Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[pinshadow]

To be fair, if the absence of a costume indicates playability, then that would equally apply to both Heihachi and Lloyd as their costumes are also missing, alongside Monster Hunter.

I think there’s a solid chance that they may have been saved for future DLC costume waves especially if those characters (6-11) have been decided upon or were decided upon around June/E3.

EDIT: To be fair in another way, the spirit argument comes down to what Sakurai has as his vision of the game. We may very well not find out which side is closer to correct until Pick 11 gets their livestream, lol.

Well, yea, I think the general consensus, atleast here, is that another Namco rep is almost inevitable at this point, it just comes down to who it is. Monster Hunter though? Maaaaybe, but I feel way stronger about Dante, and the fact that Rathalos is already in the game makes me think the idea of a character got shot down for whatever reason.

 

[Bob-Omber]

I'm saying that if Geno's not in, it wasn't because he's a spirit or something like that. Sakurai does't rule out characters for random rules that the fanbase has constructed. We literally have precedent for this, he wanted to include Mewtwo and Lucas in Smash 4 and put them in despite there already being a trophy for them. If he wants to include a character, by everything we know, he just puts them in.

We already have precedent for characters being physically in the game as characters and spirits at the same time. Nabbit has a spirit and is a stage hazard.

I get that this isn't the same as being a fighter but still if the reason spirits cant be fighters is because they're dead and dont have physical bodies, then that dosn't make sense because clearly, they kinda do

 

[Icewolff92]

I don't quite get why Square and/or Nintendo would be so worried about Geno and Chocobo costumes either. Literally just old costumes that everyone was expecting to come. How would that detract from the Dragon Quest promotion at all? If anything they shot themselves in the foot. The absence of the costumes brought more attention to them and even more so, they revealed Hero just before BANJO AND KAZOOIE, who stole the show from DQ more so than any measly costume could. lmao

They used Banjo for the sake of not getting people in the west to go "hurrdurr who the hell is this ****" when it comes to the Hero reveal. And no, people would have talked more if they revealed the Geno costume compared to not showing it.

 

[Malo Mart]

We already have precedent for characters being physically in the game as characters and spirits at the same time. Nabbit has a spirit and is a stage hazard.

To be fair, that goes for almost every characters with stage cameos, as well as bosses and ATs. The only exception I can think from the top of my head is a good bunch of the King of Fighters cameos.

Hmm, incoming SNK Spirit event maybe?

 

[Lord Woomy]

To be fair, if the absence of a costume indicates playability, then that would equally apply to both Heihachi and Lloyd as their costumes are also missing, alongside Monster Hunter.

Namco and Capcom didn't have any characters in the FP for there to be a perfect opportunity for those costumes to come back, Square did. While, I personally believe Lloyd and Dante are pretty likely for FP2 as well, it's more suspicious for Geno and Chocobo when their costumes literally had a character to come with and said character just got no returning costumes.

 

[JarBear]

Lol not sure about the argument about Nintendo worries about a costume stealing a show... they did Sans over terry, which was obviously going to be the case. One can argue that cup head would have stolen the show over ANOThER FiRE eBLeM ChaRACteR!

They don’t care ...

so the argument about not releasing Geno costume to steal Heroes spotlight is kinda lame. Also .. Banjo stole the fighter spotlight at E3 hands down. When you have a “one more thing” to present at the end of a presentation, that steals the show...

 

[Deleted member]

Can we please just drop the spirits argument? Let’s just freakin wait and see instead of bringing it up every once in a while. Anything is a possibility including assist trophies whether you see likely or not.

 

[Icewolff92]

Lol not sure about the argument about Nintendo worries about a costume stealing a show... they did Sans over terry, which was obviously going to be the case. One can argue that cup head would have stolen the show over ANOThER FiRE eBLeM ChaRACteR!

They don’t care ...

so the argument about not releasing Geno costume to steal Heroes spotlight is kinda lame. Also .. Banjo stole the fighter spotlight at E3 hands down. When you have a “one more thing” to present at the end of a presentation, that steals the show...

That doesn¨t mean that Square didn¨t care. It takes two to tango you know?

 

[Deleted member]

That doesn¨t mean that Square didn¨t care.

Do we know for sure if Square dictates what to show or not to sure at a presentation including a 2-3 minute costume add?

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Can we please just drop the spirits argument? Let’s just freakin wait and see instead of bringing it up every once in a while. Anything is a possibility including assist trophies whether you see likely or not.

To be fair that’s the entire point of the debate.

We don’t know for sure what’s possible, but we can only make inferences based on what’s in front of us.

It doesn’t mean everybody has to believe it, but I do think it would be helpful to at least acknowledge that, at least with my posts, I’m not posting that “spirits disconfirm” and not basing it on anything.

The people who do post that and don’t back it up? Yeah, that can get annoying for sure.

 

[Icewolff92]

Do we know for sure if Square dictates what to show or not to sure at a presentation including a 2-3 minute costume add?

As far as we know, having the breakdown purely on Hero could be a part of the deal in getting access to Hero. Nintendo can¨t just bargain in and force them to sign whatever they want. Plus, this port was a big deal for Nintendo too (a lot have to do with this being Iwatas last request to Square apparently), which makes it even more sense to just purely focusing on Hero.

 

[Deleted member]

To be fair that’s the entire point of the debate.

We don’t know for sure what’s possible, but we can only make inferences based on what’s in front of us.

It doesn’t mean everybody has to believe it, but I do think it would be helpful to at least acknowledge that, at least with my posts, I’m not posting that “spirits disconfirm” and not basing it on anything.

The people who do post that and don’t back it up? Yeah, that can get annoying for sure.

We really don’t have to bring it up every once in a while. It’s really tiring as a topic.

 

[Malo Mart]

They used Banjo for the sake of not getting people in the west to go "hurrdurr who the hell is this ****" when it comes to the Hero reveal. And no, people would have talked more if they revealed the Geno costume compared to not showing it.

Well, what was the point of having Hero as a promotion for Dragon Quest in the West, then? If they knew people were just going to dismiss Hero and turn their heads to Banjo, why even bother with that?

And I'll admit that's all hypothetical, but I imagine if Geno got costume'd back then, people would've just accepted it and moved on. Geno costume coming with Hero seemed like a damn near lock in many folks' eyes, Sure many of us woulda still gotten disappointed or even mad for a while, but it's not like we expected any different. Compare that to what actually happened and the absence of his costume rekindling speculation on him. Personally I saw little to nothing on Geno between base Ultimate dropping with his Spirit to the Hero presentation, but then afterwards he seemingly became a hot topic in the community again.

 

[Deleted member]

As far as we know, having the breakdown purely on Hero could be a part of the deal in getting access to Hero. Nintendo can¨t just bargain in and force them to sign whatever they want. Plus, this port was a big deal for Nintendo too (a lot have to do with this being Iwatas last request to Square apparently), which makes it even more sense to just purely focusing on Hero.

Even the direct is focused on DQ and the main thing is promoting the game, 2 returning costumes that everybody is expecting is not gonna affect sales to the game.

 

[pinshadow]

As far as we know, having the breakdown purely on Hero could be a part of the deal in getting access to Hero. Nintendo can¨t just bargain in and force them to sign whatever they want. Plus, this port was a big deal for Nintendo too (a lot have to do with this being Iwatas last request to Square apparently), which makes it even more sense to just purely focusing on Hero.

So if they weren't planned to be with Hero, where are they then? They didn't show up with any other character from the pass, meaning the only other option is that they never planned to bring back the costumes at all, even though Geno's rights are negotiated, the costumes are already made, and it's free money for Square.

The only logical reasoning for the costumes not showing up is that they were moved to sometime in post pass. Would they show up with another, different Sqaure character? Maybe, but wouldn't Geno just overshadow them as well according to this theory?

 

[Heoj]

Im like 95% sure that geno is gonna be playable in season 2, i think that what happened is geno and chocobo miis were meant to accompany hero but they scrapped them last minute to make geno playable in season 2.
And im gonna stick with this belief like glue, if im wrong then i die believing and if im right then i celebrate hard.

 

[Lord Woomy]

Even the direct is focused on DQ and the main thing is promoting the game, 2 returning costumes that everybody is expecting is not gonna affect sales to the game.

Westerners: "Man, I really am excited for the Hero presentation. I'm going to buy DQ11 just because he looks so cool!"
Geno Mii costume: is revealed
Westerners: "Wow, I ****ing hate DQ11 now and everything involving the series. It's stupid dumb and bad now that the Geno Mii costume has been revealed and I don't want to buy anything relating to it ever again."
Clearly, the most expected outcome if Geno's Mii costume was shown off in Hero's presentation.

 

[Icewolff92]

Well, what was the point of having Hero as a promotion for Dragon Quest in the West, then? If they knew people were just going to dismiss Hero and turn their heads to Banjo, why even bother with that?

Because they knew that they needed something to soften the blow of Hero¨s reveals to the western audience. When the reveal was out of the way, people were more okay with it, and therefore not as "anti-DQ! a lot would most likely have been if Banjo were not shown.

Even the direct is focused on DQ and the main thing is promoting the game, 2 returning costumes that everybody is expecting is not gonna affect sales to the game.

It effects more than you know.

So if they weren't planned to be with Hero, where are they then? They didn't show up with any other character from the pass, meaning the only other option is that they never planned to bring back the costumes at all, even though Geno's rights are negotiated, the costumes are already made, and it's free money for Square.

The only logical reasoning for the costumes not showing up is that they were moved to sometime in post pass. Would they show up with another, different Sqaure character? Maybe, but wouldn't Geno just overshadow them as well according to this theory?

Or it could just be so simple that they never grabbed the Mii Costume at all for this first wave of character. Just look at Banjo. We got him, but no Rare costumes.

 

[pinshadow]

Or it could just be so simple that they never grabbed the Mii Costume at all for this first wave of character. Just look at Banjo. We got him, but no Rare costumes.

The costumes already exist though, and they only ever planned to do this one wave of DLC, so where would the costumes have been if not with Hero?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So if they weren't planned to be with Hero, where are they then? They didn't show up with any other character from the pass, meaning the only other option is that they never planned to bring back the costumes at all, even though Geno's rights are negotiated, the costumes are already made, and it's free money for Square.

The only logical reasoning for the costumes not showing up is that they were moved to sometime in post pass. Would they show up with another, different Sqaure character? Maybe, but wouldn't Geno just overshadow them as well according to this theory?

No, because the franchise they'd come with isn't going to have trouble selling in the West. Those comparisons don't work because of this factor.

DQ needs to sell. Not Banjo. Not Persona. Not SNK. Not Fire Emblem. What's the sole presentation to have nothing else but its own franchise? DQ. It's not some weird conspiracy theory.

Of course, they could've moved the costumes to another time as well due to this. Assuming they come back, anyway. Geno might've been decided to become playable around that time, or another SE character. He already had to start negotiating for characters at some point too, especially since they take around a year to six months to make. November is easily within that time period.

There's a lot of possibilities while keeping within SE's specific idea of pushing DQ alone(which they did pretty well, mind you). Let's not forget the extra long DQXI Definitive Edition part in a Nintendo direct. There's clear evidence of it being heavily pushed. What was at Square-Enix's own e3 segment? DQXI, and a long bit at that. Kind of adds up.

 

[Icewolff92]

The costumes already exist though, and they only ever planned to do this one wave of DLC, so where would the costumes have been if not with Hero?

Sure, but this is Square we are talking about. Not Capcom or SNK who are very easy to make crossover, which is why there is a high chance that Geno weren¨t even meant to be a costume in the first place.

 

[RingJ5]

And yet that's what they did. There is nothing dumb about pushing their product that has had trouble selling. How do you think it's going to sell without mass promotion? Cause that's literally the only option they have.

Concidering how demanded Geno is, no it's not that stupid if you really think about it. Smash community would talk more about why Geno ended up as a costume more than the game.

Think of it this way: Smash has sold around 16 million copies. Even if... not even ten percent, not even five percent, but a particularly conservative estimate of exactly one percent of players went as far as buying every last costume in the game, that’s $120,000 per costume, though that number would admittedly be split between Nintendo and Square in some fashion, and doesn’t even count the people buying costumes out of preference rather than completeness.

In ad campaign terms, it’s essentially them “spending” potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars just to have an extremely small amount of extra focus on something that you want to market in the west, which as many have since pointed out was already overshadowed during the initial reveal to begin with.

And as for “what the Smash community would think”, we’re still such a small minority compared to the general audience that we’re basically a non-factor in this kind of marketing, and even then when the presentation happened a good amount of die-hard Geno supporters were dejectedly expecting the costume to appear anyway and things to be over and done with until its complete absence sparked things right back up. So even if they(Square specifically, I mean) did care what we thought, getting people’s hopes back up for a full character would manage to be an even worse way to go about things.

 

[Ura]

To be fair that’s the entire point of the debate.

We don’t know for sure what’s possible, but we can only make inferences based on what’s in front of us.

It doesn’t mean everybody has to believe it, but I do think it would be helpful to at least acknowledge that, at least with my posts, I’m not posting that “spirits disconfirm” and not basing it on anything.

The people who do post that and don’t back it up? Yeah, that can get annoying for sure.

Making inferences only helps to a certain point but it should never be used as definitive proof.

i.e. All characters will be third parties because the previous four have been third party. Which ironically was a very popular talking point before last week.

So really, a promotion can happen anytime. It could be Pack 6, Pack 11, or anywhere between. Saying "this has been the trend so far" is pretty meaningless given said trend can be broken at any time much like the above perception.

 

[pinshadow]

No, because the franchise they'd come with isn't going to have trouble selling in the West. Those comparisons don't work because of this factor.

DQ needs to sell. Not Banjo. Not Persona. Not SNK. Not Fire Emblem. What's the sole presentation to have nothing else but its own franchise? DQ. It's not some weird conspiracy theory.

Of course, they could've moved the costumes to another time as well due to this. Assuming they come back, anyway. Geno might've been decided to become playable around that time, or another SE character. He already had to start negotiating for characters at some point too, especially since they take around a year to six months to make. November is easily within that time period.

There's a lot of possibilities while keeping within SE's specific idea of pushing DQ alone(which they did pretty well, mind you). Let's not forget the extra long DQXI Definitive Edition part in a Nintendo direct. There's clear evidence of it being heavily pushed. What was at Square-Enix's own e3 segment? DQXI, and a long bit at that. Kind of adds up.

Of course Dragon Quest is being heavily pushed, it's the main reason why Nintendo (and why I thought they would) put him in in the first place. Giving 15 seconds of a Mii costume segment to Geno and a Chocobo hat is not going to make people buy Hero less or not buy Dragon Quest XI S. It was a smash specific presentation anyway, anyone watching was almost certainly going to buy Hero anyway or already had the Pass. Hero already had his big reveal at the start of E3.

 

[Icewolff92]

Think of it this way: Smash has sold around 16 million copies. Even if... not even ten percent, not even five percent, but a particularly conservative estimate of exactly one percent of players went as far as buying every last costume in the game, that’s $120,000 per costume, though that number would admittedly be split between Nintendo and Square in some fashion, and doesn’t even count the people buying costumes out of preference rather than completeness.

In ad campaign terms, it’s essentially them “spending” potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars just to have an extremely small amount of extra focus on something you want to market in the west, which as many have since pointed out was already overshadowed during the initial reveal to begin with.

And as for “what the Smash community would think”, we’re still such a small minority compared to the general that we’re basically a non-factor in this kind of marketing, and even then when the presentation happened a good amount of die-hard Geno supporters were dejectedly expecting the costume to appear anyway and things to be over and done with until its complete absence sparked things right back up. So even if they did care what we thought, getting people’s hopes back up for a full character would manage to be an even worse way to go about things.

With how big Square pushed it, it would make sense that they wanted to truly get EVERYONE's attention, and that includes the hard core Smash players.
There is a reason why articles like these were written before the release https://www.videogamer.com/news/dra...western-sales-for-new-entries-to-be-localised

And like I said before. No, Geno being a Mii Costume returning, would be more talk of the town then him not returning.

 

[Deleted member]

Because they knew that they needed something to soften the blow of Hero¨s reveals to the western audience. When the reveal was out of the way, people were more okay with it, and therefore not as "anti-DQ! a lot would most likely have been if Banjo were not shown.



It effects more than you know.



Or it could just be so simple that they never grabbed the Mii Costume at all for this first wave of character. Just look at Banjo. We got him, but no Rare costumes.

How exactly does a Chocobo and Geno costumes will make people not want to buy the game? What if there is a Geno fan but they’re interested of buying the game despite Hero? What if Smash fans want to buy the game but it’s nothing to do with Hero or Geno at all. Gameplay and a trailer is all you need to make your audience decide to buy a product. What if Geno and Sora fans are not interested no matter what happens?

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Making inferences only helps to a certain point but it should never be used as definitive proof.

i.e. All characters will be third parties because the previous four have been third party. Which ironically was a very popular talking point before last week.

So really, a promotion can happen anytime. It could be Pack 6, Pack 11, or anywhere between. Saying "this has been the trend so far" is pretty meaningless given said trend can be broken at any time much like the above perception.

I was one of the people who said Fire Emblem or Astral Chain would be an exception if any. Look what happened?

Promotions happening is just as, if not more, questionable that what others say. I literally based inferences on actual, measurable information. I find it unlikely (not impossible) for upgrades because of the way packs have been handled for two Smash games in a row. That is measurable.

I would at least appreciate responses that don’t ignore anything I’ve said in the past, because blindly believing anything is a bad idea. Dismissing it as a “fan rule” comes off as more of stick fingers in your ears and screaming so you don’t hear what an opposing side thinks.

I’m not blindly believing anything.

For the sake of the thread I think it would be best to move on.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Of course Dragon Quest is being heavily pushed, it's the main reason why Nintendo (and why I thought they would) put him in in the first place. Giving 15 seconds of a Mii costume segment to Geno and a Chocobo hat is not going to make people buy Hero less or not buy Dragon Quest XI S. It was a smash specific presentation anyway, anyone watching was almost certainly going to buy Hero anyway or already had the Pass. Hero already had his big reveal at the start of E3.

That's not how businesses work, though. You're trying to think of it too hard from a purely fan point of view. SE doesn't want anything else there, and it makes sense. Chocobo is Final Fantasy, a series that heavily outshines DQ in the West. That only hurts the point of the presentation. Geno is too highly requested to not overtake a lot of it. Besides the fact it'd mean he's not playable, which would be a huge deal too.

Both of those would easily overtake the presentation when it comes to SE. They have a clear focus in mind.

Besides, as noted, there's a pretty good chance it was part of the licensing agreement.

I agree the fact that Geno and Chocobo's costumes not being here yet is strange, but with a lot of other missing costumes, that just suggests some were moved to Pass 2 overall. It's also possible some were simply not licensed to come back, which also makes sense. Whether or not it was because of a DLC newcomer being those particular characters. There's too many possibilities.

 

[Deleted member]

Imagine Smash fans who bought the game later found out Geno and Chocobo are costumes again. What’s gonna happen? Refunds, death threats, petition to ban the DQ series in the West, and an angry mob towards the Square Enix headquarters and at Akira Toryiama’s House?

 

[RingJ5]

With how big Square pushed it, it would make sense that they wanted to truly get EVERYONE's attention, and that includes the hard core Smash players.
There is a reason why articles like these were written before the release https://www.videogamer.com/news/dra...western-sales-for-new-entries-to-be-localised

Then I’d absolutely argue that they ****ed up even harder by omitting the costume, because they shifted the potential conversation from “Damn, Geno’s just a costume after all” to “Wait, where’s Geno’s costume? IS HE BACK IN THE RUNNING!?”

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Then I’d absolutely argue that they ****ed up even harder by omitting the costume, because they shifted the potential conversation from “Damn, Geno’s just a costume after all” to “Wait, where’s Geno’s costume? IS HE BACK IN THE RUNNING!?”

Considering Geno could be a pass character?

Not a bad thing either. Especially since Hero was still heavily talked about along with DQ after the presentation. And they got their sales pretty well. Looks like things went pretty well, actually.

 

[Droodle]

Then I’d absolutely argue that they ****ed up even harder by omitting the costume, because they shifted the potential conversation from “Damn, Geno’s just a costume after all” to “Wait, where’s Geno’s costume? IS HE BACK IN THE RUNNING!?”

I'm pretty sure that to Square Enix, making DQ a bigger deal in the West is far more important then putting a minor fan-favorite in a crossover fighting game.

Geno could still get in as a fighter this pass (or maybe not). But business wise, marketing DQ full force makes a lot more sense. There will undoubtedly be many more Dragon Quests, but the fate of the SMRPG series is pretty questionable/bleak.

 

[Lord Woomy]

I love how Geno fans are always depicted as a small, weird, and overly vocal minority of the Smash community but when it comes to promoting DQ, we have the popularity and numbers to entirely dictate how well DQ11 sells in the west somehow.

 

[MisterMike]

>Imagine thinking that a character from a 24-year-old game that most casual fans know little about is in any way a threat to the success of one of the biggest and most influential RPG series in history.
>Imagine thinking that people getting mad over a character being made a costume is enough to overshadow an entire game franchise to the point that it will directly impact it's sales.
>Imagine thinking that a huge company like SquareEnix would even give so much of a **** about making Dragon Quest successful in the west that they'd avoid pissing off Smash fans via releasing the Geno costume.

 

[RingJ5]

Considering Geno could be a pass character?

Not a bad thing either. Especially since Hero was still heavily talked about along with DQ after the presentation. And they got their sales pretty well. Looks like things went pretty well, actually.

I'm pretty sure that to Square Enix, making DQ a bigger deal in the West is far more important then putting a minor fan-favorite in a crossover fighting game.

Geno could still get in as a fighter this pass (or maybe not). But business wise, marketing DQ full force makes a lot more sense. There will undoubtedly be many more Dragon Quests, but the fate of the SMRPG series is pretty questionable/bleak.

See, now this gets into an entirely different unfortunate realm of possibilities, did Square intentionally bait Geno fans with the hope of a potential upgrade to make sure that DQ’s reveal had less negativity surrounding it?

I am still diametrically opposed to the idea that DQ needed every last second of focus to the point of not releasing already-finished costume DLC, but apparently you’re all really insistent that Square would unironically go that far, so let’s look at it this way:

In doing that, they essentially added rocket thrusters to the Geno hype train. In the result that Geno is literally anything less than a fully playable character at this point, they basically have to hope against hope that the backlash that would come from ramping up this train for a full extra year only to have it wreck in a ball of angry fire was worth the tiny extra bit of DQ advertising back in July, because there is no way in hell that they were unaware of how it would look at the time.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

See, now this gets into an entirely different unfortunate realm of possibilities, did Square intentionally bait Geno fans with the hope of a potential upgrade to make sure that DQ’s reveal had less negativity surrounding it?

I am still diametrically opposed to the idea that DQ needed every last second of focus to the point of not releasing already-finished costume DLC, but apparently you’re all really insistent that Square would unironically go that far, so let’s look at it this way:

In doing that, they essentially added rocket thrusters to the Geno hype train. In the result that Geno is literally anything less than a fully playable character at this point, they basically have to hope against hope that the backlash that would come from ramping up this train for a full extra year only to have it wreck in a ball of angry fire was worth the tiny extra bit of DQ advertising back in July, because there is no way in hell that they were unaware of how it would look at the time.

Sure. SE aren't idiots. They could've done that after negotiating to use Geno as playable. Works perfectly if so.

Or they just decided to renegotiate to release the costume later. Either, or.

They clearly did go that far. Was it the sole reason? Who knows. But we see pure DQ. We see that they need it to sell. They correlate pretty well. There might be more to it than that, sure, but we have zero evidence to suggest otherwise.

The actual question is what's going on with the costumes, not the fact they wanted DQ to sell in the West. Pass 2 was not negotiated for at the same time as Pass 1. It's quite possible they figured out something else with Geno and Chocobo. We have multiple possibilities, at least for Geno;

1. Costume was scrapped in the first place, and they only got the Spirit.
   1. The costume was scrapped originally, but negotiated for later.
2. Geno actually is going to become playable, something they decided later on, which would also lead to a scrapped costume.
3. The costume is fully there and they intended it with Hero, but plans changed due to an agreement among all three parties to focus on a series that actually needs it right now to sell. Likewise, another SE character is coming for both costumes.

Chocobo is highly unlikely to be playable, so it doesn't fit the pieces too well. Could've been scrapped altogether for all we know. Could come with Geno or another SE costume. So mostly 1, 1.1, and 3 is possible for this one.

 

[Droodle]

>Imagine thinking that a character from a 24-year-old game that most casual fans know little about is in any way a threat to the success of one of the biggest and most influential RPG series in history.
>Imagine thinking that people getting mad over a character being made a costume is enough to overshadow an entire game franchise to the point that it will directly impact it's sales.
>Imagine thinking that a huge company like SquareEnix would even give so much of a **** about making Dragon Quest successful in the west that they'd avoid pissing off Smash fans via releasing the Geno costume.

No one is thinking that Geno's a threat to DQ or anything of the sort. It's about priorities, when the biggest release of the company in the second half of 2019 is Dragon Quest, why would they want to promote Chocobo or Geno in a Dragon Quest-centric presentation? A company that is extremely run by "suits" like Square would want to maximize the money earned from one of their biggest series, as well as popularize it. Putting Geno/Chocobo in the presentation as costumes would serve to do 2 things.

1. Take away the message that "this is a Dragon Quest presentation. We want this game to succeed in the West."
2. Upset certain "subsets" of the Smash fanbase, which could potentially result in a negative attitude of DQ 11S even before the game releases. This would be a PR nightmare. I know people will say "that would never happen", but they narrowly avoided it in the E3 direct; when the majority of the Smash fanbase preemptively got angry when Hero got shown off before Banjo. Geno is kind of in the same situation as Banjo as a "fan-favorite", and we all know that when a fan-favorite gets deconfirmed/costumed the Smash fanbase tends to act like toxic children.

Now does this mean that Geno IS a costume? No. Again we are just discussing hypothetical's here. Geno may indeed be a fighter. But the "evidence" that his mii costume is missing from the presentation isn't really all that clear cut.

Now if Chocobo came back in the presentation without Geno, that would be another case entirely.

EDIT: Also another bonus to the idea that Square Enix pretty much told Sakurai to primarily focus on DQ is the style of the presentation itself. We went 20 minutes without really seeing any other fighter aside from Hero, not even other Square RPG characters like Cloud. Typically we end up seeing another character within 5-10 minutes of the presentation. Obviously, nothing huge; but definitely a pretty big contrast to the other presentations (even the Joker video).

 

[MisterMike]

No one is thinking that Geno's a threat to DQ or anything of the sort. It's about priorities, when the biggest release of the company in the second half of 2019 is Dragon Quest, why would they want to promote Chocobo or Geno in a Dragon Quest-centric presentation? A company that is extremely run by "suits" like Square would want to maximize the money earned from one of their biggest series, as well as popularize it. Putting Geno/Chocobo in the presentation as costumes would serve to do 2 things.

1. Take away the message that "this is a Dragon Quest presentation. We want this game to succeed in the West."
2. Upset certain "subsets" of the Smash fanbase, which could potentially result in a negative attitude of DQ 11S even before the game releases. This would be a PR nightmare. I know people will say "that would never happen", but they narrowly avoided it in the E3 direct; when the majority of the Smash fanbase preemptively got angry when Hero got shown off before Banjo. Geno is kind of in the same situation as Banjo as a "fan-favorite", and we all know that when a fan-favorite gets deconfirmed/costumed the Smash fanbase tends to act like toxic children.

Now does this mean that Geno IS a costume? No. Again we are just discussing hypothetical's here. Geno may indeed be a fighter. But the "evidence" that his mii costume is missing from the presentation isn't really all that clear cut.

Now if Chocobo came back in the presentation without Geno, that would be another case entirely.

Cloud came with the Geno costume in Smash 4, I don't think they care about keeping their franchises separate.

 

[Deleted member]

No one is thinking that Geno's a threat to DQ or anything of the sort. It's about priorities, when the biggest release of the company in the second half of 2019 is Dragon Quest, why would they want to promote Chocobo or Geno in a Dragon Quest-centric presentation? A company that is extremely run by "suits" like Square would want to maximize the money earned from one of their biggest series, as well as popularize it. Putting Geno/Chocobo in the presentation as costumes would serve to do 2 things.

1. Take away the message that "this is a Dragon Quest presentation. We want this game to succeed in the West."
2. Upset certain "subsets" of the Smash fanbase, which could potentially result in a negative attitude of DQ 11S even before the game releases. This would be a PR nightmare. I know people will say "that would never happen", but they narrowly avoided it in the E3 direct; when the majority of the Smash fanbase preemptively got angry when Hero got shown off before Banjo. Geno is kind of in the same situation as Banjo as a "fan-favorite", and we all know that when a fan-favorite gets deconfirmed/costumed the Smash fanbase tends to act like toxic children.

Now does this mean that Geno IS a costume? No. Again we are just discussing hypothetical's here. Geno may indeed be a fighter. But the "evidence" that his mii costume is missing from the presentation isn't really all that clear cut.

Now if Chocobo came back in the presentation without Geno, that would be another case entirely.

Now imagine thinking 10 seconds of Chocobo would do any negative affect. It’s not gonna overshadow Hero nor the game. Again, 10 seconds.

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

No one is thinking that Geno's a threat to DQ or anything of the sort. It's about priorities, when the biggest release of the company in the second half of 2019 is Dragon Quest, why would they want to promote Chocobo or Geno in a Dragon Quest-centric presentation? A company that is extremely run by "suits" like Square would want to maximize the money earned from one of their biggest series, as well as popularize it. Putting Geno/Chocobo in the presentation as costumes would serve to do 2 things.

1. Take away the message that "this is a Dragon Quest presentation. We want this game to succeed in the West."
2. Upset certain "subsets" of the Smash fanbase, which could potentially result in a negative attitude of DQ 11S even before the game releases. This would be a PR nightmare. I know people will say "that would never happen", but they narrowly avoided it in the E3 direct; when the majority of the Smash fanbase preemptively got angry when Hero got shown off before Banjo. Geno is kind of in the same situation as Banjo as a "fan-favorite", and we all know that when a fan-favorite gets deconfirmed/costumed the Smash fanbase tends to act like toxic children.

Now does this mean that Geno IS a costume? No. Again we are just discussing hypothetical's here. Geno may indeed be a fighter. But the "evidence" that his mii costume is missing from the presentation isn't really all that clear cut.

Now if Chocobo came back in the presentation without Geno, that would be another case entirely.

EDIT: Also another bonus to the idea that Square Enix pretty much told Sakurai to primarily focus on DQ is the style of the presentation itself. We went 20 minutes without really seeing any other fighter aside from Hero, not even other Square RPG characters like Cloud. Typically we end up seeing another character within 5-10 minutes of the presentation. Obviously, nothing huge; but definitely a pretty big contrast to the other presentations (even the Joker video).

If these suits were really smart, why did they let hero get shown off with Banjo? When he has geno levels, if not more, of support.