Did anyone Enjoy Tripping Too? (Don't taze me bro)

SmashBrawl2

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#1
Hi Guys,

I played the full Smash Bros Brawl predominately, and while i enjoyed customizing and enjoy real Smash battles with items/levels and weapons, something occured to me...

I didn't mind tripping, and i actually enjoyed the mechanic. I thought it was humorous, and it definitely enjoyed the real classic real way, as opposed to the Melee/ Competitive way...

But im not hating, i really found it funny, and it made people focus less on button bashing, and playing carefully and punished those that button bashed, and played fragrantly, and kept falling off cliffs carelessly. This element was a good reminder to people that Smash is more of a hybrid game, and not a real fighting game, like street fighter.

Its also really cool that their playing with items matches at the Smash Tournament. Its good representation of the real way to play, even though the event is being used as a mainstream publicity stunt, that is still catering to competitive crowds... Its the best of both worlds...

Its issues were way blow out of proportion, and really didn't affect peoples games as much as some the competitive crowd would like to pretend it did, but it really gave credence to the classic real way to play most definitely...


So would anyone else admit that tripping was actually a fun mechanic, and humorous?
 

Dairz

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#4
So would anyone else admit that tripping was actually a fun mechanic, and humorous?
It was humorous the first few times, but then quickly became annoying when I would fall and lose an opportunity based on a random event. So no, it was not "fun". Humorous, sure. It was pretty awesome when your opponent was the one to trip.
 

DonkaFjord

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#6
I only recalled one or two times where I was actually a little annoyed but I didn't really care it was there for the most part and I don't care its gone now either. I can understand why people hated it though.
 

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#7
Well, it's not confirmed gone, just presumably so(and considering how many hated random tripping specifically, most of it is bias, not actual evidence given by the interviewer. The tweet itself isn't even viewable. -_-). The interview was vague enough to be skeptical at this point what he meant. That, and he could've meant any kinds of tripping, but changed his mind. All we knew was some kind of tripping was gone, apparently.

Anyway, I didn't mind it, and toggling it(as in where it'd affect the whole game) would've been the better option, imo. However, if random tripping is gone, that's less programming to throw in, so removing it wholesale technically works just as well and only would annoy a pretty small minority of players.(some don't mind, few like it, most hate it)
 
D

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#8
Well, it's not confirmed gone, just presumably so(and considering how many hated random tripping specifically, most of it is bias, not actual evidence given by the interviewer. The tweet itself isn't even viewable. -_-). The interview was vague enough to be skeptical at this point what he meant. That, and he could've meant any kinds of tripping, but changed his mind. All we knew was some kind of tripping was gone, apparently.

Anyway, I didn't mind it, and toggling it(as in where it'd affect the whole game) would've been the better option, imo. However, if random tripping is gone, that's less programming to throw in, so removing it wholesale technically works just as well and only would annoy a pretty small minority of players.(some don't mind, few like it, most hate it)
It's not confirmed? Sakurai outright explicitly stated that tripping was getting torched.

What does it take to make something "confirmed" for you?
 

Chinderblock

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#9
It's not confirmed? Sakurai outright explicitly stated that tripping was getting torched.

What does it take to make something "confirmed" for you?
He said "Tripping is gone", not Random Tripping. That's exactly why it was never confirmed, period. It was a vague statement with barely any context. How amazing that the interview decided not to save the interview to see if there was actual real context on Sakurai's part(instead he was blatantly vague as hell). In reality, it literally can read as "All tripping is definitely gone" and it makes just as much sense. The interviewer didn't mention random tripping either, notably. Alluded to it(but how do we know Sakurai actually interpreted it that way, especially when he didn't give one iota of context it was Tripping of the Random kind. He didn't even give context it was item-based or move-based. Just that it was "Tripping" in general. I could legitimately say he was lying or changed his mind due to the complete lack of evidence and actual exact words.

It's vague, period. People need to just stop bothering to say it's confirmed till the game is finished at this point. It's likely gone, nothing more. e3 itself will also help prove it, if we see no random tripping(and it doesn't come back by the final launch respectively). Also, assuming Sakurai did mean random tripping(not knowing, since he didn't even say it anyway. Now, if the interviewer actually outright said "Tripping not caused by an Item or Move", maybe there'd be enough perfect context. Let's not assume Sakurai knew which version of tripping was hated, because even if he did, how does he know that the Interviewer definitely meant that anyway? Not with language barriers. And with zero indications he knew the context anyway, Sakurai could've been saying something many took wrong. That's the issue with a very vague statement on Sakurai's end, and a somewhat vague point on the interviewer's end. Both were poorly written and left it up in the air. It was never directly confirmed, just a conclusion many gave due to what they say(and severely bias more than actual facts, which there were pretty none at thq5 point in time).

I don't play the inevitable game. I don't use confirmation bias as proof(which is entirely what is being used here, not actual factual statements, just silly beliefs because it makes the most sense), and there's no reason to. Keep in mind SmashWiki has this same rule. We still refuse to say Random Tripping is gone till it's actually gone. We, hell, made it clear that "he seems to be referring to Random Tripping" now because that's the best we can get. It's still speculation at this point.

I find no reason to believe it's out till we see it with our own eyes, not a very badly done interview that we actually needed a different kind of tripping shown to even have a potential idea he likely meant random tripping was gone(which was a form of decent evidence, at the very least), not multiple vague statements that amount to "I guess he meant Random Tripping?" at best.(and the most logical conclusion while using actual facts that exist, not vague statements)
 
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D

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#10
He said "Tripping is gone", not Random Tripping. That's exactly why it was never confirmed, period. It was a vague statement with barely any context. How amazing that the interview decided not to save the interview to see if there was actual real context on Sakurai's part(instead he was blatantly vague as hell). In reality, it literally can read as "All tripping is definitely gone" and it makes just as much sense. The interviewer didn't mention random tripping either, notably. Alluded to it(but how do we know Sakurai actually interpreted it that way, especially when he didn't give one iota of context it was Tripping of the Random kind. He didn't even give context it was item-based or move-based. Just that it was "Tripping" in general. I could legitimately say he was lying or changed his mind due to the complete lack of evidence and actual exact words.

It's vague, period. People need to just stop bothering to say it's confirmed till the game is finished at this point. It's likely gone, nothing more. e3 itself will also help prove it, if we see no random tripping(and it doesn't come back by the final launch respectively). Also, assuming Sakurai did mean random tripping(not knowing, since he didn't even say it anyway. Now, if the interviewer actually outright said "Tripping not caused by an Item or Move", maybe there'd be enough perfect context. Let's not assume Sakurai knew which version of tripping was hated, because even if he did, how does he know that the Interviewer definitely meant that anyway? Not with language barriers. And with zero indications he knew the context anyway, Sakurai could've been saying something many took wrong. That's the issue with a very vague statement on Sakurai's end, and a somewhat vague point on the interviewer's end. Both were poorly written and left it up in the air. It was never directly confirmed, just a conclusion many gave due to what they say(and severely bias more than actual facts, which there were pretty none at thq5 point in time).

I don't play the inevitable game. I don't use confirmation bias as proof(which is entirely what is being used here, not actual factual statements, just silly beliefs because it makes the most sense), and there's no reason to. Keep in mind SmashWiki has this same rule. We still refuse to say Random Tripping is gone till it's actually gone. We, hell, made it clear that "he seems to be referring to Random Tripping" now because that's the best we can get. It's still speculation at this point.

I find no reason to believe it's out till we see it with our own eyes, not a very badly done interview that we actually needed a different kind of tripping shown to even have a potential idea he likely meant random tripping was gone(which was a form of decent evidence, at the very least), not multiple vague statements that amount to "I guess he meant Random Tripping?" at best.(and the most logical conclusion while using actual facts that exist, not vague statements)
This is you thinking way too hard about this.

There's really only one single relevant way you can interpret the statement "Tripping will not be in Smash 4". There was only one form of tripping that relevantly needed to be mentioned when he was directly asked the question that he supplied that answer to.

Rest easy, friend. Tripping will likely only be in the game in the form of Diddy bananas.
 

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#12
You like that tripping made people "play carefully".....yet you play with all items on.

Cool bro.
...Which items make you play smarter too. Makes sense to me. Many of them actually require a different kind of skillful play, after all.
 
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#13
It was a random influence on battle that you could never opt out of, and that's why it's loathed.

If one didn't like the chaos introduced by certain items or stages or attacks, one could disable and avoid those. No one can disable tripping.

I'd go the route of compromise and say random pratfalling could be enabled or disabled in SSB4's options, but I can't imagine who would ever willingly play with it on. OP, your post suggests that you came to enjoy it, but I believe that's because the choice is to either find enjoyment in it or have the game marred by this strange design flaw. You see a silver lining in the random slips, but if it was a matter of checking and unchecking a box in options, would you still leave it enabled?

post-script edit: *taze*
 
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Morbi

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#14
As a predominately casual player, I did not mind tripping. In fact, I actually quite enjoyed it; it added an interesting element to the game-play which is usually a great thing. I can understand why competitive players hate the mechanic, but in a friendly environment, it is good fun.
 

BaPr

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#15
Not against tripping. When it happens, it almost never changes the out come, just delays it.
 

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#16
This is you thinking way too hard about this.
I'm sorry that I properly analyze stuff instead of making assumptions using poor statements? Don't act condescending towards me about it. I hope you have an actual non-insulting response left. Otherwise, I know I blatantly am right here and that it's not confirmed(actually, no, that's blatantly correct because he didn't confirm anything at the time.)

There's really only one single relevant way you can interpret the statement "Tripping will not be in Smash 4". There was only one form of tripping that relevantly needed to be mentioned when he was directly asked the question that he supplied that answer to.

Rest easy, friend. Tripping will likely only be in the game in the form of Diddy bananas.
The only relevant way I can interpret it properly is "Tripping will not be in the game." And it's in the game. I am saying with honesty I actually think he lied or changed his mind. And there's really no legitimate reason to believe otherwise barring the actual game not having Random Tripping, which I'm not so sure is that likely any more. Toggable is something I actually think might happen at this point, either DLC or otherwise.

And yes, I would turn it on outside of Single Player and specific tourneys. Cause I don't care if I trip barring special circumstances.
 

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#17
Seeing as I'm a competitive player who has lost grand final matches from tripping, I cannot help but be happy that it's gone (it has to be gone, plz).
Story of my life: I'm Marth, I grab Wario, I have a guaranteed tipper forward smash out of grab release for the kill, but it requires a 'stutter step' to do it easier, which uses dashing. So wario releases out, I go for the stutter step fsmash and trip immediately, Wario gets a waft on me for the match. Bueno.

When the interview showed Sakurai saying 'tripping is gone', a lot of people immediately questioned diddy kong. Realistically the tripping we hate is the whole 'random dash' thing, whilst Diddy (and characters with moves that had higher trip chances) more specifically didn't do anything 'wrong'. In fact I was actually a little regretful to infer that would mean things like diddy's bananas would get changed (at the time that meant to be DIXIE WITH DOWN B!? Hah!) and stuff like jab trips for kills (although all jabs now have finishers?) or combo starters (mk's down tilt) weren't competitively horrible mechanics. They were still all random though, so I wouldn't be too upset at complete removal.

We see diddy with bananas, but we're left with no visuals of anyone tripping from it or any other move, and we don't know if other moves will still randomly trip you. But I think we can assume they will not. A character that has items that forces a tech situation is not that farfetched tbqh, doesn't have to be anything like how tripping worked in brawl.
 
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Luigi player

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#19
obvious troll is obvious.

"He said "Tripping is gone", not Random Tripping."

maybe i should sig this (well not really)
this also seems like an obvious troll.
if he didnt mean random tripping he'd mean all tripping in the game with that quote. which obviously wont be the case seeing as we still have bananas.
 

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#20
Ignoring insulting aside from two people, I do hope it comes back with a toggable option. It was rarely ever a problem and people overstate how often it hurt competitive play. It doesn't happen often enough to affect most matches.

Brawl has way more issues than silly Random Tripping(which may or may not be gone anyway), like lack of hitstun, lack of L-Cancelling(manual, which actually did matter, since a lot of moves didn't get enough of the lag removed to actually help, compared to previous games), and lack of real combos, never mind Chain Grabbing being more broken than before. It's a weak outcome on most matches anyway. I actually didn't even care about it and never lost a match due to that in itself. Other reasons, yes. That, nope.
 

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#21
Brawl has way more issues than silly Random Tripping(which may or may not be gone anyway), like lack of hitstun, lack of L-Cancelling(manual, which actually did matter, since a lot of moves didn't get enough of the lag removed to actually help, compared to previous games), and lack of real combos, never mind Chain Grabbing being more broken than before. It's a weak outcome on most matches anyway. I actually didn't even care about it and never lost a match due to that in itself. Other reasons, yes. That, nope.
People who enjoy Brawl (competitively) would disagree with you a lot. Random tripping and MK/Ice Climbers are the only two things that perpetuate problems in the game for many. You insult me (and any other competitive brawl player) by stipulating that I should care more about straight forward different mechanics that contrast with Melee (I could argue nearly every point in your list as wrong though; but this isn't the place for it]) over the fact that the game I chose to otherwise enjoy, randomly decides to rob me of matches, which has robbed me of tournament victories which may amount to hundreds of dollars? Unbelievably hype regional crew battles ending when on the massive come back, last stock, last hit, ends with a trip and the complete dejection everyone suddenly feels about a game when 100 people were screaming their lungs out mere moments earlier is because the game didn't have L cancelling/etc?

I was not replying to your grievances with other users.
 

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#22
People who enjoy Brawl (competitively) would disagree with you a lot. Random tripping and MK/Ice Climbers are the only two things that perpetuate problems in the game for many. You insult me (and any other competitive brawl player) by stipulating that I should care more about straight forward different mechanics that contrast with Melee (I could argue nearly every point in your list as wrong though; but this isn't the place for it]) over the fact that the game I chose to otherwise enjoy, randomly decides to rob me of matches, which has robbed me of tournament victories which may amount to hundreds of dollars? Unbelievably hype regional crew battles ending when on the massive come back, last stock, last hit, ends with a trip and the complete dejection everyone suddenly feels about a game when 100 people were screaming their lungs out mere moments earlier is because the game didn't have L cancelling/etc?
I don't play casually at all because it bores me. And I'd rather lose to Random Tripping then because I couldn't L-Cancel and actually heavily change the match by removing most of the lag. But that's just my opinion on it.

I only play in a pure competitive way at this point. I do fully believe those others are more important, and I'm not insulting a single person by having that opinion. That's out of context here. You shouldn't feel insulted because somebody has a different opinion of what's bad in the game, that's all. I would definitely leave in Random Tripping if it meant getting all that other awesome stuff(again, imo). It's worth the rest, really. Every game has some competitive issues(balances, namely).

And I was not insinuating anyone should care more about it. Again, that's misreading what I mean. I believe Random Tripping is ultimately meh and has enough little effect period. I've never seen it cost a match period, and it's barely any from what I know. It does not help our data has shown it happens barely around .02% of the time(has any new data shown up to prove its rate anyway?) That means that it affecting an outcome extremely often is legitimately overstating it(not that it isn't a problem in a competitive match. That's two different statements, of course. It's a problem, just not one that shows up heavily, where the other stuff does show up more. That's why I came to the conclusion that Random Tripping is miniscule in the grand theme of things. From what I believe, not others.) Likewise, the reason I said it should be toggable is just because it's not even much of a problem compared to things that heavily affect matches overall. I get that it's random and annoying. I know that all too well. I don't think it should be gone because of that. I don't care about it, yes. Should others? That's their call, not mine, and they can do as they wish, respectively.

I was not replying to your grievances with other users.
I never thought you were.
 
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SmashBrawl2

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#23
I
Well, it's not confirmed gone, just presumably so(and considering how many hated random tripping specifically, most of it is bias, not actual evidence given by the interviewer. The tweet itself isn't even viewable. -_-). The interview was vague enough to be skeptical at this point what he meant. That, and he could've meant any kinds of tripping, but changed his mind. All we knew was some kind of tripping was gone, apparently.

Anyway, I didn't mind it, and toggling it(as in where it'd affect the whole game) would've been the better option, imo. However, if random tripping is gone, that's less programming to throw in, so removing it wholesale technically works just as well and only would annoy a pretty small minority of players.(some don't mind, few like it, most hate it)
So it might be returning? Hmm.. I had alot of fun with the mechanic, it kind of made things interesting and definitely raised the stakes for those that had trouble staying on the platforms during battle....

I also think the majority of gamers didn't really notice l-cancelling and wavedashing were gone. Seemed those that had trouble moving around without wavedashing were the ones that disliked it being gone... Most people in general I speak to and survey know nothing about the term...
 
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Chinderblock

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#24
So it might be returning? Hmm.. I had alot of fun with the mechanic, it kind of made things interesting and definitely raised the stakes for those that had trouble staying on the platforms during battle....
I will say: Doubtful as many others have guessed. There's a tiny chance at this point, and that's being realistically. Correctly stated, it appears he said Random Tripping was gone(due to the wording, it overall was vague enough). Also, and slightly unrelated, but this last Miiverse post, Sakurai said Meloetta didn't show up during the Greninja trailer. It actually did, as we found a picture during that particular moment. He lied.

That appears to be in the Japanese post too. That means that what he says and what he does isn't necessarily the same thing. I think it's important to note that he could lie through his teeth if he wanted to. However, it'd be bad PR to lie about Random Tripping. If he makes it toggable, I doubt anyone would really care and turn it off(and by toggable, we mean that it doesn't show up in any mode while turned off).

I'm trying to be realistic while observing the official data we have. I have to take the fact it's vague into account but also what reveals were shown.

Also, try not to double post, my friend. :)
 

SmashBrawl2

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#25
I will say: Doubtful as many others have guessed. There's a tiny chance at this point, and that's being realistically. Correctly stated, it appears he said Random Tripping was gone(due to the wording, it overall was vague enough). Also, and slightly unrelated, but this last Miiverse post, Sakurai said Meloetta didn't show up during the Greninja trailer. It actually did, as we found a picture during that particular moment. He lied.

That appears to be in the Japanese post too. That means that what he says and what he does isn't necessarily the same thing. I think it's important to note that he could lie through his teeth if he wanted to. However, it'd be bad PR to lie about Random Tripping. If he makes it toggable, I doubt anyone would really care and turn it off(and by toggable, we mean that it doesn't show up in any mode while turned off).

I'm trying to be realistic while observing the official data we have. I have to take the fact it's vague into account but also what reveals were shown.

Also, try not to double post, my friend. :)
Sorry bout the double post, my internet connection is bad...

I do wonder if their is a perhaps a miscommunication or whether he really did say it was taken out...

If he accidentally was misleading, it probably won't affect the majority that buy the game,

but i could see it angering the competitive community on the internet, that only play Melee...

However, I don't think most gamers will really notice....
 
D

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#28
Not against tripping. When it happens, it almost never changes the out come, just delays it.
"Almost never" is already past the point of acceptable for a community that is focused on determining a winner completely by skill 100% of the time in every single match. If it isn't plainly never, it will never be considered appropriate in competitive play if we had the choice.

The chances of their being a tick box for a feature that predominantly creates nothing more than a chance to be hindered is not only bad game design, but incredibly unlikely to return. When you add to the fact that Sakurai has near directly (whether you believe the statement is vague or not, which it really isn't) and explicitly stated that the mechanic will not return...it's pretty fair to say that a discussion about the benefit of tripping is comparable to nothing short of coal to fuel a flame war between "casuals & competitives".

In short? If you liked tripping, that's ok. For all its ridiculousness in its design it created a moment that in *some* situations between friends, I could see a trip being a good laugh. To be honest, in my personal opinion, I don't believe it ever really affected much. I thought I spent a lot of time doing aerials so tripping maybe happened to me once every 20 matches and not even in a crucial moment, because the way I moved was not really conducive to accidentally inducing the mechanic often.

We are talking about competitive players, though. Winning matters. There is cold, hard cash on the line. Feelings, emotions, anger, happiness, trust, and so on. These are people who take the game seriously, so throwing coin flips in to a game that was otherwise better off without them when it came to deciding matches through skill was not only a huge burn, but was never going to bode well to players of that ilk, and it's absurd to believe it ever would.

It's likely that players who liked tripping probably won't be as hurt about tripping being removed as players who hated it (the vast majority, I would think) will be happy for it being removed, which means it's actually a good development decision to remove it anyway.

That's really all there is to it.
 
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#29
Sorry bout the double post, my internet connection is bad...

I do wonder if their is a perhaps a miscommunication or whether he really did say it was taken out...

If he accidentally was misleading, it probably won't affect the majority that buy the game,

but i could see it angering the competitive community on the internet, that only play Melee...

However, I don't think most gamers will really notice....
They'll notice. Seriously, they will.

I think if he adds a toggable option, he can dodge every bullet easily. They'll just turn it off. Those who like it will leave it on.
 
D

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#30
They'll notice. Seriously, they will.

I think if he adds a toggable option, he can dodge every bullet easily. They'll just turn it off. Those who like it will leave it on.
I think the discussion is utterly pointless, because the chance of this happening is rather so close to zero that you're in the decimals.

Possible? Sure, it's possible.

Likely? Lol, no. Plausible? Hell no.
 
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Norm

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#33
As a person who liked to play competitively over casually tripping was a nuisance. I'm happy it's gone it added nothing to the game even if I was playing a casual match it was still annoying to go to spin around and hit someone only to trip and have them get you instead. It interrupted the flow of the match.
 
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#37
You must not play too much then. Tripping gets everyone killed now and then.

I never liked the feature personally. I don't know what Sakurai was thinking.
Oh no I certainly played a lot of Brawl. Not competitively or anything, but I sunk many an hour into that game. Tripping never screwed me, I almost always knew when it would happen because it didn't really feel random to me
 

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#39
As someone heavily invested in game design, I deeply despise the mechanic for a number of reasons, the majority of which are not related to competitive play, that I will not get into lest everyone wants an essay.

It's not like I don't understand the intent. There were much better ways for Sakurai to achieve the what he wanted to achieve that would be more sensible to the intended end-user.
 

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#40
As someone heavily invested in game design, I deeply despise the mechanic for a number of reasons, the majority of which are not related to competitive play, that I will not get into lest everyone wants an essay.

It's not like I don't understand the intent. There were much better ways for Sakurai to achieve the what he wanted to achieve that would be more sensible to the intended end-user.
/thread
 
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