If you could change ZSS' move set, what, if anything would you change about her?

Jamisinon

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#1
I personally really liked ZSS and Sheik in Sm4sh. I was torn for a little while which of the two to main. They felt somewhat similar. Very fast character that had some combo potential and KO setups. In the end I ended up favoring Sheik. A large part of that is the grab. I know Samus had the tether grab and it's pretty iconic for her as a character. But I wonder if ZSS should also a ranged grab? Or maybe a shortened version (like how Young/Toon Link had shorter hookshot range than adult Link). They removed adult Link's hookshot grab for Ultimate. So I wonder if they would consider doing the same for ZSS. I'd personally like it better if her grab wasn't inherently high risk and she had a more common grab. She could still have the side B to tether to ledge (since she had among the weakest magnet hands in sm4sh).
I've always loved Metroid games so I like ZSS more as a character than Sheik so I'd love it if I ended up liking ZSS more and would thus main her in the new smash.
 
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KatKit

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#2
I liked her Brawl up-B. It was cool dragging down opponents and it was one of her few whip attacks. Speaking of which, I liked her old smash attack, too. It hit in two directions, if I recall correctly. Imagine if she swung the whip and then had an optional second kick if you pushed the button again. It'd be pretty unique and like a combination of her old and new smash attacks.
 

Octavium

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#3
Her sm4sh animations are sick so I don't have much to complain about, I love her new smash attacks and her reliance on martial arts rather than the whip, her landing lag is alright.

If I we're to change something about her it would be some of her specials, I would return side-b to its former brawl glory to make it useful and give us ZSS players more options (or I would pull off a Project M and use that version of side-b to set up for exciting combos). I would also give us the option of cancel the Down-b animation at its peak, giving us much more flexibility for offstage edgeguarding, recovering and combo-ing.

I would also give her a much shorter skid animation for quicker turnarounds as she is pretty much an athlete.
 

Jamisinon

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#5
Down tilt being the Mega Man-esque heel slide she had in Other M (one of the few things I liked about ZSS in that game)
I really like this idea. I think of how good Cloud's D-tilt was in sm4sh (tho it's sorta similar to mega man's as they are both slides) I'm just picturing how great d-tilt slide into up-tilt into an up air or tech chase could be. I think that would be a great change.
 

Jamisinon

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#6
Just thought of something super important. I know she has the tether while kind of nullifies a need for good magnet hands, but why are ZSS' magnet hands so bad in sm4sh. She is absolutely one of the worst and it just makes it so recovering to the ledge with Up B isn't the most viable option. I don't think it's game breaking as is, but if she could grab ledge when she's right by it that'd be nice.
 

Octavium

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#7
Just thought of something super important. I know she has the tether while kind of nullifies a need for good magnet hands, but why are ZSS' magnet hands so bad in sm4sh. She is absolutely one of the worst and it just makes it so recovering to the ledge with Up B isn't the most viable option. I don't think it's game breaking as is, but if she could grab ledge when she's right by it that'd be nice.
I don't think its that bad of an option to up-b there's a lot more than just 2 frames to punish ledge grab from the tether despite it being fast, fighting a good player will teach you how unsafe side-b can sometimes be.

With just a bit of practice the magnetic hands for ZSS in smash 4 is enough to be consistent with, much easier than learning to sweetspot in melee. It's important to also know that the magnetic hands are both at the beginning and end of up-b animation.
 
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Jamisinon

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#8
I don't think its that bad of an option to up-b there's a lot more than just 2 frames to punish ledge grab from the tether despite it being fast, fighting a good player will teach you how unsafe side-b can sometimes be.

With just a bit of practice the magnetic hands for ZSS in smash 4 is enough to be consistent with, much easier than learning to sweetspot in melee. It's important to also know that the magnetic hands are both at the beginning and end of up-b animation.
I play predominantly Melee so I totally feel like in sm4sh so many characters get ledge for free. Especially since I play a lot of Mario and some Marth in sm4sh. I think it just feels random that ZSS has bad magnet hands in comparison to the rest of the cast. I don't watch a ton of sm4sh tournies, especially nowadays but it just felt so rare that someone would Up B to ledge instead of Side B to ledge. Then again, if you take Melee how many Samus players recovered to ledge without use of tether? So I guess that in itself makes sense, that ZSS has a characteristic about her that is still somewhat similar to actual Samus. I think my thinking on it is simply if 90% of the cast has insane magnet hands why not ZSS? I mean, having a tether is a pretty good reason to not have magnet hands but still why give ZSS the Little Mac/Roy treatment?
 
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