insta-ledge grab

[snex]

why do i never see puff mains run off the ledge into a sing to insta-grab the ledge?

 

[Red Rice]

Probably because it's easier to run off and fair/bair to gimp

I actually don't know, I'll let a puff main answer that. But against spacies^^^^^

 

[AGLET]

It's hard for some people to do consistently, but it's definitely a good option. Hbox is the only top level puff and he doesn't do it, but it doesn't mean other people don't. I know some puff mains who incorporate it into their game

 

[krazyzyko]

It's really hard to do because if you tap the joy stick upwards, you will jump. So you gotta sloghtly tilt the stick to sing hug effectively.

 

[snex]

ive been getting pretty consistent at it with practice. its really not that hard. the trick is to roll the stick up as you fall off.

 

[Massive]

Playing puff at a high level is a matter of minimizing risks to offset her low % KO vulnerability and high-risk, high-reward rest strategies.

If you mistime an instant ledgegrab even slightly and they grab early, you lose a stock.

Going for a superfluous ledgeguard when there are better/safer options (dropzone fair, jump-off bair/nair/fair, dsmash, etc) will put you at a disadvantage and is probably not a good idea.

 

[snex]

there are a few situations where this would be useful. the two biggest i can think of are when spacies can insta-side B straight to the ledge, and sheik shino stalling. in the spacies case, if they choose to up+b instead, you have just gained invincibility for grabbing the ledge. doing this is hardly superfluous.

 

[krazyzyko]

there are a few situations where this would be useful. the two biggest i can think of are when spacies can insta-side B straight to the ledge, and sheik shino stalling. in the spacies case, if they choose to up+b instead, you have just gained invincibility for grabbing the ledge. doing this is hardly superfluous.

Dash attack, jabs, Dtilt are safer vs spacies side B.
The Sheik might punish on reaction before you're too close to the edge.

 

[snex]

which spacies are you playing that can't sweet spot the ledge with sideB? none of puff's moves will hit a sweet spot. and for sheik, her ledge punishes vs puff are garbage, so attempting to sing cancel ramen noodle is well worth it.

 

[krazyzyko]

which spacies are you playing that can't sweet spot the ledge with sideB? none of puff's moves will hit a sweet spot. and for sheik, her ledge punishes vs puff are garbage, so attempting to sing cancel ramen noodle is well worth it.

If spacies sweetspot well, then Dtilt and Dsmash can hit. Remember their hitbox is behind them, so it's pretty safe to edgeguard it. That's why pros usually rather firejump most of the time or side B platform cancel.

Nou. That never happens because sheik can just keep piling on the garbage lol. Puff can't take ay advantage after getting faired in the face.

I've personally never seen this happen in an actual match. If puff messes up and tap jumps > sing Sheik can just hang in the ledge while puff SD's. It's terribly unsafe unless you master it. Nobody has mastered that yet. 21XX maybe? XD

 

[snex]

If spacies sweetspot well, then Dtilt and Dsmash can hit.

uhh no. *maybe* a down angled ftilt can hit on some stages, but dtilt is downright ****, and dsmash cannot hit a sweetspot.

Remember their hitbox is behind them, so it's pretty safe to edgeguard it. That's why pros usually rather firejump most of the time or side B platform cancel.

and if they choose to firefox, you are instantly on the ledge with invincibility. wheres the downside?

Nou. That never happens because sheik can just keep piling on the garbage lol. Puff can't take ay advantage after getting faired in the face.

if sheik doesn't leave the ledge, puff can just try again. eventually you will steal the ledge and she loses the stock. more than a good trade. if sheik *does* leave the ledge, now she's at a disadvantage because puff > sheik.

I've personally never seen this happen in an actual match. If puff messes up and tap jumps > sing Sheik can just hang in the ledge while puff SD's. It's terribly unsafe unless you master it. Nobody has mastered that yet. 21XX maybe? XD

nobody has practiced. i have it down about 70% of the time, and my tech skill sucks.

 

[krazyzyko]

@ snex -
Check the hitboxes, they hit a bit low. Spacies' head is vulnerable so even if they sweetspot, they might get hit.

There's no downside vs fire jump. I was talking about the side B being more effective to edgegaurd than to sing hug, that's all.

Blindly Shinostalling, waiting to get edgehogged is the wrong way to do it. Punishing an approach on reaction is the way to go. Puff can't 'eventually' get the edge if Sheik keeps batting her off with fair and uair.

Cool, l can do it sometimes and am pretty technical player. I main spacies and do all techs consistently but since their are better options and missing it is giving away a stock or stage control it's just not worth it.

 

[Crossie]

I actually just recently realized this is a thing and have started practicing it. I think saying it's risky if you're not consistent at it isn't really a good reason not to do it. That just means you should get consistent at it. This is no riskier for someone who's good at it than wavedashing backwards off the ledge to edge hog. Both could lead to an SD and a missed edgeguard if you mess up your tech skill, but fortunately, since there's not much else to practice alone as a Puff main, there's plenty of time to work on things like these. There aren't tons of situations where it's great, but it's certainly never bad to be able to grab the ledge quickly.

 

[Crossie]

Used this in tournament today to edgehog a fox's illusion to ledge after I baired him on the other end of the stage, confirmed for OP Jiggs tech

 

[Hawt Salsa]

Used this in tournament today to edgehog a fox's illusion to ledge after I baired him on the other end of the stage, confirmed for OP Jiggs tech

Can confirm, I may or may not have been that fox.