Default Mii Gunner 1111 default weight is very good.

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

I dunno why some people on here think the character as default is bad.

With customs dead now people think this character sucks, but is actually very underrated.

The character can zone very well with f-air. Shifting between n-air and f-air for mind games into full charge shot is so good.

Flame pillar(side b) is so good! You can infinite a person attempting to grab the ledge if timed right. Just spam flame pillar on the ledge at the right times and the opponent will get hit by the flames before they grab the ledge.

Chargeshot(b) is very good. Helps rack up damage and is one of our kill moves.

Up b is a good recovery.

Down b is good for some air stalling and great for reflecting pesky stuff.

The character is fine the way it is. I plan on doing more with this character now. I did get top 32 with Wii Fit at Evo awhile back and plan on improving the Mii Gunner meta now. I've been labbing Mii Gunner and love the stuff this character offers in default.

Customs are pretty much dead now, so there's no point in using Mii gunner customs or changing their weights, unless your playing for fun or something.

 

[Shadó Chimera / シャドーキメラ]

She's underrated with default or not, but she's deffenitly better with size change and extra moves.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

She's underrated with default or not, but she's deffenitly better with size change and extra moves.

She is better, but there's no point in weight changes and customs moves, Because customs are dead now.

Tournaments allow Mii's to be used, but they must be default weight and 1111 moveset.

I personally love the default weight and moveset.

 

[Shadó Chimera / シャドーキメラ]

Have a source for it being default 1111 only for every tournament?

 

[Doruge]

Miis aren't even affected by customs being off. There's no reason to force them to use 1111, regardless of whether or not the 1111 set is good or not.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Have a source for it being default 1111 only for every tournament?

All the ones here in SoCal do defualt Mii with 1111 moveset. I'm assuming the others do that as well or they just outright ban all Mii's from being used. Custom Mii's aren't allowed in tournaments unless they are defualt or it's a custom format pretty much.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Miis aren't even affected by customs being off. There's no reason to force them to use 1111, regardless of whether or not the 1111 set is good or not.

Custom moves are banned in default setting. That also bans Mii's other custom moves. Mii's are only allowed to use their original moveset and weight. Both cannot be tinkered with under the default setting. That's the rules here in SoCal. I'm okay with it since I use default weight 1111 Mii Gunner anyways.

 

[Doruge]

Custom moves are banned in default setting. That also bans Mii's other custom moves. Mii's are only allowed to use their original moveset and weight. Both cannot be tinkered with under the default setting. That's the rules here in SoCal. I'm okay with it since I use default weight 1111 Mii Gunner anyways.

That isn't true though. If customs are off then Miis are still able to use their full moveset. Forcing Miis into 1111 is a nonsensical house rule that only exists because people don't want to deal with another top tier. We should not just bend to this rule, we should campaign against it because it is ridiculous and unfair to Mii users.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

That isn't true though. If customs are off then Miis are still able to use their full moveset. Forcing Miis into 1111 is a nonsensical house rule that only exists because people don't want to deal with another top tier. We should not just bend to this rule, we should campaign against it because it is ridiculous and unfair to Mii users.

Anything other then 1111 is considered a "custom" move like every other fighter. Mii's are not a special exception. I'm thankful that Mii's are legal to use as long as they are default weight and moveset. Before they were banned all together, but now they made all 3 legal with default set. Mii Gunner is very good with 1111. Relying on customs to win isn't really a good thing since customs aren't gonna happen anymore now that Evo is done.

 

[Doruge]

Again, that is simply untrue. Try playing as a customized Mii when customs are turned off, and you will see that you still have access to your alternate moves instead of being restricted to 1111 like the other characters. Mii moves do NOT work the same way as any other characters's custom moves. They are the ONLY characters who are not restricted to 1111 by the game itself under ANY circumstance.

The game specifically and intentionally made Miis the exception, there is no reason to force them into 1111.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

You are being very hard headed about this. Just because you don't have to flick the custom button for Mii to use customs doesn't make them any different than regular fighters. They are the same like every other fighter. They share a default moveset like every other fighter. Enabling customs for mii's will also enable it for everyone else. It wouldn't be fair to give them customs and not everyone else. I love Mii Gunners default moBe set and am content with it. Tough luck for anyone else who hates it. Rules are rules. Customs won't happen anymore which means Mii gunner has to use 1111 set.

 

[Doruge]

Just because you don't have to flick the custom button for Mii to use customs doesn't make them any different than regular fighters.

Yes, yes it does.

Enabling customs for mii's will also enable it for everyone else.

No, it will not. That doesn't even make sense. Customs for miis are always "enabled", no matter what in-game options you set.

It wouldn't be fair to give them customs and not everyone else.

We aren't "giving" them customs. They already have those customs by default. The game itself is giving them customs, you're trying to take them away.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

You can campaign all you want, but there are a lot more people against customs than for them. Mii's fall under "customs" and they barely allowed the use for default Miis to be used in regular tournaments here in the WC. There is nothing wrong with Mii 1111 standard set. I'd rather Miis to at least be usable with 1111 set than banned all together like they were before. I'm pro customs, but I don't ever see customs making a comeback again sadly. I've learned to cope with it and just have stuck to Mii gunners default weight and moveset. I enter tournaments here mostly with Wii Fit, but do go Mii Gunner when needed. Mii Gunner is splendid with default.

 

[Doruge]

Miis are completely separate from customs. They are completely unaffected by customs being on or off. I don't understand why so many people don't get this. Banning customs does NOT ban Mii moves by extension.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Most, if not all TO will not allows Mii's to use their customs in default tournaments. They'll either allow Mii's with 1111 set and default weight or ban all 3 for the event. You can try to convince any TO's about this, but good luck with that. Most will say no and only allow default Mii or ban them all together. Again I am thankful that I can use 1111 Mii Gunner in a tournament. I dont understand why you are so upset about this. Unless you enter tournaments with custom Mii gunner. I don't see why you'd be upset by this.

 

[Doruge]

There are TO's who allow Miis to use the alternate moves with customs off. The only reason so many TO's restrict Miis to 1111 is because they are simply following tournaments like CEO, which followed other large tournaments, which followed Apex, etc. If TO's would stop blindly following whatever the last big tournament did, then Miis would not be limited so often.

BTW, consider yourself lucky that 1111 gunner is still good. I main Brawler who becomes basically obsolete when forced into 1111. Like, the worst character in the game by far. That is why I'm upset about this.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

But that's their rules and there's nothing we can do about it. I'll still enjoy the game, even if I disagree with them. 1111 Mii Gunner is very underrated. The character is oozing with so much potential. Found some cool stuff using Gunner.

1111 Mii Brawler can't be the worse, because Lucina exists lol She's easily the worst character in Smash.

 

[Man of shame]

while I think the stander 1111 isn't all that bad It's still very limiting.personally I use 3223 small due to cannon uppercut giving her a kill move (I thinks it kills earlier than any of her other moves)

 

[AzuraSarah]

There are TO's who allow Miis to use the alternate moves with customs off. The only reason so many TO's restrict Miis to 1111 is because they are simply following tournaments like CEO, which followed other large tournaments, which followed Apex, etc. If TO's would stop blindly following whatever the last big tournament did, then Miis would not be limited so often.

^This.
I'm a 'default' gunner player simply because of what my area forces me into, and I've considered gunner to be quite decent with the 'default' loadout.
However, I don't consider Mii's to have a 'default' set of moves. While the other characters would have primarily been balanced around a core set of moves (Hence customs off) and then have customs added to them, the Mii Fighters seem like they were not designed around this and the only reason to arbitrarily limit them is because TOs are following rulesets from other tournaments / don't want to deal with them.

Personally I'm of the notion that a player should be allowed to pick a weight / moveset combination and only be allowed to use that combination for the tournament, but ain't no TO wants to bother with the implications of this and people have an extreme knee-jerk reaction to things they don't understand / don't want to deal with (The fact that Mii Fighters were even banned at all to begin with just because they were banned on For Glory shows this).

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Sadly most TO's classify Mii weight and moveset changes to fall under "customs". That's only enabled when it's a custom format.

Honestly people say Mii Gunner gets better with customs, but Ive never seen a good Mii gunner at all. Most I've seen just spam grenade and die fast all the time or don't even know how to use The character. Only good Mii Gunner I've seen is Miku's and he's a EC player. He showed that default 1111 Mii Gunner is very good and was going toe to toe with many great players like Nairo.

I did use Mii Gunner a bit at Evo, but I used Wii Fit trainer more for my high placement. Mii gunner was my Custom Villager counter.

 

[Man of shame]

Sadly most TO's classify Mii weight and moveset changes to fall under "customs". That's only enabled when it's a custom format.

Honestly people say Mii Gunner gets better with customs, but Ive never seen a good Mii gunner at all. Most I've seen just spam grenade and die fast all the time or don't even know how to use The character. Only good Mii Gunner I've seen is Miku's and he's a EC player. He showed that default 1111 Mii Gunner is very good and was going toe to toe with many great players like Nairo.

I did use Mii Gunner a bit at Evo, but I used Wii Fit trainer more for my high placement. Mii gunner was my Custom Villager counter.

Congratulations on getting that far at evo with those two characters, any tips for someone trying to improve there Gunner.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Congratulations on getting that far at evo with those two characters, any tips for someone trying to improve there Gunner.

Practice f-air spacing a lot. This is extremely vital. Learn to space and time it well. It can also be used after certain move. I love to save with N-air and f-air. It keeps your mix ups good and keep the opponent guessing what you'll do. Have a full charge shot at all times. This pressures the opponent to play odd and force them to play to your game. I do is fair and nair with some flame pillars(side b) mixed in there and charge shot whenever there's an opening. Grabs are very good to hit them away and to charge your charge shot. They can also do some neat combos on characters. You can do down throw into nair at low percentage on many characters. Practice flame pillar ledge hitting. You just throw flame pillar at the ledge when the opponent is trying to recover. This will always hit them off the ledge and prevent them from grabbing it if timed correctly. Spam this a lot, because it pressures the opponent on the ledge and gives good damage when abused to its fullest. Practice this technique. Reflector can be used for some good air stalling when needed. It's helpful in certain situations besides reflecting stuff. Do practice reverse jump f-air for mobility purposes. It's very helpful and can lead to some cute kills with up smash or down smash.

 

[Pazx]

Implying that all tournaments force Mii fighters to have a 1111 moveset is blatant misinformation. It sounds to me like you guys know ****ty TOs, although if you haven't already tried it would probably be worth talking to them about allowing Miis to have other movesets.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Implying that all tournaments force Mii fighters to have a 1111 moveset is blatant misinformation. It sounds to me like you guys know ****ty TOs, although if you haven't already tried it would probably be worth talking to them about allowing Miis to have other movesets.

Tournaments here in California only allow Default Mii's with 1111 set as do other big tournaments. Mii's other specials are considered "customs" to them. That's why they don't allow them. I don't really care since I enjoy the default set for gunner anyways.

I'll show people here that default Mii gunner is good, because I noticed a lot of people here always say it's terrible. Miku the EC Mii Gunner is putting in some nice work. He's literally the only good Mii Gunner I've seen. Every other Mii gunner ive seen has been very lackluster. With customs enabled all they ever do is spam grenade and still lose. That's not how the character is suppose to be used. The character has the right tools to work and all I ever see is people hide behind that silly grenade custom and hope it carries them to victory.

 

[Pegasus Knight]

But that's their rules and there's nothing we can do about it. I'll still enjoy the game, even if I disagree with them.

I disagree. Some venues allowed more Mii freedom until bad players started crying about Brawler's KO setups, nevermind that ZSS can do the same thing but better. Anther's Ladder reportedly was one of the ones that allowed open Mii move selection until that point. At some point, for some venues, the rules changed.

We can try to change them back. I've begun circulating an Open Letter on this topic, challenging TOs on the most common objections to Mii freedom and offering logistical help to ensure their event stays running on time even if they let us have freedom again.

If you (where 'you' is anyone reading this post who is bothered by the situation) live in an area that places heavy restrictions on Miis, I encourage you to share the letter with their TO. It can be found at http://smashboards.com/threads/mii-...in-the-afterlife.401541/page-18#post-19645879

1111 Mii Brawler can't be the worse, because Lucina exists lol She's easily the worst character in Smash.

No, 1111 Brawler easily is worse. Without free move selection, he's limited to fishing for random raw smashes as his KO option. Well, that and a KO throw at absurdly high percentages I guess.

1111 Brawler cannot recover, cannot kill, has nothing truly scary to set up off a grab, and has pretty lousy range. Lucina attacks further, gets better setups off grabs, and is actually able to get back on-stage. I won't deny that Lucina has some big flaws, but Brawler really is worse. 1111 Brawler is virtually worthless in any sane environment, because the only thing scary about him are his incredibly slow to recover smashes. Block those and you're fine. If he grabs you, who cares, he can't threaten a KO off it. He's honestly in competition with Zelda for 'worst in the game.'

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Because those TO's consider Mii's other moves to fall under "customs". Some just don't want to do that and I respect them and won't challenge them on what they want.

Also Mii brawlers kick custom is way way better than zero suit Samus. I can see why people hate it, because it's pretty broken to be honest, getting kills at 50% is pretty op. If Mii customs are allowed... Then yay! If not... Oh well. I'll still use 1111 gunner set.

I'm curious but do any Mii gunner people here ever go to tournaments or place well for that matter? I've never seen anything of such from here besides Miku's Mii Gunner.

 

[GS3K]

I think aside from Mik!, the only other players that have used gunner are san and chibo in customs legal events.

I dunno what their placings are, but I think @ san. took Boss to 5 in grand finals of a NY weekly or something (it had cringeworthy commentary) once he switched to gunner and went against dabuz at collision (I think he did, my memory is shoddy). Chibo used gunner at smash n splash

I'd go out myself, but my current situation leaves me unable to.

I just grown to stop caring about the customs debate, because it's just going to go in circles with little to no resolution. If miis get to use whatever, fine by me. I put a decent amount of time into just about everything, so I should be fine.


edit: Found the video. my ears...

 

[san.]

Default size is okay, but soo much potential is lost and many more MUs become uphill IMO. I'd love to eat my words, but it's just way too risky for me if default was the only choice.

I just learned yesterday that 0/0 Gunner has an AWESOME dance trot, so much potential when you could vary your size.

 

[Pegasus Knight]

Well, TOs were challenged on it once to change their minds, seems fair to check in with them again to see how they feel a few balance patches later.

Oh well. I'll still use 1111 gunner set.

I'm curious but do any Mii gunner people here ever go to tournaments or place well for that matter? I've never seen anything of such from here besides Miku's Mii Gunner.

I'm honestly pretty discouraged about Gunner. It's not the grenades. I don't need them. It's not that Charge Shot is the worst chargeable projectile in the game. I can live with this.

It's that opponents keep falling out of my kill moves. How in the hell do you win with this character?

 

[Shadó Chimera / シャドーキメラ]

Down/up tilt

 

[BlueTerrorist]

Because those TO's consider Mii's other moves to fall under "customs". Some just don't want to do that and I respect them and won't challenge them on what they want.

Also Mii brawlers kick custom is way way better than zero suit Samus. I can see why people hate it, because it's pretty broken to be honest, getting kills at 50% is pretty op. If Mii customs are allowed... Then yay! If not... Oh well. I'll still use 1111 gunner set.

I'm curious but do any Mii gunner people here ever go to tournaments or place well for that matter? I've never seen anything of such from here besides Miku's Mii Gunner.

I place Top 5 consistently in about all my locals not named Smash Attack when I used Gunner and NYC is pretty monstrous. I put her on hiatus due to people falling out of kill moves. Think I found a way around that during training so I may bring her back to the battlefield.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Asked the TO's here in Cali and they are following The basic rule and only allowing default weight 1111 Mii's to be legal. Modifying the weight or moveset falls under "customs" from what they said.

There's no point in me practicing with grenade if most tournaments and huge nationals are only gonna allow the 1111 set.

I used grenade Mii Gunner alongside Wii Fit Trainer to get 25th place at Evo.

Thank goodness I've been practicing the 1111 gunner set. I've gotten use to it and it can still do some crazy stuff lol

California is one of the strongest Smash states in the U.S. It's very stacked over here and the competition is fierce. Zero lives over here now.

I just need to practice the timing of that Gunner flame pillar ledge infinite lol

 

[GS3K]

I mostly used guest size 1111 (off topic - western outfit is probably the most creative of all gunner's coatumes
and is what I use as my designated 1111 costume) as a training exercise to get a better grip on the moves as a whole other than "blow up everything that moves".

It's worked alright, but I do wish there was
something that could be done to allow more freedom in use. Chances are there isn't, but I'm done seeing the same rehashed points over miis and customs reach 100+ posts and nothing being gained from it besides a collossal headache. I originally thought of just giving up and leaving after EVO, but I came back after a hiatus away from this game and felt I had unfinished business here (got overly burned out on smash and it caused me to get headaches and not good stuff because I forced myself to keep playing)

I'll still support the idea of altering size and specials and whatnot if they'll ever be allowed again, since nobody would be forced to use them if so and can go to 1111/guest if they choose, but I'm not directly getting involved in arguing it with anyone because I have better things to do.

 

[Pegasus Knight]

If they really do stick with Guest Size, 1111 only that will be really sad.

Brawler is effectively unplayable like that. It's not the 50-50 thing. Dapuffster proved Brawler is still good at that size. It's the move list. 1111 Brawler can't recover and has no real mix-up game, so he just has to fish for random smashes for the KO. It's like playing Little Mac minus Mac's advantages.

Swordfighter is at least okay, I guess. Their up-B 1 is garbage, but the rest of the character is tolerable. I could live with 50-50 1111 Swordfighter.

Gunner isn't as bad off as Brawler, but I just keep getting hit out of kill moves. I'll land d-smashes and u-smashes at points where they SHOULD work, and I get nailed afterward regardless. It's very frustrating and puts me off to the character. You say utilt and dtilt, but those are pretty hard to hit with in my experience.

 

[GS3K]

Space dsmash so that the opponent is within jab reach. If the opponent is close to the green streak of the cannon swipe, dsmash will likely connect on both hits.

 

[san.]

You don't need to perform raw smashes either. You can safely perform smashes while in the comfort of your own explosions. If the opponent is hit near the end of grenade or bomb drop, that can also combo into kill moves. It just takes practice to get down.

 

[Pegasus Knight]

We're talking 'within jab 1'? Because if they're right next to me the move outright whiffs, it has a blindspot. Am I right in believing that if they're too far out, like I'm trying to 'tipper' it (ala Marth) that it will whiff as well, so the proper range is 'between the tip and the blindspot'?

San: That's interesting, but sadly it looks like venues are going 1111 50-50 size, and despite people saying "we should do something", I'm not hearing much about people engaging TOs and ladder hosts on the topic despite being given useful research and letters to bring it up with them.

 

[GS3K]

I'll get some gifs up when I have time to make em to explain what I mean better, but not at the moment because I'm away from my system (out of town) and my 3ds is dead.

 

[Pegasus Knight]

...Honestly, even that description has helped. I'm upset that I have to be that precise with a move that doesn't gain Tipper benefits, but at least now I know why the damn thing keeps missing and I can cut down on some of it. Thank you for the info!

 

[GS3K]

First hit of dsmash can also stage spike someone hanging from the edge without ledge invincibility.