Commander_Beef
Smash Champion
Ignore this.
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Enemies of the Crown: King Dedede Matchup Thread (SERIN IS IN CHARGE NOW NOT GATES)
- Thread starter Gates
- Start date
Fogo
Smash Shinigami
If they did, i would get the link tatooed on my arm. That's how amazing it was.
Srsly. Florida DDDs **** on snakes for some reason lol Co knows what he's talking about. Snakes just whine about being chaingrabbed and say the match-up's **** because of it.
Hot_ArmS
Smash Hero
lol for real
Mikey7
Smash Lord
Vs a regular Snake its even
....then I played Ally a good amount of matches...I just get confused as to how this was even a good matchup for Dedede to begin with - Snake's got a small advantage
If you're off the edge, don't use up b low, it just gets grabbed. Now if you lose ALL of your jumps its an infinite grab to dthrow over and over again...this was learned by experience, its not fun at all lol
....then I played Ally a good amount of matches...I just get confused as to how this was even a good matchup for Dedede to begin with - Snake's got a small advantage
If you're off the edge, don't use up b low, it just gets grabbed. Now if you lose ALL of your jumps its an infinite grab to dthrow over and over again...this was learned by experience, its not fun at all lol
Commander_Beef
Smash Champion
You're able to input commands after the down throw at the edge you know...
The timing is easy.
The timing is easy.
Mikey7
Smash Lord
Yeah but the thing is if your jumps are all lost, most u can do its like forward air, which is an easy shield then you must up b again.
I'm really trying to find a way to get around this, I haven't given up yet
Commander_Beef
Smash Champion
Mikey...if we don't upB for recovery and we use all of our jumps, he shouldn't be able to grab us when we grab the ledge from below, and if we stupidly use all of our jumps and then grab the ledge while falling, Snake's grab range woudn't be long enough if we space ourselves then grab the ledge anyways. If you're super cautious at the situation, do an airdodge ahead of time while falling instead of doing the work of spacing yourself to grab the ledge. Time the airdodge correctly and you should be able to grab the ledge after the airdodge frames are done.
Mikey7
Smash Lord
Stupid responses like that are why I gave up looking at the character boards - mindless stupidity based on theory, back to not reading these again
CO18
Smash Hero
Im pretty sure you can nair if he's doing that. Im not sure whenever Im down thrown at the ledge I usually nair/ airdodge and end up making it safely. Or if hes doing grab attacks mash out fast into a jump release since youre over the ledge then youll be high enough so he cant do it anymore.
Dark 3nergy
Smash Hero
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Would an air dodge off the ledge, after Falco's CG, work if you start seeing or are expecting the Dair animation?
Uh...Mikey i think commander beef and co18 are pretty much saying the same thing in essence.
Your saying your having problems recovering low with up+b well...all i can say is do not recover low with Dedede's up+b. It's just as dangerous as Snake recovering low with HIS up+b. Dedede has 4 jumps, and you should try using each jump after you reach the apex height of the previous jump used. Up+b...only as a very very last resort. Dedede's movement speed in the air is pretty slow when hes not fast falling...so use his slow speed to stall abit, camp in the air and wait to see if your opponent is impatient enough to come after you below the ledge. Like beef said, Snake is too tall to grab people at the same level as the platform. If you can use jumps to get yourself to sweet spot the ledge thats your best option.
Uh...Mikey i think commander beef and co18 are pretty much saying the same thing in essence.
Your saying your having problems recovering low with up+b well...all i can say is do not recover low with Dedede's up+b. It's just as dangerous as Snake recovering low with HIS up+b. Dedede has 4 jumps, and you should try using each jump after you reach the apex height of the previous jump used. Up+b...only as a very very last resort. Dedede's movement speed in the air is pretty slow when hes not fast falling...so use his slow speed to stall abit, camp in the air and wait to see if your opponent is impatient enough to come after you below the ledge. Like beef said, Snake is too tall to grab people at the same level as the platform. If you can use jumps to get yourself to sweet spot the ledge thats your best option.
If Snake is waiting to grab D3 from the air cant D3 air dodge into up tilt. I heard that up tilt comes out faster than the grab i haven't tested this but i have seen people do it successfully. Correct me if im wrong.
T3h Albino
Smash Master
its buffered utilt mang
you air dodge down and then input the utilt command quickly and as soon as you hit the ground utilt comes out.
atleast i think thats how it works lol ;B
you air dodge down and then input the utilt command quickly and as soon as you hit the ground utilt comes out.
atleast i think thats how it works lol ;B
Fogo
Smash Shinigami
If you time it right, I think you can always grab someone out of an air dodge, regardless of what move they try to buffer.
T3h Albino
Smash Master
yeah because grabs have super armor ;B
Vayseth
Smash Master
I think we should revisit some match ups that are especially difficult for DDD.
I say we revisit: ICs, Falco, Diddy and Metaknight. They seem to be DDD's hardest match ups (IMO) but I can't say I've ever played against a good Oli or Pika (I live by anther, but I rarely play him XD) but those could be included as well.
And believe it or not, I think we need to seriously revisit the snake match up.
I say we revisit: ICs, Falco, Diddy and Metaknight. They seem to be DDD's hardest match ups (IMO) but I can't say I've ever played against a good Oli or Pika (I live by anther, but I rarely play him XD) but those could be included as well.
And believe it or not, I think we need to seriously revisit the snake match up.
ICs are already scheduled for discussion and everyone else has been discussed twice. The metagame really hasn't changed for these matchups either.
That's what we're doing RIGHT NOW.
T3h Albino
Smash Master
lol 69
anyway ill post a wall of text on my opinion of the matchup later
IN THIS POST it will be an edit xD
ic's arent as bad as people make them seem for d3
just space yourself <__< and when you do get grabbed you'll probably be at a high percent anyway
anyway ill post a wall of text on my opinion of the matchup later
IN THIS POST it will be an edit xD
ic's arent as bad as people make them seem for d3
just space yourself <__< and when you do get grabbed you'll probably be at a high percent anyway
CRASHiC
Smash Hero
Ban FD. Platform camp worth hell. They will attempt some tricky dysynch tricks as they jump in air to get you off the platforms, this happens, abuse your great aerials to separate Nana, gimp Nana. Kill the single popo. You mustn't make a mistake. You must always keep track of their movements, abuse your range, watch out for the freeze attack ****. Don't go for a grab, don't do anything with heavy lag. Stick to dtilt, ftilt, utilt (though the range on this makes it risky) bair, and when you are platform camping, auto canceled dair. In reality, every move is a risk. Out of the neutrals, pray to god you get Smashville. You can abuse the moving platform for some major camping.
Also, if I could quote Co18 for a second, Nana love DDDs fmash.
Also, if I could quote Co18 for a second, Nana love DDDs fmash.
CRASHiC
Smash Hero
Wariooooooooo :_: Whyyyyyyyy?
Hot_ArmS
Smash Hero
lolz atomsk wants to main ic's now too
Teh Future
Smash Master
If you guys manage to seperate us you can kill either one easily by bthrow/fthrow off the stage followed by bairs. Pretty much a garanteed kill. The only the time you guys have the advantage is when ICs are off the stage. Sibe B has incredible mobility but if you space bairs correctly then thats one less stock. If they use upB to the stage you can run off and hit popo and their dead.
Waddle dees stop Ice blocks if you manage to get one on the ground it is good. ftilt is also good because of its ****** range just make sure they aren't close enough to punish it.
If you plan on camping platforms make sure you aren't predictable when landing because ICs upair shieldpokes/juggles/racks up damage extremely well.
If you do get grabbed mash like crazy at low percentages (<40) and you'll probably be able to get out
Waddle dees stop Ice blocks if you manage to get one on the ground it is good. ftilt is also good because of its ****** range just make sure they aren't close enough to punish it.
If you plan on camping platforms make sure you aren't predictable when landing because ICs upair shieldpokes/juggles/racks up damage extremely well.
If you do get grabbed mash like crazy at low percentages (<40) and you'll probably be able to get out
Fogo
Smash Shinigami
Ice climbers are pretty hard. I've beaten some, but if it's a player at an equal skill level you should really consider switching. I use lucario for them.
I love your avatar atomsk lol
I love your avatar atomsk lol
T3h Albino
Smash Master
player of = skill
i go gnw
this matchup is too stupid to warrant playing
I mean yeah i was saying before it's not as hard as people make it out.
but it's still dumb hard lol ;B
i go gnw
this matchup is too stupid to warrant playing
I mean yeah i was saying before it's not as hard as people make it out.
but it's still dumb hard lol ;B
meepxzero
Smash Master
its impossible for DDD to win if ic desynch and slowly approach.
desynch blizzard ~> grab ftw
desynch blizzard ~> grab ftw
Mackorony101
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2007
- Messages
- 69
Bleck
those G&W always get me
those G&W always get me
CRASHiC
Smash Hero
Well, yeah, we all want to main ICs, but that's the mother ****in cool kids club. Good luck gettin in. That ****'s members only.
Commander_Beef
Smash Champion
Okay...people, we're literally discussing the matchup and what small things we can do to overcome obstacles against ice climbers. Of course we all want to switch characters but I was expecting great information from atomsk and fogo who would rather switch characters.
The stuff that Crashic said may be a little more basic or logical but it's a great start and we can use that info nicely.
So I would like to add this. As gay as it sounds, we should do a little more air camping to these guys than Falco. And we should plank more with a control stick tilt to get off the ledge. They won't expect that.
Don't do inhale as much here, but still do it sparingly because it'll separate them easier than down airing because they'll probably shield. Only use sparingly because one climber will know to smash you.
For people who don't know, we will counterpick Norfair for this, but they'll normaly ban it. But counterpick it when possible.
The stuff that Crashic said may be a little more basic or logical but it's a great start and we can use that info nicely.
So I would like to add this. As gay as it sounds, we should do a little more air camping to these guys than Falco. And we should plank more with a control stick tilt to get off the ledge. They won't expect that.
Don't do inhale as much here, but still do it sparingly because it'll separate them easier than down airing because they'll probably shield. Only use sparingly because one climber will know to smash you.
For people who don't know, we will counterpick Norfair for this, but they'll normaly ban it. But counterpick it when possible.
Commander_Beef
Smash Champion
I'm well aware of that which is why you said to just switch characters, but do you have any information, tips or advice for this matchup disregarding player skill at all? I'm sure you do.
Fogo
Smash Shinigami
CO18
Smash Hero
I dunno. I dont think Ics are that terrible for Dedede but I havent played Meep or Lain yet. Ill try to get some matches in with lain @ genesis.
Umm...Very nice work has been done here. I've only seens ICs and G&W boards with finished match-ups. Basically, I'm posting because I'm working on a chart with every board in mind. A huge match-up chart with all the minds from the SWFs!
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=226315
Or did you have something else in mind?