How Heavy?

Diddy Kong

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#1
Just because people have refused to answer this before; how does Ridley's weight rank up compared to the other super heavy weights? Previously, Bowser was the very heaviest and he'll likely be, but Donkey Kong was also playable in the demo who's since Bowser's inclusion always the 2nd heaviest. Ganondorf and Samus, who are also relatively heavy where also playable. And I just want to know, how heavy is Ridley compared to them? Is he combo bait, or surprisingly light for his size giving him a sort of glass canon archetype like Mewtwo?
 

Erimir

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#2
I don't think it's a refusal so much as that is pretty difficult to discern from the information we have because there are so many variables to account for to infer it (how much damage, rage, DI, which stage from what position, how many players, which attack).

He clearly looks to be on the heavier side, but if you see him next to Bowser... sure, he takes up a similar amount of space, but it's because he's long and lanky and hunched over - he has less volume than Bowser. So he looks like he ought to weigh less than Bowser. Given that he's capable of flight, presumably he should have less dense bones as well. So logically he should weigh less than Bowser. But for balancing purposes maybe he doesn't.

But I would be surprised if he was as heavy as Bowser.
 

CrowGoesCaw

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#3
There seems to be a lot of conflicting opinions on this. Some people don't even think he's a heavy.

Zero is the only pro I've heard weigh in (har har) on this. He said Ridley is one of the heavies, but not the heaviest. I think it was him who said heavier than samus, lighter than DK. But I'd could be confusing that last part with other peoples comments.
 
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#5
The most descriptive thing I heard was "heavy but still dying before characters like Snake."
To be fair the only characters above Snake in Brawl might be DK and Bowser so that might not be saying much since I'm assuming Snake will be just as heavy in Ultimate.

My guess the weight ranking right now will be (high to low)

-Bowser
-DK
-Snake
-Ridley
-King Dedede
-Charizard
-Ganondorf
 

Diddy Kong

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#6
Snake is really that heavy yet again? I thought this was a mistake, much like his insane hitbox on the U Tilt? Reasonably, Snake should be around the weight of Link or Ike I guess.

But okay, he clearly isn't a super heavy weight which bodes fine with me honestly. His overall skinny frame might have to do with it.
 
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#7
Snake is really that heavy yet again? I thought this was a mistake, much like his insane hitbox on the U Tilt? Reasonably, Snake should be around the weight of Link or Ike I guess.

But okay, he clearly isn't a super heavy weight which bodes fine with me honestly. His overall skinny frame might have to do with it.
That's true, they might have reduced his weight. But from what I've been told he's largely unchanged (though they definitely reduced up-tilt hitbox LOL), and nobody has said it feels like he's lighter to my knowledge. Also, when I played him at Nintendo NY, he felt exactly like Brawl Snake to me. I'm expecting Snake to still be a super heavyweight. He's a big boi doin big boi missions.

I'm pretty certain he'll be top 5 in weight nonetheless, Ridley that is. He's too big not to be, and isn't Mewtwo, who is light for some reason.
 

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#8
The most descriptive thing I heard was "heavy but still dying before characters like Snake."
It does come down to Ridley's falling speed, weight, and gravity values. In Smash Wii U, Bowser may be the heaviest fighter, but his endurance against vertical knockback is worse than that of Donkey Kong and King Dedede.

Anyway, Ridley could end up being as heavy as Charizard, while his vertical endurance is set poor enough for him to get KO'd sooner than those who weigh less than him.
 

Diddy Kong

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#9
That's true, they might have reduced his weight. But from what I've been told he's largely unchanged (though they definitely reduced up-tilt hitbox LOL), and nobody has said it feels like he's lighter to my knowledge. Also, when I played him at Nintendo NY, he felt exactly like Brawl Snake to me. I'm expecting Snake to still be a super heavyweight. He's a big boi doin big boi missions.

I'm pretty certain he'll be top 5 in weight nonetheless, Ridley that is. He's too big not to be, and isn't Mewtwo, who is light for some reason.
Honestly, Mewtwo is pretty much the reason I could expect Ridley to be way lighter than he appears. Then again, Ridley doesn't exactly "float" and for a character with wings, he has quite terrible recovery.

Remembers me quite of Charizard, which is ironic because...

 
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#10
Honestly, Mewtwo is pretty much the reason I could expect Ridley to be way lighter than he appears. Then again, Ridley doesn't exactly "float" and for a character with wings, he has quite terrible recovery.

Remembers me quite of Charizard, which is ironic because...

I don't expect him to be very light, and hopefully he's not light at all. Playing Mewtwo sucks when you're both tall and die at like 80% to anything lol
 

Iridium

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#11
I don't expect him to be very light, and hopefully he's not light at all. Playing Mewtwo sucks when you're both tall and die at like 80% to anything lol
He really should not have been. Mewtwo is 269.0 lbs., and although that would be hard to implement in Smash for obvious reasons, he weighed at 85 units in SSBM, a lot more than in SSB4. Having him be close to his original weight would come with pros and cons, but maybe his strengths would make up for this (this took me a while).
 

Diddy Kong

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#12
I don't expect him to be very light, and hopefully he's not light at all. Playing Mewtwo sucks when you're both tall and die at like 80% to anything lol
Well, Mewtwo's recovery is very good to compensate for this. So he kinda feels like a middle weight anyway, who just escapes combos far easier. But I get your point, I dislike Mewtwo being so extremely light as well...
 
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#13
Well, Mewtwo's recovery is very good to compensate for this. So he kinda feels like a middle weight anyway, who just escapes combos far easier. But I get your point, I dislike Mewtwo being so extremely light as well...
Yeah his recovery is good but if you keep getting juggled/hit off stage, that good recovery doesn't avoid you taking damage unfortunately.
 

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#14
Speaking of recovery, Ridley's at first glance seems about average to above average in terms of distance, at least when you have your jumps
available. But where it really shines is in the danger it can pose to his opponents. Side b can drag opponents below the stage, and up b hits pretty hard.
 
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#15
Ridley looks relatively light. Probably lighter than Mario. At one point in Treehouse he dies to a partially charged Inkling Fsmash at 70%... Either he’s crazy light, it’s massively overtuned, or some combination of the two. But considering all the other times he died at relatively low percents I doubt the Fsmash is that dumb.

I’m not exactly impressed with his recovery either. He falls fast, his double jumps look pretty bad, his air speed looks mediocre... His up special looks good but most characters with good recoveries have at least two or three options. That’s one relatively normal one. We don’t know what the hitboxes are like either. So if he has to fly predictably and the hitboxes are *** then he’s getting dunked a lot.

The FAF on his aerials besides Uair seem pretty mediocre too, though I can’t say I was super attentive to that either. If you’re low enough to consider a Uair you might not even make it back if you do...
 

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#16
Ridley looks relatively light. Probably lighter than Mario. At one point in Treehouse he dies to a partially charged Inkling Fsmash at 70%... Either he’s crazy light, it’s massively overtuned, or some combination of the two. But considering all the other times he died at relatively low percents I doubt the Fsmash is that dumb.

I’m not exactly impressed with his recovery either. He falls fast, his double jumps look pretty bad, his air speed looks mediocre... His up special looks good but most characters with good recoveries have at least two or three options. That’s one relatively normal one. We don’t know what the hitboxes are like either. So if he has to fly predictably and the hitboxes are *** then he’s getting dunked a lot.

The FAF on his aerials besides Uair seem pretty mediocre too, though I can’t say I was super attentive to that either. If you’re low enough to consider a Uair you might not even make it back if you do...
Come back with evidence regarding the percent Mario dies to that fsmash, then we can talk.

Ridley also has his side b that can snap the ledge and dunk people who don't respect it like flame choke, and a fast, good coverage nair.
 
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#17
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n73NGG6n_iY

Just after three minutes Mario is buried and then hit by an Fsmash at ~120% and barely survives... Though after flying across the stage. On the flip side, about 25 seconds Mario takes one at more like 25% and barely goes anywhere. I think that’s enough to infer that Ridley is lighter than Mario.

I’m sure there’s gotta be footage of Mario getting Fsmashed at 70% somewhere but I don’t feel like combing over all of it. I think it’s clear enough that Ridley isn’t heavy.

Flame Choke was gutted... I don’t quite recall how Ridley’s move works offstage but I do know it’s not a win button like the old Flame Choke.

Is there a clip of somebody using a Nair offstage? Because again I don’t remember the FAF being that good.
 

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#18
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n73NGG6n_iY

Just after three minutes Mario is buried and then hit by an Fsmash at ~120% and barely survives... Though after flying across the stage. On the flip side, about 25 seconds Mario takes one at more like 25% and barely goes anywhere. I think that’s enough to infer that Ridley is lighter than Mario.

I’m sure there’s gotta be footage of Mario getting Fsmashed at 70% somewhere but I don’t feel like combing over all of it. I think it’s clear enough that Ridley isn’t heavy.

Flame Choke was gutted... I don’t quite recall how Ridley’s move works offstage but I do know it’s not a win button like the old Flame Choke.

Is there a clip of somebody using a Nair offstage? Because again I don’t remember the FAF being that good.
Pretty sure people also take less knockback when buried.
 

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#19
Ridley looks relatively light. Probably lighter than Mario. At one point in Treehouse he dies to a partially charged Inkling Fsmash at 70%... Either he’s crazy light, it’s massively overtuned, or some combination of the two. But considering all the other times he died at relatively low percents I doubt the Fsmash is that dumb.
I’m sure there’s gotta be footage of Mario getting Fsmashed at 70% somewhere but I don’t feel like combing over all of it. I think it’s clear enough that Ridley isn’t heavy.
It's not clear. In the slightest. The burden of proof lies on you.

Acting as if your assumptions/observations are correct when you have neither firsthand experience nor video evidence supporting your claim to know (Ridley's) supposed weight achieves absolutely nothing.

And it is going hard to take you seriously when your own example isn't working the way you think it does.


Pretty sure people also take less knockback when buried.
Buried opponents take 30% less knockback to be precise.
 
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#20
That’s why I mentioned being buried. I don’t think y’all are going to will Ridley into being a heavyweight lmao.

Nothing about Inkling’s Fsmash seems busted. Ridley quite blatantly died to one such Fsmash at 70%. With bigger blastzones, I might add. How many things outright kill Mario at 70% in Smash 4? Not many.

We’ve seen what a low and a high end hit does with Inkling’s Fsmash. Seems very normal to me... Why do you think it isn’t normal? What evidence do you have? Ridley? Sakurai frequently makes bigger/tall characters lighter when they have high dash speed. Akuma type characters frequently have low durability. Consider this topic exists at all...
 
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#21
Consider this topic exists at all...
...and much to the consternation of everyone else, if I may add.

Again, burden of proof is on you/OP. You're not going to magically will any of your suppositions into being either at the rate you're going so I suggest quitting while you're ahead, fam.

Diddy Kong Diddy Kong , it's not that peeps are refusing to answer for the sake of withholding knowledge or are even in denial of something like Ridley being a lightweight. Nobody honestly knows the answer to that for sure, and a lot could change from now until release.

Smooth Criminal
 
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#22
If you're talking about Inkling smashes, you ought to also double check that the character hit didn't have ink on them, which would increase damage and knockback. This would make it even harder to get an apples-to-apples comparison...

Also re: being buried reducing knockback. It's quite possible that the modifier has changed, but we can be sure that there's still a modifier and it's somewhere in the same vicinity.
 
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#23
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4-OrOkDLxmI

12:45 Ridley takes a Kirby Bair at 105% and gets catapulted across New Pork City and dies.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jDrcjdJHwQs

0:57 Ridley gets cleanly killed by Link’s Dash Attack from close to the center of T&C at 89%.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=E_O5Ge4tpyQ

Here at about 0:40 Ridley takes Bairs from Samus and gets absolutely launched at 82%. Not killed, if only because of how ridiculous the blast zones are. You can see on the display it was only barely. Right after he takes a stale one (which I believe was a sourspot and not a late hit, correct me if I’m wrong) and inches even closer to the edge. This is IMO the strongest evidence.

Then at 2:20 he takes an Fsmash from Mario (I believe, it’s quite chaotic) at 109% and died from center stage. Again, massive blast zones.

Again, it’s not looking good for Ridley’s weight. I’ve seen zero evidence of him being heavy. I mean... We have some top players known for riding the hype too damn hard claiming he’s like Snake but these same players had some wild claims during Smash 4’s development and during the release of the game of the newer characters.
 

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#24
It's a new game, moves could be different from Smash 4 as could be the actual standards for weight. Nobody will know true weight until someone datamines, and the only person that we can conclusively state is heavier than Ridley is Bowser, due to no one being heavier than him.
 
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#25
I’m under the impression that very little has changed. Looking at clear, objective things, like damage for example, and it seems like very much of it is the same. Pit for example has two moves with any apparent damage difference at all. Samus’s Bair doesn’t seem so different that it would do something like this, Kirby’s Bair doesn’t either, Inklings Fsmash doesn’t seem stupidly powerful, and so on. The odd variable, the missing piece, is indeed Ridley.

You can’t just pull a mulligan right after I present exactly what you asked for. I was arguing that Ridley looks far lighter than he appears. That very much seems to be the case... And I answered OP’s question more definitively than anybody else. I see no reason to be all huffy.
 

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#26
I’m under the impression that very little has changed. Looking at clear, objective things, like damage for example, and it seems like very much of it is the same. Pit for example has two moves with any apparent damage difference at all. Samus’s Bair doesn’t seem so different that it would do something like this, Kirby’s Bair doesn’t either, Inklings Fsmash doesn’t seem stupidly powerful, and so on. The odd variable, the missing piece, is indeed Ridley.

You can’t just pull a mulligan right after I present exactly what you asked for. I was arguing that Ridley looks far lighter than he appears. That very much seems to be the case... And I answered OP’s question more definitively than anybody else. I see no reason to be all huffy.
Besides the potential demo-disclaimer that's already been discussed, I also mentioned that unless you can recreate these scenarios with different victims, the evidence just isn't conclusive enough.
 

CrowGoesCaw

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#27
The odd variable, the missing piece, is indeed Ridley.
What about DI? We have no idea what the player's inputs are and DI makes a massive difference in smash4. Bad DI can cause kos far earlier and good DI can lead to surviving far longer. Ridley might have DIed the wrong way and Mario the right way. Or maybe Ridley is light. Honestly, there is no way to tell off of such few points of data.
 
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#29
What about DI? We have no idea what the player's inputs are and DI makes a massive difference in smash4. Bad DI can cause kos far earlier and good DI can lead to surviving far longer. Ridley might have DIed the wrong way and Mario the right way. Or maybe Ridley is light. Honestly, there is no way to tell off of such few points of data.
Looking at the Samus Bair example, the Ridley was Plup. I do not know what kind of DI Ultimate uses, but I would like to believe he knew what it was and how to use it. He also knew how many newer items worked too, meaning he isn’t totally oblivious to how newer games work. And besides that, just looking at how he moved, he likely was DIing straight to the right at worst.

One could argue that DI is worse overall, but again, I don’t see any evidence as to such.

Time to point out the obvious. It's a demo and the best thing to do is wait till the game's out
I mean, I wouldn’t act surprised if Ridley wasn’t heavy at release either.
 

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#30
I'm aware replying to this late (and it may be futile overall trying to convince one otherwise) but


Ridley is covered in as much (if not more) ink than Mario is in the above example, and travels roughly the same distance from the center of the stage.
 
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#31
The Samus Bair example is much more meaningful because there’s less variables at play.

Also I checked in a few different places and asked Samus fans if there was any evidence of changes to the move, and it came up negative. There’s no readily apparent buffs or nerfs to the knockback.
 
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