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High Tier King?

D

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Bowser has kinda struggled throughout the Smash series. He was abysmal in Melee, and only slightly better in Brawl. When Smash 4 was in it's speculative stages however, things started to look up for the Koopa King. Analyzing footage, and playing pre-release builds, many players thought that the precarious princess poacher was top-tier material. Unfortunately, when Sm4sh finally released, this was not the case, and Bowser was mid-tier at best. However, now in Ultimate, Bowser might finally be a true force to be reckoned with. He is one of, if not the, fastest heavies in the game. With ridiculous kill power, and combo potential, Bowser may finally be a truly high-tier god. Thoughts?
 

S_B

Too Drunk to Smash
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NH, Discord: SB#6077
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I fell in love with Bowser all over again today at the PAX East console free play area. Spent most of the day just playing against the best players I could find there and really started to get back into the Bowser groove by the end.

My last match was an epic 2v1 comeback with a shield break finish for the win. Made me realize just how badly I miss going to tournaments...

Yeah, Bowser may very well be the best heavy, and he's clearly the best version of Bowser we've seen to date.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
I fell in love with Bowser all over again today at the PAX East console free play area. Spent most of the day just playing against the best players I could find there and really started to get back into the Bowser groove by the end.

My last match was an epic 2v1 comeback with a shield break finish for the win. Made me realize just how badly I miss going to tournaments...

Yeah, Bowser may very well be the best heavy, and he's clearly the best version of Bowser we've seen to date.
Unpopular opinion: Bowser>Ganondorf
 

Ambuuuuu

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 26, 2019
Messages
4
I would say he's upper mid-tier, since he has a bad disadvantage, and an average neutral when not at really low percent.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Correct but since when was this unpopular? No pros ever rank Bowser above Ganondorf.
Huh. I always thought people saw Ganon as the superior character. Nice to see the pros have taste!
 

Luigi Linguine

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 27, 2017
Messages
57
I would say Bowser is the third best super heavy right now behind Ganondorf and DK. He's got some deadly panache goin' on in this game and he'll really mess you up if he gets in, but like all super heavies besides K. Rool, his disadvantage is just abysmal. Because of that, I would place Bowser in upper mid, but high tier might be pushing it imo.

For the record, this is how I would currently rank the super heavies:
1. Ganondorf
2. Donkey Kong
3. Bowser
4. King Dedede
5. K. Rool
6. Incineroar
7. Charizard
 
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SuchAnxiety

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 30, 2019
Messages
1
Dude, people are totally sleeping on Bowser. Up-Special out of shield is soooo strong and a down-special that actually works now combos out of a cancelled neutral-air. I do truly believe Bowser beats every other heavy in this game (save Snake, if you count him) and I think he's universally ranked too low on tier lists. Forward-air neutralizes most projectiles too. It's insane. This game has permanently converted me to a Bowser main after playing Fox my whole life, lol.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Dude, people are totally sleeping on Bowser. Up-Special out of shield is soooo strong and a down-special that actually works now combos out of a cancelled neutral-air. I do truly believe Bowser beats every other heavy in this game (save Snake, if you count him) and I think he's universally ranked too low on tier lists. Forward-air neutralizes most projectiles too. It's insane. This game has permanently converted me to a Bowser main after playing Fox my whole life, lol.
AND HE'S SO FAST. MY MAN BE SHMOOVIN
 

xwingz900

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 20, 2018
Messages
103
Bowser is actually ridiculous in Ultimate, glad things are actually looking up for this character. I definitely see him as the best heavy in the game.

My super heavy ranking is
1. :ultbowser:
2.:ultganondorf:
3.:ultincineroar:
4.:ultdk:
5.:ultkingdedede:
6.:ultkrool:
7.:ultcharizard:
 

Lacrimosa

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 31, 2019
Messages
1,255
Location
Germany
So, how well my dude is doing in tournaments.
Similar to Zelda: A low-player base, but the people maining him do get exceptionally well results. Maybe not always the same person, but to my knowledge there is always a Bowser placing well. Dedede does the same, too. Most namely with Zaki.
I also think Bowser's the best super-heavy. Though Guy is a pretty good ability that helps him a lot and other super-heavies would kill to have that.
I don't know about K. Rool but that he won an Australian major is not bad and at least noteworthy for a char that was/is considered unviable.
There are also a few Incins but I haven't heard much of Magister lately :/.
1. :ultbowser:
2. :ultkingdedede:
3. :ultdk:
4. :ultganondorf: (tendency towards 5th)
5. :ultkrool:
6. :ultincineroar:


7. :ultcharizard:

Zard is way behind Incineroar but that's good. PT doesn't need a high-tier super-heavy when they already have a comboing lightweight with Squirtly and a really, really good character like Ivy that can also kill. This char can shred through most of the cast, anyway.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Dedede gets the best representation and results out of all the heavies as far as I can tell.

"Handsome Fighters Never Lose"
 

Dε√ilj∦o

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 20, 2015
Messages
238
Location
Paris, France
I fell in love with Bowser all over again today at the PAX East console free play area. Spent most of the day just playing against the best players I could find there and really started to get back into the Bowser groove by the end.

My last match was an epic 2v1 comeback with a shield break finish for the win. Made me realize just how badly I miss going to tournaments...

Yeah, Bowser may very well be the best heavy, and he's clearly the best version of Bowser we've seen to date.
Ay man glad to see you're having fun with Bowser again.

I think Bowser is mega slept on. Its weird, I don't know why he still has such a poor player base, but as someone mentioned above the few people that play him show good results, because my man's actually really ****ing good in this game. He even got buffed multiple times since release ; and I think he doesn't need more buffs. He's excellent right now and I have a lot of fun destroying people online with him. Unfortunately I don't go to tourneys so maybe my opinion doesn't matter.

But if there's one thing in particular I love about playing Bowser online compared to Smash 4 is actually being able to pick battlefield and frame 6 command grab people on platforms my god that is TOO good.
 

Rookie06

Smash Rookie
Joined
Oct 6, 2015
Messages
3
It baffles me that people think Ganondorf is better than Bowser. He has like all of Ganondorfs strengths but is better in almost every other aspect. Aside from some of the absolutely insane Ganons, I think the character is almost seen as good because of other people just being bad half a year into the game. Only see him falling. Essentially to me, the only things Ganon is amazing for, Bowser is still great for.

I think Bowser is the best heavy, and the next best ones would be DK and Dedede (pretty slept on). He gets juggled easily, but you could say that for many of these characters. But unlike a traditional heavy character he loses a major weakness in being slow, and instead of just being not slow, he's actually fast. The weight makes him extremely difficult to kill (moreso than anyone else), all of his moves are actually pretty good, and he has good potential mixups, decent combos, and brutal answers for shield and spotdodge. He's intimidating to fight against psychologically, which is outside the game, but a very real thing when applying good pressure.

Nair combos are pretty ridiculous damage, at higher percents leads to bair on a ton of the cast. It's the best combo since Fire Breath. Don't think I need to speak on that in this game. Up B OOS is an amazing tool, can punish even some well spaced aerials. Side B I'd argue is the best command grab in the game. It makes your opponent feels unsafe, even on platforms. Fire Breath / up B punish spot dodge brutally or safely depending on how confident you are one is coming. Dair and Down B while not spammable are super useful and can even condition opponents into letting you get the other one in many scenarios. If you condition them to shield, down b will kill nearly any character as early as 20. Fair is stupidly good offstage. We all know this though, I'm just brushing the surface, didn't even mention things like Tough Guy or his tilts. Despite clearly having some big weaknesses and poor matchups vs some zoners, I think he's high tier (maybe low high tier but still). He has some weaknesses but his strengths are so ridiculously good (and the best in the game, at that) that in a lot of senses they make up for any shortcomings.

Only disclaimer here is that someone said he beats every other super heavy in the game. I think he loses kinda hard to Dedede. There's a high level Dedede in my area who shares this opinion as well. He has so many tools to mess with Bowser and Fire Breath not reflecting Gordo like Flamethrower is really rough. Dedede is the one character I feel is super hard for Bowser to kill when playing well.
 
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EatLivers

Smash Rookie
Joined
May 26, 2019
Messages
12
In my opinion either Bowser or Ganon is the best super-heavy in Ultimate. I'd say Bowser is an anti to a lot of the lighter characters on the roster, as he can KO at very low percents and survive attacks above 150. Not to mention his Tough Guy ability that enables him to override jabs and weak moves. His side b is can be easily abused and gives him an edge on battlefield as he can KO at lower percents with it if he hops up on one of the platforms. His fair has a huge hitbox and can cover more than 50% of the area around him. Ultimately, if you don't know how to play against Bowser, you pretty much lose in my eyes. I'd say Bowser's only weakness would be sword characters. He's just not as fast out of shield and has trouble getting in at times.
 
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Bobert

"...And His Music Was Electric"
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Sep 11, 2012
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568
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Switch FC
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I love Bowser in this game but I'm not confident on him being high tier. He has a lot of bonkers moves like his up air, f6 flying slam, and up-b OoS, but he has a lot of problems that weigh him down imo. He lacks a good poke in neutral compared to other characters and is absolutely abhorrent in disadvantage. He's so big and doesn't have a safe landing option, he's probably the easiest character to tech chase in the whole game because of how slow and short his tech rolls are, and is one of the easiest characters to spike and counter offstage because you always know where he's coming from.

He's likely still the best heavy though. He doesn't have much competition in that regard. Ganondorf is super cheesy at times but I honestly don't agree with people calling him high tier either. Ganon is my most played among all of the smash games he was in. I've said this before, but he's essentially a glass cannon that can consistently get shattered before he has a chance to go off because he's so slow, has a bottom 5 recovery and a disadvantage as bad as Bowser's, if not even worse. With that said, Dedede is the only character that I feel rivals Bowser's place as best heavy, and the rest are just totally outclassed by Bowser.
 

DeDeDIke

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 4, 2019
Messages
90
Location
Vancouver
I'm not a Bowser main (he's one of my secondaries), but I do agree he's the best superheavyweight in the game. D3 (one of my mains) I find rivals Bowser. Despite the fact that Ganon has hard-hitting smash attacks, he loses hard to Bowser. I can't tell you how many Ganons I have beaten while playing Bowser.
 
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