Gunner Style Discussion

[KuroganeHammer]

Grenades are not "chip damage", it clearly breaks a 30 HP shield in one hit in that video. >__>

 

[GS3K]

That's a bomb. Grenades do 5-6 hits.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Oops, they all look the same to me LOL

 

[ILOVESMASH]

Something I noticed about small mii gunner is that he has an unusually long initial dash and perfect pivot. Can these be incorporated in anyway in his gameplan? I'm think Charge shot and F-Smash could benefit from PP.

 

[Djmarcus44]

Perfect pivot definitely helps gunner. It is a good way to make flame pillar or gunner missile a little safer, and it helps me use flame pillar at the ledge. Perfect pivot forward tilt is really good for stopping approaches.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

Oops, they all look the same to me LOL

Bomb Drop has that glowing light on the rim. Grenade Launch is just a grenade.

I dunno about perfect pivots, but what I've found helps a lot when playing a small Gunner is to be able to reliably do B-Reversals and Turnaround-Bs with Bomb Drop and Grenade Launch. (I still frequently screw up and accidentally do a Turnaround-B when trying to do a B-Reversal and vice versa.)

Also, ledge-cancelling Cannon Uppercut after the meteor hitbox is pretty cool. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ej63-j6Mqtw&t=25s

 

[AscWolf]

What are generell thoughts about eh mid size gunner?
In Germany Miis are legal in mid size with every combination of Moves.
Currently I use 3322.

In January is a tournament where Miis are legal in every size.
Is smallest/thinnest the most recommendable choice?

 

[AEMehr]

Technically speaking, the thinner and shorter Gunner is, the better she is. The mobility buff is just so good. I suggest you should try playing around with a 0/0 Mii whenever possible and see how you like it.

I myself play around with both sizes, but with 50/50 moreso since that's currently the legal size. 0/0 Gunner is fun though since you literally fly around the stage with gun-dashing haha.

 

[Jazzasaur]

Hm, I'm really loving the Mii gunner, finding Him or Her to be so much fun both custom or not. Wondered how many people used Gunner over the other Mii types?

Also I'd love to learn some stuff from some of the awesome people here, would be great!

Thanks!

 

[Djmarcus44]

Hm, I'm really loving the Mii gunner, finding Him or Her to be so much fun both custom or not. Wondered how many people used Gunner over the other Mii types?

Also I'd love to learn some stuff from some of the awesome people here, would be great!

Thanks!

I agree, Mii Gunner is a fun character (although some of my opponents disagree). I use Mii Gunner way more than the other Miis because Gunner is a better fit for my playing style. When I saw Mii Gunner's moveset on Smash wiki before the game came out, I knew that I would main Gunner.

If you want to learn more about Gunner, this thread along with the Mii Gunner guide are good places to start. There is also plenty of information about Mii Gunner in the Mii Gunner true combo and follow up thread and the Mii Gunner AT thread. Chibo's knowledge dump and Mii Gunner's video thread are very helpful for seeing the strategies of some of the best Gunners.

 

[Jazzasaur]

I agree, Mii Gunner is a fun character (although some of my opponents disagree). I use Mii Gunner way more than the other Miis because Gunner is a better fit for my playing style. When I saw Mii Gunner's moveset on Smash wiki before the game came out, I knew that I would main Gunner.

If you want to learn more about Gunner, this thread along with the Mii Gunner guide are good places to start. There is also plenty of information about Mii Gunner in the Mii Gunner true combo and follow up thread and the Mii Gunner AT thread. Chibo's knowledge dump and Mii Gunner's video thread are very helpful for seeing the strategies of some of the best Gunners.

Thanks so much, I'll look into researching with those guides in mind. Could be really useful to start working on combo's.

Same here, I'm just really loving how the gunner plays compared to the other Mii's. His specials are a blast to use, given the opportunity usually always use rocket uppercut, shame most have to stick to the 1111 load out, though even that's pretty fun.

 

[Djmarcus44]

Thanks so much, I'll look into researching with those guides in mind. Could be really useful to start working on combo's.

Same here, I'm just really loving how the gunner plays compared to the other Mii's. His specials are a blast to use, given the opportunity usually always use rocket uppercut, shame most have to stick to the 1111 load out, though even that's pretty fun.

No problem. There are also some good tournament matches and interesting discoveries for Mii Gunner on YouTube.

 

[AEMehr]

Hm, I'm really loving the Mii gunner, finding Him or Her to be so much fun both custom or not. Wondered how many people used Gunner over the other Mii types?

Also I'd love to learn some stuff from some of the awesome people here, would be great!

Thanks!

How do you play Gunner? What to do is really dependent on your style of play and the specials you like to use. Gunner's gameplan can change drastically on the latter, someone running Grenades doesn't act the same as someone running Charged Shot.

 

[Jazzasaur]

How do you play Gunner? What to do is really dependent on your style of play and the specials you like to use. Gunner's gameplan can change drastically on the latter, someone running Grenades doesn't act the same as someone running Charged Shot.

That's very true, I tend to use the Mii Gunner as a keep-a-way character, using flame pillar, reflector, bomb drop and rocket upper cut for specials and usually end up using his forward air a lot for spacing. If that's an alright set up?

 

[AEMehr]

That's very true, I tend to use the Mii Gunner as a keep-a-way character, using flame pillar, reflector, bomb drop and rocket upper cut for specials and usually end up using his forward air a lot for spacing. If that's an alright set up?

You mean Grenade Launch? Bomb Drop is a Down Special.

 

[Jazzasaur]

You mean Grenade Launch? Bomb Drop is a Down Special.

Apologies, I was going to say bomb drop or reflector. Though Greande launcher is pretty sweet.

 

[AEMehr]

oh lol

So you use Charged Shot? It works I think, do you use Rocket Upper as a "get off me" or a kill move? If you like to play keep-away you're probably better off with one of the other two Up Specials.

 

[Jazzasaur]

oh lol

So you use Charged Shot? It works I think, do you use Rocket Upper as a "get off me" or a kill move? If you like to play keep-away you're probably better off with one of the other two Up Specials.

Haha sorry about that,

Yeah I've mostly been using charged shot or sometimes grenade launcher. The rocket upper I've been using as a KO move, mainly because of not knowing how best to use the other two, though I'll start practicing with them, much appreciated.

 

[AEMehr]

Haha sorry about that,

Yeah I've mostly been using charged shot or sometimes grenade launcher. The rocket upper I've been using as a KO move, mainly because of not knowing how best to use the other two, though I'll start practicing with them, much appreciated.

You are free to keep using Cannon Uppercut if you'd like, I prefer Lunar Launch because it's a decent escape tool and arguably the best recovery between the three. Though it's predictable as to where you go after using it.

You can use it to edgeguard to stage spike unsuspecting opponents or send good for sending opponents away from the stage depending on which way you're facing.

Cannon Uppercut's spiking capabilities and kill potential are be too good to pass up sometimes, but I personally prefer survivability over the extra kill option.

 

[Jazzasaur]

You are free to keep using Cannon Uppercut if you'd like, I prefer Lunar Launch because it's a decent escape tool and arguably the best recovery between the three. Though it's predictable as to where you go after using it.

You can use it to edgeguard to stage spike unsuspecting opponents or send good for sending opponents away from the stage depending on which way you're facing.

Cannon Uppercut's spiking capabilities and kill potential are be too good to pass up sometimes, but I personally prefer survivability over the extra kill option.

Ah alright that's understandable, I've been on the other flip side with the extra kill potential over the recovery.

I'll try looking into using lunar shot more often though, it be great to practice using the spike on it. I've only been able to land it once haha.

Thanks again!

 

[AEMehr]

Of course, anytime! Please feel free to tell us how the practice goes later.

 

[Ridel]

So should I get used to learning a default sized Gunner? It appears that most tournaments are starting to allow use of Mii's customs but not weight so should I be practicing with a medium weight Gunner?

 

[Djmarcus44]

So should I get used to learning a default sized Gunner? It appears that most tournaments are starting to allow use of Mii's customs but not weight so should I be practicing with a medium weight Gunner?

It would take a while for Miis can get different sizes (At this moment, it seems very unlikely that tournaments would allow the change), so it would be a good idea to learn guest size gunner. From personal experience, the hardest thing to do when changing sizes is to learn the foxtrot and perfect pivot for the new size.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Well, with Geno as a mii gunner now. I probably will be using mii gunner more

 

[SonicMario]

Well, with Geno as a mii gunner now. I probably will be using mii gunner more

Same thing for me except it'll be when Tails comes in Feburary

 

[Skailler]

(scrub question incoming) What exactly is the reason I hear Missiles being the best Side B so often as of lately? I keep hearing its amazing, but I really cant tell why at all. Its basically the same as Samus´s Missiles, including the meh homing, lack of lag cancelling and KO power. I could potentially see its uses for edgeguarding, but Flame Pillar (is that the right name? idk about the english ones) just seems so much more useful to me. Good to fade back and stop approaches (although Fair does that better), punishing low recoveries/missing the ledge. Am I just bad or are Missiles overrated in my region?

On another note, I really miss 0/0 Gunner. Guest size just feels soooo awkward now.

 

[GS3K]

Missiles allow you to play a more aggressive, pressure/wall-out style with gunner. This is an example some of the things you can do with 3312 (San)

 

[Djmarcus44]

(scrub question incoming) What exactly is the reason I hear Missiles being the best Side B so often as of lately? I keep hearing its amazing, but I really cant tell why at all. Its basically the same as Samus´s Missiles, including the meh homing, lack of lag cancelling and KO power. I could potentially see its uses for edgeguarding, but Flame Pillar (is that the right name? idk about the english ones) just seems so much more useful to me. Good to fade back and stop approaches (although Fair does that better), punishing low recoveries/missing the ledge. Am I just bad or are Missiles overrated in my region?

On another note, I really miss 0/0 Gunner. Guest size just feels soooo awkward now.

As GS3K said, missiles put more pressure on the opponent (The endlag reduction on the missiles allow Gunner to chase an opponent while the missile is out). The missiles also give more true combos to Gunner.

 

[Skailler]

Missiles allow you to play a more aggressive, pressure/wall-out style with gunner. This is an example some of the things you can do with 3312 (San)

As GS3K said, missiles put more pressure on the opponent (The endlag reduction on the missiles allow Gunner to chase an opponent while the missile is out). The missiles also give more true combos to Gunner.

That looks awesome, thanks for explaining! How much harder is it for a Guest Size Mii to follow up on the Missile, and how useful are the Homing Missiles? I cant test it myself atm, so I cant do really much else than asking.

 

[Epok]

Missiles allow you to play a more aggressive, pressure/wall-out style with gunner. This is an example some of the things you can do with 3312 (San)

I really like that play style. I am very akin to mix ups and mind games. The use of fair as a mobility option was brilliant. What was up with that shield break though? Do bombs do that much shield damage?

 

[Djmarcus44]

That looks awesome, thanks for explaining! How much harder is it for a Guest Size Mii to follow up on the Missile, and how useful are the Homing Missiles? I cant test it myself atm, so I cant do really much else than asking.

With guest size gunner, it is much easier to get a combo with the homing missiles as opposed to the super missiles. In the mii gunner true combo and follow up thread, there are sections on combos for 3312 gunner and combos for 1312 gunner. All of the missile combos for guest size gunner that I know of are listed there.

 

[GS3K]

Do bombs do that much shield damage?

Bombs have a lot of shield damage. Like, 2 of them is enough to break most of the casts' shield.

 

[Epok]

Bombs have a lot of shield damage. Like, 2 of them is enough to break most of the casts' shield.

Wow! That's awesome. I have another reason to use that special now.

 

[LiteralGrill]

MII MAINS LISTEN UP! I want to have a "Mii Week". With rulesets at Evo 016 being decided, now is the time for all who play Miis to have their voices heard before just a major decision. So I want to make a "Character Experts" article on EACH Mii. You don't have to be a super expert or won a ton of tournaments or something to participate, even long time Mii players are eligible. Just DM me the answers to these questions for every Mii you play by MONDAY NIGHT so I have enough time to write articles. GET ON IT MIIS!

What are your biggest achievements with Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]? Why should folks consider you a 'Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner] Expert'?

What interested you in playing Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]?

What Mii Moveset Do You Use? (1-1-2-2. 3-3-2-2, ect.)

What are Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]'s biggest weaknesses?

What are Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]'s biggest strengths?

What are their worst and best matchups among the 'top tiers'?

Is Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner] viable on a national level?

Advice for anyone interested in Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]?

How do you feel about “MiiGality”? Would rather see Miis outright banned over just being at 1-1-1-1?

 

[Djmarcus44]

MII MAINS LIST EN UP! I want to have a "Mii Week". With rulesets at Evo 016 being decided, now is the time for all who play Miis to have their voices heard before just a major decision. So I want to make a "Character Experts" article on EACH Mii. You don't have to be a super expert or won a ton of tournaments or something to participate, even long time Mii players are eligible. Just DM me the answers to these questions for every Mii you play by MONDAY NIGHT so I have enough time to write articles. GET ON IT MIIS!

What are your biggest achievements with Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]? Why should folks consider you a 'Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner] Expert'?

What interested you in playing Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]?

What Mii Moveset Do You Use? (1-1-2-2. 3-3-2-2, ect.)

What are Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]'s biggest weaknesses?

What are Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]'s biggest strengths?

What are their worst and best matchups among the 'top tiers'?

Is Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner] viable on a national level?

Advice for anyone interested in Mii [Swordfighter/Brawler/Gunner]?

How do you feel about “MiiGality”? Would rather see Miis outright banned over just being at 1-1-1-1?

How do you DM someone?
My biggest achievement as a Mii Gunner player was getting 3rd place at my local doubles tournament. I have also won some online tournaments. I should be considered an expert on Mii Gunner because I have made great contributions to the Mii Gunner true combo and follow up thread. Due to my research and testing of Gunner (finding advanced techniques find or Gunner on YouTube, and trying to use them as well as I can), I am probably one of the most knowledgeable players of 1111 gunner. I am also pretty active on the Gunner boards, where I am learning more about Gunner from some of the best Gunner players such as San and Wii Twerk Trainer and teaching others about Gunner.

I was first interested in playing Gunner, when I saw the character's moveset on the Smashwiki. This led to me wanting to main Gunner before the game came out.

I use 1111 gunner the most. I realize that 3312 is better for gunner, but I am most comfortable with 1111 (also my tournament scene only allows 1111).

Mii Gunner's biggest weaknesses are the lack of a reliable kill confirm, and low damage output due to the fact that Gunner doesn't have a great combo game. This makes Gunner have a substandard advantage state.

Mii Gunner's greatest strength is his/her top tier neutral. Gunner's fair is a long ranged and safe poking projectile (it is safe on perfect shielding, and it only has 12 frames of landing lag) that also gives Gunner great burst mobility and decent mobility overall in the form of Gundashing. In addition Gunner has a variety of other good options in the neutral such as getting an opponent to approach with charging up charge blast or using nair, bair, pivot ftilt, pivot flame pillar, or pivot fsmash to keep opponents away.

Mii Gunner does pretty well against ZSS, Ryu, Pikachu, Sonic, Diddy Kong, Meta Knight, Villager, Cloud, and Bayonetta. While more results are needed to get a conclusive matchup ratio for these matchups since Gunner is not a commonly seen character in tournament play, Mii Gunner beats all of these characters in the neutral except for Villager (Gunner and Villager tie in the neutral, and the matchup is pretty even since both characters are able to significantly mess up each other's gameplans), and Gunner can edgeguard all of these characters well with flame pillar at the ledge. Also Gunner juggles all of these characters effectively due to the good range of Gunner's moves along with Gunner's great burst mobility and projectiles. Gunner struggles most with Rosalina, Fox, and Mario due to their ability to deal with Gunner's projectiles pretty easily. Although these matchups are bad, Gunner has enough tools to make the matchups doable (all of these matchups are around 40-60).

It depends on how you define viability, but I personally think that Mii Gunner is a somewhat viable option at a national level (Although Mii Gunner has low viability at a national level due to a lack of tournament results, Gunner still has some viability). Gunner has shown some promise at the national level, with Wii Twerk Trainer getting 25th at EVO using Gunner as a secondary, and ROM tying for 9th in Wombo Wednesday at Smash@SCU (it was a 129 man tournament, but it had top level players such as Komorikiri, Ranai, 9B, and Ally). ROM has also placed in the top 32 in some of Japan's biggest tournaments. These results are why the Japanese competitive scene tends to have a much higher opinion of Gunner than other competitive scenes (Gunner is usually seen as a low mid tier in Japan while other areas place Gunner in the bottom 5).

Anyone that is interested in playing Mii Gunner should check out the Mii Gunner boards. There is a lot of information about how to play Gunner, and there are several good Gunner players that will gladly help you get better. I would also recommend that Gunner players practice using fair since the move is very versatile. It is also important to get good at hitting opponents with charge blast. Players using gunner with grenades should practice at using their grenades well by working on their b-reverse timing and grenade spacing in order to combo from the grenades. Player using gunner with bomb drop should practice bomb shuffling in order to use the move safely, and they should practice landing with the bombs. Also players using bombs should use the bombs out of a full hop in order to move to the right place for a combo.

I personally would rather Miis have the option of 1111 than for them to be banned. I main 1111 gunner, and there is no reason why the character should be banned (In fact 1111 miis are at a disadvantage since it is harder for them to get experience against other players since they are not allowed on for glory. It is also harder to play Miis on tournament mode since most people play without miis allowed). I also think that Miis should be allowed to use their best movesets in tournaments since it is not harmful to competitive play, and it would be beneficial to the metagame of Mii Fighters.

 

[MintChipper]

What custom set is best for pairing with a Cloud in doubles?

 

[Djmarcus44]

What custom set is best for pairing with a Cloud in doubles?

I think that 3322 might be the best moveset for doubles with Cloud. The projectiles can help Cloud confirm in to his powerful moves, and the cannon uppercut is a good option for killing opponents.

 

[CT Chia]

Everyone who wants to see Miis unrestricted at Evo should sign this petition and share it with their friends!

https://www.change.org/p/free-miis-at-evo-2016

 

[Djmarcus44]

The Game and Watch boards are discussing the Gunner matchup on the "GnW MU chart" thread. Please feel free to post your thoughts on this matchup on the thread listed above.

 

[luke_atyeo]

hey dudes, I'm trying to collect a bunch of quick easy info graphics on essential character knowledge to make a quick reference guide for commentators (we all hate it when a commentator says something that is wrong)
This shulk thing here is an example of the kinda stuff I am looking for

I'm going around to all the character boards and it'll be a little messy for me to try and check them all, so if you have any cool things like that, or just some useful info that I could turn into a similar picture, please send me a message. Cheers lads.