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Crtique my ****

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
Location
Spiral Mountain
Move sequences are written as [action action], optional or occasional nuances will be noted in parentheses [action (optional action)].

Vs Tai

Interesting 1st game choice. I always feel striking to FD vs Marth is kind of bold, because it can backfire if the Marth is really good about juggling and can convert a launch combo into a push combo to get you offstage / forced to up-B or die with finesse. If they're more of a tech-chaser with f-throws and such, the large space is really good though.

Okay so your [SH (FF) WL back] is a good way to pull him in because you're putting your tummy out there (and you're good about being at a distance when you do it) and then you're pulling away to protect your landing. But sometimes he's running right into you and you're not policing this with needles or fairs. This especially starts happening during the later parts of the match. You're kind of fortunate he didn't just dash attack too, since that covers a stupid landing area. [SH (FF) WL back] is kind of like an anti-landing approach but it loses to overshooting or people who just get close enough to attack your jump, since you're vulnerable during the rising part of your jump. You need to protect that better when they start adjusting to this. The bright side is that this is a quick action so if you stay grounded or swing at them when they're trying to overshoot & attack you, you can get some hits this way, do big damage, then go back to your baiting.

Your move placement needs work. Experiment more with ways back from the ledge. You missed some free hits on him when he overextended (he missed something over the edge while you were stalling and you ledgehop faired, but you missed the fair AND could have started a combo if you went for uair instead). Similarly, a lot of times you use the [SH (FF) WL back] effectively and get him to miss a grab but then you go for a jab and get crouch-grabbed for it. You go for really long dash attacks a lot too. It's pretty telegraphed that when Sheik is running a long way without breaking up her movements that they're going in for dash attack or grab, and her other options require her to stop or break up her momentum (dash cancel, jump, shield, etc) so even if you do something else they're safe for the moment. This is basically why Sheik's approach options are considered so-so. You need to be more patient at these long-range situations and be willing to footsie or shoot needles. In fact, shooting needles and THEN going in with a footsie / run-stop offense can be strong because you split their attention between avoiding needles and dealing with your new proximity. But don't do YOLO dash attacks. They are bad. In those moments you are flailing.

When you're under a platform, spamming u-tilt is great vs players with so-so tech skill but vs people who have competent movement games, you're telegraphing where their window to escape the bad position is. Mix up better below people. Pretend you're gonna get on the platform even. Or just wait a bit before going for the u-tilt so their leg will be exposed and they'll be forced to move to avoid the impending shield poke or aim their shield down (which opens up the option for you to aim at another exposed part of their body with FJ uair or something instead). Remember -- they're really afraid of you in those positions 'cuz your attacks are fast and they're in reach of them so they have to take preparatory actions to counter you doing basically anything. Understanding this, you really can just wait a bit in a lot of these situations first to see what they're most worried about and then punish them for not protecting themselves from something else. This tends to be how positional advantage works in general, but it tends to be exaggerated for long-range, poke characters who tend to not win exchanges on the basis on frame-advantage (like Peach, the spacies, and to some degree Falcon).
 
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SacaSuMoto

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 9, 2012
Messages
285
Location
Santa Barbara, Ca
Move sequences are written as [action action], optional or occasional nuances will be noted in parentheses [action (optional action)].
Understanding this, you really can just wait a bit in a lot of these situations first to see what they're most worried about and then punish them for not protecting themselves from something else. This tends to be how positional advantage works in general, but it tends to be exaggerated for long-range, poke characters who tend to not win exchanges on the basis on frame-advantage (like Peach, the spacies, and to some degree Falcon).

Thank you very much! The long run dash attacks have been a big habit of mine that I have not been able to kick. I have been working on trying to wait a little bit longer, but it takes a lot of conscious effort not to be impulsive. I will be rereading this for many days to come, thanks again for the advice.
 

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
Location
Spiral Mountain
You're probably doing them because you feel pressured to get back into the game because you feel you're falling behind. The dash attacks probably work vs weaker opponents when you're falling behind, but better players can abuse this because it's not elegant gameplay.

Perhaps try substituting it with something else that helps you feel in control again. Like needles. Or setting up the Sheik triangle on a platform to create a safe zone for yourself that you can work off of.
 

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
Location
Spiral Mountain
The Sheik triangle is the triangular space where your air needles are thrown, especially when you're descending in the air or about to land on a platform.

The way it works is that when you FJ to go above a side platform, because of the needle's AC and angle, you create a temporary zone where any approach the opponent makes that puts them in that triangular space can be attacked with little commitment. Sheik can "follow" needles that connect in this position with run off FF fair and on occasion other goodies, which deters opponents from messing with that part of the stage for a moment, unless they're close enough to slid through the needle spray and get the jump on you.

I'm on a roll with my writing & thinking right now so I'm gonna continue this train of thought. So just be aware that this next bit isn't directly aimed at you but deals more with flailing in general. This will likely wind up in some kind of guide or a SSBM lesson. Other people reading, consider this a preview of sorts.





UNDERSTANDING FLAILING
An introspective study in why Marth players spam f-smash
By Kirbykaze

I'm gonna begin by defining flailing. Flailing can be defined as, "A player's prolonged use of specific attacks (generally strong ones) at most if not all available opportunities in high frequency, usually with the intention of dislodging some level of control from their opponent or bridging a perceived deficit."

If that makes sense right away, that's excellent. If not, here are some examples: Peaches that d-smash or nair at every opportunity when being comboed on the ground or air respectively, a Fox just throwing his u-smash at his opponent despite how much they're shielding, a Marth spamming f-smash to try and kill a high percent floaty who's catching up with him in the damage race, or a Sheik that's spamming dash attack vs a Falco because after she comboed him to 60% she got gimped and now she's down a stock...

Any of those examples sound familiar? I've no doubt that most of you encountered these at some point. But flailing is interesting to me for a number of reasons, namely that it's amazing to me that so many people react the same way to certain stimuli. And all with the same driving goal behind it: "I need to stop my opponent before I fall further behind. I need to do something." This, to me, is cool. Let me explain below...

First, I don't want you to get the wrong idea. Spamming f-smash is still terrible as Marth and so is everything else I listed above. In principle flailing is a desperation tactic. You want to avoid those or use them as a last resort if that. But what's curious about flailing is twofold. First, it's crazy how common it is. Second, what's interesting to me is that what it represents isn't strictly terrible. Though it's a desperation tactic, at its core it's meant as an adaptation. This means a player is at some level trying to adjust to a situation. The issue is it just happens to be a maladaptive one. But the driving force at its core (I need to do something different) is not bad and can be a good learning tool & way to understand yourself as a player. Furthermore, I think flailing can be actually turned into a way to implement new things into our game because flailing is usually detectable as a shift from our normal gameplay. By understanding why the habit is there, we can then build an understanding of what we're trying to accomplish with it and how we can introduce new habits to replace it.

To expand on this idea of using flailing as a conduit to integrate or circulate new strategies into your game, it comes from the nature of flailing. We feel vulnerable therefore we try to fix it. And as I stated earlier I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to get back into the game when you feel you're falling behind. It makes sense to change up what you're doing if you know that fundamentally you can't catch up by continuing to do your basics because you need to get something started, whether it's a combo, some proper footing, or some breathing room. That's generally why people start to flail and lose their composure. But where flailing falls short is how it goes about trying to fix this. It has three major flaws: 1) it's repetitive, 2) it lacks finesse, and 3) it tends to be punishable and committal. Which means that it's not a good response to the needs outlined above because you're ultimately playing sloppier and despite the initial change you're now doing more of the same thing -- look at how many whiffed our non-sweet spot dash attacks some Sheiks toss out vs spacies when they feel lost. But the interesting thing about flailing is that once a player hits that move they "needed" enough to spam it and connecting with it culminates in the accomplishment of the goal that created that desperation, they tend to be able to revert back to more controlled, elegant gameplay. This is huge.

To be continued.
 
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Sempai

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 9, 2007
Messages
614
Location
Wildwood/St.Louis, MO
Great explanation! Id like to have someone else's insight other then my own on my habits/playstyle. What do you think?
Have fights against Peach, Falcon, Fox, and Marth

Apologize for lack of audio and video quality, it was ripped from a stream.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRFRDRUo83M Falcon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwj0nEyeQLM Marth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcLldG3da7w Peach
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzRokLGrtT0 Fox
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9B_NGH4pjg Fox Watch me get 4 stocked >.>
 

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
Location
Spiral Mountain
I think we need a Sheik Match Video Critiquing Thread. To keep this more organized. I feel the Q&A needs to be separate from this because it facilitates idea sharing and helping new players find resources. Personal help needs to be handled by a separate thread.

Anyone with good formatting who plans to be around here actively want to make the thread?
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2008
Messages
19,345
I think we need a Sheik Match Video Critiquing Thread. To keep this more organized. I feel the Q&A needs to be separate from this because it facilitates idea sharing and helping new players find resources. Personal help needs to be handled by a separate thread.

Anyone with good formatting who plans to be around here actively want to make the thread?
Other character boards have implemented exactly what you described. I went and put up a thread (and stickied) for exactly that the purpose of "post your vids here and wait to be critiqued". Plus, these place needs a freaking directory for all of those stickies.
 

ChivalRuse

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
8,414
Location
College Park, MD
Pretty good improvement between this set of videos and the last set.

I just want to point out that KK's post on "flailing" is a great elucidation of the concept and is basically what players need to overcome to achieve that composed "clutch" factor that everyone strives for.

Saca: I noticed two big aspects of your game that were causing you to fall behind in those matches. The first is that you had trouble getting first hits in the neutral. Take the game against Wieners for example. He constantly looked to win the neutral by throwing out spaced SHFFLs, which is actually something that you should be anticipating and looking to dodge in order to sneak in grabs and f-tilts. However, there were many times when you simply let him hit your shield with an aerial (spaced so you could get no counter attack in) or sought to avoid his stage presence by rolling in or jumping. Most of these options he was scouting out well (there were numerous times when he called you on your roll; and it was plain that you were getting caught above him a lot, which was ultimately your downfall in those matches).

Whenever you get above Marth, you need to get back to the floor, if possible, quickly, but if not, then sneakily. That should be your priority once you get put in such a position. Moreover, you should just stay grounded in the matchup, period. You definitely like to jump a lot, but Sheik's ground moves and dash grabs are what win her the Marth matchup moreso than doing aerials.

My advice to you is to just play more reactive and focus less on the character matchup that you're playing and more on the mental battle that you are conducting with your opponent. Remember that good players are always thinking about where you are going and what you are going to do, so you need to be one step ahead!

Best of luck to you.
 

Sempai

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 9, 2007
Messages
614
Location
Wildwood/St.Louis, MO
I watched your match against Craiger.

Nice job, but your win came from you punishing harder than your opponent, which is fine, but most good foxes will punish harder than he did. He rarely landed anything off a uthrow. Most foxes will get you with two uairs at least.

In General, try not to jump around quite as much, and if you do make sure your fastfalling, sometimes you hang in the air for too long. Play around with SH semi-rising Fair, FFing as early as possible. Its quite a fun tool.

Secondly, WD OOS, its a very important tool at high level, and it keeps you moving, and helps you from getting stuck in your shield in awkward situations. I think I only saw it once. Its also very helpful when on a platform and stuck in shield.

Lastly, GRAB MORE, as a Sheik player you need to make sure you cover one of Sheik's greatest weaknesses, getting CCed. Out of all the grabs you landed, Id say 80% of them ended up in a kill, the other 20% you got decent dmg or at least better stage position. Your spacing is pretty good, so a better grab game would rlly help you out.

Now, Bairs, fairs and needles are one way to rack up dmg on a spacie to get him to a comboable percent. But your "combo" to get him to the 30s and 40s, is grab techchase. This is important to know.

As a Sheik player, your grab is very important, your Dthrow (Guillotine) is very aptly named, and is great against everybody, so use it and abuse it.

Hope this helps :p
 

SacaSuMoto

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 9, 2012
Messages
285
Location
Santa Barbara, Ca
More recent ****. mainly using this thread to archive my matches now lol

vs Flash (sheik) (DYFWI)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN7B6wTeM9w

vs Lovage (Fox) (CCHD)
http://youtu.be/awk2jshE0KQ?t=55m42s

vs HugS (Samus) (CCHD)
http://youtu.be/awk2jshE0KQ?t=10m56s

vs JoeJoe (Sheik) (CCHD)
http://youtu.be/7q5iAYSXXvE?t=1h18m38s

vs DanteFox (CCHD)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIDilNwPmYQ

vs RapidRage(Falco) (11/04/14)
http://youtu.be/P8NdEYM_O54?t=1h32m48s

vs Dantefox $2MM (11/04/14)
http://youtu.be/P8NdEYM_O54?t=2h4m21s
 
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