I'm not seeing Explosive Flame enough

chipndip

Smash Journeyman
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Jul 14, 2014
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Chiptendo
#1
Whenever I see other Palutena players play, I don't see much Explosive Flame usage, and when they do use it, they don't combo into Auto-Reticle.

Not sure why people prefer playing up close rather than wetting up enemies as much as they can before the fight comes to them. With AR, EF, f-tilt, and d-tilt, you have a good deal of options to play keep away, but I see a lot of other Palutena players play up close. Why is that?
 

Repli.Cant

Smash Cadet
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Dec 8, 2018
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The Hills of Radiant Wind
#2
I guess people aren't used to her being good? Newer people are going to be picking her up for the first time so they probably won't be using all her tools to the max effect. Give it time, people will learn.
 

ddonaldo

Smash Journeyman
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Jul 1, 2008
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#3
I think its because Palutena isn't a great zoner and more of an anti-zoner. Explosive flame is awesome but someone who knows how Palutena works can still run past it and punish, same with raw auto reticule.

Her projectiles are still best used against someone else attempting to zone you or when they are off stage
 

12Tables

Smash Rookie
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Messages
10
#4
Until we can figure out how to do dash away Short EF instead of med or long EF, Characters like Chrom and Roy will punish us for attempting to use it in neutral. EF and AR work great against other zoners but they lose effectiveness the faster characters can close the distance.
 

maybe.

Smash Cadet
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Aug 30, 2017
Messages
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#5
I get destroyed whenever I try to use it in neutral except against people who clearly don't know the match up well, then I abuse it until they figure it out. I use it religiously in advantage, like when my opponent is offstage it can set up unbelievably good traps, I catch people constantly by throwing it out off the ledge and forcing them to recover high into a charged up smash. I just think it's too high risk in neutral especially against speedier characters, against slower more campy characters I guess it serves some use but typically I'll just spam neutral B to force them to approach, only match up I've seen it be really for in neutral is against the belmonts since it can outrange and break through their holy water wall really easily, most other characters just see it coming and jump over it for a free punish though.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
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#6
Until we can figure out how to do dash away Short EF instead of med or long EF, Characters like Chrom and Roy will punish us for attempting to use it in neutral. EF and AR work great against other zoners but they lose effectiveness the faster characters can close the distance.
I use short EF reliably by using delaying b input slightly. Essentially, I almost take one step forward, and sometimes actually do. Also, I use short EF to mix up my dash attack. Her dash attack is incontestable because of her shield, so people learn to block. But I sometimes dash and throw out short EF, which catches them off guard. Either gets them or diminishes shield, surprising them, setting up an actual dash attack or grab. So opponents don't know if I will dash attack, short EF, or grab. They can't reliably defend against all three. If they back up, then it's long EF or AR. I find this useful even though higher level players say not to rely on dash attack too much. I have not even started dash dancing either.

FYI: short EF can be done naturally during walk, dash or run. Or even during forward jump or forward descent.
 
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12Tables

Smash Rookie
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Messages
10
#7
I use short EF reliably by using delaying b input slightly. Essentially, I almost take one step forward, and sometimes actually do. Also, I use short EF to mix up my dash attack. Her dash attack is incontestable because of her shield, so people learn to block. But I sometimes dash and throw out short EF, which catches them off guard. Either gets them or diminishes shield, surprising them, setting up an actual dash attack or grab. So opponents don't know if I will dash attack, short EF, or grab. They can't reliably defend against all three. If they back up, then it's long EF or AR. I find this useful even though higher level players say not to rely on dash attack too much. I have not even started dash dancing either.

FYI: short EF can be done naturally during walk, dash or run. Or even during forward jump or forward descent.
I was talking about a short range EF in the opposite direction you are running.
 

Eisal

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Dec 8, 2014
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169
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Stockholm
#10
Explosive Flame is good, really good. It was much better than I initially thought it to be. However, it can be quite dangerous to use against fast characters, and should be used with caution when up against those who are more or less supposed to rush you down. It's safer to use after you have racked up precentage.

It combos at early percentages though, and is a kill move at higher. A great ledge guard, and a way to force projectile spammers near you.

I might have been using it too much, to the fault of having myself punished way too many times.
 

leafgreen386

Dirty camper
Joined
Mar 20, 2006
Messages
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Playing melee and smash ultimate
#11
Against slower characters, feel free to spam it as much as you like. They have trouble closing gaps, and EF can essentially shut them out of the match. Against the faster characters, though, you're usually only going to land it when you've already landed a hit somehow. Short EF is the only one you should ever try against faster characters, and even that is punishable if you're not smart about it.
 
Joined
Jan 2, 2019
Messages
71
#13
Depends on who I face.

When I first started using Palutena in Ultimate I got into the habit of using it way too much, which is bad since it leaves you vulnerable for ages. If I know I can land it or that it will cut off the opponents path to me then I will use it, and of course you should be using it when they are off stage, but you shouldn't be using it too much.

And I also love comboing it with autoreticle, but this also depends on where I am located, who I am facing and what percentage they are at.
 
Joined
Mar 12, 2006
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Pembroke, Ontario, Canada
#14
I would actually argue the opposite; many Palus online are using it as a crutch to punish when they could be applying pressure with her awesome normals. This is particularly true against fast characters that can just jump over it and hit your face. You are better using a Dash Dance and jumps to pressure in that situation.

It has its place; it can force low/high recoveries offstage and it can handle situations where Palu cannot make it to the opponent, such as covering landing locations during juggles while I am falling. But you are more threatening by placing your character where EF would land versus using EF in that same spot most of the time.
 

PKD9

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 11, 2019
Messages
1
#15
I was talking about a short range EF in the opposite direction you are running.
I'm pretty sure you can accomplish this by rolling the movement stick in a quick half circle. For example, if you are running right, you can roll the stick quickly from right to left in a half circle and hit 'B' to do a short range EF right out of run in the opposite direction you were running. It's been working for me consistently (though I wonder if it is sensitivity dependent).
 
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