#GoldenSunday - Isaac for Smash Ultimate (AT Confirmed!)

Ninjaed

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Removing AT's who become playable in a new game *is* a rule. But being unable to promote AT's to playable via DLC is *not* until Sakurai himself says so. We've had exactly one set of DLC to go on as a track record. And the same type of picks are impossible to make this time because half of those fighters were veterans.
Fair enough. Sakurai could decide "let's make Isaac playable" and remove him from the assist trophies. I dare not hope so though. They went through the trouble of updating his trophy moveset so that does not bode well...
 

SPEN18

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In which Isaac might just be old skool enough to consider a 'retro addition'?
Hard to say. A lot of us thought he'd be old enough to be 'retro' in this game. It's just that Sakurai (and a lot of the general public, for that matter) still consider 'retro' to basically just mean the 80s. So at this point, it isn't a matter of how old GS actually is, but whether or not the perception of what's retro changes.
 

tbuster766

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I also think it's basically impossible, unless they swap Isaac's AT for Matthew. But it won't happen. Sakurai said beforehand that the DLC characters are already decided upon. Fan imput won't change a thing.

I am just bargaining for next game...

In which Isaac might just be old skool enough to consider a 'retro addition'?
I'm aware, just that the way he put it sounded condescending considering how he acted like none of the more popular assist trophies wouldn't have made it in as DLC even if they weren't assists. In Isaac's case it seems very slim in that regard, but at the very least I wouldn't outright dismiss his or others' chances.
 
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osby

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It doesn't (considering things like the company's willingness to make sequels) , but at the very least it can shut down the "poor sales" argument.
People still make that stupid argument? Never-mind Mother got a lot of stuff while selling nothing. Golden Sun sold well, the problem isn't that. Its fanbase is definitely quieter than some and it didn't left the impact Mother or Fire Emblem did, but it still deserves representation in Smash more than AT and music (but they are good starts).
 

tbuster766

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People still make that stupid argument? Never-mind Mother got a lot of stuff while selling nothing. Golden Sun sold well, the problem isn't that. Its fanbase is definitely quieter than some and it didn't left the impact Mother or Fire Emblem did, but it still deserves representation in Smash more than AT and music (but they are good starts).
Sadly I have seen many comments talk about Golden Sun dying as a franchise because of poor sales (articles, forum comments, youtube comments, etc). I also agree, especially considering the drop in interest for the series as a whole over time. If only there weren't such a huge gap between the second and third installments and/or the game released on the 3DS instead. This would have potentially attracted more of the community from the GBA days as well as newer people into the series.
 
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SirCamp

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Where are people finding proof of Dark Dawn's sales?


Also, Camelot are the ones responsible for continuing to make Mario Sports games, not Nintendo. Intelligent Systems are the ones responsible for continuing to make Fire Emblem games (which is traditionally their best selling franchise), not Nintendo.

These two things are incomparable to one another.
What exactly are the details on this? My understanding was that Nintendo owns the Golden sun IP. In which case, couldn't Nintendo simply have another developer make the next Golden Sun game, if they wanted another? I always assumed that Camelot has been making Mario Sports titles because that's what Nintendo wants them to do, not the other way around.
 

osby

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What exactly are the details on this? My understanding was that Nintendo owns the Golden sun IP. In which case, couldn't Nintendo simply have another developer make the next Golden Sun game, if they wanted another? I always assumed that Camelot has been making Mario Sports titles because that's what Nintendo wants them to do, not the other way around.
Yeah, but Nintendo has a lot of old titles collecting dust, why they should pay attention to GS specifically? Nintendo needs to see a demand for the franchise or more traditional RPGs in general, which admittedly, is not easy.

Also, changing developers is not always good for franchises.
 

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I was wondering if you could choose 5 assist trophies to promote to playable who would you pick?

It's harder than I thought at first, competition between assist trophies would be pretty fierce.

Isaac (duh)
Bomberman
Waluigi
Ashley
Krystal or Skull Kid (coin toss)

Consolations to: Riki, Shadow, Dillon, Shovel Knight, Starfy, Sukapon, Takamaru, Midna (there's actually a load of great candidates)

I'm basing it off Ultimate. (Otherwise Ray MK would probably be included)
Isaac (Obviously)
Waluigi
Shadow
Spring Man
Bomberman

I would have added Takamaru, but the rule of 5 must be adhered, and not even Sakurai was able to make him playable.
 

SirCamp

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Yeah, but Nintendo has a lot of old titles collecting dust, why they should pay attention to GS specifically? Nintendo needs to see a demand for the franchise or more traditional RPGs in general, which admittedly, is not easy.

Also, changing developers is not always good for franchises.
I'm not trying to imply that Golden Sun fans would be better served by having a new developer make the next GS game in lieu of Camelot. Simply that if Nintendo ultimately controls the IP, I have a hard time seeing the death of the IP being the fault of any entity other than Nintendo. It's possibly Camelot could push for it more or harder, but again my understanding anyway was that it was ultimately up to Nintendo for it to be made, with Camelot or otherwise.
 
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TheSpaceKing12

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https://mobile.twitter.com/DominicHaigh/status/1058111758370566144
This guy did a sales comparison of Golden Sun, Fire Emblem, and Xenoblade.

While VGCharts is not completely accurate, it does make you wonder what is going on.
A by the numbers analysis won’t work here. What needs considered is mindshare. Golden sun may have sold 1.7 million copies. But of those 1.7 million, how many people among them would still actively identify as a golden sun fan? If 100,000 people voted for Isaac in the fighter ballot, would it not be fair to call them the last golden sun fans in the world? Mindshare is the biggest factor here. How many people bought the gba Classic when it’s arrived. And how many more remember and still talk abbout the IP.
 
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If 100,000 people voted for Isaac in the fighter ballot, would it not be fair to call them the last golden sun fans in the world?
No, this is completely ridiculous and stupid. The ballot was targeting Smash fans specifically and was telling people to vote once. People can be fans of numerous different things. I'm a Golden Sun fan but I voted for King K. Rool because I wanted him more. (I also voted for Isaac later but some people won't do this.)


What exactly are the details on this? My understanding was that Nintendo owns the Golden sun IP. In which case, couldn't Nintendo simply have another developer make the next Golden Sun game, if they wanted another? I always assumed that Camelot has been making Mario Sports titles because that's what Nintendo wants them to do, not the other way around.
Yes, Nintendo could put someone else on it in theory, but Camelot has all the storyline ideas in place. And despite owning a number of different IP, they respect the wishes of the creators. For example, Nintendo let Rare do whatever they wished with Rare characters and did not touch those characters. As such, Nintendo didn't actively start using Diddy Kong until the Rare buyout.

Nintendo may own various IP, but they leave it up to the original devs. Camelot had a lot of employees leave and they didn't feel confident in making another RPG. After Dark Dawn turned out the way it did, that further hurt matters.


Fair enough. Sakurai could decide "let's make Isaac playable" and remove him from the assist trophies. I dare not hope so though. They went through the trouble of updating his trophy moveset so that does not bode well...
Technically Chrom proves they don't even need to remove the AT. Also, the AT could actually as a basis for the DLC character. They could even replace the AT with Garrett for example. There's a number of things they could do.

Also I don't want you to be hopeful. That's fine. I just want people to stop saying there's no way AT's can be promoted to playable via DLC. Because there's no evidence this is the case until Sakurai flat out says it.
 

SirCamp

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A by the numbers analysis won’t work here. What needs considered is mindshare. Golden sun may have sold 1.7 million copies. But of those 1.7 million, how many people among them would still actively identify as a golden sun fan? If 100,000 people voted for Isaac in the fighter ballot, would it not be fair to call them the last golden sun fans in the world? Mindshare is the biggest factor here. How many people bought the gba Classic when it’s arrived. And how many more remember and still talk abbout the IP.
I agree to an extent, which is to say raw numbers won't tell us the whole story. But let's be real, people can be a fan of multiple things at once. Just because someone didn't vote for Isaac in the Smash ballot doesn't imply that they can't be Golden Sun fans.

But as to your point about mindshare (is this even a term? I'm not familiar with it), I would agree this is largely due to advertising, or more to the point the lack thereof, on Nintendo's end. They chose to push Fire Emblem, and it worked. The same can't really be said for Golden Sun. Now again there are almost certainly other confounding factors at play that we aren't privy to, and this is also assuming the numbers we have access to are accurate, but I have to believe that Golden Sun would be much more prominent today if there were an actual serious push for the series on Nintendo's end. My suspicion is that based on some factors that we don't know, Nintendo deemed Fire Emblem to be a series more likely to grow into greater success down the line, perhaps because it filled a niche that Nintendo wasn't covering with their other IPs, and as such made a marketing push that doesn't immediately make sense to us based only on the numbers we have access too. Still, it's unfortunate, and mildly irritating, to see a series that you love get ignored in favor of a series that seems to have been performing worse.

Also when it comes down to it, the fact that Golden Sun appears to be much more popular in the West likely led to it being a lower priority for Nintendo as a whole. In general seems that the company as a whole is much more interested in increasing the popularity in the West of titles that are already popular in Japan, rather than the other way around.


Having said all that I still hold a sliver of hope that the very obvious push for more Golden Sun will spark, in the very least, a discussion at Nintendo as to the future of the IP. Given the fan reaction to games like Octopath and the general reception of RPGs on the Switch I feel there is a non-outside chance that Golden Sun could be considered for revival in some fashion. And at this point, that's what I'm hoping for.

In completely unrelated news, the Assist Trophies I would upgrade are:

1 Isaac
2 Bomberman
3 Tingle (if we have to choose Ultimate ATs replace him with Skull Kid)
4 Ashley
5 Takamaru

Waluigi would be fine too, but he doesn't excite me at all. Overall I really really want Isaac and Bomberman, the others would just be gravy. Tingle is a big want as well, but I'm not sure if he fits the criteria, and even if he does I have very little hope of him actually happening anyway.
 
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Kalaam

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I suppose that, at the time, Nintendo pushed for Fire Emblem more than Golden Sun because Fire Emblem had no competition in this genra. While Golden Sun would have to compete against Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest for example.
 

StrawHatX

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Can't think of any off the top of my head, but maybe look for some said by (POTENIAL SPOILERS) Zack Fair in final fantasy?



Speaking of which, I read up on Jon from Gameexplain's twitter after Isaac was deconfirmed as an assist and was kinda ticked off how he more or less was saying Isaac and other assist trophies wouldn't have been DLC character regardless of whether or not they reprised their roles as such. Not to bash on insiders, but man do some of them come off as pompous folks.
Jon pisses me off because he was always so quick to discount Isaac for not being relevant enough anymore, yet he’s all aboard on Geno DLC despite the fact that Geno is faaaaaaar more irrelevant outside of the Smash community than Isaac.

Not to mention in order to get Geno in the game both Nintendo and Square would have to agree on it and why would Square want their second rep to be a one off Mario character from a 22 year old game? But Isaac is so unbelievable despite the fact that Golden Sun is completely Nintendo’s to control.

It’s just annoying when people bring up the relevancy card until it’s a character they want. Then it doesn’t matter.
 

TheSpaceKing12

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I agree to an extent, which is to say raw numbers won't tell us the whole story. But let's be real, people can be a fan of multiple things at once. Just because someone didn't vote for Isaac in the Smash ballot doesn't imply that they can't be Golden Sun fans.

But as to your point about mindshare (is this even a term? I'm not familiar with it), I would agree this is largely due to advertising, or more to the point the lack thereof, on Nintendo's end. They chose to push Fire Emblem, and it worked. The same can't really be said for Golden Sun. Now again there are almost certainly other confounding factors at play that we aren't privy to, and this is also assuming the numbers we have access to are accurate, but I have to believe that Golden Sun would be much more prominent today if there were an actual serious push for the series on Nintendo's end. My suspicion is that based on some factors that we don't know, Nintendo deemed Fire Emblem to be a series more likely to grow into greater success down the line, perhaps because it filled a niche that Nintendo wasn't covering with their other IPs, and as such made a marketing push that doesn't immediately make sense to us based only on the numbers we have access too. Still, it's unfortunate, and mildly irritating, to see a series that you love get ignored in favor of a series that seems to have been performing worse.

Also when it comes down to it, the fact that Golden Sun appears to be much more popular in the West likely led to it being a lower priority for Nintendo as a whole. In general seems that the company as a whole is much more interested in increasing the popularity in the West of titles that are already popular in Japan, rather than the other way around.


Having said all that I still hold a sliver of hope that the very obvious push for more Golden Sun will spark, in the very least, a discussion at Nintendo as to the future of the IP. Given the fan reaction to games like Octopath and the general reception of RPGs on the Switch I feel there is a non-outside chance that Golden Sun could be considered for revival in some fashion. And at this point, that's what I'm hoping for.

In completely unrelated news, the Assist Trophies I would upgrade are:

1 Isaac
2 Bomberman
3 Tingle (if we have to choose Ultimate ATs replace him with Skull Kid)
4 Ashley
5 Takamaru

Waluigi would be fine too, but he doesn't excite me at all. Overall I really really want Isaac and Bomberman, the others would just be gravy. Tingle is a big want as well, but I'm not sure if he fits the criteria, and even if he does I have very little hope of him actually happening anyway.
Mindshare is an actual term. It refers to the quantity of the public that is invested mentally, one way or another. It’s a very important factor when say, analyzing the sales of casual games like yearly sport style titles despite how terrible microtrasactions can get within. Or say, when examining why Nvidia GPU’s sell so much better than AMD cards despite costing hundreds more for a few FPS better. In both of those cases, it’s a matter of mindshare. Loyalty to a brand created by agressiv marketing by said brand. A madden fan doesn’t care if the microtrasactions make the game unplayable. He is sold because he is a madden fan, and the marketing made him so. Likewise, an Nvidia fan doesn’t care if prices keep rising and performance increases keep getting smaller, they are a fan, and will remain a fan because of the marketing, the media, and all surrounding material saying that they are the best.

In this case, it’s in reference to the raw quantity of active golden sun fans. Or more so...the lack thereof. It doesn’t matter that th first game sold 1.7 million. There aren’t 1.7 million fans screaming for Isaac and smash, and a new game. Not even remotely close. If there’s a 100,000 active gold sun fans left (a serious highball, honestly) But There’s 500,000 active Xenoblade fans (probably an underestimate, in all seriousness) than the Xenoblade fans will naturally be far more vocal by raw numbers, and by extension, see more representations. I know that using numbers to break down why the numbers aren't concrete Is somewhat counter intuitive. But it’s shows my point. The only way we’re gonna got anywhere is if we continue to remain vocal.
 
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tbuster766

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Jon pisses me off because he was always so quick to discount Isaac for not being relevant enough anymore, yet he’s all aboard on Geno DLC despite the fact that Geno is faaaaaaar more irrelevant outside of the Smash community than Isaac.

Not to mention in order to get Geno in the game both Nintendo and Square would have to agree on it and why would Square want their second rep to be a one off Mario character from a 22 year old game? But Isaac is so unbelievable despite the fact that Golden Sun is completely Nintendo’s to control.

It’s just annoying when people bring up the relevancy card until it’s a character they want. Then it doesn’t matter.
Here I thought he wouldn't throw the relevancy argument around to discount any chance Isaac has as someone who is a "fan" of the series. Honestly he really should make up his mind.
 
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PK-remling Fire

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I was wondering if you could choose 5 assist trophies to promote to playable who would you pick?
I'd choose:
Alucard
Shadow
Isaac
Zero
Skull Kid

Another cool concept that I saw being thrown around here was that of an "assist trophy battle" mode. In the mode you could pre-select certain assist trophies and be able to summon them by filling up an assist meter, like how other fighting games have support fighters that you could summon. Of course it wouldn't be anything like Rathalos or Moon, but I could've seen that mode happen with damageable assist trophies like Waluigi, Knuckles, or Springman.
 
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Still depressed since the Direct. Still can’t work up enough motivation to try ordering the game again.
No worries. It's easier or harder for many to recover from a blow like that. I hope you'll get that passion back soon and also fight alongside us to get Golden Sun back and have Isaac's name on everyone's minds.
 
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Mindshare is an actual term. It refers to the quantity of the public that is invested mentally, one way or another. It’s a very important factor when say, analyzing the sales of casual games like yearly sport style titles despite how terrible microtrasactions can get within. Or say, when examining why Nvidia GPU’s sell so much better than AMD cards despite costing hundreds more for a few FPS better. In both of those cases, it’s a matter of mindshare. Loyalty to a brand created by agressiv marketing by said brand. A madden fan doesn’t care if the microtrasactions make the game unplayable. He is sold because he is a madden fan, and the marketing made him so. Likewise, an Nvidia fan doesn’t care if prices keep rising and performance increases keep getting smaller, they are a fan, and will remain a fan because of the marketing, the media, and all surrounding material saying that they are the best.

In this case, it’s in reference to the raw quantity of active golden sun fans. Or more so...the lack thereof. It doesn’t matter that th first game sold 1.7 million. There aren’t 1.7 million fans screaming for Isaac and smash, and a new game. Not even remotely close. If there’s a 100,000 active gold sun fans left (a serious highball, honestly) But There’s 500,000 active Xenoblade fans (probably an underestimate, in all seriousness) than the Xenoblade fans will naturally be far more vocal by raw numbers, and by extension, see more representations. I know that using numbers to break down why the numbers are irrelevant Is somewhat counter intuitive. But it’s shows my point. The only way we’re gonna got anywhere is if we continue to remain vocal.
If a business ignores 1.7 million sales because said fanbase isn’t loud, they aren’t doing business properly.

Besides, games (and products in general) aren’t made solely for a hardcore fanbase. That’s your cushion. A game, say, Battlefield V, isn’t made to sell solely to the Battlefield fandom, but also for whoever has $60 to spare and could be interested in the game. Depending on your game, you can do more or less advertising, but you can’t release a game (especially a niche one) with zero advertising and complain that hardcore fans weren’t enough if it sells below expectations.

Even then, you just have to study the market. Sure, previous game sales and the ballot are helpful, but GS’ sales are at this point obsolete and don’t represent the market, and the ballot is heavily skewed towards Smash fans and only allows one answer. While the number of Golden Sun fans might not be enough to carry the game, there’s a huge number of potential JRPG fans that would, given a certain level of quality, a competent release date, and awareness, buy the title.
 

TheSpaceKing12

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If a business ignores 1.7 million sales because said fanbase isn’t loud, they aren’t doing business properly.

Besides, games (and products in general) aren’t made solely for a hardcore fanbase. That’s your cushion. A game, say, Battlefield V, isn’t made to sell solely to the Battlefield fandom, but also for whoever has $60 to spare and could be interested in the game. Depending on your game, you can do more or less advertising, but you can’t release a game (especially a niche one) with zero advertising and complain that hardcore fans weren’t enough if it sells below expectations.

Even then, you just have to study the market. Sure, previous game sales and the ballot are helpful, but GS’ sales are at this point obsolete and don’t represent the market, and the ballot is heavily skewed towards Smash fans and only allows one answer. While the number of Golden Sun fans might not be enough to carry the game, there’s a huge number of potential JRPG fans that would, given a certain level of quality, a competent release date, and awareness, buy the title.
You are failing to consider the fact that Golden Sun is an IP that is not a priority. The first title sold well. This is true. But the only way that new entries, or promotions like smash can be justified, is if the hardcore audience is loud enough to indicate that a market for said content still exists. Mario and Zelda fans don't need to campaign for new content it just happens andthey support it. Metroid fans for instance, do. If an IP isn't a priority, and you don't have fans begging for more. More will not be capable of being justified to a table of business suits, and by extension more will not be created. And that is sadly a fact. They could produce a fourth golden sun, but if no one is asking for it, it will be seen as a frivolous venture. Even if previous content sold well. The decay of demand has stronger implications on the long term viability of a IP to a business than even the raw numbers do. It's basic consumerism.

Thankfully for us. We indicated that demand does exist via the smash bros fighter ballot. PLENTY of demand. Which is why I personally believe Golden Sun 4 does in fact exist and will happen within the next year or two.
 
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You are failing to consider the fact that Golden Sun is an IP that is not a priority. The first title sold well. This is true. But the only way that new entries, or promotions like smash can be justified, is if the hardcore audience is loud enough to indicate that a market for said content still exists. Mario and Zelda fans don't need to campaign for new content it just happens andthey support it. Metroid fans for instance, do. If an IP isn't a priority, and you don't have fans begging for more. More will not be capable of being justified to a table of business suits, and by extension more will not be created. And that is sadly a fact. They could produce a fourth golden sun, but if no one is asking for it, it will be seen as a frivolous venture. Even if previous content sold well. The decay of demand has stronger implications on the long term viability of a IP to a business than even the raw numbers do. It's basic consumerism.

Thankfully for us. We indicated that demand does exist via the smash bros fighter ballot. PLENTY of demand. Which is why I personally believe Golden Sun 4 does in fact exist and will happen within the next year or two.
Priority only exists if you will it. At some point in time, Metroid and Donkey Kong got priority, and then lost it for some unexplained reason. Now it’s Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing. We’re subject to the whims of the company.
 

Arsenal234

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I think it should start soon so it can pick up traction. I think a petition from all of the assist character fanbases should be presented to nintendo before they start work on the second batch of DLC (maybe mid 2019). Whiles the pain idea is still fresh on people's minds., it really doens't have to be next week but I don't think it should be something we start too late. It is a grass roots movement, and people with real influence (pro players and youtubers) are less likely to help out if the movement looks like it has no legs underneath it. Also it is too early to start asking those people. Some have images to maintain and won't want to push this kind of petition at the risk of sounding ungrateful. If the petition has a lot of support further down the line people are more likely to jump on board. It is going to take some time to build up credible numbers.
 
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Xenigma

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So in recent days I've been trying to not worry about Isaac, especially since Sakurai has confirmed the current DLC slate is already set in stone, and instead I've been thinking about Golden Sun itself. Thinking about the games so much in recent months has made me really want to replay the original two, yet I've also realized that I really don't want to replay them on a GBA or DS. Not that the SP in particular is bad or anything (I know where mine is and it still works), but with the Switch being a thing that exists, the idea of breaking out an older system with a much smaller screen feels so unappealing by comparison. It's funny how Nintendo abandoned the idea of Virtual Console right as they released arguably the best platform for playing Virtual Console games.
 
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Priority only exists if you will it. At some point in time, Metroid and Donkey Kong got priority, and then lost it for some unexplained reason. Now it’s Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing. We’re subject to the whims of the company.
Or the whims of the Takahashi brothers. Golden Sun is not really a game that can be given priority, at least not something the brothers would be able to handle, stating how much effort goes into rpgs and creating this story and needing time to put the ideas together which is where this demand for Golden Sun 4 comes in, they'll do it if enough fans request it but it'll still take time to develop the story lore and it's likely why this series may never be passed on to any other developer, despite the Monolith Soft suggestion, the brothers have the lore.

Of course the question then becomes, have we met this demand? There's just no communication, no way to know whether they have received enough fan requests for Golden Sun 4 and development started two years ago or something. I mean I'd hate to think we're still in the waiting phase and nothing's happened. I know it comes off crazy how casually we're talking about Golden Sun 4 now after how much of a hiatus the series has been on, but it does fit in with what the Takahashi brothers said years ago, unless they really don't want to do Golden Sun anymore and Mario sports games is less stress.
 
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KMDP

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A by the numbers analysis won’t work here. What needs considered is mindshare. Golden sun may have sold 1.7 million copies. But of those 1.7 million, how many people among them would still actively identify as a golden sun fan? If 100,000 people voted for Isaac in the fighter ballot, would it not be fair to call them the last golden sun fans in the world? Mindshare is the biggest factor here. How many people bought the gba Classic when it’s arrived. And how many more remember and still talk abbout the IP.
The GBA is the 10th best selling Video Game console of all time, and the 4th best selling Nintendo console (5th if you count the GB and GBC as separate).

There's also all the people who played Golden Sun, loved it, but voted for someone else on the ballot because they were obeying the 1 Vote Per Person thing and had someone else higher on their priorities than Isaac.

It's very rare for someone to actively stop liking something; like, people hate what Disney are doing with Star Wars' movies, but that doesn't stop them from liking the original Star Wars trilogy and being fans of said trilogy, even if they hate Last Jedi and Solo.

The obvious answer to this is teenagers, who often claim to hate things they liked as children, but more often than not this is an active attempt to seem more adult, and once they actually become adults they look back on those things they claimed to hate as teenagers more fondly.
 

SPEN18

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I wouldn't mind matthew coming in instead. At least you would get some representation for a character from the series
On one hand, beggars can't be choosers. So a lot of us would be okay with Matthew. But on the other hand, if Matthew got in there'd be absolutely no reason not to include Isaac as either an Echo or an alt costume, so it would be incredibly weird if Matthew got in but not Isaac. Isaac's the one most people voted on, and he's the face of the series. I said in an earlier post that it would be like adding Roy without Marth in Melee.
 

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The GBA is the 10th best selling Video Game console of all time, and the 4th best selling Nintendo console (5th if you count the GB and GBC as separate).

There's also all the people who played Golden Sun, loved it, but voted for someone else on the ballot because they were obeying the 1 Vote Per Person thing and had someone else higher on their priorities than Isaac.

It's very rare for someone to actively stop liking something; like, people hate what Disney are doing with Star Wars' movies, but that doesn't stop them from liking the original Star Wars trilogy and being fans of said trilogy, even if they hate Last Jedi and Solo.

The obvious answer to this is teenagers, who often claim to hate things they liked as children, but more often than not this is an active attempt to seem more adult, and once they actually become adults they look back on those things they claimed to hate as teenagers more fondly.
While it is completely true that people rarely go from actively enjoying something, to actively hating it. The question that is raised in this instance, is simply, has Golden Sun's older, stronger fandom simply moved on? The children who may have played Golden Sun, could have grown up to become Fire Emblen and Xenoblade fans very easily. Could it be that this series was a product of it's time, and as such, is incapable of existing in full force in our modern era? I would so no outright, as a good RPG will always attract and audience. But it's very telling that Golden Sun reddit, our de facto home base, only has 5 thousand subs. Just how many people left are there that remember golden sun? How many allowed the series to enter the confines of thier heart, over say something like, pokemon. It's been talked about that Pokemon and Final Fantasy's stranglehold on the attention RPG's get is slowly killing smaller series. Could this be a victim of said stranglehold? I don't have all the answers. Not even a lot of them. But I can say that in order for Golden Sun to experience a rebirth, we can't stand by and continue with the silence.
 

ZelDan

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 19, 2011
Messages
695
Location
New Hampshire
As someone who didn't like DD anywhere near as much as the first two games, Matthew being added as the GS rep would just be awkward for me and hard to get that excited over TBH. If Isaac was an alt for him then perhaps I could get happy that I could play as Isaac, but Matthew alone, ehhh....

I'd rather get Felix than Matthew alone, though even he'd be kinda weird when he isn't the face of the series either and when he doesn't have the excuse of being the main character of the most recent title. Only way Felix could make sense is if they make a new game and have Felix be the lead character again.
 

KMDP

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 18, 2018
Messages
5,596
While it is completely true that people rarely go from actively enjoying something, to actively hating it. The question that is raised in this instance, is simply, has Golden Sun's older, stronger fandom simply moved on? The children who may have played Golden Sun, could have grown up to become Fire Emblen and Xenoblade fans very easily. Could it be that this series was a product of it's time, and as such, is incapable of existing in full force in our modern era? I would so no outright, as a good RPG will always attract and audience. But it's very telling that Golden Sun reddit, our de facto home base, only has 5 thousand subs. Just how many people left are there that remember golden sun? How many allowed the series to enter the confines of thier heart, over say something like, pokemon. It's been talked about that Pokemon and Final Fantasy's stranglehold on the attention RPG's get is slowly killing smaller series. Could this be a victim of said stranglehold? I don't have all the answers. Not even a lot of them. But I can say that in order for Golden Sun to experience a rebirth, we can't stand by and continue with the silence.
The thing is, not everyone uses Reddit. r/GoldenSun may be "the de facto GS home base" but it's not indicative of Golden Sun's popularity.

Source: I'm a huge Golden Sun fan, and I don't have a Reddit account. In fact this thread is the first time I've even engaged with the Golden Sun fandom publicly.
 
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