Going to my first Smash Tournament tomorrow! Any last minute things I should know/bring?

Zero Soul

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#2
Bring water, don't forget your controller (you'd be surprised how many people do that lol) and maybe bring a couple snacks a long if the venue doesn't have food inside/nearby. Also, this isn't that obvious so I'll bring it up as well, but if they aren't in a bracket match (the ones that count for the tournament) and you see people playing, once they're done with the game/on the CSS you can ask to hop in and play friendlies with them, most people will welcome that regardless of whether or not they know you. Hope you have fun!

Edit: Oh and one other thing, not sure if it'd be at your local scene but where I'm from you're supposed to fistbump before and after every set, although I doubt anyone will take offense to you not knowing about it since you're new lol.
 
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#3
Bring water, don't forget your controller (you'd be surprised how many people do that lol) and maybe bring a couple snacks a long if the venue doesn't have food inside/nearby. Also, this isn't that obvious so I'll bring it up as well, but if they aren't in a bracket match (the ones that count for the tournament) and you see people playing, once they're done with the game/on the CSS you can ask to hop in and play friendlies with them, most people will welcome that regardless of whether or not they know you. Hope you have fun!

Edit: Oh and one other thing, not sure if it'd be at your local scene but where I'm from you're supposed to fistbump before and after every set, although I doubt anyone will take offense to you not knowing about it since you're new lol.
Hmm ok thanks for responding!
 

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#4
Play friendlies before the tournament and after you’re eliminated. It’s a great way to meet people, get adjusted to an offline setting, and improve as a player.
 
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#7
OK, so in my first round of my first match, I pick first and pick Bowser. My opponent picks Rosalina, and I lose. Then they switch to Zelda, I stay Bowser and win. Then they switch to Charizard. Then I was dumb and pulled out my pocket (Pit) and almost won, but still lost. So I'm in losers, and the guy I fight, not even 2 seconds of us on the character select, locks in Rosalina. At this point, I have no idea what to do (have no answer to Rosalina) so I pull out my secondary, Mewtwo, and just barely lose. We go to character select to prepare for game 2, and he once again locks in Rosalina. At this point, I had no idea what to do and was desperate, so I picked Cloud XD. I lost...

On one hand, I expected to get dead last or close to it. On the other hand, I didn't expect 3 out of my 5 rounds I ended up getting to be against my main's biggest counter. So, uhhh.....how do I, a Bowser main, handle Rosalina, I guess is the question.
 

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#8
There's an underlying lesson here.

New players, especially once they are exposed to a competitive environment and the skill differentials within it, tend to jump to looking for mystical knowledge. They get obsessed with matchup counters, stage preferences, and playing secondaries. "How do I fight this character?"

This isn't surprising: Knowledge is easy. You learn it, say "aha!" and feel like a problem is solved.

But where you are at, raw knowledge is not the solution. There are no concise words we can type that will unlock the secrets of beating Rosalina.

Play one character. Consistently practice against a variety of people who are better than you. Lose with dignity and learn to have zero tolerance for excuse. Develop good fundamentals, and gradually absorb them from others. Build the ability to answer your own questions--because in the middle of a match, that's your only option.

I'm gonna repeat: Play one character.

Once you have those down and become a top 20,000 player, then you can converse with other players about the nitty gritty details. At that level you can consider picking up a serious secondary; below that, why not just be a better Bowser? The best Bowser in the world can surely beat some random Rosalinas.

Going to your first event was a big step you should be very proud of! Yet if you stick with it and keep competing with a growth-oriented mindset, you will look back on it as the smallest stepping stone, even if it was the most important.

I hope you'll continue posting on Smashboards, which can be a very helpful resource at all parts of your journey. Don't be afraid of asking questions!
 
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#9
There's an underlying lesson here.

New players, especially once they are exposed to a competitive environment and the skill differentials within it, tend to jump to looking for mystical knowledge. They get obsessed with matchup counters, stage preferences, and playing secondaries. "How do I fight this character?"

This isn't surprising: Knowledge is easy. You learn it, say "aha!" and feel like a problem is solved.

But where you are at, raw knowledge is not the solution. There are no concise words we can type that will unlock the secrets of beating Rosalina.

Play one character. Consistently practice against a variety of people who are better than you. Lose with dignity and learn to have zero tolerance for excuse. Develop good fundamentals, and gradually absorb them from others. Build the ability to answer your own questions--because in the middle of a match, that's your only option.

I'm gonna repeat: Play one character.

Once you have those down and become a top 20,000 player, then you can converse with other players about the nitty gritty details. At that level you can consider picking up a serious secondary; below that, why not just be a better Bowser? The best Bowser in the world can surely beat some random Rosalinas.

Going to your first event was a big step you should be very proud of! Yet if you stick with it and keep competing with a growth-oriented mindset, you will look back on it as the smallest stepping stone, even if it was the most important.

I hope you'll continue posting on Smashboards, which can be a very helpful resource at all parts of your journey. Don't be afraid of asking questions!
Wow thanks man, that was well written. I think not being able to stick to a character was my biggest problem. From now on, I’m gonna try very hard to stick to ONE character (Bowser) and improve with him before I learn anyone else. Thanks a lot man, I really needed someone to tell me that
 
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#10
So, uhhh.....how do I, a Bowser main, handle Rosalina, I guess is the question.
Assuming you want to still main Bowser, I see two main options: #1. You focus entirely on Bowser and try to overcome the bad matchup. Keep in mind that matchup charts are made with top level players in mind, at lower level of play the matchups might look very different. One of the reasons Rosa is so bad for Bowser is because she can ledge trap him really hard, and another reason is that it can be really hard for Bowser to land. If the Rosas you're facing aren't ledgetrapping you or preventing you from landing too badly the matchup might not be that bad.

#2. Keep maining Bowser and pick up one secondary. Even top level players (with a few notable exceptions, such as ANTi or Tweek or MkLeo) rarely have more than one secondary (if they even have a secondary). Trying to play three or more characters in tournaments means you'll either have to invest a lot of time to keep them all fresh or you risk being rusty with one or several of them.

Also, keep in mind that just because you ran into two people using Rosa in that tournament doesn't necessarily mean you will in the future. Some people attend tournaments rarely, while others are regulars. Until you've been to a few tournaments you won't know how common Rosalina will be. Perhaps solo Bowser will still work?
 
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#11
The problem I kept running into was
Assuming you want to still main Bowser, I see two main options: #1. You focus entirely on Bowser and try to overcome the bad matchup. Keep in mind that matchup charts are made with top level players in mind, at lower level of play the matchups might look very different. One of the reasons Rosa is so bad for Bowser is because she can ledge trap him really hard, and another reason is that it can be really hard for Bowser to land. If the Rosas you're facing aren't ledgetrapping you or preventing you from landing too badly the matchup might not be that bad.

#2. Keep maining Bowser and pick up one secondary. Even top level players (with a few notable exceptions, such as ANTi or Tweek or MkLeo) rarely have more than one secondary (if they even have a secondary). Trying to play three or more characters in tournaments means you'll either have to invest a lot of time to keep them all fresh or you risk being rusty with one or several of them.

Also, keep in mind that just because you ran into two people using Rosa in that tournament doesn't necessarily mean you will in the future. Some people attend tournaments rarely, while others are regulars. Until you've been to a few tournaments you won't know how common Rosalina will be. Perhaps solo Bowser will still work?
The problem that I kept running into was that Luma would hit me after using up throw and then I wasn’t able to follow up (at least not true). So I basically can’t grab Rosa until after I get rid of Luma (which also isn’t easy). Any way to combat this specifically, or do I just have to suffer through it?
 
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#12
The problem that I kept running into was that Luma would hit me after using up throw and then I wasn’t able to follow up (at least not true). So I basically can’t grab Rosa until after I get rid of Luma (which also isn’t easy). Any way to combat this specifically, or do I just have to suffer through it?
That's another reason why that matchup sucks, yeah... I recommend joining the Bowser Discord, they'd be more qualified to give advice on the issue than I am. You can find Smash Discord invites here: https://smashcords.com/smash-4/
 

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#13
I know people do suggest just one character only, but I think this depends on the level of imoact you want to make/how far you want to go/who that one character is.

I think the top successful players in smash 4 should have ONE secondary/counter that covers their mains bad matchups the best overall. Characters like Bayo, Diddy, Sheik don't really need a secondary at all. They are good enough to stand on their own. Bowser though, although I believe he is viable to win a major, can't do it on his own most likely unless proven otherwise. He's gonna need some help for characters who can camp him out like Rosa, other guys (I'm not a Bowser expert so idk his worst MUs really) You say you use Mewtwo also? I think Mewtwo can do a great job covering Bowser's bad MUs like Rosa, etc. He functions as a good zoner with good escape and landing options, opposite to Bowser's grappling style and struggle to land which Rosa can abuse.

So build up your Bowser to the best of your ability, try to overcome his worst MUs if you can. If you can't,then no shame in popping out a suitable secondary,don't be stubborn.

Just use MKLeo and Elegant for examples. MKleo,the best player in the world, has many answer due to his (unusual) amount of secondaries. Elegant will use Luigi and Luigi only. Very good player still, but he has never,ever beaten Dabuz in the oodles of times they have player. The best Luigi vs Rosa player in the world have proven that the Mu is basically unwinnable at top level play. A secondary is sorely needed.

Good luck!
 
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#14
I think the top successful players in smash 4 should have ONE secondary/counter that covers their mains bad matchups the best overall.
Well... If they want to do well consistently, they should pick a good main. A top level player maining a good character could be the best without using a secondary, and I think we've seen this many times. ZeRo was basically a Diddy Kong for a long time (he dabbled in Lucina for a bit but ultimately decided to focus on Diddy). Larry Lurr seems to do well with mostly solo Fox, and VoiD and Mr. R do really well with solo Sheik. I believe Tweek could do well with either solo Bayonetta or solo Cloud if he wanted to... Either way he spends so much time on the game that he can afford to split his time on multiple characters without seemingly taking a hit. Players like Tweek and MkLeo are anomalies, most players wouldn't have the time or skill to split themselves that thin and still do well.

Seeing how QG (the OP) just started going to tournaments I'm assuming he doesn't spend as much time as Tweek or MkLeo (neither do I, for that matter). What works for a select few might not work as well for players who don't put in as much time and effort. Anyway, most top level players seem to fall into one or two categories:

#1. Top/high tier character players. This type of players will generally play a really good character that doesn't have much need for a secondary or a pocket, so they might do better just focusing on their main. In some cases it might be worthwhile having something to deal with a specific threat (such as ESAM* bringing out Samus to deal with Ally's Mario).

*Pikachu is a borderline case, anyway. Most players in this group would be playing a top 10 character, not a top 15 character.

#2. Players who play some specific character that they really enjoy. See: Many Japanese players (like Raito, Ranai, or kameme) , many local/regional players, and such. There are some borderline cases where the character is decently good but not really super-good, like with Captain Falcon, Peach, Luigi, and Meta Knight. These characters may benefit more from having a secondary, but that player is also (often) known for their lower high/mid/low tier main, so they may be reluctant to bring out a secondary.

Players in group #1 are less likely to need a secondary, while players in group #2 are less likely to want one. In many cases, players who do use a secondary are using a former main, which means they'll have to invest less time to keep the character fresh.

Bowser though, although I believe he is viable to win a major, can't do it on his own most likely unless proven otherwise.
I'm not a big fan of the whole "viable to win a major" thing. Link almost won a major, and he's arguably worse than Bowser. Individual skill and bracket luck goes a long way. If someone like Tweek or MkLeo or ZeRo decided to solo-main Bowser then I could see Bowser winning some majors. None of these players will solo-main Bowser though because they'd likely win even more majors if they mained a better character.

So build up your Bowser to the best of your ability, try to overcome his worst MUs if you can. If you can't,then no shame in popping out a suitable secondary,don't be stubborn.
I'm inclined to agree with this. Maybe try to play friendlies with some Rosa/Sonic/Zero Suit Samus players and see if you can deal with the bad MUs with Bowser. If you really feel lost, a secondary could be quite useful. Also, some people enjoy playing multiple characters, even if it might hold them back a bit.

Elegant will use Luigi and Luigi only. Very good player still, but he has never,ever beaten Dabuz in the oodles of times they have player. The best Luigi vs Rosa player in the world have proven that the Mu is basically unwinnable at top level play. A secondary is sorely needed.
To be fair, Dabuz is an amazing player. Let's say Element would pick up a Corrin secondary to deal with Rosalina. Well, Cosmos, the best Corrin in the world, has struggled quite a bit versus Dabuz (with all this being said, many of the Cosmos-Dabuz sets were fairly close, I haven't watched enough Dabuz-Elements sets to really tell, perhaps it truly is a horrible MU. Does Element lose to other Rosalinas as well?).
 
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Thinkaman

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#15
Considering a secondary is a fine suggestion for a top 1000 or so player, who have already taken a character nearly to the top of their potential.

The advice you'd give Elegant has little overlap with the advice that should be given to a new account on Smashboards who just went to their first tourney.


Edit:
I will play devil's advocate with myself and point out that new players often have no way of correctly judging who they want to main. Sure, maybe I like Ridley, but if I don't have a deep understanding of the game, how Ridley works, and how I work as a player, it's rather foolish of me to declare "That's it! I'm maining Ridley!"

The only thing more cringey than a new player listing their 10 "mains" is a new player who knows exactly who their main is.

Where do you think Mew2King got his name from? None of us sprung fully formed from the forehead of Athena, ready to accept the fated mantle of our destined character. When Melee came out, I putzed around with Mewtwo for a year before realizing I was a Puff player.

In Brawl I turned out to be unusually good with Brawl Puff, who was objectively a poor character. I got a lot of mileage out of that bottom-tier, and only had to really consider investing in secondaries after about 18 months. (I learned Ness and Squirtle, who had a lot of similarities while doing well in Puff's worst matchups.) But again, that was after 18 months, with a horrible character, and I was one of the top Brawl Puffs in the world. (Since there were so few)

The list of players who need a secondary in Smash 4 could be fit on a single page of paper.
 
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#16
I know people do suggest just one character only, but I think this depends on the level of imoact you want to make/how far you want to go/who that one character is.

I think the top successful players in smash 4 should have ONE secondary/counter that covers their mains bad matchups the best overall. Characters like Bayo, Diddy, Sheik don't really need a secondary at all. They are good enough to stand on their own. Bowser though, although I believe he is viable to win a major, can't do it on his own most likely unless proven otherwise. He's gonna need some help for characters who can camp him out like Rosa, other guys (I'm not a Bowser expert so idk his worst MUs really) You say you use Mewtwo also? I think Mewtwo can do a great job covering Bowser's bad MUs like Rosa, etc. He functions as a good zoner with good escape and landing options, opposite to Bowser's grappling style and struggle to land which Rosa can abuse.

So build up your Bowser to the best of your ability, try to overcome his worst MUs if you can. If you can't,then no shame in popping out a suitable secondary,don't be stubborn.

Just use MKLeo and Elegant for examples. MKleo,the best player in the world, has many answer due to his (unusual) amount of secondaries. Elegant will use Luigi and Luigi only. Very good player still, but he has never,ever beaten Dabuz in the oodles of times they have player. The best Luigi vs Rosa player in the world have proven that the Mu is basically unwinnable at top level play. A secondary is sorely needed.

Good luck!
I think my biggest problem is that for the longest time I played Falco, so he’s technically my most played character, but I have accepted that he is not good and that I will probably never pull him out in tournaments. Had I sunk that time into Mewtwo or Bowser, I think things would have turned out very differently for me. Anyways, yeah I agree, Mewtwo could probably be decent at handling Rosalina.

Considering a secondary is a fine suggestion for a top 1000 or so player, who have already taken a character nearly to the top of their potential.

The advice you'd give Elegant has little overlap with the advice that should be given to a new account on Smashboards who just went to their first tourney.
To be fair, I’ve been playing this game since the 3DS version launch day
 
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Thinkaman

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#17
To be fair, I’ve been playing this game since the 3DS version launch day
This both an irrelevant measure and not actually that long an amount of time.

I played Melee constantly for 6 years before I started going to events and really learning the game. While I had managed to figure out which character was for me, almost everything else I thought I knew about the game was wrong. This sort of experience is super common in every competitive game I've seen.

In the Melee days, when the Internet was a different thing, there was a more stark line drawn between those in the know and those not. Now it's a lot easier to people without experience to gain surface-level knowledge. For example, in the Melee days, you could sniff out instantly if someone was clueless or experienced by asking them if Marth or Roy was better; no such litmus test would work (for any game) in 2018.
 
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#18
Considering a secondary is a fine suggestion for a top 1000 or so player, who have already taken a character nearly to the top of their potential.
I'm not even sure if it's ideal for top 1000, might be better for those in the top 100 range or so. Armada even thought that in Melee, unless you're a top 10 player you'd probably be better off solo-maining instead of dual-maining. His video can be seen here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzdMvpVSON0

It makes sense, too. Since your time is limited (assuming it is), it might be better to spend the time you planned on working on a secondary on your main instead. Many of the top level players who play multiple players allegedly play a lot. Like, sometimes 8-10 hours per day, which is not feasible for most Smash players.

If you have, say, 30 hours to play per week, you could spend 20 on your main and 10 on your secondary, or you could spend 30 on your main. I think that's probably what you should do to begin with, and if you keep losing to Bowser's bad MUs after going to several characters, then maybe picking up a secondary could be worth it (or switching main, up to you).
 

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#19
I'm not even sure if it's ideal for top 1000, might be better for those in the top 100 range or so. Armada even thought that in Melee, unless you're a top 10 player you'd probably be better off solo-maining instead of dual-maining. His video can be seen here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzdMvpVSON0
This is definitely accurate for top-tier characters.

I broadened my scope to "1000" to cover the modern worst case of bottom tier characters in Smash 4. You might broaden it further if you play a polarized lower tier in Brawl, or any of the bottom levels in Melee.
 
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