EVO made me realize a few things.

Sky`

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#1
If we want Evo or any respected tournament sponsor to even CONSIDER our game to be competitively viable there are a few things we have to fix/look at.

1. The Entertainment factor just might be more important than the reasoning behind the competition. For example, Whether or not you believe that MK's banishment would help or hinder the competition, the idea remains that it would increase the level of excitement in matches. Nobody is interested in planking, scrougeing, and other things that really only benefit MK and.. Pit. Again, I'm not debating the strategy behind time outs and planking and such, I'm saying that it's not entertaining.

2. We need to have a rule set that we all agree upon. This unity rule set to me, has heard no praise at all. I'm not sure how, but we are going to have to have more than just the BBR's input on a ruleset. The BBR And the BBR-RC should not have full control over this- This needs to be a group community effort.

3. We honestly need to take a look at our professionalism. We can't escape the 'get *****' phrase or, 'you're a f*****', or any of that stuff. But we can control how we dress and how we smell. In my tournaments here in nor-cal, effective immediately, I'm implementing a professional rule, which states in short, I have the right to DQ you if it's clear that you are not keeping up with your hygiene. I suggest other TO's do the same.

I want to show up at Evo next year guys. Not only as the best Phoenix Wright to hit america.(<3) But to see Brawl get some real attention.
 

Supreme Dirt

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#6
I personally have trouble with the heat that happens in a venue.

I sweat a lot.

I don't want to be DQ'd because I sweat a lot, and thus start to smell bad.
 

Steam

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#10
It really sucks when one person smells like *** because it can stink up everything. and it HAS affected my focus in tourney before :/
 

Big-Cat

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#11
And what does dressing up have to do with Smash? <_<

:phone:
Even though it's weird to say it, there's a sense of formality in a tournament. No one wants to play against someone who looks and smells like ****. It's too distracting and it gives people a bad impression of the person who looks and smells like ****.

I don't think the OP is saying to dress business casual or anything, just don't look like you just finished playing football in the rain.

@OP
I honestly think you'd have to do more to increase the entertainment factor. IMO, Brawl's just not entertaining to watch period because of the slow paced nature of the game. Some may like that, but I get bored with it and the eight minute matches (meaning nearly half an hour at most for match sets).
 

Kholdstare

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#12
>people who can't afford everyday showers

Most people who have bad hygiene simply are too lazy to take a shower everyday. Or use deodorant. Or brush their teeth. Or wash their clothes.
 

Sky`

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#14
If you can afford to go to a tournament, you can take a shower.

And Brawl is Very entertaining. If anybody remembers Fiction vs MikeHAZE, that was one of the most entertaining matches ever, second to Nick Riddle vs Ally.
 
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#15
This is now a Brawl hygene thread. :troll:

On a serious note concerning entertainment, some find Brawl to be entertaining even with MK's plank shinanigans while others don't, so regardless, you're gonna have your critics whether MK's banned or not.

As for hygene, I've been to my fair share of cons and even a Brawl tourney, and didn't have to deal with bad smells, so you're (the OP) just probably plain unlucky to always be near people who have never heard the word "soap" and would rather live their lives wolfin' up a storm. That said, I was at a con recently last month; Connecticon. There, I went to a rave party. It was alright for a rave. Not like Anime Boston's, but decent... and oh my god, it felt like the smell manifested into a balled up fist and suckerpunched me in the face! Though, in all fairness, I suppose the humidity, sweat, and the sheer amount of people who filled the room contributed heavily. Still, if that's the kind of smell you have to deal with at every tourney, then yeah, I support enforcing a hygene rule.

Now as for the BBR controlling every aspect of the ruleset, I gave that post of yours some thought, and honestly, I have to agree. I mean, there's really nothing wrong with the ruleset now, but you bring up the interesting point of expanding and perhaps making a more refined and flexible ruleset created by SWF as a community rather than as only a few specially chosen "elites". I guess the reason they have the backroom in the first place is to prevent people from going in with half-baked or stupid posts, like "omg we should totally allow Flat Zone because its so awesum a stage and is random fun". Yeah, that's an extreme example, but realistic nonetheless. Oh well...
 

Starphoenix

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#16
You mean to tell me the other fighting communities are more hygienic? I've seen some of those guys, they take their own towels... I don't know, it just seems like a very strange complaint to me. Than again I haven't actually attended one so I have no idea what the atmosphere is like.
 

Psychoace

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#17
Dude evo was ****ing dank as ****...to say 1500 people in one room didn't smell is ********. There was also so much **** talking, even on the stream. Kidevu talks so much **** it's unreal. The only thing we have to worry about it whether or not mvd will cut his hair anytime soon lol.

I'd be down with another brawl evo run, if they followed our rulesets and we came to a decision on planking.
 
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#18
This is gonna get locked. ._.

Somebody should make Hygene Boards for the crowd so they can share some TMIs.

For celestia's sake. >.>
 

Jonas

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#19
Really? We're not accepted by EVO or don't have sponsors because we smell?

Most Smash tournaments I've been to have been kind of ghetto so it's not like I always have the option to be fresh out of the shower wearing clean clothes before each match. I can sort of see your point if attendees are staying at a hotel or something, but do you honestly think we're the only fighting game community who doesn't smell like roses during tournaments?
 
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#20
YOU GUYS ARE COMPLAINING MEANINGLESS ****.

Just take a bath, clean your whole body, Old Spice your armpits, AXE your armpits and chest, look swagg or fly or whatever! (Shirts, Jeans, Socks, Shoes). Put Perfume!

You are now clean.

I'm a teenaged boy! So why the heck are you all complaining? It's like y'all jealous of stink.​
 

NeoBatou

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#21
Dude evo was ****ing dank as ****...to say 1500 people in one room didn't smell is ********. There was also so much **** talking, even on the stream. Kidevu talks so much **** it's unreal. The only thing we have to worry about it whether or not mvd will cut his hair anytime soon lol.

I'd be down with another brawl evo run, if they followed our rulesets and we came to a decision on planking.
Oh there's ALWAYS a ton of shi* talking at EVO man. I love that atmosphere...especially when you get to prove people wrong and shut their ***** mouths after winning.

The hygiene ordeal, just deal with it. I know it's unbearable sometimes.....but you'll find a way over it. It doesn't really affect your concentration that much if you REALLY concentrating. If you must, get a can of fabreeze to your tournaments if you want to do something about it.

As far as EVO is concerned, I think we do fine without EVO's popularity. We have Apex, Genesis, WHOBO, things like that. We have plenty of representation. We don't need EVO IMO.
 

Supreme Dirt

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#22
YOU GUYS ARE COMPLAINING MEANINGLESS ****.

Just take a bath, clean your whole body, Old Spice your armpits, AXE your armpits and chest, look swagg or fly or whatever! (Shirts, Jeans, Socks, Shoes). Put Perfume!

You are now clean.

I'm a teenaged boy! So why the heck are you all complaining? It's like y'all jealous of stink.​
I'm allergic to Axe.

Otherwise you have it right.
 

-Ran

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#24
BBR has no say in the RC ruleset. The RC ruleset has been receiving significant use. Usually the tournaments that are posted on the board, we see around 70% or greater each week in utilization. Smash is unique compared to other games, since we have to focus on the creation of a rule set. We have challenges that others don't have. Prior to the RC, we had no formal ruleset. We had recommendations, and that was really the end of it.

Though, some believe that the RC is some dictatorship, it isn't. Unlike the BBR, we don't have a gag order on what we're doing. We just can't give specifics on who said what, etc. We're freely allowed to say what we're discussing with members of our community, so that we can input. At the end of the day, the TOs that form the RC are doing what we feel is best for our community. We're trying to transition from the tribe mentality that Smash has had over all its life.
 

SmashChu

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#26
This thread has boiled down to looking at the hygen and "Herp de derp, Melee is teh better." No surprise, nothing will get done.

OP has the right idea. The thing is that in order to bring Smash Brothers back in competitive light would be totally rethinking Smash Brothers. People will hate me for saying this, but items are one thing that needs to be looked at. Most players who play this game use items and default rules have items on medium and Smash Balls are a big part of the game. People will always find the matches without items boring. This is one idea.

The big picture is rethinking Smash and get more in touch with the disenfranchised players that competitive Smash has alienated over the years.
 
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#27
^ if we are able to someone in some way create a solid rule set that utilizes item and make it the "standard" way to play i think we would gain a lot more support from different kinds of players as well as support from the Nintendo and maybe even Sakurai as he himself has stated he prefers the game to be played using items.

I know many are against the idea but what do we have to lose? It' not like if it doesn't work out we can't just go back to the way things were before.
 

Revven

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#28
This thread has boiled down to looking at the hygen and "Herp de derp, Melee is teh better." No surprise, nothing will get done.

OP has the right idea. The thing is that in order to bring Brawl back in competitive light would be totally rethinking Brawl. People will hate me for saying this, but items are one thing that needs to be looked at. Most players who play this game use items and default rules have items on medium and Smash Balls are a big part of the game. People will always find the matches without items boring. This is one idea.

The big picture is rethinking Brawl and get more in touch with the disenfranchised players that competitive Brawl has alienated over the years.
Fixed.

Really, Melee already has a well established competitive scene without items. Throwing items back into it doesn't make any sense when you have no control over containers being on/off, thus randomly exploding capsules/crates are able to occur and ruin competition.


Your suggestion really does only apply to Brawl. It's not Smash in general, both 64/Melee did not create this huge "issue" or "disconnect" with the other communities. Brawl came out in 2008, Brawl was the only Smash game that was mainly going to be featured at EVO, Brawl players didn't want items on so they got into a huge argument with Mr. Wizard and co., items still remained, the tournament for Brawl there wasn't spectacular by any means but also wasn't a total travesty (though it was very LULZY), and then people still wanted to argue with the fighting game community and... then they set the bias for Smash in general from there. That's primarily where all the hate comes from or originates from because the Brawl community didn't want to test items for awhile first whereas originally for the first couple of months to maybe even a year Melee actually had item tournaments.

People will always find the matches without items boring.
This too also only applies to Brawl. Melee is very technical and fast paced so rarely do you find any match of it with items off to be "boring". The only matches in the last year or so that have been "boring" were Hbox vs. Armada when Armada was Young Link and Armada vs Taj when it was Peach vs Mewtwo. All those characters have a few things in common, but the main thing is: they all don't fall as fast as space animals do thus combos are shorter, KOs take longer, and gimps are harder. Even still though, those matches can be entertaining because of the technicality the players are displaying (Taj's Mewtwo for example).

With Brawl, the most hype you get out of a match without items is how well someone DI'd a move while being at an extremely high %.. Which to me, personally, isn't exciting at all because DI is easy in Brawl (it is more forgiving than in Melee). Oh and I guess you could count who gets hit and the crowd goes wild over a single hit or two. Would items add to the entertainment? It really depends on what items are on but in my mind all I would see is a lot more camping for really good items and then throwing them at the opponent at the right time instead of actually using them (see: throwing the Homerun Bat is better/safer than actually using its jab, tilt, and smash variations). When Brawl is already a huge campfest in general (sorry to say that but it's really all I ever see whenever I watch it).

So really, it's not Smash in general that needs "rethinking", it's Brawl that needs "rethinking" and to be quite honest I'm not sure if even "rethinking" it can save its public face that the fighting game community has for it. The damage has already been done you might as well move on and not care what the fighting game community thinks of it.

Sakurai set out to make a game that allowed "everyone to win" and he still has that belief going into Smash 4 (there was a quick quote posted this week with him stating what he's always thought since Brawl). Not sure what everyone has been hoping for in the last 3 years the game has been out but there hasn't been some "super secret" technique that makes the game much more interesting to watch. All there's been found is a way to abuse the ledge and camp even harder with a character that was already a tyrant early on in the game's life; further solidifying its competitive scene as being skewed towards everyone needing a pocket MK (gross exaggeration but truthfully the tier list has barely changed...)

With tactics like that and the overall disagreement between the two communities it's no wonder they have this profound dislike for Smash (though really as far as I have read it's mainly the Brawl scene that the fighting game community hates).
 

AlphaZealot

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#29
The FGC dislikes the entire Smash community. Not just Brawl. The Melee community tries to do its best to let the FGC know Brawl and Melee are different every time there is any talk about Smash, and then the FGC basically just laughs because they simply don't care at all about either game. This is not a new "problem" as it dates back to roughly 2004.

The chasm between the FGC and the Smash community has worked to our benefit. Due to a lack of backing from EVO we got picked up by MLG, and MLG has to date put in a good ~$150,000-$250,000 into the community, including $70,000 in prizes last year for Brawl. Consider this: last year for MLG Dallas, $35,000 was given out to the top 8. In order to EVO to give out that same number amount in prizes, they would need 3,500 attendees, or a little more than double what their top attended game got this year. Smashers have (both Brawl and Melee) made more over the life of their games then any other fighting game (largely thanks to MLG but also due to our absurd number of underground tournaments).
 

Strong Badam

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#30
evo picked up Melee in 2007 and Brawl in 2008
quit Brawl pretty quickly when they learned how scrubby the Brawl community was. whining about items, trying to invalidate CPU's win over Ken due to his intelligent use of items. Meleers had to test them for years before they banned him. Brawl was a different game with different items, why did the players think they could just skip that process? that's the main reason the normal fighting game community dislikes Smash.

the general age difference between brawlers and other fighting games is also significant. there's a different maturity level in the different communities and it's because smash attracts younger audiences. there's nothing inherently wrong with that but it does cause issues.
 

Mr.C

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#31
evo picked up Melee in 2007 and Brawl in 2008
quit Brawl pretty quickly when they learned how scrubby the Brawl community was. whining about items, trying to invalidate CPU's win over Ken due to his intelligent use of items. Meleers had to test them for years before they banned him. Brawl was a different game with different items, why did the players think they could just skip that process? that's the main reason the normal fighting game community dislikes Smash.

the general age difference between brawlers and other fighting games is also significant. there's a different maturity level in the different communities and it's because smash attracts younger audiences. there's nothing inherently wrong with that but it does cause issues.
I've been apart of the Melee competitive scene since 2004, I've kept track of the competitive scene since 2003 and I cannot recall a single major tournament that used items.

Items are terrible for this game, they're terrible for Melee and they're terrible for any other competitive fighting game.
 
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#32
Just because you can't recall any prior to when you started keeping in touch with the melee scene doesn't mean anytime before that they had item tournaments. I personally enjoy using items as i find a lot of skill to be found in needing to adapt to which item is thrown onto the field and thinking up of ways to use it to my advantage along with the stage. Like for example if a unira spawns i think about where i could place it to best limit my opponents movement and also how i can use it to setup for a strong attack. Or i could simply throw it away off stage to above my opponent from using it.

There are alot of underlying things that have strategic and competitive value through using items. They help keep the match fresh and although sure you can camp and wait out the specific item you want but chances are your going to ether get hit or get KO'd by your opponent who would rather just pick up any old item an use it to deal damage. Brawl's is currently very defensive the way we're playing it. I think things would become at the very least a little bit more offensive driven. You would get punished harder for just simply camping and planking due to the constant occurrence of knowing good items like smart or gooey bombs or even smash balls could show up.

While items don't fix all of the problems brawl faces i think it fixes a few major ones.
 

SmashChu

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#33
^ if we are able to someone in some way create a solid rule set that utilizes item and make it the "standard" way to play i think we would gain a lot more support from different kinds of players as well as support from the Nintendo and maybe even Sakurai as he himself has stated he prefers the game to be played using items.

I know many are against the idea but what do we have to lose? It' not like if it doesn't work out we can't just go back to the way things were before.
I've argued this point a lot, but I can now say (that'm I'm older and less of a little snot) that, at the very least, try it. Melee could get away with it because they at least had a reason. What made it silly in Brawl was that they straight up adopted Melee's rules despite it was fixed in Brawl. If there is at least a good reason as opposed to "Well, they are random, so ehh."

Oh course, the first step is to try and appeal to the disenfranchised players. At least get them behind or, at at least not against you.

Really, Melee already has a well established competitive scene without items. Throwing items back into it doesn't make any sense when you have no control over containers being on/off, thus randomly exploding capsules/crates are able to occur and ruin competition.
That's fine. Melee at least had a reason. Of course, the problem is Melee is an old hat and Brawl is the focus until the next game comes out. This is where your growth lies. Let Melee be Melee. It's time has come and gone.


Your suggestion really does only apply to Brawl. It's not Smash in general, both 64/Melee did not create this huge "issue" or "disconnect" with the other communities.
The bigger issue is that there was "issues" within the game's own fanbase. Smash as an E-Sport will never grow if it's own fanbase think's it's a joke. And we did see it as a joke in 2004 and so on. It doesn't matter what other fighting game communities think if your own fanbase hates you. That is where the problem really started and it was a Melee problem.

Brawl came out in 2008, Brawl was the only Smash game that was mainly going to be featured at EVO, Brawl players didn't want items on so they got into a huge argument with Mr. Wizard and co., items still remained, the tournament for Brawl there wasn't spectacular by any means but also wasn't a total travesty (though it was very LULZY), and then people still wanted to argue with the fighting game community and... then they set the bias for Smash in general from there. That's primarily where all the hate comes from or originates from because the Brawl community didn't want to test items for awhile first whereas originally for the first couple of months to maybe even a year Melee actually had item tournaments.
Fact is no one BUT Melee fans make the distinction between the players. Everyone is a Smash player and that fact will remain the same. That is how it is seen If something happens in Brawl, it effects everyone. It's also important to note that those "Brawl," players were actually "Melee," players. Brawl only came out months before and that was it's first real tournament. It was Melee players who took the rule set and plopped it into Brawl. If Brawl was it's own entity, it would have it's own rules and reasons behind it, not Melee's reasons.

So really, it's not Smash in general that needs "rethinking", it's Brawl that needs "rethinking" and to be quite honest I'm not sure if even "rethinking" it can save its public face that the fighting game community has for it. The damage has already been done you might as well move on and not care what the fighting game community thinks of it.
I'm going to say that this thinking will kill Smash brothers. Not Brawl. Not some other game. Smash Brothers.

No one makes the distinction. No one else finds the matches different between Melee and Brawl and among the fanbase, most of them find ti boring (Fox only, Final Destination ring a bell?) Brawl's problems are Melee's problems as Brawl's player base grew from Melee. All Smash Brother's have the same "face," and that face is awful.

SRK had a thread where they clearly explained why the hate the Smash community. They clearly said they hate the SMASH community. Not the game. Not the Brawl community. The Smash community. The only people who want to make it two communities are the Melee players (yet they all post on the same few sites). A big thing that does need to change is trying to play off that Melee it's own thing when it's clearly not. If Smash Brothers is to grow, than this game of spliting games into sectors has to stop. It's not doing any good and it's just a way to throw other players (many who were Melee players) under the bus.

With tactics like that and the overall disagreement between the two communities it's no wonder they have this profound dislike for Smash (though really as far as I have read it's mainly the Brawl scene that the fighting game community hates).
Than we are not reading the same thing. The distinction only comes in when Melee players try to make it, and that goes for every thread here and on SRK. I'll say it again: trying to make a split will not help anyone nor does anyone outside of Melee players care.

Strong Bad made a good analysis, both on EVO and the age gap. The one thing Smash should do is encouraging a code of ethics, if only to try and shrink the maturity gap. Set ways people should act in tournaments and on other sites. People will respect Smash players if they have this.

One example of something was on the last State of the Game episode (Starcraft 2 BTW). They mentioned that people were booing the Halo champions (who did really well). Many of the Pros thought that was wrong and think Starcraft fans should stop that behavior. Similar things should go on in Smash (maybe not the same instance, but you get the idea). One thing they did well was punish M2K and Ally (I believe it was Ally. Correct me if I'm wrong) for what happened at MLG. If people are going to act in a bad way, at least make them accountable.
 

Steam

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#34
It was M2K and ADHD at MLG that got punished.

and really, half the people from other communities just hate on us because it's popular/to legitimize their own. a vast majority of them have never actually been with members of the smash community yet they just rip on it because others do. They criticize us for using items but have never really played the game to understand why they're banned. I wonder how they'd react if in street fighter cody's knives fell from the sky, could be picked up by anyone, and did 25% of someone's health and were unblockable. I wonder if they'd ban that if they could...

smash is doing very well competitively for a game that wasn't really made to be a competitive fighter and wasn't rebalanced over and over (at the cost of buying yet another game)
 

NeoBatou

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#35
smash is doing very well competitively for a game that wasn't really made to be a competitive fighter and wasn't rebalanced over and over (at the cost of buying yet another game)
I agree with this argument. Since when do we need EVO to take brawl to the next level? We have our own national/region/local events ALL the time and we have just as much popularity as Street Fighter or Marvel. I really don't see the point of trying to push brawl into EVO...when EVO's main attraction is Street Fighter. If you want brawl to be on the forefront, make your own big events. People will show up to watch and tons of players will show up to play.
 

SmashChu

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#36
and really, half the people from other communities just hate on us because it's popular/to legitimize their own. a vast majority of them have never actually been with members of the smash community yet they just rip on it because others do. They criticize us for using items but have never really played the game to understand why they're banned. I wonder how they'd react if in street fighter cody's knives fell from the sky, could be picked up by anyone, and did 25% of someone's health and were unblockable. I wonder if they'd ban that if they could...
That's not it at all. There was a thread not to long ago where SF players say they hate the community because of the way they act. They disagree with the item bans because they understand why Melee banned them. Melee banned items because you couldn't turn off exploding capsules. You can in Brawl. But now the argument makes no sense.

I agree with this argument. Since when do we need EVO to take brawl to the next level? We have our own national/region/local events ALL the time and we have just as much popularity as Street Fighter or Marvel. I really don't see the point of trying to push brawl into EVO...when EVO's main attraction is Street Fighter. If you want brawl to be on the forefront, make your own big events. People will show up to watch and tons of players will show up to play.
You need events like MLG and EVO because they are transparent. No one really cares about Smash Brother's own events. You wont grow by having your own events. You need to be seen more, which means going to events like MLG or EVO.
 

NeoBatou

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#37
You need events like MLG and EVO because they are transparent. No one really cares about Smash Brother's own events. You wont grow by having your own events. You need to be seen more, which means going to events like MLG or EVO.
You can grow by having your own events, but you can expand to a larger scene with bigger events at other venues....so you have a point.
 

Mr.C

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#38
That's not it at all. There was a thread not to long ago where SF players say they hate the community because of the way they act. They disagree with the item bans because they understand why Melee banned them. Melee banned items because you couldn't turn off exploding capsules. You can in Brawl. But now the argument makes no sense.
Random spawns, random power through items, and most of the time the higher tier characters use items better than anyone else. Exploding capsules are not the only reason why items are banned, they're banned because they do nothing for game play outside of ruining it.

Let other communities think what they want, they have absolutely no idea how this game is played and they have absolutely no idea what effect items have on game play. If SF had items randomly spawning all over the map would they ban that nonsense? Guaran****ingteed.

Items will never be respected by anyone that is good in this community and items will never be used in any respectable tournament ran by people that understand this game. It doesn't really matter what a bunch of casuals say, it doesn't really matter what a bunch of Street Fighter players say because it's not going to change anything.

You need events like MLG and EVO because they are transparent. No one really cares about Smash Brother's own events. You wont grow by having your own events. You need to be seen more, which means going to events like MLG or EVO.
This community has had way more tournaments than any other fighting game and has had way higher pay outs than any other fighting game. While coverage from MLG/EVO is a bonus, it isn't going to change the fact we have hundreds of dedicated TO's running tournaments that have 50-200 people consistently every other week.
 

Djent

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 6, 2010
Messages
2,606
Location
Under The Three Spheres
#39
It's not even the fact that we "ban" items, it's that we shun people who prefer them. If SWF had been less aggressive about snuffing out ISP in the early days of Brawl, I'm willing to bet we could have coexisted peacefully with SRK despite a difference in ideology.
 

SmashChu

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 14, 2003
Messages
5,784
Location
Tampa FL
#40
You can grow by having your own events, but you can expand to a larger scene with bigger events at other venues....so you have a point.
Thinking on it, I think what your saying would be OK if Smash players cared more about competitive Smash. The player base is big enough to do their own tournaments, but the competitive community is too small.

Random spawns, random power through items, and most of the time the higher tier characters use items better than anyone else. Exploding capsules are not the only reason why items are banned, they're banned because they do nothing for game play outside of ruining it.
Explosive capsules were the main reason. Randomness was always a side reason. More so that the competitive community got the mindset of "No items," rather than looking at what makes sense. The banning of items as created a lot of flak for competitive Smash, even from their own fanbase. It is time to relook at it.

Also, not sure how you know it benefits the top when no one has used them in tournaments.

Let other communities think what they want, they have absolutely no idea how this game is played and they have absolutely no idea what effect items have on game play. If SF had items randomly spawning all over the map would they ban that nonsense? Guaran****ingteed.
The games are totally different, so it's bad hearsay anyway. In fact, SRK has done most of the item testing and believe they will work. Even still, Smash needs to be looked at as Smash, not Street Fighter Lite.

Items will never be respected by anyone that is good in this community and items will never be used in any respectable tournament ran by people that understand this game. It doesn't really matter what a bunch of casuals say, it doesn't really matter what a bunch of Street Fighter players say because it's not going to change anything.
The point of what I'm writing is that Smash needs to grow. You can ignore everyone and stay in your bubble, but the result is the games will die due to lack of new players and further splintering of the games. The point is to try and change or else the community dies. I think some people see it.

This community has had way more tournaments than any other fighting game and has had way higher pay outs than any other fighting game. While coverage from MLG/EVO is a bonus, it isn't going to change the fact we have hundreds of dedicated TO's running tournaments that have 50-200 people consistently every other week.
The problem is no one cares. More isn't better if no one is willing to watch you play or join in. The problem with competitive Smash is that it's isolated. Everything is set up for competitive people and is not welcoming of new players. These big tournaments will get the name of Smash out their and would encourage people to join it. It is transparent. Small tournaments do nothing as the only people who care are those already in the inner circle.

Also, prize pools are comparable. EVO and MLG payed about the same, given EVO is a pot play.
 
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