco,Wolf

*Overall:6/10

*Summary:alternitave flat stage if FD isint doin it for you,good amount of room for spacing and camping
Final Destination
*general advantage:flat,campy stage

*general disadvantage:*see smashville* with less MK dair camping

*character advanatage on this stage:*see smashville*

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:Falco,Snake,Diddy,ICs

*Overall:6/10

*Summary:

Starter/Counter

Lylat Cruise
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:this is a good stage simply because over half the cast will self gimp theirselves on the stage,yoshi however, is not one of them as long as you know the best methods to recover.you should never get gimped by the stage

*Summary:7/10
Halberd
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:5/10

*Summary:
Pokémon Stadium 1
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:

*Summary:5/10
Castle Siege
*general advantage:middle transformation has no walls so CGing is good here

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:easy kill on chars you can CG to the edge on the mid. transformation

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:MK

*what chars you should avoid taking here:peach,ZSS

*Overall:6.5/10

*Summary:Castle Siege is also good. In the first part, if you can keep the lower end of the stage, you have a nice advantage. It's harder to be approached, especially if you stick under the platform. The second part has statues which will block projectiles, a plus if you're fighting a character with annoying ones, and it's a walk off, so CG deaths there. The third is just a tilting FD, so it's good too.

Counter

Delfino Plaza
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:MK

*Overall:6/10

*Summary:
Brinstar
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:MK

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:

*Summary:4.5/10
Frigate Orpheon
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:high ceiling

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:
ZSS,Olimar,ICs,Bowser,Falcon,Falco,Ganon,Link,Soni c

*what chars you should avoid taking here:MK, Marth, G&W, Samus

*Overall:8/10

*Summary:omg i <3 this stage, so many people just dread when i pick it,this is another stage that gimps alot of characters, so its definatley a must in your list of counterpicks. this is one of those stage youll have to get used to playing on before you really wanna go here
Rainbow Cruise
*general advantage:low ceiling

*general disadvantage:low ceiling and walls

*character advanatage on this stage:bthrows on the left side are good for kills, top half uair kill lights-mids at 40-50%

*disadvantage: pretty much everything said above can be used on yoshi aswell and alot easier

*what chars. to take to this stage:Samus,Link,Ganon,Falcon,Ike

*what chars you should avoid taking here:Everyone else

*Overall:4.5/10

*Summary:refrain from using this stage in excess, scince your advanatges are also your disadvanatges.
Jungle Japes
*general advantagean recover well out of the water

*general disadvantage:high ceiling

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:Jigglypuff,Ike

*what chars you should avoid taking here:Wolf

*Overall:4/10

*Summary:
Pirate Ship
*general advantage:yoshi can fair spike for an easy kill

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking herehars with better spikes(Ganon,Samus,Falco,Ness)

*Overall:6.5/10

*Summary:
PictoChat
*general advantage:most drawings work in yoshi's favor like living longer or good camping ability

*general disadvantage:large ceiling

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:5/10

*Summary:
Pokémon Stadium 2
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:the electric stage will mess with your recovering

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:

*Summary:5/10

Counter/Banned

Norfair
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:vs Mario

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:Mario

*what chars you should avoid taking here:Sonic

*Overall:5/10

*Summary: Norfair is a very good stage for Yoshi against most characters. You can control the bottom platform and make it VERY difficult for an opponent to get in. Eggs can hit most of the stage from the bottom platform, and you can usmash through the middle ones. You can grab the opponent if they try to get in and throw them away and continue the defense of your bunker. However, it can also be very difficult for Yoshi to take the bottom platform back if you lose it. Never ever take Olimar or ROB there, because they will take it and they will **** you there.
Luigi's Mansion
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:high ceiling

*character advanatage on this stage:taking Jiggs to LM keeps her closer to the ground because of the ceiling, so it's easier to usmash or do whatever you'd like to stop her air moves. She may live longer because of the house though, but it shouldn't be a problem.

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:6.5/10

*Summary:a stage for the defensive yoshi,by abusing the mansion you can tech and give more space between you and your oppponet
Distant Planet
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:5/10

*Summary:Distant Planet is a good stage for us also. The slope is a great help for Yoshi. You can camp from the slope, and you can CG characters to their death on the walkoff. We even have an fthrow CG on some characters that we don't normally have a CG on going up the slope.
Green Greens
*general advantage:

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:5/10

*Summary:
Yoshi's Island [Melee]
*general advantagean CG to the edge and kill

*general disadvantage:

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:MK

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:9/10

*Summary:easily yoshi's best stage,easy camping and spacing, and the only true MK counter stage, however its rarely legal,but when it is dont think twice about picking it
Port Town Aero Dive
*general advantagean approach from under the stage

*general disadvantagears kill at 40%

*character advanatage on this stage:

*disadvantage:

*what chars. to take to this stage:anyone dumb enough to pick it on you

*what chars you should avoid taking here:

*Overall:1/10

*Summary:its delphino with cars that kill at 40%, dont even bother with this stage

[/collapse]

Format:
[collapse=95M]

Op: ηττπ:υυυ.σμασηβοαρδς.κομ/ποστ#716351:παγε:13367
Overall: Good!
[collapse=Write Up]
yoshi main said:
Use the size of the stage to use your eggs in a yummylicious fashion.
Use the fallaing springs as a wall to throw your eggs through and not let your opponet approach
better yoshi main said:
Use your eggs
Stay low to the bottom
long write up no one wants to read cause this guy puts effort into his stuff, don't get grabbed, if you press vB you are wrong.
More writeups that no one wants to read, and a little attack on delta for playing gay and winning here with 0%.
DR on this stage is fancy too, you can hop from platform to platform using DR.
TL;DR dis stage is bess
[/collapse]
[collapse=Characters>Stage]
Take:
:troll:
:yoshi:
:ganon:
:bowser:

Even(players prefrence):
:yoshi2:
:random:
:falco:
:Mario:
:mario2:

Ban dis stage:
:metaknight:
:metaknight:
:metaknight:
:yoshi:
[/collapse][/collapse]

Counterpick Stages:
Halberd
Pokemon Stadium 2
Brinstar
Delfino Plaza -NOW DISCUSSING!
Frigate Orpheon
Rainbow Cruise


Schedule:
Week 1: RC
Week 2: Frigate
Week 3: Delfino Plaza
Week 4: Brinstar
Week 5: Halberd
Week 6: PS2

[collapse=Rainbow Cruise]



OP: v.v down there silly head.
Overall: Good
[collapse=Write up]
There's 2 points here where we can wall infinite on this stage. The second one is really nice, because it is when the stage is dropping down. We can just usmash at the end of the chaingrab and kill them off the top then quickly fall down.
I took Will here in our most recent set and it worked out well. I won despite getting dtilted against the ship for a lot of damage first stock.

Basically, it's all about abusing our mobility options. Stay below (or far above, if necessary) during the vertical scroll. If you're caught above, just run away and work your way down if you find an opening. If you're below, throw eggs, Usmash them, and Uair them for pressure.

Once you reach the pendulum, I usually just stall it for a bit and then jump out to the right as the platforms are appearing. This forces the enemy to approach you and gives us a lot of advantages. The whole horizontal scroll is good for us. Platforms to use or poke through, and an entire portion for us to use for walkoffs or a ground game in general.

This stage is really good for us as long as you avoid MUs with really good aerial characters (GnW, Wario possibly, MK).

[/collapse]
[collapse=Characters>Stage]
Don't take:
:metaknight:
:wario:
:gw:
[/collapse][/collapse]

[collapse=Frigate]



OP:http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=309460&page=2 on default PPP, down there on 40 PPP (which I know all you yoshis enjoy.)
Overall: Good.
[collapse=Write Up]
This isn't like a hard CP for Olimar but we have a pretty decent advantage as long as we abuse the first transformation, the flips, and keep the center of the second transformation.

Frigate is fun but, as people said it already, don't take MK/Snake here. (Is snake really that bad here? Never seriously played on it.)

Silly Stuff we have here
  1. 1st Transformation
    • There's a Dtilt lock on the wall created when the right plat goes down.
    • That section also makes a pretty good camping spot.
    • Easy gimps off the right side. Most characters grab released off the side have to recover in a way so linearly that even if they get back on you can send em back off without much effort.
    • Going under the stage is pretty easy if you really feel like you have to.
  2. 2nd Transformation
    • Some characters have an extra regrab if you grab them at the center of the slope
    • Holding the Center is amazing for camping
    • We can DJ waveland up the slopes.
  3. Flips
    • That epic eggroll thing.
    • Not sure if we have any grab release related gimps on this stage, but if i find one i'll post it here later.

First Transformation, Great for aggression. Even supports camping if you pick the right spots.
Second Transformation, Great for camping.

Take characters with bad to meh recoveries, or characters that you either already out camp, or could outcamp with help of the slope on transformation 2.
I think Frigate is good depending on the MU. The first section is definitely not an issue at all. The second part is a coin toss. If you hold the center dip, you win. If you lose it, it can be impossible to get back.

MK rapes us here, so I would never go here in today's Metagame.
Frigate is a good stage that doesn't have MK or Snake on it.
MK cause he's MK and will find someway to punish some bad habit of ours and get us off the stage making us die from the first transformation (No ledge at right) while the second isn't really much of a problem other then he can scrooge (tesh's old frigate video)
Snake... Just the slants mess with everything along with him having more mobility with his grenades now.
^ This.

If you know Frigate, it's a great Yoshi stage more because it wrecks a lot of characters and both transformations help us in different ways (first part highly favors mobile characters and the second will let us out camp 90% of the cast due to the dip being too low for lasers and other projectiles and we can lob stuff out of it).

Characters I wouldnt take here off the top of my head,
Like Slush said, Meta Knight and Snake, Olimar, Pikachu, D3, and ROB.

This stage is really good to CP against,
Falco, Lucario, Toon Link, Fox, Wolf, DK, Sheik, Ness, Mario, Bowser, Samus, Link, Ganon.

Anyone I didnt mention, we shouldnt have much of a problem against them, just we dont **** them there.
[/collapse]
[collapse=characters]
Take:
:toonlink:
:fox:
:wolf:
:dk2:
:sheik:
:ness2:
:mario2:
:bowser2:
:ganondorf:
:samus2:
:link2:
:lucario:
:falco:

even:
:yoshi2:

BAD:
:metaknight:
:snake:
:olimar:
:pikachu:
:dedede:
:rob:
[/collapse][/collapse]


[collapse=Delfino]



OP: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=309460&page=4 or 2 on 40 PPP
Overall: TBA
[collapse=Write Ups]

Delfino is a good stage.
[/collapse]
[collapse=Characters>Stage]
Up to you!
[/collapse][/collapse]


ToDo:
write OP
Add Images
Finish CP's
Let the thread die(DRAT!)

Happy :yoshi:

:phone:
 
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#3
Alot of these wont take a full week to discuss. Others Might take more. Stage Discussion failed last 2 times because we didn't let the discussions end naturally. Not to mention we didn't have any real method of discussing them.
 
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#4
The schedule is easily bendable.
I won't say "stfu about battlefield it's FD time"
we can go at any pace, that's just a basic ideal pace so we have something to follow and get it done.

Do the plats mess up our eggs?

:phone:
 

Z'zgashi

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#5
They can, but they arent too bothersome. Really, if you know how to use your eggs, which if you're maining Yoshi you should, they shouldnt be a problem at all.
 
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#7
Sorry, just throwing this out there, but discussing stages like bf/fd and nuetrals first is extremely uninteresting. Not to mention we play on them the most, so everyone knows the stages decently. Past that it's mostly just matchups on these stages which belong more in matchup threads than in stage discussion.

I'd say start with the counterpick stages, maybe even counterpick/banned (green greens, norfair, japes, etc) to promote more discussion about stages that not everyone already has 999 games played on.

Also possibly 2 stages at a time, so people can comment even if they dont have a lot to say about 1 of the stages.
 
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#9
That's better :p

There's 2 points here where we can wall infinite on this stage. The second one is really nice, because it is when the stage is dropping down. We can just usmash at the end of the chaingrab and kill them off the top then quickly fall down.
 

Delta-cod

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#11
I took Will here in our most recent set and it worked out well. I won despite getting dtilted against the ship for a lot of damage first stock.

Basically, it's all about abusing our mobility options. Stay below (or far above, if necessary) during the vertical scroll. If you're caught above, just run away and work your way down if you find an opening. If you're below, throw eggs, Usmash them, and Uair them for pressure.

Once you reach the pendulum, I usually just stall it for a bit and then jump out to the right as the platforms are appearing. This forces the enemy to approach you and gives us a lot of advantages. The whole horizontal scroll is good for us. Platforms to use or poke through, and an entire portion for us to use for walkoffs or a ground game in general.

This stage is really good for us as long as you avoid MUs with really good aerial characters (GnW, Wario possibly, MK).
 
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#12
Wario is good here, he has the "unspeakable technique" which can make him invincible for like 10 seconds cause he's off stage past the blast line.
And he could probably have good tire work here (my brother mains wario xD)

This stage bugged me hard with ICs, but I like it with yoshi.
I'd say it's overall a good stage for us.

:phone:
 
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#16
Yes, there are the falling donuts to the left, and platform above it. We can't auto kill off of it because the wall disappears before reaching the blast zone.
 
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#17
This thread, y u die so fast?
Hades, do some characters release onto the plat of the first one?

Also does anyone know how realistic it is to egglay an opponet while the stage is moving back down to the ship?
I mean, that's like gaurnteed KO as well, cause they shoot up when they break out.
But gravitys alot higher when it's moving down... Oooh I don't wan test:(
but I will I guess!
Now, discuss all dis

:phone:
 

Delta-cod

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#18
Characters typically have good enough movement out of an Egg Lay to just get off to the side and fall down with the scroll. I highly doubt Egg Lay is the best kill option there.
 
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#22
Yeah it's just a stall move, but i guess it's legal cause it's not a super long time and it's a SD most of the time.

K bak to actual discussion.
Polts not here, but I guess we got eneough actual write ups for RC now, if anyone else is gonna do one get it done.
Until then would we say this is overall a good stage for yoshi? I think so.

:phone:
 
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#23
Frigate.
Egglay to kill when stage flips?
You know you want egglay to be useful on one of these stages.

I hate the ledge of this stage.
I don't like either parts really.

Any other oppinions?

:phone:
 

Z'zgashi

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#25
I absolutely love the balls off of Frigate, if I dont CP RC/Brinstar/PS1&2/SV/Norfair (when it was legal) I almost always go here.
 
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#26
LOL so its kinda.... not on your list at all almost.
well I guess it depends on the MU/Who's there.
I really HATE frigate.
I played on it earlier and got ***** by a dumb cpu :(
I just wan grab teh ledges on the right side:(
still tho, can't see what's good about it.
 

Z'zgashi

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#27
I usually CP this stage one or so per tournament. We do good against Falco here.
 

Delta-cod

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#28
Why the **** is the table not being flipped?

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻


I think Frigate is good depending on the MU. The first section is definitely not an issue at all. The second part is a coin toss. If you hold the center dip, you win. If you lose it, it can be impossible to get back.

MK rapes us here, so I would never go here in today's Metagame.
 

Z'zgashi

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#34
No seriously. The second parts dip lets us duck under his aura spheres and and the platform above stuffs all of his approach options and is high enough that his dair cant hit through it if we duck. The first part has 3 different heights that we can hop around to keep him on his toes, and the right side wrecks him if we get him offstage as his recovery isnt safe at all without a ledge or close wall to cling too.
 

Sinister Slush

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#36
Frigate is a good stage that doesn't have MK or Snake on it.
MK cause he's MK and will find someway to punish some bad habit of ours and get us off the stage making us die from the first transformation (No ledge at right) while the second isn't really much of a problem other then he can scrooge (tesh's old frigate video)
Snake... Just the slants mess with everything along with him having more mobility with his grenades now.
 

Z'zgashi

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#37
^ This.

If you know Frigate, it's a great Yoshi stage more because it wrecks a lot of characters and both transformations help us in different ways (first part highly favors mobile characters and the second will let us out camp 90% of the cast due to the dip being too low for lasers and other projectiles and we can lob stuff out of it).

Characters I wouldnt take here off the top of my head,
Like Slush said, Meta Knight and Snake, Olimar, Pikachu, D3, and ROB.

This stage is really good to CP against,
Falco, Lucario, Toon Link, Fox, Wolf, DK, Sheik, Ness, Mario, Bowser, Samus, Link, Ganon.

Anyone I didnt mention, we shouldnt have much of a problem against them, just we dont **** them there.
 
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#38
I mean I guess it's a pretty normal stage.
Platforms and all.

The problem with this (and all stages with plats) is your CGs practicaly gone. You have limited space to CG, and basicly your only hope is the infinite on wario while you're on a platform.
It's a very character specific stage, I guess some characters will hate it, some will love it, and we could care less.

Edit: posted at the same time. Like that info guys!

:phone:
 

Z'zgashi

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#39
The CG works just fine during the first transformation, and if you really think about it, we dont need the CG for the second one. Yoshi should be standing in the dip, lobbing eggs all over their face and stopping approaches with pokes from tilts, aerials, pivots, etc.
 

hadesblade

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#40
Why wouldn't you take olimar here? I always cp it vs them. He's so bad on the first part, and the flips put him in the air.
 
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