If they were to add one last patch to the game.....

[Kain6th]

And you were in charge of making the decisions, what would you patch?

Who would get buffed and who would get nerfed? etc?

 

[Bluekirby2]

I would buff Jigglypuff, Dedede, Ganondorf, and Zelda

I would probably also buff Little Mac's side b so he doesn't go into free fall after using it

I'd give characters like Pit and Falco kill moves that can kill at an early percentage

Buff counters to characters like Bayonetta

And fix For Glory so that instead of just Omega stages you can also play on tournament legal stages, and you can see who the other person is picking

 

[Nebbyla]

buff the puff

 

[MercuryPenny]

nerf bayonetta until she's worse than puff, zelda and dedede

oh and make cloud more comparable to the rest of the cast

 

[MarioMeteor]

- Make all custom moves immediately unlocked upon booting up the game.
- Changes to the rules (stock count, custom move switch, etc.) the previously used tag, and the previously used color are saved even when the game is turned off. No, Sakurai, I don't want to play a two-minute Time match.
- You can now change a character's customs from the character select screen, like in the 3DS version.

Buff: (slightly)

Nerf: (slightly)

 

[MrGameguycolor]

This would be my list of priority.

Sm4sh's balance isn't bad overall, but a few tweaks here and there would really help.

 

[Lola Luftnagle]

Well, I won't ask for much but here's my personal patch:

• : Weight-based knockback on hits 1-3 on neutral air
• : Onslaught never puts y'all in free-fall when used in the air
• : Decrease landing lag on f-air and b-air to 10 frames

 

[Nah]

I would get rid of all the disjoints on the hitboxes for characters that should never have had them in the first place. When you're attacking with a limb and you're not equipped with rocket-powered high heels or have psychic powers there is absolutely no ****ing good reason why you should be hitting me when you're not touching me. Why this game has had 16 patches and there's still disjoints on stuff like Diddy fair or Falcon rapid jab is beyond me.

Then I would change the way hitboxes interact/how clanking works. Mario jab shouldn't be able to clank with Robin jab, Pika ftilt shouldn't be able to clank with Robin ftilt, Corrin Fsmash shouldn't be to clank with Peach bair. If you try punching a sword swing, what doesn't happen is that you make contact and come out ok, your hand gets split the **** open because you just stuck your fist in the way of moving sharp metal. Like unless Peach's ass is made of steel or something she shouldn't be able to have a lance get shoved up it and not get hurt.

Would probably make a few specific changes to characters too, but my main issue with the game right now is hitboxes and clanking mechanics.

Also I know that a lot of people are gonna say Jiggypuff buffs, but there's good reason why this character has never received a single buff in the 2.5 years Smash 4 has been out.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Like unless Peach's *** is made of steel or something she shouldn't be able to have a lance get shoved up it and not get hurt.

I mean, if it can explode things, I don't think that's too far fetched.

Also I know that a lot of people are gonna say Jiggypuff buffs, but there's good reason why this character has never received a single buff in the 2.5 years Smash 4 has been out.

Yes, because the balancing team is inept. It took them till 1.15 to do something about Sheik and Zero Suit. And Dedede, a character regarded just as badly as Jigglypuff, has been nerfed, with no compensation.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Personally I'd focus on some of the Final Smashes.

If anyone gets caught by the inhale portion of Dedede Burst, they should be totally immobile during the Final Smash duration so that all of Dedede's hits connect. There's also a glitch involving that Final Smash, which renders the Double Final Smasher bonus effect useless for Dedede.

And speaking of Dedede, improve the knockback for his Jet Hammer. In an ironic dilemma, Kirby's full power Hammer Flip actually delivers stronger knockback than Dedede's full power Jet Hammer.

Mega Lucario should have the exact same attributes as Lucario. It just seems dumb that it's now slower, because a software update affected Lucario's attributes, but not Mega Lucario's attributes.

All of Giga Mac's attacks should deal 2x more damage than Little Mac's attacks. However, the adjustments to Little Mac's damage output from some of the software updates has messed up that trend.

Make Giga Bowser viable. Seriously, you can make KOs more efficiently with a Bowser who acquires a Super Mushroom. Giga Bowser would be lucky to make even 1 KO before his transformation timer expires, making him quite underwhelming for a Final Smash transformation.

 

[Zerp]

No buffs are necessary, I'd just nerf a few of the characters, mainly to the point that they're drastically weaker than . No biggie.

In case anyone can't tell, this is satire, I wouldn't actually do this.

 

[MrGameguycolor]

Zerp
No need worry about Doc, the devs already did the nerfing for you.

In all seriousness, that would make for an interesting mod.
Like a reverse Sm4sh Chaos!

 

[MarioMeteor]

No buffs are necessary, I'd just nerf a few of the characters, mainly to the point that they're drastically weaker than . No biggie.

In case anyone can't tell, this is satire, I wouldn't actually do this.

But that already exists, see?

[/s]

 

[Lola Luftnagle]

I can't believe y'all sugar pies ain't looking at buffing/nerfing items. Well, I for one think some Pokèballs need a few changes.

• I'd make it so Moltres has its extreme knockback restored. Just why the **** can't he KO most characters above 150% that easily here?
• Staryu's Swift passes through walls with infinite range like in Melee.
• Goldeen stops appearing from a Master Ball.
• Weight-based knockback on Dedenne's Discharge with higher KB at the finish.
• A three-and-one-third percent chance Togepi uses Nightshade.

 

[JagerCrush]

Other than nerfs to characters like Bayo & Sonic that I don't enjoy seeing them in tournament at all I would give small buffs to the lower half of the cast and try to leave most of the upper half of the cast unchanged. I would instead focus more on implementing a lot of things the artful/smooth lander mod did. I'd get RAGE completely out of the game and balance the characters accordingly while also doing things like less landing lag, slower shield regen rate, more lag on air dodging, general things to make it so staying in shield isn't such a good option. It would force a less campy less floaty gameplay style which I believe would be more fun to play and watch. Remove untechable tumble, add stage variants like no transformation pokemon stadium and 3ds/past stages like corneria, melee yoshi's story etc.
For the casuals I'd make large custom stages playable in 8-man smash bc 8-man smash deserves more than big battlefield and FD.
For Glory wouldn't just be variations of FD, it would be the tournament legal stages instead.
In this world where I have full control I would add more content like a few more characters such as Wolf, Ice Climbers, K. Rool. I would also add 1 additional costume to each character. I would make it so that mii size doesn't affect weight/hitboxes etc so all miis would play the same which would help give 1111 miis some representation.

 

[Pillowpet]

I want to see them buff Jigglypuff even if it's only making rest a more viable kill option. Also buff the heavyweights as well

 

[Pyrover]

Very specifically... make rage only affect knockback growth, thus fixing some things like Luma up air.

Increase damage and shield stun on all of Puff's aerials. Just enough to make her safe to poke at you and have a bit more oomph. Also make her up throw kill around 130 because it would be funny.

Dedede:
- Make Gordos stick to walls consistently. Also decrease endlag on Gordo Toss so that he can volley back a reflected Gordo.
- F-Throw should kill around 120; it looks really strong.
- Fix down tilt
- Buff knockback on Jet Hammer

Give the Pits some more knockback on things so that he can kill you.

Change the default match type to stock, because honestly.

Lower the speed boost Cloud gets from Limit. There is no reason he should fly around faster than Yoshi.

Lower landing lag on Zelda's lightning kicks. Just a little bit.

Samus' super missiles should kill like in Melee. They are missiles after all.

Give Wii Fit some damage buffs and maybe make Deep Breathing heal 4 or 5 percent. You don't get to use it much anyway.

Lower knockback on Donkey Kong up air so he is slightly less of an abomination.

Buff Falco's air speed a little bit.

No repeat custom moves.

And maybe make Duck Hunt's smashes work while we're at it.

 

[Captain Phobos]

MAKE FALCO'S LASERS FASTER

 

[Lola Luftnagle]

May I suggest a patch that benefits all characters here: all normal aerial moves are able to be L-canceled. That's all the buffing I think the fighters need.

 

[MercuryPenny]

why not just skip the bs and just halve all aerial landing lag

 

[MrGameguycolor]

why not just skip the bs and just halve all aerial landing lag

All aerial landing lag?

Giving Ryu's Nair 3 frames...
That's less then his hard landing lag of 4 frames.






That's not even mentioning the mess that is Bayo...

 

[MarioMeteor]

why not just skip the bs and just halve all aerial landing lag

Yes, let's make Sheik even faster than she already is. How about we leave landing lag alone?

 

[Lola Luftnagle]

Well, it seems some of y'all don't like some of Melee's more complex nuances such as L-canceling. And hey, who is little 'ole me to argue with that?

Anyway...I would want to reduce recovery frames on master 's grab and give each of his elemental tomes three more durability points.

 

[MercuryPenny]

Yes, let's make Sheik even faster than she already is. How about we leave landing lag alone?

that too

seriousmode post though:

-weaken 's camping game significantly (namely fix bullet arts nair), nerf bat within, and make witch time work based on how much damage the move she counters would do. it would still have the weakening mechanic from the base game, and there would probably be like a 3-second max on it somehow so it doesn't end up being completely broken against something like a fully charged flare blade
-make 's autocancel frames way less lenient so he isn't literally unpunishable when he throws out an aerial onstage, make up-air's hitbox smaller, and make nair a little slower.
-make a little faster, buff din's fire to be closer to brawl's version, and either make her sourspots less terrible or reduce the unreasonable endlag on her moves.
-give 's blasters startup and endlag comparable to mario's fireballs
-buff 's up throw by increasing the knockback growth - as in, give her a reason to grab and a reliably safe method of killing. heck, buff her grab range a bit while we're at it too. other than that, give her the ability to drift in the air after hitting something with rollout at least (preferably with the ability to grab ledges), give jab the sakurai angle, give up tilt combo ability, buff her air speed, increase range on bair (SLIGHTLY. we don't want a disjointed melee bair).
-fix 's down b so it can't kill at 0 offstage
-remove from the game

kidding. just make luma's jab not transcendent and nerf luma's power a lot. rosalina's already pretty capable on her own, she doesn't need a floating transcendent projectile with unreasonable kill power to throw around
-give a reason to exist
-increase the knockback growth on 's down tilt so he doesn't have easy kill confirms at 100+%
-give 's f-throw more consistent followups
-idk what could get but he needs it. maybe that's why the devs never buffed him LOL
-make the hitbox on 's mechakoopas unblockable so he has serious stage control that's hard to deal with, make his run speed a little faster so he can approach without side-b, make his recovery better so there's a reason for him being so easy to gimp
-increase autocancel frames on 's fair to 23

that's prolly it

 

[MrGameguycolor]

-give a reason to exist
/QUOTE]
He's does.

Bair and Cape.

 

[Skwrl]

Characters I would nerf:
Characters I would buff:

Not based on any sort of scientific research, only based on personal preference.

 

[TooBadWaluigiTime]

Buff the ever loving **** outta Dedede and Puff.

 

[LeWaddleDee]

Somehow give some love to the lower tiers and probably small nerfs to high or top tiers, mainly chars. like d3 or ganon though.

 

[Nathan Richardson]

For zard I'd make patches so he can move while using his specials. There shouldn't be a reason that using a special move like flamethrower or rock smash kills momentum going in any direction. Also give him proper traction.

 

[Ruben Samich]

I haven't read thoroughly through every post but I'm pretty sure no one has said anything about Samus yet! Samus needs a little less lag after her grab (although not too much cause then people would just spam it) a little less lag before and/or after her super missle, and pretty much just needs less lag all around.


EDIT: Also her Z-air needs to be improved, it barely does anything






(in case you can't tell by my profile, I like Samus)

 

[MarioMeteor]

I haven't read thoroughly through every post but I'm pretty sure no one has said anything about Samus yet! Samus needs a little less lag after her grab (although not too much cause then people would just spam it) a little less lag before and/or after her super missle, and pretty much just needs less lag all around.


EDIT: Also her Z-air needs to be improved, it barely does anything






(in case you can't tell by my profile, I like Samus)

Her Zair is fine. It's great for spacing, and it has very little lag.

Now, her jab, on the other hand, that needs fixing. It really triggers me how Samus is the only character in the game with a jab that just flat out doesn't work. There is absolutely no reason why you should be able to punish a jabbing Samus with a full combo.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Samus does have a slow standard attack combo. Amusingly, so did Dr. Mario during his Melee days.

Still, a standard attack that gets a tip saying not to use it definitely doesn't sound right. The best way to fix that dilemma is to decrease the second hit's start-up lag.

 

[Nah]

I have always found it strange that they deliberately made Samus's jab 2 dysfunctional. Why would they intentionally do that?

 

[L1N3R1D3R]

The only mention I've seen for Duck Hunt in this thread is making his smash attacks work. While this buff should happen and would be greatly appreciated, they desperately need a different buff more:

Make Duck Jump (up-B) have more acceleration, both horizontal and vertical. This would make it start moving more quickly, making it harder to hit at the start and also making it travel a bit farther, and it would also be easier to weave back and forth to avoid other attacks while successfully recovering. This buff would make it a bit better at recovery, but more importantly, much harder to gimp.

And while I've been experimenting with the character, they could use a few other buffs to make their moveset flow better, as well:

• F-air has decent range and frame data, but it's not that strong, so why doesn't it autocancel in a short hop like B-air, U-air, and D-air do? Making it autocancel in a short hop would make it better at pressuring, especially with retreating F-air, and it would also make F-throw --> F-air be safer and able to start further combos.
• It always bugs me that you can't deflect Can with other moves in the air, because a Can that barely falls offstage is useless. I'd change that to make the Can gameplay even more dynamic and versatile. It would be able to be hit by the opponents, too, so it shouldn't make Can overpowered.
• I'm not sure how they would fix this, but I dislike how the Clay Pigeon destroys with neutral-B. If it could destroy with a different button, then it would greatly improve his projectile game, as they could take the Can out or bounce/detonate it while the Clay Pigeon is out.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Wild Gunman deserves a mention too, since it's not very good in terms of making KOs. Even the strongest gunman struggles to KO most of the cast until they go beyond 200% damage.

I did alter Wild Gunman to be a more effective move for Duck Hunt (with the strongest gunman KOing Mario at around 122%, while the weakest gunman KOs Mario at around 277%), especially the custom variants of the move.

 

[L1N3R1D3R]

Wild Gunman deserves a mention too, since it's not very good in terms of making KOs. Even the strongest gunman struggles to KO most of the cast until they go beyond 200% damage.

I did alter Wild Gunman to be a more effective move for Duck Hunt (with the strongest gunman KOing Mario at around 122%, while the weakest gunman KOs Mario at around 277%), especially the custom variants of the move.

I mostly use Wild Gunman for pressuring shield, and if it connects, it pops them up perfectly for a followup that can kill instead. I don't want it to be buffed, not necessarily because it would make him too good in conjunction with the other buffs, but because that's not the kind of move Wild Gunman should be.

 

[dakotaisgreat]

I wouldn't nerf a single character in the entire game. The top tiers are all pretty balanced right now in my opinion, I don't have any issue with the upper echelon of the best characters in the game. Here is a list of who I would buff.

-Ike
-Wario
-Shulk
-Mr. Game & Watch
-Samus
-Palutena
-Little Mac
-Roy
-Charizard
-Pacman
-Kirby
-Bowser Jr.
-Wii Fit Trainer
-Falco
-Dr. Mario
-Dedede
-Ganondorf
-Zelda
-Jigglypuff

These are the only characters who I really don't think are competitively viable right now.Basically everyone D tier and below in the current tier list, except for Link and Duck Hunt.

I don't really know how I would buff all of those characters, so I won't comment on all of them, as for the characters that I do know what I'd buff..

Roy - Roy's sweet spotted hits on his tilts, fair, and bair more rewarding. Since I'm talking about five different attacks here, I'm saying increase the damage by 1-2%. His sweet spotted hitboxes are not as rewarding as Marth's are, despite being less safe and having less range, this doesn't make sense to me. Put 2% on all of Roy's sweet spotted fair, bair, ftilt, utilt, and dtilt and he would shoot way up in usefulness. No other changes needed.

Charizard - Make Flare Blitz heavily damage shields. It's already super easy to dodge and still wouldn't be a very useful attack, I don't see this breaking anything. Also I'd raise his air speed because he's a flying type (Original comment I know). Also increase the damage of his flamethrower.

Too lazy to type up anything else character specific, but special shoutouts to Dedede, Dorf, Zelda, and Jiggly. They really are the worst ****ing characters in the game. They truly are in a tier of their own I think.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I mostly use Wild Gunman for pressuring shield, and if it connects, it pops them up perfectly for a followup that can kill instead. I don't want it to be buffed, not necessarily because it would make him too good in conjunction with the other buffs, but because that's not the kind of move Wild Gunman should be.

I guess it depends on the individual. The sombrero gunman's shots look like they would pack a punch, especially since he has the shortest range, and his shots have an added flame effect.

Anyway, improving Wild Gunman would at least help with Duck Hunt's limited KO options. On the other hand, if your opponent knows how to avoid the attack as a whole, then the buffs become irrelevant; Wild Gunman is quite predictable (even the easiest CPUs have the habit of dodging the shots), thanks to the start-up lag that each gunman has. But if you can somehow get the shots to connect, they should at least be rewarding, even if the reward is simply putting the target at a position where you can deliver the finishing blow more easily.

 

[L1N3R1D3R]

I mostly like using the Gunmen for how random their timing and power is, and how high-ranged they are when they suddenly do shoot. That makes it hard for the opponent to predict if they don't also know exactly how Duck Hunt works. Like you said, if it's not hitting anyway, there's no reason for it to be stronger, and if it does hit, I guess the higher knockback could be good, but I'd still prefer to have lower knockback because that leads to more followups at wide percents. (At CEO, Raito got a kill on someone, I believe it was Mr. R, with Gunman into F-air!)

Anyway, as for an overall look at the game and what I want to be changed, you can simply look at my tier list at any given time, which right now is this.

The only characters I want nerfed are the four in S Tier. Meanwhile, A+ Tier should basically stay the same, A Tier should get some small tune-ups, A- Tier should get decent buffs, B+ Tier should get significant buffs, and B- Tier should get heavy buffs.

 

[dakotaisgreat]

I mostly like using the Gunmen for how random their timing and power is, and how high-ranged they are when they suddenly do shoot. That makes it hard for the opponent to predict if they don't also know exactly how Duck Hunt works. Like you said, if it's not hitting anyway, there's no reason for it to be stronger, and if it does hit, I guess the higher knockback could be good, but I'd still prefer to have lower knockback because that leads to more followups at wide percents. (At CEO, Raito got a kill on someone, I believe it was Mr. R, with Gunman into F-air!)

Anyway, as for an overall look at the game and what I want to be changed, you can simply look at my tier list at any given time, which right now is this.

The only characters I want nerfed are the four in S Tier. Meanwhile, A+ Tier should basically stay the same, A Tier should get some small tune-ups, A- Tier should get decent buffs, B+ Tier should get significant buffs, and B- Tier should get heavy buffs.

Nerf the S tier characters and the current A+ tier would just become the new S tier. It's pointless. This is a really balanced top tier right now and we shouldn't seek to change it. The top ten players in this game all play 10 different characters. That's amazing and pretty much no other fighting game has that kind of diversity.

Also, the use of Duck Hunt's gunmen is to provide pressure, which they do just fine. It forces you to either jump or shield, that's it's purpose and it does it just fine. I don't see the point in talking about buffing Duck Hunt when he's clearly a viable character. At least half the cast is worse than he is right now.