Masterplum
Smash Apprentice
I believe it has. Lately the better player has been winning more often and you dont really see bad players winning for wierd reasons unless its wifi. What do you guys think?
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Very true. It's sad that it's not so technical anymore.I disagree wholeheartedly. A large amount of technical skill has been removed from the game. Recoveries have been made easier with auto-sweetspotting edges, L Canceling has been removed (Yes, there ARE some auto-canceling moves, but that's a different matter,) shield stun is gone, making defense much easier, wavedashing is gone, the combo potential is almost erased...
That's nice and all, but how does it tie into the OP's point?I disagree wholeheartedly. A large amount of technical skill has been removed from the game. Recoveries have been made easier with auto-sweetspotting edges, L Canceling has been removed (Yes, there ARE some auto-canceling moves, but that's a different matter,) shield stun is gone, making defense much easier, wavedashing is gone, the combo potential is almost erased...
I agree its just that alot of people were complaining that there was hardly a gap and that practicing would do no good because someone could easily play for an hour and possibly beat you. I never agreed with that but many people from this site think so and i was wondering if their opinion might have changed.That's nice and all, but how does it tie into the OP's point?
"Technical requirement" is not as demanding as Melee, of course, but when it comes down to it:
At upper levels of Melee play where technical ability is high, "all players" are able to use the 'same tools' (wavedash, L-cancel, chara-specific techs) and it breaks down to who can bait the opponent into mis-spacing to begin strings of moves for damage and/or kill.
In Brawl, where technical requirement is low (aside from 'defensive technical skill', like SDI and such), all players are able to use the 'same tools' (aside from chara-specific techs), and it breaks down to who can bait the opponent into mis-spacing to land hits, and continually try to bait and read the opponent's reaction to be able to land consecutive hits and finally, to land a kill move.
So in both games, at upper levels of play, pretty much all players are at about an equal level of technical skill/requirement, and it breaks down to who's better at baiting and punishing.
The OP's question is whether or not the better players are the ones who win in (offline) Brawl, where it was thought that Brawl is down to a point where bad players can defeat players who are exponentially better than them, because of a smaller skill gap.
I'd think it'd be fairly obvious that better players are usually the ones who win, unless factors like matchup inexperience or tripping are taken into account.
Nobody had truly had perfect technical skill in Melee, though.So in both games, at upper levels of play, pretty much all players are at about an equal level of technical skill/requirement, and it breaks down to who's better at baiting and punishing.
Some people consider it a blessing, others despise it. Sakurai set out to make Brawl a less competitive game, and I would say he did a **** good job of it.... Not that that spells out any good things for this community. We have to keep our heads up though. The games still young and there's much to be learned [I hope.]Brawl, unarguably, requires less technical skill to play well than melee does, so unless there are people walking around winning melee tournaments without wavedashing I think that the limited technicality diminishes the gap between the best players and the worst players.
That's complete bull****.In melee, high level play involved pressing buttons really quickly in the correct order. Some thinking is involved, but it's mostly fast hands.
In Brawl, you have to watch your opponent, camp, space and bait. You also have to know your matchups well. You have to play intelligently.
So this means that all the less intelligent people play melee
nonono.if I am understanding the arguments correctly,
Brawl has a wider gap between players than melee because technical skill us less important and thus mindgames and spacing, ie playing smart, is more difficult to master in brawl than to do so in melee in addition to the technical aspect of melee
short version
Playing smart > Playing smart + Technicality ??
Oooh I totally agree now that we are arguing the same topic, but it seems that this should have been expected. Players get better at different rates and Brawl is being picked up by a lot of players who feel good enough about their skill that they would attend a tournament, because you do not have to be able to shffl to do well in a tournament. What that creates is more people who are not pro at brawl attending tournaments. I think it is great for the community and the game and the players who will eventually get better. In lots of games or sports people often increase their skills more when they attend a tournament than when they "practice."nonono.
The point isn't that Brawl's skill gap is greater than Melee, because it isn't. Brawl's spacing is basically who can control placement via aerial movement, projectiles, walking, attacks, etc. Melee's spacing was all that AND wavedashing (extra movement/feinting/punish option) and L-cancelling (less landing lag), which means that players need to be able to think AND move at a faster pace. This would make it require a larger skill gap because it needs more technical ability at a faster speed.
The point is that there is a more noticeable skill gap in Brawl right now between good and bad players than there was in say, mid-April.
dude are you serious. i hate youIn melee, high level play involved pressing buttons really quickly in the correct order. Some thinking is involved, but it's mostly fast hands.
So this means that all the less intelligent people play melee
Well, it was a rather exaggerated point, but it made me lol... but also worry -.-dude are you serious. i hate you
thats what brawl+ is forI disagree wholeheartedly. A large amount of technical skill has been removed from the game. Recoveries have been made easier with auto-sweetspotting edges, L Canceling has been removed (Yes, there ARE some auto-canceling moves, but that's a different matter,) shield stun is gone, making defense much easier, wavedashing is gone, the combo potential is almost erased...