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Custom Moves: How to fix

Guybrush20X6

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I think we can agree that custom moves were a good idea, with a lacklustre execution.

The way I see it, there's three major problems

1. Too difficult to set up. You have to create save data, and go a seperate menu to acess it
2. Too long to unlock. Who decided that you could get doubles? Come one, speak up!
3. Didn't really do much. Besides the Miis, Palutena & Mega Man, you didn't really change much. Soooooo many of the Up-B options were crap recovery w/ powerful attack, default and no attack w/ better recovery

I have one idea that I think would solve all those problems, even if it's a bit more work.

Custom movesets.

Let's say for example, you have one for Mario, who has all the properties and standard attacks of the vanilla one but instead of a Fireball, he throws his hat as a projectile. Or we have Breath of the Wild Link who functions like normal Link but with a weapon degredation mechanic (sword, shield, boomerang and bow can break but score extra damage and knockback on final hit), Bombs are controlled like Snake's C4 and the Paraglider can be used to recover, replacing the Claw/hookshot.

Naturally some characters are easier to come up with movesets for than others so I don't think you could get one for each character (if you can think of one for Duck Hunt, let's hear it) but if say, you coudl unlock them like other characters and hit a button on the character select screen that would be all the problems of custom movesets fixed.

What do you think? Any other ideas?
 

Kirbeh

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So basically MKX styles? If so then I'm completely on board. This would give more variety for those that want customs of some kind while possibly being better balanced, and much less tedious to unlock based on your suggestion.
 

Guybrush20X6

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Sort of like a midpoint between that and clones.
 

Kirbeh

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Charizard

Charizardite Y Style (Default)

NS - Flamethrower
SS - Flare Blitz
US - Fly
DS - Rock Smash
FS - Mega Charizard Y - Charizard Mega Evolves, receiving a boost in attack power, a good increase in knockback resistance and two extra jumps.

Charizardite X Style


NS - Dragon Rage - Charizard fires a ball of blue flame straight forward. The flame travels fast, but deals light damage.

SS - Dragon Rush - Similar to Flare Blitz but a bit slower and less powerful. In exchange, the move deals multiple hits, and it doesn't damage Charizard.

US - Fly

DS - Dragon Dance - Charziard charges itself up with energy, boosting it's attack power and speed for a short period. The move must be fully charged to receive it's benefits and after it wears off has a small cool down period before it can be used again.

FS - Mega Charizard X - Charizard Mega Evolves, receiving a large boost to attack power, slightly increased knockback resistance and one extra jump.

Firium Z Style

NS - Flame Burst - Charizard spews a small flame in a parabolic arc. The flame bursts on contact with an opponent or a surface dealing light damage and knockback. The range greatly increases upon bursting, creating smaller flames that allow it to deal multiple hits, which when combined with the distance it can travel make it a useful projectile if a bit tricky to land.

SS - Flame Charge - Similar to Flare Blitz, but it covers a bit less distance and is much less powerful. On the plus side, the move comes out faster, has little end lag and deals no recoil damage to Charizard.

US - Fly

DS - Fire Fang - Charziard lunges forward a short distance and bites the opponent with flaming fangs. Deals decent damage and knocks the opponent into the air for combo setups.

FS - Inferno Overdrive - Charziard fires a large ball of flame straight forward, dealing heavy damage to those caught in the blast.
 
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Blue_Sword_Edge

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Ryu is a good candidate for this.

These in a way would be a reference to how Marvel vs Capcom 1 (correct me if I'm wrong on the game) handled it with Ryu's Mode Change.
Default
  • Neutral: Hadoken/Shakunetsu Hadoken
  • Up: Shoryuken
  • Side: Senpukyaku /Tatsumaki Senpukyaku
  • Focus Attack
Final Smash: Shinku Hadoken/ Shin Shoryuken

Custom 1
  • Neutral: Reppu Hadoken (Taken almost directly from Ken's Ultra Street Fighter 4: Omega Mode attack.) This sends the Hadouken through Ryu's feet for controlling aim, but it's overall weaker than a full power Hadoken.
  • Up: Tatsumaki Gourasen (Taken from Gouken when not in Omega Mode in Ultra Street Fighter 4.) Performs a vertical Tatsumaki, but the attack goes higher and more damage with Gouken's inputs for the attack.
  • Side: Ryuubi kyaku (Taken directly from Sean from Street Fighter 3.) Ryu executes a wheel kick. Using the inputs that Sean uses will buff the power and distance. Has the ability to dodge projectiles. Has end lag for balance.
  • Down: Kongoshin (Modified from Gouken's use in Street Fighter 4.) Ryu's arms strike downward causes a burial while have the same armor properties as Focus Attack.
Final Smash: EX Shinku Hadoken/ Shoryureppa

Similar to Shinku Hadoken, EX Shinku Hadoken fires a powerful Hadoken when Ryu's not close, but it is a beam rather than an energy ball. Does multiple hits and the final one launches the foe. Like Shin Shoryuken, Shoryureppa activates when close. However, Ryu does three powerful, but dodgeable fire enhanced Shoryukens. The final Shoryuken does the largest knockback and damage.

Custom 2 (Can be informally called the Satsui No Hado set or Akuma set.)
  • Neutral: Gohadoken Loses SF inputs for a chargable Hadoken. A full charge is stronger than default Hadoken. This hadoken is purple.
  • Up: Goshoryuken Loses horizontal distance and SF inputs for multihit properties and purple energy dealing overall stronger damage. Slightly less height than the full power Shoryuken
  • Side: Tatsumaki Zankukyaku Loses SF inputs and some horizontal distance for dark purple, electric Tatsumaki Senpukyakus that multi hits. Also, it is slow.
  • Down: Kongou Kokurestuzan Ryu punches the ground that causes a small energy geyser to rise in a similar height to Akuma's.
Final Smash: Shun Goku Satsu

Ryu becomes consumed by the Satsui no Hado and dashes forward. Nothing happens if the move fails to catch someone. If it catches someone, the screen turns black leaving only the damage indicator there and the visuals of attacks on the foe. When the attack finishes, the screen turns back to normal with the foe launched and Ryu's back turned, showing a K.O symbol on Ryu's back if the foe is K.Oed.

On custom moves, I say have all the moves available the moment the fighters become playable.
 
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RetroGamersGuru

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Yeah, current Custom moves wasn't executed well. I agree that the MKX style different movesets is a good way to do it if ever worked on again (and more likely to be accepted). I still support the costume swap idea with different properties more (since it would be different moveset changes under a different character), but if that idea doesn't get implemented into the Smash engine correctly (or at all), this idea works just as well. I'd say 2 or 3 different movesets is a good number to include without taking too long even on the DLC characters (cus if DLC characters don't get different movesets than their OG one, these separate movesets will likely be opposed again).

I'd prefer that the movesets be unlocked at the same time that the smash fighters are unlocked, but if separate, as long as you don't get numerous editions of the same moveset, I'm fine with it. And of course have the movesets accessible on the regular CSS without having a separate menu option to toggle it (Like the Mii Fighters).
 

AdmN30

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Yeah, I didn't like how most of the character's custom moves were just variants of the same move. Some of them I kind of liked, like Mario's Gust Cape and Charizard's Dragon Rush, but yes, others were disappointing, like the non-damaging ones and the crap recoveries.

I have an idea which would replace at least one custom move slot (mainly the ones most people don't care about) in each B input and replace it with something original.

Maybe replace one of Mario's Custom Neutral B moves with the Iron Hammer, in which he slams it down on opponents and can break through shields.

And then for the custom recoveries that have both short distance and non-damaging variants, I say cut both and replace them with something better in return.

Say they cut the two custom recoveries that Mario has and replace the first custom Up B with the Luma Spin Jump which would operate like the Super Jump Punch when used in Midair, but replaces the combo hits with one slightly stronger hit and the ability to deflect projectiles. And then fill the last custom Up B with an original move like the Cape Flight in which he uses the Super Cape to fly like in Super Mario World, but a bit more nerfed for Super Smash Bros.

Of course, I'm just spit-balling ideas.
 
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Guybrush20X6

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Here's a few more ideas

Wario and Ganondorf could have new movesets closer to their original (well, Wario Land in the former's case) depictions without having to sully the precious tradition. Also Ganondorf had some of the better special moves IMO so they could be worked in over the normals. And Wario's garlic breath is a neat concept even if it's a little lacking in execution.

Olimar could have the different Pikmin Captain as alt movesets and each has a different line-up of Pikmin. Alph woul have Pink and Stone instead of White and Purple, the President could have all Purple Pikmin and Louie, Brittany and Charlie could have different sets too.

Palutena's vast movepool could be worked into Medusa/Viridi/Hades costumes.
 

Wolfie557

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Here's a few more ideas

Wario and Ganondorf could have new movesets closer to their original (well, Wario Land in the former's case) depictions without having to sully the precious tradition. Also Ganondorf had some of the better special moves IMO so they could be worked in over the normals. And Wario's garlic breath is a neat concept even if it's a little lacking in execution.

Olimar could have the different Pikmin Captain as alt movesets and each has a different line-up of Pikmin. Alph woul have Pink and Stone instead of White and Purple, the President could have all Purple Pikmin and Louie, Brittany and Charlie could have different sets too.

Palutena's vast movepool could be worked into Medusa/Viridi/Hades costumes.
Not really because Viridi and the others have compltely different powers. I guess I could see the fireball be part of underworlds arsenal too tho.
 
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Blue_Sword_Edge

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I got some ideas on custom moves, but I I am not sure if it will fit.

To refer to the special instance of Pikachu, I think Pikachu should grab a board and Surf. I don't know if I'd make it a recovery move or go with logic and make it a side special.

As for Sonic, I think his one spinning special should be a custom for the other and bring some pickups like shields or Wisps.
 

Dark Dude

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How about instead of custom moves the way they are now (12 "new" special attacks for each character), we customize their standard attacks instead? For each move (Attack, Forward Tilt, Forward Smash, etc.) you could have a slider adjusting the speed / strength of the move. You could then save that to a custom character with it's own custom palette so you could have your own custom version of each character.
 
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