Etrian Nomination Mafia - Endgame: Until the Day the Adventurers Rise Again

[Dooms]

I get that he's "controlling" the town, but generally scum attempts at controlling the town involve strong-manning things and limiting discussion in specific spots instead of trying to get everyone involved. While I think you can "fake" this, I don't think it's beneficial to do so. The only time I recall Laundry actually limiting discussion was saying that we couldn't lynch Z, which made sense because we were right next to deadline and the vote count gave us two options.

To clarify on bolded, I think it is beneficial to fake this to some extent, but I do not think it's beneficial to not strong-man the town at all and to let town do its thing with minimal influence.

Biggest example here is that with his reads, I have had no reason to "follow" Laundry. I generally agree with his reads, but that's not because they're his reads, it's because we've just agreed on things. I've never felt pressured by Laundry to follow him, even near deadline. He's not being very demanding and I genuinely feel like he's much too open with people having their own reads for me to put him into the "controlling town as scum" pile.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

He's not being very demanding and I genuinely feel like he's much too open with people having their own reads for me to put him into the "controlling town as scum" pile.

All he's done is yell at me, berate me, misconstrue my opinions and @ Ryker at anytime he gets frustrated with me scumreading his approach.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

So when Laundry mislynches two people now (Shish, Me) will you all stop praising him as if he's been the driving force of positivity in this game lmao

Newpage quoting for posterity

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Back to this actually

Vote: Laundry

THUNDERDOME BABY

MARSHY ARE U WATCHING

 

[Dooms]

All he's done is yell at me, berate me, misconstrue my opinions and @ Ryker at anytime he gets frustrated with me scumreading his approach.

So like are you ignoring Day 1/2 and 3 before your AtE entirely or do you really feel like he hasn't done anything at all this game?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

So like are you ignoring Day 1/2 and 3 before your AtE entirely or do you really feel like he hasn't done anything at all this game?

His Day 1 was fine, really I was townreading him D1 much like you, but his Nomination Phase 1 lacks any sort of resolve he had in D1 and instead he posts content to get by.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Joey, if you're town, and you see me flip green..can you promise to make Laundry play this game instead of comfortably sitting back, writing some kind of paragraph he won't follow up on nor use to actually read the people he is seemingly concerned with, and pressure him further? There is a possibility to be wrong, however I believe in his current state he is very conceited and I wasn't pleased in the way he kept trying to deflect with me. I don't know what got in his head that makes him above me but it didn't help, and if there's something you need to look at it's how EVERY TIME I come at him with criticism he wants to undermine my arguments and focus on me looking foolish instead of engaging with me to understand why I am making them, or why I would make them as town or even scum.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'm town like I've said many times so GL

So when Laundry mislynches two people now (Shish, Me) will you all stop praising him as if he's been the driving force of positivity in this game lmao

Can you ****ing stop with this before I lose it again.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Soup: Laundry, you're scum for [reason].

Laundry: *Puts on reading glasses, sits down in armchair* Ugh, soup. You have to understand that Town has to incentivize their play by constantly contributing in such a manner that is town. If you're not posting your thoughts then you're not letting town know what you're doing because then they don't understand. This is simple Mafia stuff and I have been doing that all game, posting my thoughts and contributions like a townie would. It's important to remember that I am town and doing things that are townie, therefore you have no reason to scumread me. Ugh, @ Ryker, please tell this neanderthal he is wrong....

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I don't mind the Nabe direction, Disfunkshunal . If I didn't want to solve for Soup/Z25, I think that's where I'd be over Ruy. What do you make of Ruy over the course of this game.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Can you ****ing stop with this before I lose it again.

I'm just saying man!! None of this is AtE lmao

 

[Dooms]

Soup can we talk about your argument then before this phase is over?You know I don't see Laundry scum, so I'm not going to act like I'll flip on him if you're town. I definitely will reconsider and re-read the slot regardless of you flipping today or not, though.

I don't need you to repeat your argument, but focusing on the idea that he isn't contributing and that he isn't actively engaging with his reads, do you think you're the biggest example? Do you have any other specifics in mind aside from yourself, or is it mostly the way he handles your slot?

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

That and your entire mock Laundry shtick is definitely AtE. Your reasoning for calling him scum is shallow and you're currently trying to weasel your way into a lynch by implying that people will be sorry if they lynch you and reiterating that the Laundry Illuminati is running this game. Don't let them control your thoughts!

**** off with that.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Soup can we talk about your argument then before this phase is over?You know I don't see Laundry scum, so I'm not going to act like I'll flip on him if you're town. I definitely will reconsider and re-read the slot regardless of you flipping today or not, though.

I don't need you to repeat your argument, but focusing on the idea that he isn't contributing and that he isn't actively engaging with his reads, do you think you're the biggest example? Do you have any other specifics in mind aside from yourself, or is it mostly the way he handles your slot?

I have to admit that it is very annoying (in general) that SWF tends to not let people just air out their feelings and say something off-the-cuff and demand thorough procolomation such as a case or a huge wall. What I'm saying is how I feel, and creating a wall, bigger case etc. would just be an overblown statement, and believe me, I have tried to do so this game and hell even ****ing Z25 is trying to do that this game and I don't remember him pulling out walls in PYP.

That and your entire mock Laundry shtick is definitely AtE. Your reasoning for calling him scum is shallow and you're currently trying to weasel your way into a lynch by implying that people will be sorry if they lynch you and reiterating that the Laundry Illuminati is running this game. Don't let them control your thoughts!

**** off with that.

Nah, I'm just humoring myself and being dramatic for effect

 

[Dooms]

I don't want a wall. I just want examples of him doing this to slots aside from yourself from your perspective. You don't even need to ex: bring out a lot of quotes. If you have examples off of the top of your head, great. If you don't, just say that and I'll look back and answer it myself.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I have to admit that it is very annoying (in general) that SWF tends to not let people just air out their feelings and say something off-the-cuff and demand thorough procolomation such as a case or a huge wall. What I'm saying is how I feel, and creating a wall, bigger case etc. would just be an overblown statement, and believe me, I have tried to do so this game and hell even ****ing Z25 is trying to do that this game and I don't remember him pulling out walls in PYP.

This **** is also horse ****. I want people to air out whatever. I don't care if they're right. I care that their logic follows. I care that they let me know why they don't like something so if it doesn't line up with how they act later I can hit them. I think Disfunk is town right now and I haven't ****ing buried him for his trash garbage Z25 read.

No, you can't sit there and proclaim to the world that 3K/Disfunk is scum, then ****ing blow it off and instead hint Laundry is scum, then expect not to catch blowback. What? **** outta here.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I don't want a wall. I just want examples of him doing this to slots aside from yourself from your perspective. You don't even need to ex: bring out a lot of quotes. If you have examples off of the top of your head, great. If you don't, just say that and I'll look back and answer it myself.

#1,230

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

You can't honestly tell me your **** don't stink.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

This **** is also horse ****. I want people to air out whatever. I don't care if they're right. I care that their logic follows. I care that they let me know why they don't like something so if it doesn't line up with how they act later I can hit them. I think Disfunk is town right now and I haven't ****ing buried him for his trash garbage Z25 read.

No, you can't sit there and proclaim to the world that 3K/Disfunk is scum, then ****ing blow it off and instead hint Laundry is scum, then expect not to catch blowback. What? **** outta here.

My thoughts on 3K/Disfunk haven't changed because all I keep hearing is that I'm either wrong or disagreement but nobody has offered a counter-argument beyond that. I stopped talking about it because I was getting tired of repeating myself

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Bruh. What the ****? I pointed out exactly WHY I think you're wrong and you STILL haven't responded to me, but that isn't here nor there.

I'm talking about the end of last phase you kept hinting you had this huge push coming and then, when it came time to produce, you said you didn't feel like it. When pushed on the subject, you said in a one-liner that Laundry is scum. Don't move the ****ing goal posts here.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Here's what I see from this day thus far:

soup scummy, he think Laundry bad
Uhhh lynch Z25 I guess? he scummy


That's the only consensus I've seen throughout that I feel is some kinda commonplace agreement. A lot of other thoughts are scattered. Do you disagree? At some point we've gotta get off this wheel

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

There's been conversation about Nabe. Ruy has FINALLY involved himself with the game.

At the end of the day, no, I don't think we have to get off this wheel because I think this is a scum lynch and they think they're ****ed if they don't avert it. I think you're trying to dig out and I'm not gonna hand you a shovel.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Bruh. What the ****? I pointed out exactly WHY I think you're wrong and you STILL haven't responded to me, but that isn't here nor there.

I'm talking about the end of last phase you kept hinting you had this huge push coming and then, when it came time to produce, you said you didn't feel like it. When pushed on the subject, you said in a one-liner that Laundry is scum. Don't move the ****ing goal posts here.

Your other alternatives being Nabe/Ryu correct? I saw what you said, acknowledged you didn't agree and left it as that. Why am I not pushing 3K/Disfunk anymore? Because nobody was into it, and yeah right now nobody seems to agree on Laundry besides Nabe maybe but hey it beats uhh beating a dead horse. I needed a new perspective and I said that **** because I was pleading to get some freedback, but I'm not that ****ing callous. I said it to you before and I'll say it again: We disagree, that's fine. You agree Z25 is scummy and perhaps Nabe. I am 100% down with lynching Z25 with no predujice following Nabe as a compromise.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

I don't mind the Nabe direction, Disfunkshunal . If I didn't want to solve for Soup/Z25, I think that's where I'd be over Ruy. What do you make of Ruy over the course of this game.

I've thrown out most of his D2 content because the majority was asking questions that had been answered while he was catching up. I appreciate his reads but I he hasn't said anything that's made me consider anything in a different light, nor has he brought up anything that hasn't really been considered. Because of that, he hasn't won me over as town but I do appreciate his contributions.

I disagree with his Z25 push but I fully understand it. He pretty much said he finds soup suspicious but instead of voting for him, chose to temporarily dissuade me from the wagon with a Nabe lynch. I agree with this push but on a Nabe town flip, Ryu looks much worse to me. By extension, on a Nabe scum flip, he looks much better.

I feel pretty confident that Soup is scum but I believe I can get more information from a Nabe flip than a Soup one.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I was on board with that post until the final comment.

Aside from Ruy, what do you get on a Nabe flip? Because Nabe has been an absolute nonfactor and almost everyone has taken a stance one way or another on Soup.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Z25 sure shut the **** up this phase, huh?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

vote: Z25

Self-preservation again, its worth a shot lol

 

[Disfunkshunal]

I was on board with that post until the final comment.

Aside from Ruy, what do you get on a Nabe flip? Because Nabe has been an absolute nonfactor and almost everyone has taken a stance one way or another on Soup.

Everyone else, with the exception of Z25, has mentioned being on board with lynching Soup at some point this phase. It boils down to wine but I don't see Soup spending all D1 defending a scum partner and then that same partner defending him D3. I don't buy it. Aside from that, who else do we turn to on a Soup scum flip?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I. Never. Defended. Z25. Lmao.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

It was an overstatement to say that I'd get more from Nabe flip but I think it's at least accurate to say I get the same amount at worse. I also admit to having a bias against absent players

 

[Disfunkshunal]

I. Never. Defended. Z25. Lmao.

Graveyard

You're an unbiased party. I'd like to know where you all stand on this debate when we get back there.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

#HBC | Ryker that wasn't rhetorical btw. Where does a Soup scum flip lead you?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I feel like I want to go back on Soup with that jack and forth again.

ugggg.

this emotional pulling is really getting to me because if he is scum I will 110% policy lynch Soup every game he is in and will reference this game and the other one he replaced our as scum as a “tactic”

i’m giving Zero quarter for it.

 

[Dooms]

It was an overstatement to say that I'd get more from Nabe flip but I think it's at least accurate to say I get the same amount at worse. I also admit to having a bias against absent players

What are you getting out of Nabe aside from lynching an inactive slot? I'm not jumping on that wagon atm because I don't get much of anything from it.

#1,230

I looked back, and the question I have is this: What do you expect Laundry to do with Nabe and Disfunk? Why would town Laundry do this differently than this scum read you have of him?

Looking back, at this time he had Nabe/Ryu/3K in PoE scum, me as town, and you as a scum read with Z. Nabe/Ryu go on any scum team but at the time they weren't here. IMO this type of list lines up with your logic pretty well if he was town (especially considering the wagon post was before Disfunk's catch-up, which I'd assume is what made Laundry town read the slot). Aside from yourself, what is the problem you have with this list?

 

[Disfunkshunal]

What are you getting out of Nabe aside from lynching an inactive slot? I'm not jumping on that wagon atm because I don't get much of anything from it.

[Ryu] pretty much said he finds soup suspicious but instead of voting for him, chose to temporarily dissuade me from the wagon with a Nabe lynch. I agree with this push but on a Nabe town flip, Ryu looks much worse to me. By extension, on a Nabe scum flip, he looks much better.

 

[Moydow]

Current vote count (as of post #1313):

• ѕoup: 2 (Laundry, Ryker)
• Red Ryu: 1 (Kantrip)
• Laundry: 1 (Z25)
• Z25: 2 (KY Joey, ѕoup)
• Nabe: 2 (Red Ryu, Disfunkshunal)

Not currently voting: Nabe

2 hours and 15 minutes remain in this phase. (posting now since I dunno if I'll be here again before deadline)
With 9 players alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.

 

[Dooms]

I'll concede on Ryu from a read perspective maybe, but not really from a meta perspective. Do you think that's comparable to what we'd get out of lynching Soup or Z?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

If Nabe is town i’m crewed but we’ll go from there.

Dooms walk with me talk with me, where do you stand on the laundry Illuminati idea? I’m not at all for it given how stuff has played out right now.

What is your ideal direction for today given a pool of Soup, Z25 and Nabe?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I’ll be around the next 2 hours to move my vote if need be.

 

[Z25]

Z25 sure shut the **** up this phase, huh?

I haven’t even been on lmao. Irl is a thing. Something you made damn sure I knew.

Now some thoughts.

Soup is interesting. His behavior is kind of unwarranted but if he’s town I can get why he’s frustrated. But the more I read these interactions I’m actually curious if your right on soup.

I also was thinking yesterday that the reason to he’s been defending me and then calling me scum is for paranoia purposes.

With his intention if scum to make sure I get lynched the next day sftet whenever he does because that’s where people’s thoughts would be based on his reactions.

I don’t know if that’s the case but it feels like something that could align with your analysis of him from past games. You’ve likely played more with him then I have.

But regardless I’ve been saying this but depending on soup or laundry’s flip we learn a lot.

Anyway:

Vote: Soup.


I don’t fully get what game your playing with me but I don’t like it. You were fine at first but this is just getting out of hand. I want info damn it and you’ll flip will give us a lot.