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Home-Run bat needs a rework

Spiny Top

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
49
The home run bat is bad. Let’s face it. And it doesn’t need to be, that’s the annoying part. But as it stands it is by far the worst battering item and possibly the worst item in the game. Let’s compare.

Beam Sword: deals comparable damage with far better reach on tilts and smashes in particular.

Lip’s Stick: deals way more damage with the flowering effect.

Star rod: deals comparable damage but can fling star projectiles.

Ore Club: a little slower but hits much harder and kicks up tornados.

Killing edge: comparable, but way stronger when glowing obviously.

Death’s scythe: comparable, only you can insta-kill at high percent.

Fire Bar: comparable, but with much better reach for the first half dozen hits.

So what does the home run bat bring to the table? Oh, the home run smash attack of course! WRONG. Ironically, the icon feature of the home run bat is its worst attack. The ridiculous start up lag on that attack makes it useless for anything other than a low percentage shield break.

So how can we fix this? The obvious answer is speed up the home run feature to a normal smashing speed. It would be good, but not OP. People would need to respect it. Or, we could do a deeper rework and make all around great knockback the bat’s primary feature. A jab from it packs the knockback of an average Ftilt, its tilt has smash attack knockback, and its smash hits like a fully charged smash (and you still get the ding).
 
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meleebrawler

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 8, 2014
Messages
8,156
Location
Canada, Quebec
NNID
meleebrawler
3DS FC
2535-3888-1548
The home run bat is bad. Let’s face it. And it doesn’t need to be, that’s the annoying part. But as it stands it is by far the worst battering item and possibly the worst item in the game. Let’s compare.

Beam Sword: deals comparable damage with far better reach on tilts and smashes in particular.

Lip’s Stick: deals way more damage with the flowering effect.

Star rod: deals comparable damage but can fling star projectiles.

Ore Club: a little slower but hits much harder and kicks up tornados.

Killing edge: comparable, but way stronger when glowing obviously.

Death’s scythe: comparable, only you can insta-kill at high percent.

Fire Bar: comparable, but with much better reach for the first half dozen hits.

So what does the home run bat bring to the table? Oh, the home run smash attack of course! WRONG. Ironically, the icon feature of the home run bat is its worst attack. The ridiculous start up lag on that attack makes it useless for anything other than a low percentage shield break.

So how can we fix this? The obvious answer is speed up the home run feature to a normal smashing speed. It would be good, but not OP. People would need to respect it. Or, we could do a deeper rework and make all around great knockback the bat’s primary feature. A jab from it packs the knockback of an average Ftilt, its tilt has smash attack knockback, and its smash hits like a fully charged smash (and you still get the ding).
Just throw the darn thing if you can't smash anyone with it. That has always been the other main strategy with the bat even back in 64 and Melee when it's swing was faster, because it is far stronger than any other battering item when used that way.

All or nothing is the bat's niche. Also, we would not have the Home-Run Contest without the bat as we know it.

Never seen anyone complain about an item as though it were their favorite character... I actually think Death's Scythe is the worst battering item because it is only effective if it spawns when someone is at the kill threshold, which is so high any other item could easily do the trick with a good hit. Only situation where the scythe has the edge is in stages where getting KOs the normal way is hard. Everywhere else, the scythe is weak and mediocre, including when thrown.
 
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Furret24

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 28, 2015
Messages
3,576
Not everything needs to be good. Even then, the bat is still an amazing throwing item, and the OHKO onit is faster than ever. The item is fine and great as is.
:162:
 

Spiny Top

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
49
Not everything needs to be good. Even then, the bat is still an amazing throwing item, and the OHKO onit is faster than ever. The item is fine and great as is.
:162:
You really think the OHKO is faster than ever? The thing is as slow as a Ganondorf punch based on my testing.

And if the bats only purpose it to be thrown, then it is competing with the likes of Shell, bomb omb, freezie, boomerang, smart bomb etc etc which all outclass it in that regard. It is also only marginally better than the other battering items when thrown.

So what’s the niche here? Help me out
 

Spiny Top

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
49
Just throw the darn thing if you can't smash anyone with it. That has always been the other main strategy with the bat even back in 64 and Melee when it's swing was faster, because it is far stronger than any other battering item when used that way.

All or nothing is the bat's niche. Also, we would not have the Home-Run Contest without the bat as we know it.

Never seen anyone complain about an item as though it were their favorite character... I actually think Death's Scythe is the worst battering item because it is only effective if it spawns when someone is at the kill threshold, which is so high any other item could easily do the trick with a good hit. Only situation where the scythe has the edge is in stages where getting KOs the normal way is hard. Everywhere else, the scythe is weak and mediocre, including when thrown.
This doesn’t need to come at the expense of home run contest, I’m advocating to make it swing faster is all.

I agree with you in general about the scythe. However it does in general kill faster than the traditional way, with insta kills kicking off for smashes around 80 percent and tilt kills at 120. Good against heavyweights who don’t die that early. Good for heavyweights because although their attacks kill at those percentages, the scythe is much faster with better reach. Good for lightweights who simply can’t kill at those percentages.

Compared to the bat it has more reach and a usable smash attack, in addition. And as you mentioned it can get kills on stages where walls or ceilings might deflect your kill.
 

meleebrawler

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 8, 2014
Messages
8,156
Location
Canada, Quebec
NNID
meleebrawler
3DS FC
2535-3888-1548
You really think the OHKO is faster than ever? The thing is as slow as a Ganondorf punch based on my testing.

And if the bats only purpose it to be thrown, then it is competing with the likes of Shell, bomb omb, freezie, boomerang, smart bomb etc etc which all outclass it in that regard. It is also only marginally better than the other battering items when thrown.

So what’s the niche here? Help me out
It's an item. Nobody cares if an item is balanced or not because they can just be turned off, or because of their tendency to fall in someone's lap for no reason at all.

More to the point, you're underestimating the kinds of shenanigans that happen in a typical scenario where items are enabled. Opponents distracted by brawls. Dodging one move to fall in another trap. Other items that can incapacitate opponents for easy pickings, or make yourself harder to interrupt. Or since the bat is an item, it could end up in the hands of a character with a relatively easy way to set up an early kill with it, like Mewtwo's Disable, Inkling roller, Marcina Shield Breaker or shoto Focus Attack dash cancel.

There's plenty of conventional battering items already as you've mentioned. Why do we need one more, when balancing isn't a concern?
 
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Saikyoshi

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
3,921
Location
Being petty
NNID
KarmaPilcrow
3DS FC
0344-9771-0514
It's not supposed to be practical. Hitting someone with a Home-Run Bat is more a "bragging rights" kind of move, like Warlock Punch. It's almost never the SMART thing to do, but when it lands, it's spectacular.

Besides, it's an item. Items don't need to be competitively balanced that much because their very nature throws off the balance of a match in favor of who they spawn closer to.
 
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