Important F-air to Footstool: Guaranteed Kill?

NotAnAdmin

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#2
This is a good way to style, but with the nerfed fair, it might not work the same way every time sadly. Depending on weight I'm pretty sure this is next to impossible for Jiggs, given her small hitbox and floatiness. Also by your video it looks like it can only work at lower percent. Around 30%-50%, depending on the weight.
Nice stuff though!
 

Cyro

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#3
This is a good way to style, but with the nerfed fair, it might not work the same way every time sadly. Depending on weight I'm pretty sure this is next to impossible for Jiggs, given her small hitbox and floatiness. Also by your video it looks like it can only work at lower percent. Around 30%-50%, depending on the weight.
Nice stuff though!
I was thinking the same thing, I plan on experimenting with this later on. Thank you though!
 
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#4
It really seems to be a situational tech dependent on character fall speeds and hitboxes, like the above poster mentioned. Is there some way to guarantee it at certain percents, and have you been able to duplicate it?
 

Cyro

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#5
It really seems to be a situational tech dependent on character fall speeds and hitboxes, like the above poster mentioned. Is there some way to guarantee it at certain percents, and have you been able to duplicate it?
In the description I mention that I've performed this many times, on people such as Mario, Duck Hunt, and Bowser (more but I can't exactly remember right now)
Percentage does seem to be a factor, but I still want to make sure
 
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#6
In the description I mention that I've performed this many times, on people such as Mario, Duck Hunt, and Bowser (more but I can't exactly remember right now)
Percentage does seem to be a factor, but I still want to make sure
Yep, that's my bad. :p This calls for some testing, it could be very useful if we can get it down consistently enough.
 

The 0ne

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#7
I once did a modified version of this on Peach where I avoided hitting the last hit of Fair, and then I used Phantasm to spike her. The whole combo was a 0-death, actually.
 

AmishTechnology

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#9
I've actually gotten footstooled myself after my fair ended, lol. Pretty awful when that happens, I don't know the exact details on this whole f-air footstool thing. Amazing when you land it, horrible when you attempt it and it backfires like that. If I knew the conditions in which it could backfire, that would help a lot. Am I the one who failed, or did the enemy have a frame advantage after my fair ended (time from my fair ending > the histun from the last peck of the fair that hit the enemy at low %) -> thus leading to them being able to jump before I could?

It'll be exceedingly rare because no one full hops in the neutral, but I've theorycrafted about an "on-stage" fair foostool -> enemy footstool lands -> Falco fastfalls and tech chases or something. Maybe it's only possible in a platform stage like Battlefield lol. Don't know.
 
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Mizzy Moe

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#10
hmm thats pretty cool gives falco a nice way to kill pretty quickly it seems as long as you do this around the start of a stock i like it i wanna get this down :D and you fast fell to pull him down didnt you?
 

AmishTechnology

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#11
I'm not 100% sure how to get it down on demand. It may be fast fall. It may be just positioning f-air to barely graze them so the last one doesn't hit, or maybe it's the timing.

Edit: It's not fast fall, that gets you killed hahaha.
 
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BlueBirdE

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#13
I pulled this off on a marth yesterday after an airdodge read. It was about stage ground level after a full hop. Wish i saved it but i think positioning, timing, and speed all play a part. I want to figure this out too
 

lolazerz

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#14
Like everyone else is saying this isn't a guaranteed tech but rather a very situation one that can only be done with either heavy characters or just fast fallers. But footstooling with Falco does feel a lot easier in this game
 
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Cyro

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#15
Like everyone else is saying this isn't a guaranteed tech but rather a very situation one that can only be done with either heavy characters or just fast fallers. But footstooling with Falco does feel a lot easier in this game
I've performed it on Duck Hunt several times; not just heavy characters.
 

The 0ne

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#16
Every time I get the proper fair positioning, I can feel that I'm about to get a footstool. And yeah, every time I've gotten the footstool, it has confirmed a kill 100% of the time.
 

The 0ne

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#17
Here's a part of a match I played where I successfully used this technique. Please look for the Phantasm one against Peach on my YouTube channel if you're interested!


The footstool on the last stock is yet another modification I discovered.
 

Cyro

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#18
Here's a part of a match I played where I successfully used this technique. Please look for the Phantasm one against Peach on my YouTube channel if you're interested!


The footstool on the last stock is yet another modification I discovered.
Well, he could have escaped the first footstool, you didn't connect enough of the F-air to trap him.
While the last stock looked cool, it's not exactly new. It's pretty much just general knowledge.
 

ShineFantasm

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#20
Beware of the fair to footstool, I've been doing it several times, but I dont remember which char it was, but one was able to footstool me while I was doing fair at the same time I usually do and I got killed, I laughed so hard xDDD
 
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Cyro

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#21
Beware of the fair to footstool, I've been doing it several times, but I dont remember which char it was, but one was able to footstool me while I was doing fair at the same time I usually do and I got killed, I laughed so hard xDDD
That's actually happened to me too, but I'm pretty sure that was because it was done incorrectly.
 

ShineFantasm

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#22
Yea, maybe that's what happened to me as well, anyway that's still an awesome trick to get a kill !
 

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#23
Since the update I lost the recording but in 4 straight matches I'd lose a stock against this little mac with him footstooling me out of fair. Hilarious because we'd both taunt right after
 

BlueBirdE

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#24
I just did this again not too long ago. With the changes to fair you guys think this tech is more viable,nerfed or about the same?
Scenarios ive been thinking of using this is for catching sheiks 1 frame vulnerability from her up b to ledge
 
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Attila_

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#25
I've landed this accidentally a few times, but I've also been foostooled by my opponent in the same situation. I think the opponent can act first if they react, but if they don't, you can kill them. I'd rather land the fair ;)
 

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#26
Does this combo still work after the new patch?
 
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#27
My guess is that this should never work against a conscious opponent that mashes Jump after the F-Air, but I'm not really in a prime position to test it as it is.

Set-knockback moves keep opponents frozen for longer if your percent is higher (Rage keeps them in place longer), but it also might make it so it requires more movement to avoid the final hit. My guess is that the higher your percent is, the better it works (if it ever works). The opponent's percent shouldn't matter at all on moves with set knockback.

 

BlueBirdE

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#28
Id have to test as well and see if we jump first or if we would get above the opponent first. But if the opponent already used their 2nd jump i imagine it would be more useful.
 

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#30
Fox mains have been utilizing this tactic for a while. It's pretty neat that Falco can do it as well.
 

MadCanard

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#31
Playing around with lvl 9 bots convinces me that this is not a guarantee. The opponent can act first and footstool you. Happened every time against a lvl 9.

However, it's a very tight window and any opponent that isn't a computer will probably fall victim to this unless they are smashing the jump button the whole time.
 
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#32
Well, Jump would buffer within a ten-frame window, so that wouldn't be hard for a human victim to defend against in that case.

Did you try it with your percent higher, which would cause the linking hits to have longer stun? Set the Handicap in Vs. Mode so that you're at about 100% and do it.
 
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#33
I managed to pull this off on a Dr. Mario completely by accident. I don't know about the utility of it. Not when you already have back air as an edgeguarding option.
 

McDareth

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#34
I think it is somewhat guaranteed as long as you do not fast fall the Fair. I've gotten used to seeing when Falco is low enough on my opponent to know when the Footstool is possible. From what I've seen if you fast fall, Falco will stop hitting them early enough that they recover before you do so they will more than likely Footstool you. When I started just noticing where Falco was on my opponent while using Fair, only the last hitbox would miss and I've been able to Footstool them. As far as I can remember, I have never been Footstooled in return when doing it this way.
 

Ralugi

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#35
From the looks of it, it can be avoided if the opponent DI away, and ironically, downwards to avoid the footstool.

Though it certainly can and will work against a large number of the cast.
 

BltzZ

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#36
From the looks of it, it can be avoided if the opponent DI away, and ironically, downwards to avoid the footstool.

Though it certainly can and will work against a large number of the cast.
Doesn't work anymore bro they patched it when smash 4 first came out. you used to be able to drag them down and footstool. but I'm convinced Sakurai hates falco because he took that away from him a year and a half ago but fox can still do it....
 

Ralugi

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#37
Doesn't work anymore bro they patched it when smash 4 first came out. you used to be able to drag them down and footstool. but I'm convinced Sakurai hates falco because he took that away from him a year and a half ago but fox can still do it....
Really, because I've done it quite a few times against some competent players this year. It's not impossible, just difficult as hell.
 

BltzZ

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#38
Really, because I've done it quite a few times against some competent players this year. It's not impossible, just difficult as hell.
He doesn't drag them down when you fast fall the fair anymore. However you can still footstool them if you're quick enough and don't get footstooled instead lol
 

Tankendog

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#39
I dont think this is guarenteed. I have SDed way more times trying to do this than i can even imagine. I would be interested if someone could figure out how to FF NAir through someone, avoiding the last hit of knockback, and getting a footstool off. I think this is a guarenteed SD though.
 

Ralugi

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#40
I dont think this is guarenteed. I have SDed way more times trying to do this than i can even imagine. I would be interested if someone could figure out how to FF NAir through someone, avoiding the last hit of knockback, and getting a footstool off. I think this is a guarenteed SD though.
That's great. I'm gonna lab that
 
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