Dedede's frame advantage on d-throw, and chain grabs up YI:M's slope

[T-block]

This is something I've been working on for a while now, but I haven't had time to complete it lately, so I thought I'd post up what I'd done so if anyone wants to contribute, they can.

Frame advantage on d-throw:

Character | FAF for victim | Frame advantage
Mario | 65 | 19
Donkey Kong | 64 | 18
Link | 65 | 19
Samus | 64 | 18
Marth | 68 | 22
Dedede | 65 | 19

Dedede can first act on frame 46 after inputting the d-throw.

The following inputs were used to test chain grabs up the right slope of Yoshi's Island: Melee.

00 - down
21 - [d-throw damage applied]
44 - forward (this buffers a dash out of d-throw)
45 - release forward
xx - shield + attack (grab input)

The interesting thing about the slope is that Dedede tends to have to delay his dash grab in order to have the grab actually land. If he inputs the dash grab immediately, he does not run far enough up the slope, and his grab whiffs. This means that in order to chain grab up the slope, Dedede often has a very small window to input the grab, with no buffer to work with.

The frame xx depends on the character. They are as follows:

Mario - 52
Donkey Kong - 51
Link - 51
Samus - 54
Marth - cannot be CG'd
Dedede - 51
ROB - 51

Note that, as I am only looking to see whether characters can be CG'd, these values only show a possible frame where the grab will land. For many characters, there will likely several frames where inputting the grab will results in a regrab.

A couple of interesting things to note:

• In order to CG Samus, he has a one-frame window. Inputting one frame earlier makes the grab whiff, and inputting one frame later allows her to spot dodge.
• Marth is the only character found so far who can be CG'd normally, but cannot up the slope. Standing shield chain grab misses, while for dash grab and SCSG regrab, Dedede needs to run for one frame too long, allowing Marth to buffer an up-b.

 

[Kinzer]

Any special reason for grabbing (no pun intended) these test subjects in particular?

 

[Yikarur]

the frame advantage differs after the grab is about five times on the stale move queue.

 

[T-block]

Any special reason for grabbing (no pun intended) these test subjects in particular?

I'm heading through the character list - I'll do them all eventually.

the frame advantage differs after the grab is about five times on the stale move queue.

...well ****.

Why did I not think of that? Guess I'd better go through things from the beginning.

Do you know how it changes? Does it change abruptly after five times or w/e?

 

[Yikarur]

I think 5 times was that strange border where the dthrow becomes differently.
Like non-DK infinites don't work if dthrow is 5 times on the stale move queue.
BUffered hyphen upsmash gets powershielded by Lucario because of one frame less advantage.

 

[T-block]

Ah right... I knew that the d-throw CG infinite doesn't work if it's 5x stale too >_<

Still, staleness is progressive (sorta... like... two times is more stale than one, three more than two, etc.), so I wouldn't be surprised if frame advantage changes progressively too.