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Could fox be banned

Rpggames77

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
324
This isn't meant to be a super serious topic but with fox being in ss tier now(which i don't believe is accurate) but that means that he is significantly better then the rest of the cast. The last character who was in there own tier was banned in some tournaments. So could it be possible in the future for fox to be banned?
 

Dolla Pills

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 9, 2015
Messages
894
Location
Connecticut
No. He's not significantly better than the rest of the cast, it's just there's an almost uniform consensus that he's the best character.
 

ByzCat

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 11, 2016
Messages
4
No. It's a meme at this point to complain about how "op" fox is. He's hard to play, which balances out how good he is. Fox being the best doesn't stop Leffen from loosing to duck or mango loosing to Armada. If fox was banned, it would surely kill the scene because there are so many fox players, and the non fox players spend so much time on the fox matchup.
 

necroTaxonomist

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 13, 2014
Messages
127
Location
Georgia
Nah. It's not like when they banned Meta Knight. They did that because he made the game kinda boring.
Fox just makes the game more interesting.
 

SSG SAX GAMER

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 18, 2016
Messages
190
Location
Bay Area
No because he isn't the best by a lot. He has his weakness like his bad range or how it's very hard to get consistency with him. It's different from meta knight because meta knight was so easy to use that a noob could instantly become better and beat players that had a higher skill than him just because he picked meta knight. Also, Fox has a high skill ceiling and it requires a lot of matchup knowledge and a ridiculous amount of practice that goes into fox just to be good with him anyways.
 

The Young Izzy Iz

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
146
Location
Charleston, SC
The way I've always understood fox's downside is that he's combo-able by basically every character. Around 16+ cast members can chainthrow him to varying percents, he has a suprisingly low 75 weight and therefore suffers comparatively higher knockback (cast average is around 90-100), and is a fast-faller with all it's disadvantages.
 

Slip33

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 28, 2016
Messages
72
I highly doubt it. Fox is way too favorite to be banned, not saying that he should. I don't think being hard to play gives character a pass on being OP. While he may combo-able he can combo too. His speed alone make a very difficult for characters to hit him at times.
 

The Young Izzy Iz

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
146
Location
Charleston, SC
I highly doubt it. Fox is way too favorite to be banned, not saying that he should. I don't think being hard to play gives character a pass on being OP. While he may combo-able he can combo too. His speed alone make a very difficult for characters to hit him at times.
That's the beauty of spacies, High Risk vs. High Reward. I'll also point out that while they're definitely powerful, Fox/Falco are undisputedly the Self-Destruct Masters of Melee, even good players SD with them and its by a higher margin than other characters.
 
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ph00tbag

C(ϾᶘϿ)Ͻ
Joined
Mar 16, 2007
Messages
7,245
Location
NC
Short answer: No

Long answer: Where Metaknight has few, if any, meaningful weaknesses, Fox has weaknesses that are actually pretty fatal. Metaknight has the longest range (on a kit of almost entirely disjointed attacks), the fastest attack speed, one of the fastest ground speeds, the best recovery, the most airtight frame traps, and one of the smallest hurtboxes in the game. His only quality that could be even remotely be termed a weakness is his underwhelming overall knockback stats, but given his absolute dominance of the offstage game, this is less an issue for him. With all of this taken together, only a handful of the cast could even fight Metaknight, to say nothing of beating him consistently.

Fox, on the other hand, has two flaws that give a universal path to beating him which is certainly difficult, but which the majority of the cast can exploit. Yes, he is one of the fastest characters, with the fastest moves, some of the best frame traps, and some of the best KO power in the game, but his weight and fall speed make him very susceptible to combos from the majority of the cast, and his recovery (while strong) is one of the most fragile in the game. Incidentally, he actually has pretty cruddy disjointedness on the majority of his moves, compared to many of the characters he competes with. While most of the cast has no solid answer to his neutral game, almost every character can kill him with a smart combo and solid edgeguard. This is not an option against Metaknight.

But it goes beyond that. Fox does not have any unique capabilities that have single-handedly warranted specific restrictions in the game's ruleset. Metaknight has not one, but two such capabilities. One of them is literally broken; It is literally a flaw in the game's programming that allows him to circumvent the game's built-in rules--the game cannot handle it.

First, Metaknight has, far and away, the strongest ledge game in Brawl. He has a fully invincible ledgestall, complimented by ways of attacking while ledgestalling that only a handful of characters have the tools to counter, and then only if they get a perfect read, and have frame-tight execution. And these are only his strongest options from ledge. His ledge game is so strong and full of viable options that he is the only character that actually warrants Brawl's ledge grab limit. All other characters' stalls are limited in scope, and their counters have lower execution barriers. I don't think it's an understatement to say that if Metaknight were banned, the lgl wouldn't be necessary.

Finally, if nothing else here has convinced you that Metaknight is an absurdly overpowered character, then consider the Infinite Dimensional Cape. A flaw in the coding of Metaknight's downb, Dimensional Cape, allows Metaknight to become completely intangible and invisible for a time interval of the player's choosing. No move that can be accessed in competitive Brawl can even interrupt Metaknight's IDC. A ban was put in place on the technique, but it breaks one of the cardinal rules of bannability in gaming: discreteness. You can say the option is banned altogether, but there's no discrete point where the IDC separates itself from the much harder to detect Extended Dimensional Cape. You could band Dimensional Cape altogether, but at that point, the argument goes, it makes more sense to ban Metaknight.

This kind of discussion just doesn't happen with Fox. He has, far and away, the strongest neutral game in Melee, but his flaws are universally exploitable, and unmitigated, and he doesn't have any option that circumvents the game's rules to gain an almost insurmountable advantage.
 

Ravengeance

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 3, 2014
Messages
134
Location
Upstate NY
NNID
Ravengeance
No chance. Metaknight and Ice climbers were both more "OP" in brawl. Sm4sh has had many other characters that were more OP than Fox is in melee. Yes Fox is the consensus best character in the game but remember too it took like 5 years for people to even decide Fox was the best.
 

Diosama

Stand User
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Messages
309
Location
Montreal, QC
Fox is not significantly better than the rest of the cast. That SS rank is very deceptive.

Plus, as good as he is, he's surprisingly fair, for a top tier character, compared to top tiers in other fighting games, because of how janky melee can be.
 

iAmMatt

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 18, 2015
Messages
452
Location
Southern RI
NNID
mattgw420
Fox is the perfect character imo, but he should not be banned. While fox can destroy the rest of the cast, he can get destroyed in turn. Marth and even puff are good counterpicks imo, but puff is situational. A lot of players also state that falco is better than fox. It's really based on opinion, but tournament results show that he isn't the best and that other characters will always remain viable.
 

Ten of Nine

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 6, 2016
Messages
172
Location
South
Everyone enjoys comboing Fox too much to ban him, he's the life of the party.




His jab should be banned tho...2 gud
 

Don De La Gato

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jun 11, 2016
Messages
13
Location
Bermuda//UK
I look at Fox being in his own tier as a warning label; it takes god hands to actually utilize all his potential, so endure grueling pain and suffering to do it.
 
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