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I am a competitive player with 2,000 hours and yet I’m still really confused on something…

MeliaMelonDev

Smash Rookie
Joined
Sep 21, 2021
Messages
1
So… what exactly does negative on shield truly mean? Like, I’ve known what it means for years but what is confusing me currently is how shieldstun affects it. Basically, since Byleth is one of my mains, ever since he got buffed, I’ve been uncertain as to whether or not his side b on shield is now safe and if so, why?

To explain: Top Players tend to say that it’s hard to react to but is unsafe.

Ultimate frame data says it’s -20 on shield. But it has 25 frames of shieldstun. Anytime I land the sweetspot on shield, I rarely EVER get punished at all. Therefore, it’s made me just assume it’s safe on shield now. But if that’s the case, why is it -20?

Other characters with moves that negative get punished pretty much always if they don’t have the same shieldstun.

Watching Leo, I never see people punish his side b on shield either. Is it just certain characters? Is it because of the space between them? I just really want to know. I created an account just to ask this lol
 

Big O

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BiiigOOO
So… what exactly does negative on shield truly mean? Like, I’ve known what it means for years but what is confusing me currently is how shieldstun affects it. Basically, since Byleth is one of my mains, ever since he got buffed, I’ve been uncertain as to whether or not his side b on shield is now safe and if so, why?

To explain: Top Players tend to say that it’s hard to react to but is unsafe.

Ultimate frame data says it’s -20 on shield. But it has 25 frames of shieldstun. Anytime I land the sweetspot on shield, I rarely EVER get punished at all. Therefore, it’s made me just assume it’s safe on shield now. But if that’s the case, why is it -20?

Other characters with moves that negative get punished pretty much always if they don’t have the same shieldstun.

Watching Leo, I never see people punish his side b on shield either. Is it just certain characters? Is it because of the space between them? I just really want to know. I created an account just to ask this lol
There are 2 things that determine whether something is safe on block, frame advantage and positioning. Frame advantage (when negative) tells you how much time they have to punish you. Being -20 on shield (-20 frame advantage) means the defender can act 20 frames before the attacker. Moves that are -20 are usually unsafe, but Byleth is too far away (good positioning) for some characters to be able to punish that within 20 frames. Marth may be able to Fair OoS as early as f9 for example, but if it takes him more than 20f to even get close enough to hit you, you are safe.

Hopefully this answers your question.
 
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