DK Advancement of Metagame thread |Updated Random ideas 10/28/10!!!

[crifer]

Falco´s doint it now? lol, they´re doing it since 08 :D

I think we should use less sh double bair, we should take a little more inspiration from marth mains, who also only do one fair to space better and mix-up instead of doing two.

 

[¿Qué?]

Falco´s doint it now? lol, they´re doing it since 08 :D

I think we should use less sh double bair, we should take a little more inspiration from marth mains, who also only do one fair to space better and mix-up instead of doing two.

Yeah, all they have to do is Pshield our second Bair, and we're free for anything.

 

[ItoI6]

Have you guys tried the new buffered pivot grab stuff? That might be a legit CG.

 

[Chaosgriffin]

ours does not go very far, but it is kinda intimidating seeing DK do that. lol

 

[Attila the Hun]

So does anyone follow up a d-throw with a pivot b-throw like I sometimes do?

Not sure if it was already mentioned or not.

 

[¿Qué?]

So does anyone follow up a d-throw with a pivot b-throw like I sometimes do?

Not sure if it was already mentioned or not.

Really interesting for throw gimps.

 

[Attila the Hun]

I once got up to 3 D-throw pivots actually, it was pretty lulzy.

But yeah, Iunno...it looks really sexy. : )

 

[Chaosgriffin]

It does, pivot grabs are cool, but b-revers headbutts looks even sexier

 

[¿Qué?]

It does, pivot grabs are cool, but b-revers headbutts looks even sexier

Sexy

10Sexy's

 

[Attila the Hun]

I might debate that, but oh well.

 

[¿Qué?]

Actually, scratch that.

DK falling on his back is

Sexy

10Sexy's


Running+ Pivot grab away from Meta is funfunfun.
Bair at the top of Meta's Nado and it should knock him out of it.
I'm not sure, but I think reverse U-tilt beats Nado aswell as Up angled Ftilt.
Ground pound is good if forced to approach.

 

[Chaosgriffin]

Actually, scratch that.

DK falling on his back is

Sexy

10Sexy's


Running+ Pivot grab away from Meta is funfunfun.
Bair at the top of Meta's Nado and it should knock him out of it.
I'm not sure, but I think reverse U-tilt beats Nado aswell as Up angled Ftilt.
Ground pound is good if forced to approach.

I beat nado with ground pound once, it was funny

 

[-LzR-]

Must have been a grounded nado, no one uses it so consider yourself lucky.

 

[Dumbfire]

In the few frames of startup in the eginning, when its grounded, a lot of attacks can hit it.
Even things like Links Zair hit him in those frames.

 

[Luigi player]

I'm not sure, but I think reverse U-tilt beats Nado aswell as Up angled Ftilt.
Ground pound is good if forced to approach.

Reverse Utilt and Ftilt can beat nado if they are like 100 % fresh. They have to do 10 % damage in order to beat nado. If they're stale you won't beat it :[

 

[Dumbfire]

He was talking about the Punch that hit the tornado, though.

 

[Chaosgriffin]

Must have been a grounded nado, no one uses it so consider yourself lucky.

it was planned though, we were on pictochat and the flames came up, i was in the middle and he was on the side, i started doing down b, and he tried to nado in their, but it got beat, and he went into the flames.

 

[¿Qué?]

Reverse Utilt and Ftilt can beat nado if they are like 100 % fresh. They have to do 10 % damage in order to beat nado. If they're stale you won't beat it :[

That makes a world of sense. Now I know why my stitchface will beat out Nado.

Now that reminds me.. When I glide toss turnips at MK, most of the time it's a smash toss, which makes the turnip do double the damage.. So instead of only doing 7% with the normal turnip, I do 14%.

Does the turnip have to be fresh? Regardless if it does more than 10%?

it was planned though, we were on pictochat and the flames came up, i was in the middle and he was on the side, i started doing down b, and he tried to nado in their, but it got beat, and he went into the flames.

And then the world jizzed?

Yeah.

 

[Luigi player]

Let me quote Big O for you:

Recently I discovered the in's and out's MK's tornado and why its priority is so good. A grounded tornado follows normal priority rules which means almost any move can clank with it and cancel it out. The breaking point of the tornado is 10 damage. Any move that does 10 or more damage will go through the tornado. The catch though is the aerial tornado. As soon as he leaves the ground it gets tricky.

This is probably a bug but any aerial that hits the tornado will clank with it but not go through it no matter how much damage it does. Even a fully charged punch is no exception. This means the only way an aerial can beat the tornado is if you hit MK directly without clanking with his tornado. To do this you must hit him at the top of the tornado. The tornado's hitbox doesn't reach to the top of the tornado even though it looks like it does. After you get a feel for the where the zero priority zone is you can use anything to hit him out of it. I've gotten Nair, up b, and even side b to work although timing the side b is impractical. Ground moves however are not affected by this bug. Ground moves will beat and hit through the tornado as long as it does 10 or more damage. Ground moves will not clank MK out of the tornado though. Say you Ftilt the tornado but you only hit the bottom of it. It will go through the tornado and you will see blue circles that indicate clanking but the tornado will keep going.

The summary is as follows:
1) If an aerial hits an aerial tornado it will lose.
2) The only way to beat an aerial tornado with an aerial is to hit MK without hitting the tornado hitbox. You must hit the top of the tornado without hitting the sides or bottom.
3) Any ground move that does 10 or more damage will go through and beat the tornado period. However you must hit the center to hit MK out of it.
4) A grounded tornado is not a priority nightmare. It can be clank canceled by almost anything.
5) The fact that aerials that do 10 or more damage do not go through the tornado is probably a bug.

I hope this gives you guys a better perspective on how to deal with tornado spam.

Hope this helps (btw this quote is in the first post of this thread too, read that **** ). I don't know how it is with turnips. :\

 

[¿Qué?]

Let me quote Big O for you:



Hope this helps (btw this quote is in the first post of this thread too, read that **** ). I don't know how it is with turnips. :\

Yeah, so far it's only stitch face.

 

[Dumbfire]

Meh I'll just give it a try and share some ideas.
Random up b ****. If you Short hop then immidiatly Up b you land laglessy on a platform, and then you can go off it with a lagless super armor Up b from the platform too. Don't know where is useful from and Ive already even seen people do it but why not post it to make sure everyone knows. What ive seen nobody do is Up b offstage to grab the ledge. Its flashy (lol) and it might actually be useful if they have a recovery like Falco's. Once again I made a quick video example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOqlAFWr5oU

 

[Chaosgriffin]

The up-b to ledge is risky, we can get gimped like that. SO just be careful when doing it, mainly because our up-b hit boxes don't hit the person on the ledge till fairly late in the up b.

 

[Dumbfire]

One of the last winds and only 1 hit. Its why I put the MK on the ledge to showcase when it hits them. So yeah its really risky.

 

[crifer]

lol man.
you can fullhop platform cancel with dair, no need for the double jump.

 

[Dumbfire]

Okay then, cool. How do I time that?
Meh doesn't matter I'll just Full hop and then hold down works fine too.
*erases pc part*

 

[Scabe]

Meh I'll just give it a try and share some ideas.
Random up b ****. If you Short hop then immidiatly Up b you land laglessy on a platform, and then you can go off it with a lagless super armor Up b from the platform too. Don't know where is useful from and Ive already even seen people do it but why not post it to make sure everyone knows. What ive seen nobody do is Up b offstage to grab the ledge. Its flashy (lol) and it might actually be useful if they have a recovery like Falco's. Once again I made a quick video example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOqlAFWr5oU

Nice vid, I remember seeing a vid like that somewhere.

 

[DtJ S2n]

Forgot to mention that I went to a tourney yesterday(Saturday) and I was so mad lol. The ROB match-up suuuucks, how do any of you deal with it? Is it even worth playing? I'm thinking of picking up my old main Zelda as a second just to deal with it (and I guess DDD... why not lol).

It just frustrates me so much, and well, the match-up just gets worse and worse the more frustrated you get. Stupid n-air.

 

[-LzR-]

Well, his projectiles can be avoided on reaction. Don't whiff your moves or Rob will enjoy a punish. Don't try to gimp him, not gonna happen.
And please, just don't try to pick up his gyro and throw back, he will instathrow it back. Just pick it, jump and throw it up. His best move is useless for several seconds.

 

[Neon!]

Forgot to mention that I went to a tourney yesterday(Saturday) and I was so mad lol. The ROB match-up suuuucks, how do any of you deal with it? Is it even worth playing? I'm thinking of picking up my old main Zelda as a second just to deal with it (and I guess DDD... why not lol).

It just frustrates me so much, and well, the match-up just gets worse and worse the more frustrated you get. Stupid n-air.

I'm actually starting to love this matchup, rob is one of my secondaries so i know him pretty well though. Dk's Bair>Rob , Seriously our bair absolutely destroys rob, I used it for every single punish in this set and it worked pretty well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EY1CrdbWlAc

Be very aggressive in edgeguarding, and learn their tempo when it comes to camping. most robs will shoot the gyro then immediately follow up with the laser. His big frame and floatiness makes him fairly easy to combo, theres a lot of follow ups/combos that work him because of these properties.

 

[Jebu-95]

This MU can be incredibly annoying if you dont play patiently enough. Once you get around his camping this will be become much easier (I got stuff to improve here myself). Always pick up the Gyro if you got the chance since he wont camp **** with lazors alone.

Bair > Rob Shields > Side-B ***** him. Another thing I commonly use against him: U-Throw/Cargo U-Throw > immediately follow him up (before he has time to Dair/Nair) > Uair. If he airdodges your Uair you can still Bair and punish his airdodge. It's a frametrap.

 

[Chaosgriffin]

^ Needs more forward b, and landing with punch. especially when ROB has his top in his hand, cause he will glide toss it go backwards so you cant punish, just punch through it and tell him to shut it

 

[Attila the Hun]

Hey Neon, good matches, but I'm noticing an extreme lack of F-Smash...my buddy Jordan gave me advice to mix up Bairs with an empty short hop then an F-Smash an' stuff like that. Sure, you got through without it, but I played against my best bud who's a R.O.B. main (third in our province overall) and it helped a ton.

Also, F-Tilt is just about as annoying as Nair, lol.

 

[Neon!]

Hey Neon, good matches, but I'm noticing an extreme lack of F-Smash...my buddy Jordan gave me advice to mix up Bairs with an empty short hop then an F-Smash an' stuff like that. Sure, you got through without it, but I played against my best bud who's a R.O.B. main (third in our province overall) and it helped a ton.

Also, F-Tilt is just about as annoying as Nair, lol.

I would only use f-smash if i got a strong read, or if he was spot dodging randomly (like xyro did at one point lol) in which case i used side-B.

 

[Chaosgriffin]

There are more uses for f-smash than just a read. Ledge pressure, like hun said, empty short hop after bair, punish get-up attacks, punish charging smash attacks (punch is best choice for this though), or because the DK inside you told you to do it

 

[DtJ S2n]

F-smash is pretty wonderful tbh. What you have to realize about it is that it's ridiculously safe because of it's range and how quickly he pulls his hands back.

My favorite use is like, when you b-air somebody or f-tilt somebody and they're right above the ledge and they pretty much have to drop down to the ledge, f-smashing (charged for airdodges) lands so easily there, and kills stupidly early.

Other than that, it's awesome for punishing bad landings, and over-aggressive opponents. I've won so many matches by walking backwards a couple steps and charging an f-smash. If they start a dash, they can't stop in time lol. If they don't, they probably can't reach you after you do it anyways.

 

[Chaosgriffin]

oh, yeah. walking away and f smashing works soooo good on people who approach from the air (except on wario and peach), but it owns marth

 

[Neon!]

Ive done all of those things before, especially on wifi. I've just tried to avoid overusing it, and yes it works really well on marth.

 

[Attila the Hun]

Hahah, it's just my thoughts, but obviously whatever else you did in place of it still worked, so can't really argue with that.

I use F-Smash a lot though, so it's just weird not seeing it used.

 

[MysteryRevengerson]

Not sure if it's been mentioned, but buffered Usmash catches people off guard when I use it, so it's pretty useful for the kill. In case someone doesn't know, buffered usmash is an usmash inputted RIGHT after a dash, so you don't see the dash animation, and instead, just slide forward using your usmash, like a dacus, but without the extra input.

 

[¿Qué?]

Not sure if it's been mentioned, but buffered Usmash catches people off guard when I use it, so it's pretty useful for the kill. In case someone doesn't know, buffered usmash is an usmash inputted RIGHT after a dash, so you don't see the dash animation, and instead, just slide forward using your usmash, like a dacus, but without the extra input.

^This

10This's.