If I’m in Elite Smash how good am I?

[Dilan Omer]

Its hard to stale out in my opinion. Barely losing elite with most of the 35 chars I have on it.

 

[1FC0]

It is probably going to a take a long time to stale out my R.O.B. since he is deep in the Smash of Elites.

 

[Arrei]

Rather than an "Elite Hell" of Nintendo's making, could it be that having too high of a GSP puts us in one of our creation? As a day one player, my highest GSP characters seem to be a fair amount above the average, and I routinely have to wait quite a bit longer to get opponents, as opposed to characters who are lower or I haven't used yet. It seems like the system's having trouble finding opponents within my score range, and they're almost always below my score.

 

[MERPIS]

Elite hell is literally just regular nintendo online cause ssbu has such terrible online play I can't believe for glory 1 on 1 is actually better than this horse crap
Prove me wrong please

 

[mrguy321]

im 5 mil gsp with my character how is it possible im not in elite smash? is there a setting or something i need to activate?

 

[GhostM]

im 5 mil gsp with my character how is it possible im not in elite smash? is there a setting or something i need to activate?

No, it’s either a random number or it could be based upon win %. Because everyone is purchasing a switch and playing Smash online, it bumps everyone’s rank +1, meaning that there would be no official number to reach to get into Smash Elite. It’s not a setting, you’ll know if you’ve entered elite smash because after a match the announcer will say ‘Elite Smash’, and then choosing to play online will now be replaced by the elite smash logo.

 

[Love Tap]

I honestly find the people saying it means "nothing" cumbersome and annoying. Yes, there is some margin for luck. For example, you get more GSP per battle if you have a higher win ration to lose ratio. So, if you pick up a character, and you happen to get lucky enough to paired with a few favorable matchups, you can get into elite smash in two or three matches. I did that with kirby. The chances of that happening are kind of slim, though. As far as cheese is concerned, that may be enough to get in, but it's probably not enough to stay in.

If you're seriously claiming it means nothing and that there's no difference between the intensity of matches in elite play verses players with noticeable differences in GSP I think you're being willfully disingenuous, possibly insecure about your own skill, or touting false humility.

Everyone always spews this nonsense when it comes to any ranking system but they don't realize no ranking system can calculate your skill with perfect precision. There's always going to be variance. Phrased in a way people will probably understand: is there a chance that you can be a poorly skilled player and also be in elite smash? Answer: yes. Is there a chance that you're a great player but you can't get into elite smash despite playing QP consistently and over a long period of time? Answer: unlikely.

 

[NaijiCB00]

I feel like elite smash just means you're...adept at the very least. Very rarely do you see a player with a clearly scrubby unskillfull strategy get into elite smash. In the case that you do come across one then the possibility is high that you'll send him back to regular QP. I've been in and out of elite smash more times than i can count because i just didn't have enough experience in a certain matchup and i 've been playing online since day one.

 

[Crystanium]

Love Tap
This is for you.

I've been in Elite Smash since January 2, 2019, and that was the same day I started playing SSBU online, since prior to this I was only playing against my brother and wasn't sure how I'd be able to play online. I have a few problems with Elite Smash, though. When you lose, you may lose over 2k GSP or as few as 400 GSP. I base these on the fact that I've lost at least 2k GSP or even gained just above 400 GSP depending on my opponent's own GSP. Since GSP is supposed to be an indicator of skill, it doesn't make sense that losing to one person suddenly means you're worse than 2k players or as good as 400 players. This isn't how skill works. You don't suddenly become worse.

Quickplay seems to be based on the Elo ranking system so that if you're higher, you lose more if you lose to someone with fewer points and gain fewer points if your GSP is higher than your opponent's. While I think Elite Smash says something about your skill, especially if you're at the point where your GSP no longer increases (as is the case of YB, the best Samus/Dark Samus player in the world), it has its flaws. Poorly skilled players aren't going to make it into Elite Smash, and players who reach Elite Smash, but fail to maintain remaining there consistently are falling behind to those who have never been kicked out. Again, it doesn't mean players who fall out are poorly skilled. The system is flawed because losing once is treated as being worse than up to 2k players in the world.

 

[Misty Venn]

I honestly find the people saying it means "nothing" cumbersome and annoying. Yes, there is some margin for luck. For example, you get more GSP per battle if you have a higher win ration to lose ratio. So, if you pick up a character, and you happen to get lucky enough to paired with a few favorable matchups, you can get into elite smash in two or three matches. I did that with kirby. The chances of that happening are kind of slim, though. As far as cheese is concerned, that may be enough to get in, but it's probably not enough to stay in.

If you're seriously claiming it means nothing and that there's no difference between the intensity of matches in elite play verses players with noticeable differences in GSP I think you're being willfully disingenuous, possibly insecure about your own skill, or touting false humility.

Everyone always spews this nonsense when it comes to any ranking system but they don't realize no ranking system can calculate your skill with perfect precision. There's always going to be variance. Phrased in a way people will probably understand: is there a chance that you can be a poorly skilled player and also be in elite smash? Answer: yes. Is there a chance that you're a great player but you can't get into elite smash despite playing QP consistently and over a long period of time? Answer: unlikely.

This, this, this - ALLL of this!

 

[Hunshh]

Why even is there an elite smash? Whats it supposed to mean besides you're in the top percent of all players. Who cares.

 

[Orlando BCN]

My main guess is that it's what the developers use for their research to balance the characters.

 

[Arrei]

Ostensibly, it's just supposed to be a way to match people with opponents of reasonably close skill levels, so that you don't get the guy who's been playing Smash since the N64 matched against Little Jimmy who just got the game yesterday. The lack of any semblance of matchmaking was why Smash 4's For Glory developed a certain reputation for being full of predictable projectile spammers with platters full of fresh-baked rolls.

I don't necessarily know how well it does its job though, when I can take characters I've never played and have no idea how to use and get thrown into Elite battles immediately.

 

[Hunshh]

Ostensibly, it's just supposed to be a way to match people with opponents of reasonably close skill levels, so that you don't get the guy who's been playing Smash since the N64 matched against Little Jimmy who just got the game yesterday. The lack of any semblance of matchmaking was why Smash 4's For Glory developed a certain reputation for being full of predictable projectile spammers with platters full of fresh-baked rolls.

I don't necessarily know how well it does its job though, when I can take characters I've never played and have no idea how to use and get thrown into Elite battles immediately.

I thought smash points was the only matchmaking system in place. Does this change when in elite smash?

 

[Arrei]

I'm not fully certain, but I'm pretty sure Elite Smash players only get matched with other opponents in that threshold, whereas players below that can get matched against players with wildly different scores.

 

[J.I.L]

Just Nintendo trying to be differnt and cute but screwing up like most of their online.
Elititist losers. Whoever came up with elite smash should be fired. What kind of mental degenerate thinks of having a system in a party game where they separate “elite players” from normal player base. That’s so stupid. And whoever supports players being bared from playing other based on “skill” either take smash way too easily or don’t know how to take a losss from someone way better then you.

Elite smash is stupid, and so are the creators of this game. Ultimate is the most overrated smash game I’ve ever seen.

 

[Crystanium]

I'm not certain. As far as I'm aware, it's never been explained why Elite Smash is even present. One could easily remove Elite Smash altogether and still have a ranking system that puts you up against players who have similar points. I suppose it's supposed to satisfy players who are competitive and want to see how good or poor they're at the game. Yet, you never know how high you are until you reach the very top to the point that your GSP no longer increases. The Japanese Samus/Dark Samus player, YB, has reached this point. It can then be said that in terms of Elite Smash, YB is the best Samus/Dark Samus in the world.

The problem with Elite Smash is that it does upset players, even competitive amateurs like myself. The constant fear of falling out of Elite Smash makes it undesirable for me to continue playing. Yet, if I quit, I won't improve or maintain where I'm at. I'm not a fan of ranking systems in general, but I'd imagine there are better ranking systems, rather than an Elo ranking system. I've heard Tekken 7 has the best ranking system, but I've also read that it's never clearly defined how it works, so I'd imagine the players have figured it out somehow.

The Elo ranking system punishes you by removing a lot of points if you lose to someone with lower points, and rewards you with fewer points if you defeat someone lower than you. While your skill should allow you to recover those lost points, it's very time-consuming and tedious, and there's always a possibility that as you work your way back up, there's a chance you can lose more along the way. I would probably be fine with a ranking system if Elite Smash didn't need to be maintained. One good thing about GSP is that you'll encounter players close to your skill, although it's not always the case. The bad thing is the incessant worrying that comes with it. Ranked anxiety be damned!

 

[Hunshh]

It looks like elite smash is there to keep players drawn in. It has no function at all besides tricking the player into thinking it's something it isn't. It's actually condescending to players with worse game sense and reaction time naturally, debatably the two most important factors in being good at smash. (they can be trained but at the speed and to the degree that your dna permits) When I first saw it I thought it took some exceptional grind, but after finding out I'm not so good at getting good if you get me I became spiteful. Shame on nintendo.

 

[Sucumbio]

I believe it was Sakurai himself who said words along the lines of If you're in Elite Smash, you may consider yourself good at the game.

I personal do not like it because I prefer Teams over 1v1 and ES is almost exclusively 1v1.

But basically it's meant to cordon off the players who prefer offline tournament style rulesets and play. If you can somehow get past all the ffa items on jank stages nonsense then you're going to find yourself in ES. I got my dorf into ES very early on and at a high enough GSP that he stayed in even without playing him. But now he's out and trying to get back in seems unlikely.

But like I said I prefer teams anyway.

Should have kept For Glory imho with 1v1 and teams separate.

 

[Crystanium]

I believe it was Sakurai himself who said words along the lines of If you're in Elite Smash, you may consider yourself good at the game.

I personal do not like it because I prefer Teams over 1v1 and ES is almost exclusively 1v1.

But basically it's meant to cordon off the players who prefer offline tournament style rulesets and play. If you can somehow get past all the ffa items on jank stages nonsense then you're going to find yourself in ES. I got my dorf into ES very early on and at a high enough GSP that he stayed in even without playing him. But now he's out and trying to get back in seems unlikely.

But like I said I prefer teams anyway.

Should have kept For Glory imho with 1v1 and teams separate.

My brother proposed an idea. Separate Quickplay from Elite Smash so that Quickplay is the new For Fun and Elite Smash is the new For Glory. Maintain the preferences, but the preferences work differently for Quickplay and Elite Smash. I'll present it this way for ease of reading.

Quickplay

• 1v1, 2v2, FFA.*
• Items on.
• Item spawning can be set, but cannot be deactivated.
• Final Smash meter can be activated or deactivated.
• Hazards can be on or off.
• Stages are random.
• Modes can be stock, stamina, coin, &c.
• Stocks cannot be >2, nor <6. This offers everyone a chance to win and prevents absurdly long matches.
• Stamina can go as low as 100 HP and as high as 999 HP.
• Timer can be set between 4:00 to ∞, depending on the amount of stocks. Two minutes are added for each stock.

Elite Smash

• 1v1, 2v2
• Items off.
• Item spawning cannot be activated.
• Final Smash meter cannot be activated.
• Hazards off.
• Stages are omega, tri-plat, or shuffle, where shuffling randomizes omega and tri-plats to offer variety.
• Modes are restricted to stock only and cannot be any lower than two stocks.
• Stocks cannot be >2, nor <6 for the aforementioned reasons.
• Timer cannot be set lower or equal to stocks, e.g., 3-stock, 3 minutes.†

*2v2 for both Quickplay and Elite Smash wouldn't be possible if the second controller wasn't on, i.e., you wouldn't be potentially put up against two players unless you had support from a second player.

†The reason the timer cannot be set lower or equal to stocks is because it is typically uncommon to take three stocks off in three minutes or less. A 3-stock, 3 minute set-up is usually done in order to take a stock lead and then run away the rest of the match just to win, or possibly lead into Sudden Death. Some would describe this as "degenerate".

 

[PURGE THEM LIKE THE]

I couldn't care less about knowing whether or not I'm in elite smash. In fact, they should give me the option to turn off the numbers on display. The only purpose they serve is to frustrate me when I beat someone. I have no control over who I'm facing, so I have no reason to know how much each fight is worth. I also question the meaningfulness of elite smash because I haven't touched gunner, lucina, or ness in months, yet they've never dropped out from inactivity.

If it means anything, I only have those 3, mr gw, and inkling in elite smash. The only characters I use even semi often are mr gw and inkling.

 

[Cilos]

Anyone annoyed with the latest patch in relation to Elite Smash?

I will consistently play people that beat me to get better, but when I get into elite smash, I lose a match, get kicked out of elite smash and can no longer rematch the person I was just playing. This also happens in reverse. I like to offer the person I beat a chance to play again, but then I'm upgraded to elite smash and can't do a rematch.

It's quite annoying.

 

[Sudz]

The most obnoxious part to me is that the second I get knocked out of elite I win like 99.99% of my matches but when I get back into elite I frequently fight someone that bodies me and I immediately get knocked back out.

So basically I have to start the whole process over every single match. Super obnoxious

 

[DeDeDIke]

I think it's best to just stay right outside Elite. Some of my friends who are in ES tell me that it's crammed with Hero players and projectile spammers. At least if you're just outside of ES, you could maintain your win rate a lot easier than if you're in it. I was just in ES with King DDD a few days ago and got kicked out after losing one match, then I proceeded to win a bunch of FFAs and team battles when not in ES.

 

[J.I.L]

I think it's best to just stay right outside Elite. Some of my friends who are in ES tell me that it's crammed with Hero players and projectile spammers. At least if you're just outside of ES, you could maintain your win rate a lot easier than if you're in it. I was just in ES with King DDD a few days ago and got kicked out after losing one match, then I proceeded to win a bunch of FFAs and team battles when not in ES.

Don’t know or care about the projectile spammer part, but it’s infested with hero players. I don’t play ES anymore. That character, Hero, is way to cheap. Sakurai is a dumb%## for programming him like that. Heck, most of sakurai decisions for online can describe him as what I just said.

 

[kinbobbobkin]

I disagree, Hero is not anywhere close in being cheap. Annoying, yes, but not cheap.


Anyway, I feel like the GSP system is what messes up Elite Smash.

 

[GrieverSSBU]

I honestly find the people saying it means "nothing" cumbersome and annoying. Yes, there is some margin for luck. For example, you get more GSP per battle if you have a higher win ration to lose ratio. So, if you pick up a character, and you happen to get lucky enough to paired with a few favorable matchups, you can get into elite smash in two or three matches. I did that with kirby. The chances of that happening are kind of slim, though. As far as cheese is concerned, that may be enough to get in, but it's probably not enough to stay in.

If you're seriously claiming it means nothing and that there's no difference between the intensity of matches in elite play verses players with noticeable differences in GSP I think you're being willfully disingenuous, possibly insecure about your own skill, or touting false humility.

Everyone always spews this nonsense when it comes to any ranking system but they don't realize no ranking system can calculate your skill with perfect precision. There's always going to be variance. Phrased in a way people will probably understand: is there a chance that you can be a poorly skilled player and also be in elite smash? Answer: yes. Is there a chance that you're a great player but you can't get into elite smash despite playing QP consistently and over a long period of time? Answer: unlikely.

As much as I tend to agree with your sentiments, I'm that unlikely player. I have several characters right at the edge of elite but every time I go to get them over the brink I start getting insanely ****ty matchup/stage luck or get tossed into FFA with items set to very high. I agree that it is unlikely I'll stay there forever but it's been months on the edge and it's frustrating honestly. I know I should just not care since I'm trying to stay competitively focused but damn if I can body people who have no issue getting into elite yet I still cant manage to get there myself then something seems to be amiss. I really feel like if they made it so proffered rules were matched up with similar/the same rulesets it would be far easier to attain. That's not to say I don't want a challenge, it's more I would like my preferred ruleset to not be in such a state of flux. Maybe I'm just that bad that I'll never make it in, but I highly doubt it. That's just my perspective on things.

 

[roymustang1990-]

It means you have the basics down to a T

 

[Kokiden]

It doesn't mean much when you get in, since it's easy to cheese your way in with certain characters like Ganondorf.

Staying in Elite, and consistently winning though? I'd say you're above average.

 

[DeDeDIke]

I view it more like this:
<100k GSP: Either you're really bad or you're losing on purpose.
100k ~1M GSP: You're just learning a new character and trying to get the feel for that particular character.
1M ~ 4M GSP: You're getting comfortable with the character and can win a decent amount of games.
4M ~ 4.6M GSP: Mixed bag. Here in this range we have many different players, and it's starting to get more competitive.
4.6M~5.1M GSP: Mostly good rulesets here. Players in this range tend to be very good, competent players.
5.1~5.35M GSP: This is where you see a significant skill jump. Highly skilled players should be able to maintain a bare minimum of 5.1M GSP.
5.35M GSP~5.475M GSP: You're almost on the same level as ZeRo, Mew2King, Samsora, etc., but they would probably still body you.

 

[Love Tap]

As much as I tend to agree with your sentiments, I'm that unlikely player. I have several characters right at the edge of elite but every time I go to get them over the brink I start getting insanely ****ty matchup/stage luck or get tossed into FFA with items set to very high. I agree that it is unlikely I'll stay there forever but it's been months on the edge and it's frustrating honestly. I know I should just not care since I'm trying to stay competitively focused but damn if I can body people who have no issue getting into elite yet I still cant manage to get there myself then something seems to be amiss. I really feel like if they made it so proffered rules were matched up with similar/the same rulesets it would be far easier to attain. That's not to say I don't want a challenge, it's more I would like my preferred ruleset to not be in such a state of flux. Maybe I'm just that bad that I'll never make it in, but I highly doubt it. That's just my perspective on things.

Huh. That is a bit of a weird case. Usually past 4.5 mil, in my experience, you very rarely see BS rulesets or FFA's. Still though, I'm sorry, that's a pain. I also feel you about being on the edge of elite smash. That's the main reason why I made the initial post that I had, it's because for almost every single character I've picked up, it was more or less easy win riiiiiight until the cusp of elite smash and then things just get intense.





And DeDeDIke

Oh, I agree. QP is awful. Honestly, I think the only real reason anyone would play it is if you're a masochist or if you really want the bragging rights of getting elite. For those players that do want to get more skilled, arenas are definitely the better option. If you want to go up against good players, you can usually find an arena created by an upstart twitch streamer trying to get their name out there, good players usually flock to them to show off how good they are. Every time I start to think I'm good I just join one of Xadril's arenas where I have to work my ass off for the win or get ****ed up entirely. There's also typically less lag to deal with.

I also agree about the skill jump, it started for me around 5.35 mil, I fluctuate with puff back and forth between 5.1 and 5.3 to 5.35, highest ever was like, 5.38 but never got past that. I'm weirdly inconsistent though. I don't win a match then lose a match, I either lose seven matches in a row or win nine matches in a row. I'm either in the mother****ing zone or I'm playing like ****.

 

[Gnight]

To the people who say GSP means nothing, I'm not buying it. It isfor the most part good gauge of one's skill level with a character. I regularly get beat by players of a significantly higher GSP and I'm usually able to do the same to players of much lower GSP.

I view it more like this:
<100k GSP: Either you're really bad or you're losing on purpose.
100k ~1M GSP: You're just learning a new character and trying to get the feel for that particular character.
1M ~ 4M GSP: You're getting comfortable with the character and can win a decent amount of games.
4M ~ 4.6M GSP: Mixed bag. Here in this range we have many different players, and it's starting to get more competitive.
4.6M~5.1M GSP: Mostly good rulesets here. Players in this range tend to be very good, competent players.
5.1~5.35M GSP: This is where you see a significant skill jump. Highly skilled players should be able to maintain a bare minimum of 5.1M GSP.
5.35M GSP~5.475M GSP: You're almost on the same level as ZeRo, Mew2King, Samsora, etc., but they would probably still body you.

Yeah, this!

 

[J.I.L]

I view it more like this:
<100k GSP: Either you're really bad or you're losing on purpose.
100k ~1M GSP: You're just learning a new character and trying to get the feel for that particular character.
1M ~ 4M GSP: You're getting comfortable with the character and can win a decent amount of games.
4M ~ 4.6M GSP: Mixed bag. Here in this range we have many different players, and it's starting to get more competitive.
4.6M~5.1M GSP: Mostly good rulesets here. Players in this range tend to be very good, competent players.
5.1~5.35M GSP: This is where you see a significant skill jump. Highly skilled players should be able to maintain a bare minimum of 5.1M GSP.
5.35M GSP~5.475M GSP: You're almost on the same level as ZeRo, Mew2King, Samsora, etc., but they would probably still body you.

I tried to lose on purpse to see what it's like to be below the 1,000s skill level. But it's just takes too much time. I only got to about 73k. And the people down here aren't that bad. They are literally the same crop of players you'd find in the 1 to early 3 millions. This game ranking systems is hot garbage.

 

[Gnight]

I like QuickPlay! It's really fun with my main until it got flooded by really good Banjos and now I just play with Isabelle with much lower GSP to continue to have a good time. I don't like arenas because the people there are just too good.

 

[DeDeDIke]

I like QuickPlay! It's really fun with my main until it got flooded by really good Banjos and now I just play with Isabelle with much lower GSP to continue to have a good time. I don't like arenas because the people there are just too good.

Have you tried online tourneys?

 

[Gnight]

Have you tried online tourneys?

No, I haven't.

 

[NuNero1]

If you're in elite smash with 3000000+ GSP that is truly an incredible feat. It means you know the game and are pretty adept at it. To say it means nothing is just plain ignorant in my opinion, I believe Sakurai even said that getting to elite smash means your are fundmentaly good. So don't let a few cynics or pessimists tell you any differently.

 

[DeDeDIke]

If you're in elite smash with 3000000+ GSP that is truly an incredible feat. It means you know the game and are pretty adept at it. To say it means nothing is just plain ignorant in my opinion, I believe Sakurai even said that getting to elite smash means your are fundmentaly good. So don't let a few cynics or pessimists tell you any differently.

Um, 3M GSP is kinda average you know... Elite Smash is if you're 5.3M GSP or above (>5,300,000 GSP).

 

[NuNero1]

I stand corrected then. Thank you. But still an incredible feat having 5 mil GSP.

 

[DeDeDIke]

I stand corrected then. Thank you. But still an incredible feat having 5 mil GSP.

Nah, not really. I've already seen many ppl above 5 mil GSP, heck, even some projectile campers who use cheesy rulesets are also above 5M. What WOULD be impressive, though, is if you have over 5.25M GSP and you'll able to maintain that as a bare minimum. One of my mains is hovering around there, but even I'm having trouble trying to maintain that GSP.