I'm Disappointed with our Side-B

[CoyoteFlavoring]

I can't figure out the rhyme or reason why reflected projectiles don't hit the sender upon return.


I'm not talking about distance traveled where the projectile phases out... the projectile is returned back through their model / hurtboxes and it is basically an insubstantial projectile.

For instance, if you use the Orbitars to reflect Clouds wave (limit or not) it will connect with Cloud and he takes dmg but if you sideB the projectile (limit or not) he takes no dmg even if the wave goes through his model.

Buggy as hell.

 

[Phyras]

I see many comments about the side B, about buff. But it should first be patched.
It's so inconsistent because of so many little variables :

- The length, the true range of the dash is hard to handle. If the opponent is too far, pit will still take 1/4 the length of the initial dash to break and if the opponent is in range it will extend it's range to some obscure length.

- Grounded versus airborne: although the dash animation is the same, the break animation isn't. If you're Airborne, you're lock in this spinning animation for a year. If you're grounded, you're stuck for some time. BUT if you start airborne and land during the break before the spinning animation, you have a lag shorter than if you were always grounded. If you start airborne slightly below the ledge the game will rise you above the ledge and cancel your dash into the break animation which will be a bit shorter than the "always grounded" but the attack won't trigger even if an opponent's there.

- Grabbing the ledge: The only thing that could actually "punish" an inadverted opponent since you can trigger the attack if he's just waiting on the ledge. But nobody will fall twice for that. And it's risky since too high and you will land and cancel your trigger and too low you won't trigger and be very vulnerable.

- Hitting shield: Grounded you're dead, airborne you can retreat a bit, surprising but still easy to punish.

- Hitting airborne with pit : it sent you on the air with your opponent. With a longer lag than your opponent's hit stun. So you can be punished for successfully using your side B.

I won't even try to analyze how the attack trigger work neither how projectiles are bounced back since it's pure chaos theory.
I don't even need to talk about frame data, lag, armor, damages, angles, priority or vulnerability.
Just take the falcon side b, it's a dash, with a triggered attack, some lag and airborne mechanic. But it's quite consistent.
I would rather have a side b without armor, without projectile bounce, that you can grab, that send you helpless in the air but a side B which does what it's meant to do.

 

[AndrewtheAmericanDude]

I want to not be vulnerable at the start and maaaybe have stronger super armor. I dont even know why we have a reflector on it.

 

[Kiligar]

UpperTrash Arm And ELagtroshock require several adjustments. The former lacks kill power, considering how hard it is to hit the move at high level play, the latter lacks kill power outside of ledge. The aerial lag isn’t funny. I’ve barely missed the ledge and died because I had no jumps. The super armor is very unreliable, coming out too late and getting you killed. It also sometimes doesn’t work when it should. Patch 3.0.0 is where I hope they’ll fix it.

 

[AndrewtheAmericanDude]

UpperTrash Arm And ELagtroshock require several adjustments. The former lacks kill power, considering how hard it is to hit the move at high level play, the latter lacks kill power outside of ledge. The aerial lag isn’t funny. I’ve barely missed the ledge and died because I had no jumps. The super armor is very unreliable, coming out too late and getting you killed. It also sometimes doesn’t work when it should. Patch 3.0.0 is where I hope they’ll fix it.

Idk I think u can kill with upperdash arm at any level in theory. Really you just have to guess correctly when the opponent will attack and if u guess correctly it lands, and it has decent killpower. I agree with everything else tho.

 

[Duke27]

My biggest issue with the side specials is inconsistent-looking super armor. Sometimes I'll eat a hit no problem and other times I'd get knocked out of it. If I'm remembering right, the armor frames were 11-26 in 4, which is an odd place for them. The deflect is the worst and shouldn't be there lol. I'd try recovering with it and the opponent shoots a projectile which I hit- hooray for the laggy deflect animation that's perfect for getting hit..

 

[CoyoteFlavoring]

We should start a list.

Robin Charged B

It passes through their model. I think it has to do with the reflect angle and the way it's represented on return.

 

[Vistra31]

Maybe it should KO at early percentages because in Kid Icarus Uprising the Upperdash Arm can kill in almost one hit when the opponent has full health.
JK guys I only use it for a mixup on recover or otherwise to get a kill that armors other hits. I don't care if it gets buffs or nerfs.

If I was a DP main I might understand because you might get better offstage kills with it even though other moves do the job better.

 

[Kiligar]

Frame 1 super armor. That does not disappear when connecting with an opponent’s hurt box. 0 lag on projectile reflection. Slightly less Aerial lag when whiffed and on hit as well. That’s the basics the side B would need.