Elma for Smash Ultimate: THANK YOU MIN MIN!!!!

RebelMaren

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 11, 2019
Messages
174
Location
Scotland
Uhh, you mind putting that in a spoiler tag? 'Cause that's a lot of text for something that's ultimately not directly related to either Xenoblade, or the characters from those games.
I appreciate that's it's not specifically about Elma, but I think it relates to alot of the issues that come up when discussing characters like her, and franchises like Xenoblade in Smash, and while this is an Elma thread, it's still in the speculation board. It's valuable to consider how we speculate, and why.
 
Joined
Oct 29, 2007
Messages
15,831
Location
Somewhere in the West.
So, what would one expect to do, sit there, do nothing at all, wait and hope to see if their character gets in if the big guys will it so?

As far as I see, the series fan demand does absolutely nothing for beyond bringing back veterans (apart from IPs that don't have much potential candidates to begin with) are F-Zero, Pokémon and Fire Emblem (maybe even Star Fox and Wario Ware, depending on how well those last later on). If they didn't care about what some fans wanted, they wouldn't even organise official polls and ballots in the first place. It was even outright said in the fine print of the Japanese site for 4's ballot that results may be considered for future games.

If anything, the hardcore fanbase constantly misses the big picture in regards to support; for every fan that wants Elma, there's likely a dozen more that are likelier to want Pauline or the Pokémon-starter-of-the-day instead.

We're not in the era of aiming strictly for casuals anymore, as the Switch aims for both young adults and younger kids, while still providing something for longtime veterans. Catering to consumers is one thing, but there's nothing to gain from completely alienating one specific group of consumers in favor of another. Balance is key. Smash is ostensibly a kids' game series, but still keeps in mind that it has an older audience that follows it, with some of the characters being for fans of games aimed at older audiences. And while there are characters added to prop up recent games, other ones would not have been there if there wasn't any demand for them. Then there's the ones added at the developer's own whimsy, if only to provide something a little more outside of the norm in regards to gameplay.
 
Last edited:

Calamitas

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
2,072
Location
Germany
I appreciate that's it's not specifically about Elma, but I think it relates to alot of the issues that come up when discussing characters like her, and franchises like Xenoblade in Smash, and while this is an Elma thread, it's still in the speculation board. It's valuable to consider how we speculate, and why.
And it's still a huge wall of text.
 

RebelMaren

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 11, 2019
Messages
174
Location
Scotland
So, what would one expect to do, sit there, do nothing at all, wait and hope to see if their character gets in if the big guys will it so?
I still think it's worth supporting the games and characters you love, and speculation is whatever you get out of it. If you enjoy the community around you then engage with them (that's why I'm mostly only in this thread, I genuinely like the culture around Elma's potential inclusion) or if you get a rush out of being able to guess newcomers correctly, then go for it, try to figure them out. For the most part though, yeah, you do just have to wait and see what happens, the fans don't control the direction of the game, but I believe they have some influence, and now and then, that's what'll put a character over the edge.
 

Aetheri

W/E happens don't panic...
Joined
Jan 13, 2015
Messages
7,358
Location
Mintendo Noodle House
Switch FC
SW-3397-5428-2304
Xenoblade's 10th anniversary being celebrated with art of all three games by CHOCO!
*sweating*
Damn, Elma! W-Why you looking at me with them eyes, girl?

It feels so strange wanting both Rex and Elma.

I feel like most people hate the one that's not the one they prefer.
Considering how much competition there is between characters across all franchises and given the fact that both Rex and Elma are in awkward situations it feels like 'one or the other, if any at all'...In which case most would be going with their preference.

I think it's also due to the fact that Elma sort of has this perceived 'seniority' since her game was out first and people thought she had high chances going into the main game given the timeframe when X was released, and Rex was essentially given a hard DECONFIRM at the start of DLC when initially it seemed like he was a lock as DLC, so the animosity between both to me at least seems understandable.
 

RebelMaren

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 11, 2019
Messages
174
Location
Scotland
It may well be on purpose. I've been thinking about how interesting it is that Shulk and Rex both have their hands relaxed on their blades whilst looking back over their shoulders, but Elma is seen reaching out for hers, or even past them. Perhaps representing her in the process on obtaining what the other 2 already have. Considering it's officially commisioned art, I think it's interesting. But maybe I'm the one who's reaching.

Also, browsing comments wherever the arts been posted, it's been amazing seeing all the comments about X, I think it's treatment as the series black sheep might be grossly overstated.
 

Calamitas

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
2,072
Location
Germany
It may well be on purpose. I've been thinking about how interesting it is that Shulk and Rex both have their hands relaxed on their blades whilst looking back over their shoulders, but Elma is seen reaching out for hers, or even past them. Perhaps representing her in the process on obtaining what the other 2 already have. Considering it's officially commisioned art, I think it's interesting. But maybe I'm the one who's reaching.

Also, browsing comments wherever the arts been posted, it's been amazing seeing all the comments about X, I think it's treatment as the series black sheep might be grossly overstated.
People who are negative tend to be more vocal, what else is new.
Yes I know that that easily applies to me and 2.
But I'm right so that's a difference.

Or you know. XCX Director’s Cut (wouldn’t use Definitive Edition per se anymore)
Xenoblade Chronicles X Switch Definitive Director's Cut & Knuckles.
. . .New Tatsu Mode!
 
Last edited:
Joined
Oct 29, 2007
Messages
15,831
Location
Somewhere in the West.
It may well be on purpose. I've been thinking about how interesting it is that Shulk and Rex both have their hands relaxed on their blades whilst looking back over their shoulders, but Elma is seen reaching out for hers, or even past them. Perhaps representing her in the process on obtaining what the other 2 already have. Considering it's officially commisioned art, I think it's interesting. But maybe I'm the one who's reaching.

Also, browsing comments wherever the arts been posted, it's been amazing seeing all the comments about X, I think it's treatment as the series black sheep might be grossly overstated.
It would be nice to know if it gets an official placement within the series mythology at some point. Right now, I can't tell if it's supposed to be a spin-off, sequel or interquel. As long as we don't get another "Bravely Second/Bravely Default II" situation in the end.

In the meantime, XC1DE's sales should help boost up chances for a Switch port of XCX.
 
Joined
Aug 13, 2012
Messages
1,194
Location
East Coast, USA
If they re-released XCXDE/XCXDC, do you think they would add more story and/or companions to it like they did with XCDE? They did have the four companions as DLC originally (in Japan; they came standard with the game when it released overseas), so it’s not out of the question. I have no idea what exactly they would add on storywise though. I wouldn’t mind a Torna-esque story delving into Elma’s backstory a bit more.
 

Wisehunter

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 10, 2018
Messages
130
I think I said it before, but if X came to the switch, rather than having a subtitle like definitive edition, I would love for it to get a story related subtitle writen in german, that way it would look like the new Xenosaga (and the sequel could follow the same way they did for saga, by having an "episode II" and another german subtitle)
 

RebelMaren

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 11, 2019
Messages
174
Location
Scotland
I think I said it before, but if X came to the switch, rather than having a subtitle like definitive edition, I would love for it to get a story related subtitle writen in german, that way it would look like the new Xenosaga (and the sequel could follow the same way they did for saga, by having an "episode II" and another german subtitle)
Xenoblade Chronicles X: Panzer Dragoon Zwei
 

SorrowOfAcheron

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 22, 2014
Messages
373
Location
Gales
Well, this is great news for anyone backing Spirit-to-playable characters.
Also Min-Min is the first 1st party female character DLC (if we discount Byleth), so who knows, maybe this time they're going all/mostly female.

That official art of Shulk, Elma and Rex is really good. It's nice seeing that they are still putting X alongside the main series; I like that.
Gives me some feeling like they're really trying to make them all work in their own way. I know it's just an anniversary piece, but it makes me excited.
 

Rie Sonomura

octos are babey don't @ me
Premium
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Messages
10,550
Location
Deepsea Metro
NNID
RieSonomura
Switch FC
SW-4976-7649-4666
ARM's producer picked Minmin, so I guess pray that Takahashi gets asked on his preference and picks Elma.
Seeing as how the ARMS rep isn’t Ribbon Girl who’s a costume, I’d say that was a silent deconfirm for Mii costumes that don’t have their playable equivalent already there so Rex is out

it’s down to Elma, Mecha-Fiora and Lora now imo
 

Jocario Zero

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 20, 2014
Messages
299
Location
Germany
Switch FC
SW-2327-1796-5400
Min Min: "I'm not the messiah."
Everyone who wants spirits playable: "She is the messiah!"

but seriously: im VERY happy with this. Min Min looks pretty awesome and i already love the stage.
Spirits are now in the running! Shantae, Elma, Fiora, Octoling LETS GOOO!!!

btw i love the fact that they got freakin Ryo Horikawa for a few eating-sfx. Thats hilarious. :laugh:
 
Last edited:

Pallex

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 28, 2014
Messages
208
Location
United States of America

SilverSoul24

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 15, 2014
Messages
258
Location
St. Louis, MO
NNID
SilverSoul94
Switch FC
SW-8066-4257-6220
Seeing as how the ARMS rep isn’t Ribbon Girl who’s a costume, I’d say that was a silent deconfirm for Mii costumes that don’t have their playable equivalent already there so Rex is out

it’s down to Elma, Mecha-Fiora and Lora now imo
*cries in XC2* As much as I love my driver boye, I think you're probably right about the Mii costumes. Especially since Sakurai just dropped a bit of a bomb on Heihachi fans today. I'm betting on either Elma or KOS-MOS for a Monolith rep, assuming we get one. Elma's a lock if the long-speculated port/remaster of X is indeed in the works. And as much as I'd like to see Fiora, I think her addition to Shulk's Final Smashes hurts her chances, even if a second DLC wave wasn't in the cards when the base game wrapped development.
 

Rie Sonomura

octos are babey don't @ me
Premium
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Messages
10,550
Location
Deepsea Metro
NNID
RieSonomura
Switch FC
SW-4976-7649-4666
*cries in XC2* As much as I love my driver boye, I think you're probably right about the Mii costumes. Especially since Sakurai just dropped a bit of a bomb on Heihachi fans today. I'm betting on either Elma or KOS-MOS for a Monolith rep, assuming we get one. Elma's a lock if the long-speculated port/remaster of X is indeed in the works. And as much as I'd like to see Fiora, I think her addition to Shulk's Final Smashes hurts her chances, even if a second DLC wave wasn't in the cards when the base game wrapped development.
For the Fiora thing: Chrom. Just Chrom. If he can do it so can she.

I think we could get both Elma and KOS-MOS if KOS-MOS is treated as a Namco rep, esp since I think Lloyd’s 4 costume will return too
 

RebelMaren

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 11, 2019
Messages
174
Location
Scotland
For the Fiora thing: Chrom. Just Chrom. If he can do it so can she.

I think we could get both Elma and KOS-MOS if KOS-MOS is treated as a Namco rep, esp since I think Lloyd’s 4 costume will return too
I suspect the Lloyd outfit will come with a 'Tales of' rep before they'd add KOS-MOS to be honest, just because I think 2 'Xeno' games might be too much, but I'd love to see her. I think if they ever did Echoes, and Elma got in... Fiora has a shot. I personally doubt our second Xeno rep will come from XC1, as awesome as she is.
 

SilverSoul24

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 15, 2014
Messages
258
Location
St. Louis, MO
NNID
SilverSoul94
Switch FC
SW-8066-4257-6220
For the Fiora thing: Chrom. Just Chrom. If he can do it so can she.

I think we could get both Elma and KOS-MOS if KOS-MOS is treated as a Namco rep, esp since I think Lloyd’s 4 costume will return too
I completely forgot about Chrom! Almost like Robin's Final Smash is terrible or something... Fiora definitely works then. Spoilers be damned. Melia's still XC1's best girl though.
 
Last edited:

MrJudd

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 7, 2020
Messages
182
So, I just finished DE and Future Connected and it was pretty awesome experience. I loved what they were able to do with the Shoulder. While the plot was simple, I loved how they gave continuity to Xenoblade 1's story.
I was also reading some impressions and stumbled upon this post on Resetera theorizing about what the Fog King can mean and, oh boy, am I HYPED for the next game... We will get X2 next, I'm sure of it.
 

RebelMaren

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 11, 2019
Messages
174
Location
Scotland
So, I just finished DE and Future Connected and it was pretty awesome experience. I loved what they were able to do with the Shoulder. While the plot was simple, I loved how they gave continuity to Xenoblade 1's story.
I was also reading some impressions and stumbled upon this post on Resetera theorizing about what the Fog King can mean and, oh boy, am I HYPED for the next game... We will get X2 next, I'm sure of it.
Thank you for this link! I've been looking for more analysis on X lore and not finding it.
 

Swamp Sensei

Today is always the most enjoyable day!
GRimer
Joined
Jan 4, 2013
Messages
34,453
Location
Um....Lost?
NNID
Swampasaur
3DS FC
4141-2776-0914
Switch FC
SW-6476-1588-8392
Seeing as how the ARMS rep isn’t Ribbon Girl who’s a costume, I’d say that was a silent deconfirm for Mii costumes that don’t have their playable equivalent already there so Rex is out

it’s down to Elma, Mecha-Fiora and Lora now imo
Eh?

But Min Min wasn't picked because Ribbon Girl wasn't an option.

She was picked due to being Yabuki's favorite (and popularity).
 

Aeon_Shadow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 18, 2014
Messages
393
As much as it pains me to realize characters like Geno still have a shot: Yes on Min Min breaking the Spirit "rule". Now I can go back hoping for both Elma and Edelgard again!
 

Calamitas

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
2,072
Location
Germany
Yep, Elma has a chance again, but being a bit realist here, if Sakurai was allowed to rep Xenoblade again he'd probably be dead set on bringing Rex & Pyra back since he really wanted to add them during development.
I'm really starting to feel like people tend to overstate just how big of a fan of Xenoblade 2 Sakurai is. Just because he liked the game and apologized for R*x not making it in, doesn't mean that he's some kind of super hardcore Xenoblade 2 stan who weeps every night 'cause he didn't get to include characters from the game in Smash Ultimate. That's precisely the kind of thinking that the Geno fanbase tends to be guilty of as well.

Seeing as how the ARMS rep isn’t Ribbon Girl who’s a costume, I’d say that was a silent deconfirm for Mii costumes that don’t have their playable equivalent already there so Rex is out

it’s down to Elma, Mecha-Fiora and Lora now imo
While I like that line of thinking, I don't think that the reasoning really holds up. If being a Spirit and (potentially) an Assist Trophy isn't enough to hold a character back, then I doubt that being a Mii custome is enough. Being a DLC Mii custome, no matter how early it was released, might be another story.

So, I just finished DE and Future Connected and it was pretty awesome experience. I loved what they were able to do with the Shoulder. While the plot was simple, I loved how they gave continuity to Xenoblade 1's story.
I was also reading some impressions and stumbled upon this post on Resetera theorizing about what the Fog King can mean and, oh boy, am I HYPED for the next game... We will get X2 next, I'm sure of it.
Pretty compelling read. And come to think of it:

The music used for Alcamoth in Future Connected is the same as the one used in the final area of the main game, Memory Space. Memory Space of course being an area that's a recreation of the "real" world, complete with the planets of the solar system being landmarks. And with Alcamoth being the place where the Fog King dwells
Yep, Elma has a chance again, but being a bit realist here, if Sakurai was allowed to rep Xenoblade again he'd probably be dead set on bringing Rex & Pyra back since he really wanted to add them during development.
I'm really starting to feel like people tend to overstate just how big of a fan of Xenoblade 2 Sakurai is. Just because he liked the game and apologized for R*x not making it in, doesn't mean that he's some kind of super hardcore Xenoblade 2 stan who weeps every night 'cause he didn't get to include characters from the game in Smash Ultimate. That's precisely the kind of thinking that the Geno fanbase tends to be guilty of as well.

Seeing as how the ARMS rep isn’t Ribbon Girl who’s a costume, I’d say that was a silent deconfirm for Mii costumes that don’t have their playable equivalent already there so Rex is out

it’s down to Elma, Mecha-Fiora and Lora now imo
While I like that line of thinking, I don't think that the reasoning really holds up. If being a Spirit and (potentially) an Assist Trophy isn't enough to hold a character back, then I doubt that being a Mii custome is enough. Being a DLC Mii custome, no matter how early it was released, might be another story.

So, I just finished DE and Future Connected and it was pretty awesome experience. I loved what they were able to do with the Shoulder. While the plot was simple, I loved how they gave continuity to Xenoblade 1's story.
I was also reading some impressions and stumbled upon this post on Resetera theorizing about what the Fog King can mean and, oh boy, am I HYPED for the next game... We will get X2 next, I'm sure of it.
Pretty compelling read. And come to think of it:

The music used for Alcamoth in Future Connected is the same as the one used in the final area of the main game, Memory Space. Memory Space of course being an area that's a recreation of the "real" world, complete with the planets of the solar system being landmarks. And with Alcamoth being the place where the Fog King dwells, and X taking place in our world. . . I suppose that strengthens that theory.
 
Last edited:

Shenryu64

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 25, 2014
Messages
21
Eh?

But Min Min wasn't picked because Ribbon Girl wasn't an option.

She was picked due to being Yabuki's favorite (and popularity).
Even if Min Min was pushed by Yabuki, Sakurai himself said that he was thinking in adding Ninjara or Min Min too, so why he was thinking about adding them when in the base game they added Spring Man (as assist trophy and mii fighter) and Ribbon Girl (as a mii fighter) as the best representation of ARMS? I think Sakurai felt that the representation of them was enough and wanted to pick someone else.

I don't really think this deconfirm Rex, but it is the best outcome for Elma imo. I'm just hoping that the new Xeno project is something X related because without that I don't think that Monolith would want to push Elma.
 
Top Bottom