Fixing Wii Fit Trainer's hit-boxes: Redux

[RichWalk9891]

Because my old thread regarding about WFT's hit-boxes in the WiiU/3DS forum was lacking in terms of feedback, I'm planning to post my revisions of my attempt to fix WFT's hit-boxes here. Granted these are not the official Ultimate moveset, but the purpose of this thread is for me to provide ideas of how I envision the hit-boxes to appear as, which I believe will benefit WFT's play-style without making her too overpowered.

As always, the blue circles represents my hit-box placements:

[Jab-1]

To begin with, there is now a hit-box on the right knee. The hit-box on the right foot is now extended towards the toes. The left arm also have a hit-box on the elbow to make the formation appear more complete.

[F-Tilt, Frame 5]

The right leg now has a hit-box on the knee and feet.

[F-Tilt, Frame 6]

All of the hit-boxes are enlarged to reliably hit smaller opponents, as well as aerial opponents.
EDIT: The revamped hit-box on the foot above WFT's head has been reduced slightly.

[U-Tilt]

The hit-box now extends towards the feet.
EDIT: The revamped hit-box was too large, so I decided to just extend the original hit-box instead.

[D-Tilt]

The hit-box on the knees has been enlarged.

[F-Smash]

There is now a hit-box on the left knee and feet.

[Up-Smash]

Much like Marth and Lucina's Up-Smash, there are now hit-boxes around WFT's feet right before the Tree pose is complete.
EDIT: The new hit-boxes by WFT feet now activates slightly earlier. The final stance of the Tree pose now has a hit-box that extends towards the ground.

[D-Smash]

The hit-box on the hand has been extended to match the hit-box on the foot.

[Dash]

The hit-box has been enlarged.

[N-Air, Frame 8]

There are now hit-boxes on the hands and feet, as well as the abdomen.

[N-Air, Frame 9-11]

The hit-boxes on the hands and feet have been extended, and the final frame of the attack has also been extended to the left.

[F-Air]

The hit-box on the right arm has been enlarged, and there are now hit-boxes on both feet.
EDIT: There is now another small hit-box on the hand to give the attack slightly more range.

[B-Air]

The hit-boxes on the legs have been extended towards the torso, and also enlarged by the feet. The sweet-spot (highlighted in green) has also been enlarged.

---
Thank you for reading, and if you can, please leave some feedback.

 

[Necro'lic]

I've always been fascinated by Wii Fit Trainer's wonky hitbox placement and low range. I think a lot of these seem to have a general idea of "bigger hitboxes", but unless a lot of characters with similar build as her have these large hitboxes, I don't see this being anything but superfluous.

In addition, some of your added hitboxes also seem tacked on, like the bottom foot on FAir. She doesn't thrust that limb, so having a hitbox on it at all is awkward.

I do like the idea of making her less susceptible to short characters though, that's a great idea.

Let me just go through them one by one:

-------------------------------------------

• Jab 1: Pretty much perfect both placement wise and size wise
• FTilt: I like the added hitbox one frame beforehand. I think the upwards foot hitbox might be a tad too big, but otherwise, this seems right.
• UTilt: I think the upward bubble is a bit much, and the bottom bubble should probably be more pill shaped than circle to cover the floor, because right now, it's far too big laterally, at least in my view
• DTilt: This one is perfect
• FSmash: Definitely my favorite of all of them. Seriously, she thrusts her feet forward and they are somehow dead zones?
• USmash: If these hitboxes were slightly earlier than the first hit and knocked players up into the second hit, this would be fine, since it would look natural enough that you were "dragged" into her arms from her motion
• DSmash: This is fine too
• Dash Attack: Unlike UTilt, I'm actually fine with how big this is because it's a full on body check style move, so having the hitbox be her body makes sense.
• NAir: Everything here is all well and good except the final frame. I understand wanting to cover the left side, but I think you over did it a bit on the top left and top right parts.
• FAir: Already said that bottom foot hitbox makes no sense when pertaining to how the move looks. Otherwise, it's good
• BAir: A little too much range on the left for my taste, but only a little. I do like the enlarged sweetspot and the extended hitbox on her back though.

Sorry if this was a bit nitpicky, but again, Wii Fit Trainer is interesting to me design wise because of her very precise hitboxes. I like consistency and helping alleviate her weakness to low profile characters, but I also would like to keep her low range as her weakness and would instead buff her in other ways.

 

[RichWalk9891]

I've always been fascinated by Wii Fit Trainer's wonky hitbox placement and low range. I think a lot of these seem to have a general idea of "bigger hitboxes", but unless a lot of characters with similar build as her have these large hitboxes, I don't see this being anything but superfluous.

In addition, some of your added hitboxes also seem tacked on, like the bottom foot on FAir. She doesn't thrust that limb, so having a hitbox on it at all is awkward.

I do like the idea of making her less susceptible to short characters though, that's a great idea.

Let me just go through them one by one:

-------------------------------------------

• Jab 1: Pretty much perfect both placement wise and size wise
• FTilt: I like the added hitbox one frame beforehand. I think the upwards foot hitbox might be a tad too big, but otherwise, this seems right.
• UTilt: I think the upward bubble is a bit much, and the bottom bubble should probably be more pill shaped than circle to cover the floor, because right now, it's far too big laterally, at least in my view
• DTilt: This one is perfect
• FSmash: Definitely my favorite of all of them. Seriously, she thrusts her feet forward and they are somehow dead zones?
• USmash: If these hitboxes were slightly earlier than the first hit and knocked players up into the second hit, this would be fine, since it would look natural enough that you were "dragged" into her arms from her motion
• DSmash: This is fine too
• Dash Attack: Unlike UTilt, I'm actually fine with how big this is because it's a full on body check style move, so having the hitbox be her body makes sense.
• NAir: Everything here is all well and good except the final frame. I understand wanting to cover the left side, but I think you over did it a bit on the top left and top right parts.
• FAir: Already said that bottom foot hitbox makes no sense when pertaining to how the move looks. Otherwise, it's good
• BAir: A little too much range on the left for my taste, but only a little. I do like the enlarged sweetspot and the extended hitbox on her back though.

Sorry if this was a bit nitpicky, but again, Wii Fit Trainer is interesting to me design wise because of her very precise hitboxes. I like consistency and helping alleviate her weakness to low profile characters, but I also would like to keep her low range as her weakness and would instead buff her in other ways.

First of all, thank you for the feedback. I am more inclined to agree with your input on FTilt, UTilt, UpSmash, NAir, and BAir, and will be adjusting them accordingly soon.

I am a little curious about FAir and the right foot (or bottom foot) not needing a hit-box however:

Her left foot (the one without the official hit-box) looks to make enough downward force to be considered an attack, since WFT rises her left knee close to her chest before quickly extending her left leg downwards akin to a stomp.

 

[Alsyght]

I stopped using Wii Fit because of her awful, awful hitboxes, but these are just all of my yes. I like her, and this is basically what I wanted from her after getting beaten down like an elephant trampling me with knives on For Glory so many times. If her hitboxes get fixed like this, over even somewhere near this, then yeah, I’ll go back.

 

[Necro'lic]

First of all, thank you for the feedback. I am more inclined to agree with your input on FTilt, UTilt, UpSmash, NAir, and BAir, and will be adjusting them accordingly soon.

I am a little curious about FAir and the right foot (or bottom foot) not needing a hit-box however:

Her left foot (the one without the official hit-box) looks to make enough downward force to be considered an attack, since WFT rises her left knee close to her chest before quickly extending her left leg downwards akin to a stomp.

Sorry I didn't reply. Glad you appreciate the feedback, and I admit I was wrong about the left foot on FAir.

 

[RichWalk9891]

Sorry I didn't reply. Glad you appreciate the feedback, and I admit I was wrong about the left foot on FAir.

Don't worry about it. I'm still learning how hit-boxes work and whether my ideas of how hit-boxes should be is on the right track or not, so any feedback is welcome.

 

[RichWalk9891]

Because I have too much time on my hands, I've made a feature to WFT's move-set by creating a 'silhouette' of her yoga poses, as shown below:

Considering that WFT's Final Smash has her cast a series of yoga pose silhouettes against the opponent, I figured it not completely unreasonable to incorporate these silhouettes in her attacks to give her move attack range, while making a suitable reference to her Final Smash.

And of course, her silhouettes do not consist entirely of hit-boxes and would be placed logically onto each move.

 

[RichWalk9891]

Well, it's been a year and I'm still hoping for WFT to have her notoriously poor hitbox placement adjusted to give her the range and utility she needs with her key moves.

Here's another set of hit-boxes placements based on the Ultimate edition, which are all inspired by invy's ideas in his sites. As always, the blue circles represents my own hitbox placements:

[Jab 1: Her range from front to back is slightly extended, and there is now a hitbox on her knee]

[F-Tilt: There is now a hitbox on the leg as it rises, and the hitbox in front of WFT is enlarged to give more range and hit smaller combatants]

[Up-Tilt: The hitbox in front and behind WFT is enlarged]

[D-Tilt: The hitbox is enlarged slightly]

(Note: I would also modify this move to have WFT 'slide' forward slightly to give her D-Tilt even more range)

[Dash-Attack: The hitbox now covers WFT's upper torso and leg during the Dancer pose]

[N-Air: The attack now activates a frame earlier, and WFT's hitbox on her feet is larger overall. There is also a hitbox on WFT's abdomen, and The hitboxes on WFT feet also mirror the hitboxes on her hands. The final giant hitbox now covers more of WFT's torso]

[F-Air: The hitbox on the head has been enlarged to cover WFT upper torso, and to give her an attack range directly in front of her upper torso. The hitbox on the foot is enlarged to give more range. Another hitbox is also given to WFT's other foot]

[Up-Air: A new hitbox is placed one frame early of the attack, which is also adjusted to give more horizontal range]

[B-Air: The sweetspot is enlarged, along with the hitbox on the feet. There is also a hitbox on WFT's buttocks.]

[F-Smash: There is now a hitbox on the knee and feet, to allow WFT to hit smaller opponents]

[Up-Smash: There are now hitboxes on WFT's feet AND knees two frames before WFT completes the pose, which gives her some horizontal range during the attack]

[D-Smash: The hitbox on WFT's hand is slightly extended to match the range of the hitbox on her foot. Another hitbox is placed in the buttocks to avoid a potential blindspot]

[Grab: The range on the standing and dash grabs are extended slightly]

---
As always, I'm happy to hear some feedback based on my hitbox placement ideas.

 

[Mark The Page]

A scooping hitbox for the rear f-tilt, and silhouettes for smashes seem like great ideas. Though it'd be frustrating to play against a character whose hitboxes go so far beyond her model. My fixes would be:

1. Wii Fit Trainer's excellent posture should reduce her shield pushback. Her dual-sided hitboxes theoretically double her options, but currently, even her farthest hitboxes can't reach opponents after blocking a medium blow.

2. Give Super Hoop a large horizontal hitbox at startup, which knocks away opponents (and maybe allow it to be cancelled like Header). Currently she does not have a single reliable out-of-shield option.

These small changes emphasize her unique abilities, while correcting the balancing oversights which have blocked her out of competitive play.