Elma for Smash Ultimate: Strength comes from experience. That’s true on any planet.

[Calamitas]

I said respectively after each one so hopefully people don't get confused.

But yeah, I really wanted Rex but he's dead in the water right now and anyone who doesn't think so aren't thibking rationally. He's dead, let him rest peacefully.

Well, you tell me. I've seen at least two or three people with/that are part of decently big channels (that are admittedly not too much into Smash speculation) proclaim that BRexit was essentially a shoo-in, and bound to happen at some point. Xenoblade Chronicles X whomst?
(Side note, one of those people had a list of wanted newcomers that essentially only consisted of third-party characters with the aforementioned exception.)

Meanwhile, they also forget that one noteworthy Nintendo appearance is necessary. Even something as minor as Teatherhythm or FF Explorers.

That still kinda leaves Joker as a point that stands out.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

That still kinda leaves Joker as a point that stands out.

Yeah, but even then he has Persona Q2. So Sakurai had to have been told about that game at some point during its early conception, otherwise he could have been hesitant (even if Persona has direct ties to SMT).

 

[PsySmasher]

Yeah, but even then he has Persona Q2. So Sakurai had to have been told about that game at some point during its early conception, otherwise he could have been hesitant (even if Persona has direct ties to SMT).

Persona Q2 hasn’t come out yet (if I recall correctly), so that makes Joker the only character to have NO appearances on a Nintendo console prior to their Smash reveal.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Persona Q2 hasn’t come out yet (if I recall correctly), so that makes Joker the only character to have NO appearances on a Nintendo console prior to their Smash reveal.

Well, that's not entirely true. The game got released in Japan exactly one week before Ultimate.

 

[PsySmasher]

Well, that's not entirely true. The game got released in Japan exactly one week before Ultimate.

Well go figure, the game released mere DAYS before Joker’s reveal.

But yeah, unless we’re going with other consoles‘ mascots, like Master Chief or Kratos, I don’t think we’re going to get a completely non-Nintendo related character since the majority of the speculated characters have appeared on a Nintendo console at some point.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

There is a rumored Persona 5 enhanced port coming to Switch tho

 

[PsySmasher]

There is a rumored Persona 5 enhanced port coming to Switch tho

It’s only a rumor for now. It’s much more likely after the Joker reveal, but it’s still not guaranteed yet.

And if I recall correctly, the rumor is basically a complete version of Persona 5 w/ all the DLC. Wouldn’t be too surprising since the game can run on PS3.

 

[Nonno Umby]

I still think it's funny how Elma and Rex went from a decently likely base game candidate and a shoo-in for DLC respectively to a likely DLC candidate and dead respectively in the span of one direct

It's quite interesting because before the final Direct we all assumed that base roster was Elma's only chance, but after Rex's deconfirmation and the strange lack of any XCX content we might be on something....

There is a rumored Persona 5 enhanced port coming to Switch tho

Yup, and recently people have found that Atlus has registered the domain "P5R" for their website, and usually when they do that they reveal the game with that acronym in a couple of weeks, which would be the ideal time for an early January Nintendo Direct.

 

[Deleted member]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

Yeah, it'd be like if you ignored Sans' fans and started with Frisk as an Undertale character (although even then Frisk does have something to make them stand out compared to Cross).

 

[shocktarts17]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

Hmm I wrote up a bunch of stuff about Cross before and why I didn't think they would be a good pick, let me see...

Yes both Corrin and Robin were central characters in the story with defined personalities and agency, the only things undefined for them was appearance and gender (you could argue class and love interest but that could be said for every character in Fire Emblem and wasn't because of being an avatar.)

Conversely Cross (and I'll admit I haven't yet finished X so this may change later) spends most of the game being dragged around as part of Elma's team making only minor decisions and comments to the story. They have no defined class (that I'm aware of) or appearance (though there is a "default" version same as Robin and Corrin.)

I can't speak for Villager as much but you could make the argument that there was no other suitable AC rep leaving them as the only option (pre Isabelle)

Yeah I just don't see any point to Cross. If we don't get Elma for this game I think I'd rather they just wait and grab someone from X2 if it happens or XC2.

 

[Nonno Umby]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

Cross would be quite a bad choice, especially because of how hollow it is. He doesn't really have a default appereance, and even that is quite different from the ones made by the players because of how deep the customization was even talking about body structure, facial expression and so one, and even personality wise he doesn't have one unlike Robin, Corrin and the Villager (who uses the happy go mood of AC).
Also moveset wise he doesn't even have a canon weapon, so they etheir stick with one, making him less representing of most of the actual crosses players made, or just a whole mess of weapons, which would be troublesome just for its amount alone.
But i really doubt they would go with Cross because even in the XC2 DLC the character from X was Elma, proving that she is in fact the main character, just like how Lyn was a main character and not the Avatar from that FE.

 

[Deleted member]

Cross would be quite a bad choice, especially because of how hollow it is. He doesn't really have a default appereance, and even that is quite different from the ones made by the players because of how deep the customization was even talking about body structure, facial expression and so one, and even personality wise he doesn't have one unlike Robin, Corrin and the Villager (who uses the happy go mood of AC).
Also moveset wise he doesn't even have a canon weapon, so they etheir stick with one, making him less representing of most of the actual crosses players made, or just a whole mess of weapons, which would be troublesome just for its amount alone.
But i really doubt they would go with Cross because even in the XC2 DLC the character from X was Elma, proving that she is in fact the main character, just like how Lyn was a main character and not the Avatar from that FE.

Yeah I was thinking that even if Sakurai went to MS to go through all the minor legal mumbo-jumbo of getting Cross they could've said "no wait take this character instead" with Elma.

 

[Calamitas]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

I wouldn't hate it, but I would seriously question what the point of marketing Elma so heavily for her appearance in XBC2 even was, then.

 

[PsySmasher]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

I would be disappointed.

I’m fine with Avatar characters getting in as long as they have some form of a personality in their main game, instead of them just being a blank slate.

Robin, Corrin (to some extent), and Villager (to some extent) all have a defined role/personality in their original games, which helps flesh out their characters. Story-driven dialogue also helps in the case of the FE avatars.

With Cross, you just have a blank slate. You can customize them to have a certain personality and the dialogue in X can change to fit that. For me though, that doesn’t translate well into a Smash character, even if you have a unique moveset to compensate for it.

So in short, I’d... accept it, but Cross is by far my least wanted Xeno character.

 

[HPMarratick]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

Better yet, what if they made Cross a customizable 4 star Spirit. This spirit would be useful to fill out gaps in your party and can be customized from his color type all the way to how many slots he has for supports and power bonus he gets like fall reduction or weapon damage up (obviously you'd customize their attack and defence stats as well). I don't know the parameters for programming it, but it could be interesting to see.

 

[RandomAce]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

I would be disappointed. Elma was the character I grew to love and associate X with. Even while watching play throughs of X and looking at the interaction segments, despite Cross appearing all the time, he/she is a blank avatar for you to insert yourself and doesn’t really have any dialogue aside from the moments where the game allows you to choose something to say. However, it’s Elma who has the most story focus and memorable moments (along with Lin).

The way I see it, Elma is the main character of the story while Cross is your eyes that helps you see the story from a different perspective.

 

[aarchak]

So what do you guys think of the possibility of Cross getting in?

Honestly while I would be... ok with it I guess, I would think its a bit of a dissapointment. Like wasted opportunity I guess. Also I feel like it would be dissapointing for the general audience too, since Elma would have to ride off "rule of cool" factor to be a good addition since not many people know her. Elma has that "damn shes sick jumping around with two swords and she has guns" factor that Cross doesn't carry.

Also, Cross is a generic avatar from the least talked-about game in the franchise. Not a good XCX pick if you're trying to promote it to the public.

I'd prefer Elma. Cross is like the Robin of XCX (minus getting story relevance halfway through) and Elma is the Chrom. Elma is the main character, and also the most interesting character. Incindentally, she also has the coolest possible moveset of the characters in the game.

 

[Calamitas]

So here's a fun little fact that was revealed in Sakurai's most recent Famitsu column (which admittedly doesn't directly relate to Elma): Sakurai was specifically asked by Nintendo to reveal Joker at the Game Awards, even though they didn't even have enough progress made on him to even show any gameplay. If you ask me, this makes the idea of the Fighter's Pass being only/mostly third-party characters rather unlikely, since they clearly wanted Joker to draw attention to the Fighter's Pass, which in turn makes it rather likely that he's the "biggest name" in the Pass.
And kinda related to this, I just wanna throw out my thoughts on when we could get future reveals: E3 and (maybe the Game Awards) are basically a given, so that's June and December out of the way. This leaves Nintendo Directs, for which the most likely dates are January, March(/early April) and around September. So with that in mind, I'm guessing that the remaining four reveals will be in a March(/April Direct), E3 Direct, September Direct, and then the final one in December at either the Game Awards, or another dedicated Smash Direct like the final presentation for Smash 4. And to get back to Elma specifically, I'd say her best chances for reveal dates are either the hypothetical March/April Direct or the equally hypothetical September Direct. Though then again Palutena was also revealed at E3 and she wasn't exactly the most high-profile reveal either

Anyone agree with me on that, or am I talking rubbish?

 

[aarchak]

So here's a fun little fact that was revealed in Sakurai's most recent Famitsu column (which admittedly doesn't directly relate to Elma): Sakurai was specifically asked by Nintendo to reveal Joker at the Game Awards, even though they didn't even have enough progress made on him to even show any gameplay. If you ask me, this makes the idea of the Fighter's Pass being only/mostly third-party characters rather unlikely, since they clearly wanted Joker to draw attention to the Fighter's Pass, which in turn makes it rather likely that he's the "biggest name" in the Pass.
And kinda related to this, I just wanna throw out my thoughts on when we could get future reveals: E3 and (maybe the Game Awards) are basically a given, so that's June and December out of the way. This leaves Nintendo Directs, for which the most likely dates are January, March(/early April) and around September. So with that in mind, I'm guessing that the remaining four reveals will be in a March(/April Direct), E3 Direct, September Direct, and then the final one in December at either the Game Awards, or another dedicated Smash Direct like the final presentation for Smash 4. And to get back to Elma specifically, I'd say her best chances for reveal dates are either the hypothetical March/April Direct or the equally hypothetical September Direct. Though then again Palutena was also revealed at E3 and she wasn't exactly the most high-profile reveal either

Anyone agree with me on that, or am I talking rubbish?

You seem to be talking sense, but it's very hard to predict what Sakurai's gonna do next.

 

[Izayoi]

Elma's best chance does seem to be a March/April reveal with a ~E3 release.

Why? Because my speculative bum says we're gonna get a new Xenoblade announcement on this year's E3.

 

[GolisoPower]

I don’t know if this has been talked about, but did anyone notice that the section on Smash Bros DLC on the Nintendo Support site says “Exact Fighters TBD. The Fighter Pass does not include the Piranha Plant fighter”? I dunno about you all, but I think that’s a plus for Elma.

 

[Bobthealligator]

I don’t know if this has been talked about, but did anyone notice that the section on Smash Bros DLC on the Nintendo Support site says “Exact Fighters TBD. The Fighter Pass does not include the Piranha Plant fighter”? I dunno about you all, but I think that’s a plus for Elma.

I'm not entirely sure I understand your point.

 

[PsySmasher]

I don’t know if this has been talked about, but did anyone notice that the section on Smash Bros DLC on the Nintendo Support site says “Exact Fighters TBD. The Fighter Pass does not include the Piranha Plant fighter”? I dunno about you all, but I think that’s a plus for Elma.

I think that just means that all the Fighters Pass fighters haven’t been revealed yet and Piranha Plant isn’t part of the pass.

Nothing we don’t already know.

 

[HPMarratick]

The more I think about it, the more I wonder why they put the plant in over bandana dee? Why not just put him in?
As for the timing for Elma there's more to the situation we need to look for. Are they actually remaking XCX for switch? If so they could announce it during January direct, follow up with her revial in smash during e3 and do a Elma amiibo release with the game.
Also with revial of joker being for hype I think it's safe to say high hype characters are out

 

[RawstyleEevee]

The more I think about it, the more I wonder why they put the plant in over bandana dee? Why not just put him in?
As for the timing for Elma there's more to the situation we need to look for. Are they actually remaking XCX for switch? If so they could announce it during January direct, follow up with her revial in smash during e3 and do a Elma amiibo release with the game.
Also with revial of joker being for hype I think it's safe to say high hype characters are out

Nah, I feel there is atleast one hype 3rd party left like Banjo Kazooie for example, because they most likely want to end the pass with a bang, like they did with Cloud last time(Ok he wasn't the final character but was revealed in the best time marketing wise and that was near the holidays. Same applies to Ryu who was saved for E3.) There have to be atleast 2-3 3rd parties imo, so that people want to buy the season pass.

 

[Deleted member]

Nah, I feel there is atleast one hype 3rd party left like Banjo Kazooie for example, because they most likely want to end the pass with a bang, like they did with Cloud last time(Ok he wasn't the final character but was revealed in the best time marketing wise and that was near the holidays. Same applies to Ryu who was saved for E3.) There have to be atleast 2-3 3rd parties imo, so that people want to buy the season pass.

Considering the final newcomers were Bayo and Corrin (as hype as Bayo was to me she really isn't a heavy hitter) compared to Cloud and Ryu I don't think Nintendo cares as much about "ending the hype cycle with a bang" as much as fans do

I mean the final newcomers for Ultimate was Kencineroar and a goddamn plant, like come on

(plant gang for life tho)

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

When has Sakurai ever ended a roster with a hype reveal?



And even 4's base roster was capped off similarly.

People still don't learn, even after all this time.

Going by the usual pattern, the next two characters in this pass will likely be Biff McLargeHuge hype reveals, and the last two will be oddball Sakurai picks.

 

[RandomAce]

If Elma was DLC, would Katylin Glass already be notified?

I’m wondering how far Elma could be in development if she was DLC.

 

[HPMarratick]

If Elma was DLC, would Katylin Glass already be notified?

I’m wondering how far Elma could be in development if she was DLC.

There was a message posted here from C. Glass's Twitter, which did state a while about a role that required a DHA a month or two ago. It could be for an anime since she's in that field, or it could be something else. So she could know about the role already. I dont know much of the details on it.

 

[PsySmasher]

If Elma was DLC, would Katylin Glass already be notified?

I’m wondering how far Elma could be in development if she was DLC.

Probably. Even if Elma hasn’t begun to be developed, she would still at least know her inclusion.

As for how far Elma may be developed for DLC, it depends on when she is actually planned for release.
If she’s an earlier release, she’s probably just starting (or about to start) development.
If she’s a later release, then probably not at all.

 

[RawstyleEevee]

Considering the final newcomers were Bayo and Corrin (as hype as Bayo was to me she really isn't a heavy hitter) compared to Cloud and Ryu I don't think Nintendo cares as much about "ending the hype cycle with a bang" as much as fans do

I mean the final newcomers for Ultimate was Kencineroar and a goddamn plant, like come on

(plant gang for life tho)

Its is true that all final reveals for Smash games always where more anti-hype, but like I said the overall pass would need a real hype bomb like Ryu and Cloud where(Mewtwo to a lesser extent to), because they want people to buy the season pass and that stuff would not have happend if they showed Sylux now for example, because then you would have given a bad signal that your pass would only be advertisement characters.

You start with a bang (Mewtwo in Smash 4, Joker for Ultimate), the next DLC character will be more someone like Lucas, at E3 they most likely throw a bombshell at us like Ryu was (Banjo Kazooie for example), then the final reveals will atleast contain a high profile character to, because they want to get even more sales next year with the holiday season, because thats what Cloud was for 4.

Although I do believe if Cloud was the final character reveal, Corrin and Bayonetta wouldn't be as badly received. Same thing applies to Kencineroar, although here I feel they should have spread the character reveals better because Sakurai blew is load in august and created the effect from "The Vampire killer" to the "hype killer" with Isabelle's reveal, plus the last months of Ultimate speculation where handsdown the worst in the series, because of the drought, the box theory vs the grinch. Honestly if they would have saved Dark Samus & Chrom for October with saying these are our "final echoes"(keeping Ken a secret), people would not had fallen for that Grinch leak.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Although I do believe if Cloud was the final character reveal, Corrin and Bayonetta wouldn't be as badly received. Same thing applies to Kencineroar, although here I feel they should have spread the character reveals better because Sakurai blew is load in august and created the effect from "The Vampire killer" to the "hype killer" with Isabelle's reveal, plus the last months of Ultimate speculation where handsdown the worst in the series, because of the drought, the box theory vs the grinch. Honestly if they would have saved Dark Samus & Chrom for October with saying these are our "final echoes"(keeping Ken a secret), people would not had fallen for that Grinch leak.

Nah, I'm pretty sure it was the marketing department's fault. Pretty sure Sakurai had little to no control over that. It doesn't help that the tragedy in September had delayed Isabelle's reveal, too.

Seriously, can you name a single good thing the marketing division managed to do right for this cycle? The website frequently showed info people already knew (except songs), the damn box was blatantly unfinished and unintentionally spoiled the rest of the base roster, not to mention overlooking G&W's Fire sprite until it was too late.

And on top of it all, some early copies of the game were shipped to Mexico of all places before release, leading adopters to leak the entire game online.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Seriously, can you name a single good thing the marketing division managed to do right for this cycle?

I mean, the reveal of the game kinda took us off guard...

I don't even think it got leaked...

Well, Emily Rogers knew about it, but we didn't quite take her word for granted

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I mean, the reveal of the game kinda took us off guard...

Well, that, and the banner ad commercial was good, that gave us an exploitable meme template.

Gotta admit, while 4's reveals weren't perfect, things were definitely more organised when Iwata was still around.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Well, that, and the banner ad commercial was good, that gave us an exploitable meme template.

Gotta admit, while 4's reveals weren't perfect, things were definitely more organised when Iwata was still around.

This has been your daily reminder of how good Iwata was at his job.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

When has Sakurai ever ended a roster with a hype reveal?



And even 4's base roster was capped off similarly.

People still don't learn, even after all this time.

Going by the usual pattern, the next two characters in this pass will likely be Biff McLargeHuge hype reveals, and the last two will be oddball Sakurai picks.

Actually, the last newcomers in Brawl were and . They were made and put in the game within a couple of mouths before Brawl's release and were very late additions in the game's development cycle. In fact, they almost got cut along with . The Forbidden 7 almost became the Forbidden 10.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Actually, the last newcomers in Brawl were and . They were made and put in the game within a couple of mouths before Brawl's release and were very late additions in the game's development cycle. In fact, they almost got cut along with . The Forbidden 7 almost became the Forbidden 10.

I didn't mean dev-wise, but that is true.

 

[RawstyleEevee]

Actually, the last newcomers in Brawl were and . They were made and put in the game within a couple of mouths before Brawl's release and were very late additions in the game's development cycle. In fact, they almost got cut along with . The Forbidden 7 almost became the Forbidden 10.

Jigglypuff and Toon Link where developed allongside Roy & Mewtwo though, but Sonic caused a delay, so Sakurai had to take some sacrifices here, but its weird why he didn't finish Mewtwo, but made Wolf from scratch instead (Wolf in Brawl lacks alot from a scrapped unique victory theme, to always appearing in the data as the last character finished)

 

[PSIGuy]

Happy New Year! I've noticed some XCX New Year's Art on Twitter so I thought I would share it here. I can honestly say seeing new XCX art is often the highlight of my day. Here's hoping we see more XCX love in 2019.

https://twitter.com/nikobura3222/status/1079754814479683585

https://twitter.com/huyamuyaz/status/1079933663855308800