Foot Stooling

[MJG]

I don't think people realize how good foot stooling is in this game. Obviously a lot of us are used to the sexiest combo (Bair>Foot Stool> Dair> Dair Pogo> Option Select) but footstool can be used for so much more. I am sure a lot of players are aware of some of its uses but I thought I would just share my input.

Foot Stooling Characters!
​

Now, I am sure there are more characters that we can do this to but I am 100% positive that we can foot stool these characters OoS and use a dair immediately (this is based on game play with other players.).

DI up out of Pikachu's fair and footstool pika.
: If he lands next to you
:
: This can be done after olimar's nair
: This can be done after fox's dair

Like I stated earlier, I found all of this out during tournament play and even though this is something simple, it is just another mix up that will help us out in the long run.
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Foot Stooling as an "Evasive" option!​

Ok so, there are some characters like ICs, MK, Kirby, etc., who like to try and grab TL after we have exhausted all of our jumps. I will use ICs for now since this will be easier for all of you to understand.

IC mains like to look for patterns vs TL mains in order to get the grab. I feel like we, as TL mains, can keep out the IC mains pretty easily, but something that I have done against the ICs (besides bombing them to hell and back) is falling next to them and then I like to DI right on top of the ICs and footstool them so that I can escape. I like to just try and beat on the ICs and avoid having to footstool them, but you now have 2 characters that you can footstool (either nana or popo).
_________________________________________________________________

Foot Stool > Bomb​

Simple and to the point. Footstool the opponent, throw the bomb down and use Uair/Fair/Dair.

...



I had some other things that I wanted to put on this thread but I can't wrap my head around all of my thoughts at the moment.

 

[southpaw]

footstooling ic'ies are a bad idea because they can grab you out of the footstool animation. not many people know about this surprisingly.

 

[WindMajor]

Can they even react to that?

 

[MJG]

footstooling ic'ies are a bad idea because they can grab you out of the footstool animation. not many people know about this surprisingly.

Can they even react to that?

I think it would really depend on which Ice Climber you foot stool. Either way, I don't think they would be able to react to that (like that Twinkie said) but yea, I wouldn't recommend relying on foot stooling the ICs all the time. Thats why I said:

I like to just try and beat on the ICs and avoid having to footstool them.

Just another mix up

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

It's definitely a good 'landing' mix up for anyone trying to punish your landing. Like even verses the IC's, I've never had to worry about that grabbing out of animation thing cause you don't get the animation when they're doing something, say, running over to where you're landing and shielding. In this case you simply footstool off their shield from time to time when you're in that bad situation without a Bomb or a jump, which should be rare if you can help it.
Mjg knows what he's talking about guys. In certain situations it is most certainly a viable option. I've been finding myself using this option much more often lately so I found it interesting that it was mentioned.

 

[KT Kasrani]

i have no tech skill and would never be able to do this

 

[Thebest1pj]

lol kingtoon

 

[WindMajor]

Can't we foot stool to quick draw and have it lock for a sec?

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Yes and no. In fact to be on the safe side; possibly and no.
I had the idea not too long ago as you may remember that we might be able to (Zair or Bair (for example) to) foot stool them close to the ground (the untechable one) while holding a bomb, to bomb throw down to second footstool to fast fall quickdraw which would 'lock'. I was convinced that it would work but it's still untested as I'm apparently a busy guy as of late.
Not only is it still technically theory craft, but even if I did prove it to be legit, no one would use it.

But to answer your question perhaps more directly, no you can't singular footstool them (just above the ground) to fast fall quickdraw as they have ample time to escape.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Re-posting here for Twink

I thought I'd dispel a few myths about the aerial footstool to Dair (i.e. footstooling an opponent who is in the air and comboing the stun from the footstool into a Dair spike). It's usually unsure whether it's guaranteed or not, but for the most part it's seen as impossible to ensure the Dair hits.

The only way to avoid the Dair is with DI/drifting, but there are actually many factors that go into whether or not DIing will avoid the Dair. Instead of explaining why in a certain situation the Dair hits or not, I'll just give you the list of all characters DIing in all situations and tell you whether they avoid the Dair or if it connects and spikes. I know I've personally wanted to know this info for a while now. I think you'll be surprised with some of the results. Skip the list to get the good parts in a more accessible way or browse through at your own leisure.


Key:
S = both characters are facing the same direction (both left or both right). So Toon and the opposing character are facing the same way.
O = facing the opposite direction from each other (so either they are looking at each other or have their backs to each other).
F = the opponent tried to DI the footstool forwards. This is forwards from their point of view, not Toon's.
B = the opponent tried to DI backwards.
y = yes, the Dair Spike connects and is guaranteed under the stated conditions.
n = no, it didn't connect and they were able to avoid you.

Note: Toon facing left or right makes no difference because of the wording used; so don't think of things in terms of left and right, rather think of it in terms of 'in relation to each other' which will adjust accordingly no matter which way you face. The above covers everything in every situation (don't be smart... you know what I mean XD). Oh and the list is so widely spaced so that it's easier to compare characters and just easier to read over all.


Mario:
SFy, SBn, OFn, OBy.

Luigi:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Peach:
SFn, SBn, OFn, OBy.

Bowser:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

DK
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

Diddy:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Yoshi:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Wario:
SFn, SBn, OFn, OBn.

Link:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Zelda:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

Sheik:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ganon:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Toon:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Samus:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

ZSS:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Pit:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

IC's:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

ROB:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Kirby:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Meta Knight:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

D3:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Olimar:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

Fox:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Falco:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Wolf:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

C. Falcon:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Pikachu:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBy.

Squirtle:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ivysaur:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Charizard:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Lucario:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Jiggz:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Marth:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ike:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ness:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Lucas:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

GnW:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Snake:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Sonic:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.


So what does all this tell us and how can knowing this stuff help?
Every character with one 'n' in both the O's and the S's are all characters where it is never safe to go for the spike because they will always have a way of avoiding it. So from now on, especially if off stage, don't try to footstool to spike Mario, Peach, DK, Diddy, Wario, Zelda, Sheik, Toon, Samus, ZSS, Pit, IC's, Kirby, Olimar, Fox, Falco, Wolf, C. Falcon, Squirtle, Charizard, Jiggz, Marth, Ness, Lucas, GnW and Sonic. Even if it is quite possible to connect with these characters, it is never guaranteed.

Then there are the characters that have all y's. They can never avoid the footstool to Dair, no matter what they do (assuming you get the footstool). These poor characters are Luigi, Yoshi, Ganon, ROB, Meta Knight, Ivysaur and Snake.


Finally, the bit I found quite interesting, there are the characters that have two y's in either the S's or the O's but have at least one 'n' in the other. These are characters where we can actually choose to guarantee the spike depending on which direction we decide to face. I'll list these characters in full again because it is important to note which way you need to be facing in relation to which way they are facing to guarantee the spike.

Bowser:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Link:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

D3:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Pikachu:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBy.

Lucario:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ike:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.



Questions? Comments?

 

[MJG]

If you get caught by pikachu's fair, DI up, Footstool>dair(or if you have a bomb in hand, you can footstool > bomb throw> uair/fair (to kill) or dair (to rack more damagee)

 

[~TLK~]

Re-posting here for Twink

I thought I'd dispel a few myths about the aerial footstool to Dair (i.e. footstooling an opponent who is in the air and comboing the stun from the footstool into a Dair spike). It's usually unsure whether it's guaranteed or not, but for the most part it's seen as impossible to ensure the Dair hits.

The only way to avoid the Dair is with DI/drifting, but there are actually many factors that go into whether or not DIing will avoid the Dair. Instead of explaining why in a certain situation the Dair hits or not, I'll just give you the list of all characters DIing in all situations and tell you whether they avoid the Dair or if it connects and spikes. I know I've personally wanted to know this info for a while now. I think you'll be surprised with some of the results. Skip the list to get the good parts in a more accessible way or browse through at your own leisure.


Key:
S = both characters are facing the same direction (both left or both right). So Toon and the opposing character are facing the same way.
O = facing the opposite direction from each other (so either they are looking at each other or have their backs to each other).
F = the opponent tried to DI the footstool forwards. This is forwards from their point of view, not Toon's.
B = the opponent tried to DI backwards.
y = yes, the Dair Spike connects and is guaranteed under the stated conditions.
n = no, it didn't connect and they were able to avoid you.

Note: Toon facing left or right makes no difference because of the wording used; so don't think of things in terms of left and right, rather think of it in terms of 'in relation to each other' which will adjust accordingly no matter which way you face. The above covers everything in every situation (don't be smart... you know what I mean XD). Oh and the list is so widely spaced so that it's easier to compare characters and just easier to read over all.


Mario:
SFy, SBn, OFn, OBy.

Luigi:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Peach:
SFn, SBn, OFn, OBy.

Bowser:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

DK
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

Diddy:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Yoshi:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Wario:
SFn, SBn, OFn, OBn.

Link:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Zelda:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

Sheik:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ganon:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Toon:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Samus:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

ZSS:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Pit:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

IC's:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

ROB:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Kirby:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Meta Knight:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

D3:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Olimar:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBn.

Fox:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Falco:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Wolf:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

C. Falcon:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Pikachu:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBy.

Squirtle:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ivysaur:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Charizard:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Lucario:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Jiggz:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Marth:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ike:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ness:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Lucas:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

GnW:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Snake:
SFy, SBy, OFy, OBy.

Sonic:
SFn, SBy, OFn, OBy.


So what does all this tell us and how can knowing this stuff help?
Every character with one 'n' in both the O's and the S's are all characters where it is never safe to go for the spike because they will always have a way of avoiding it. So from now on, especially if off stage, don't try to footstool to spike Mario, Peach, DK, Diddy, Wario, Zelda, Sheik, Toon, Samus, ZSS, Pit, IC's, Kirby, Olimar, Fox, Falco, Wolf, C. Falcon, Squirtle, Charizard, Jiggz, Marth, Ness, Lucas, GnW and Sonic. Even if it is quite possible to connect with these characters, it is never guaranteed.

Then there are the characters that have all y's. They can never avoid the footstool to Dair, no matter what they do (assuming you get the footstool). These poor characters are Luigi, Yoshi, Ganon, ROB, Meta Knight, Ivysaur and Snake.


Finally, the bit I found quite interesting, there are the characters that have two y's in either the S's or the O's but have at least one 'n' in the other. These are characters where we can actually choose to guarantee the spike depending on which direction we decide to face. I'll list these characters in full again because it is important to note which way you need to be facing in relation to which way they are facing to guarantee the spike.

Bowser:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Link:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

D3:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Pikachu:
SFy, SBn, OFy, OBy.

Lucario:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.

Ike:
SFy, SBy, OFn, OBy.



Questions? Comments?

i like how meta and snack both fall in the second group.

 

[army man]

i have no tech skill and would never be able to do this

don't say that! anyone can do it if you just keep on practicing

 

[Grox]

I like footstool jumps but I'm not that good at them.

 

[LeafR]

Lol, army man, you take people on these boards too seriously
Still, you're a cool guy though.