Checking the Escapability of Combos

[Paul the Octopus]

In training mode, there is a combo counter. As far as I can tell, it seems to define combos as successive hits while your opponent is in hit stun (which makes sense, considering that is the usual definition of a combo).

However, I was wondering if there are they any inescapable combos which don't count as true combos in training mode.

One way this might happen is if air dodges have start up frames (I don't know if they do ... if they start up on frame zero then this example is void). If air dodges have start up frames there might be situations where you are out of hit stun but can't actually respond with anything fast enough to avoid the next hit.

Anybody know?

I'm hoping that there are combos outside of the training mode acknowledged combos. It not, the only true combos seem to be things like dthrow into one uair/bair/fair and successive utilts, which would be a little disappointing ... hoping for some longer/swaggier ones.

 

[Gea]

The answer is yes, mostly. Plenty of combos reset the counter but do not allow for enough time for a hitbox to come out of the other player. At least, this was true in the other games, and I assume it is true here

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Yeah, I've seen things I've pretty much confirmed against human players to not count as combos in training mode, especially if it involves grabs.

Also air dodges have start up frames. Probably about 4~ ish

 

[DBSammy]

So smash 4 is less true combos and more inescapable strings?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

So smash 4 is less true combos and more inescapable strings?

yeah, like melee

 

[ParanoidDrone]

But aren't there a few 1-frame moves that can be used to break out of a combo, like shine or thunder? (Or Rush, have we figured out what's up with that yet?) Or anything with startup invincibility (Dolphin Slash?) or counterattacks (IDK what the frame data is)?

 

[Leebee]

yeah, but there were things like that in melee as well like Peach's nair (3 frames?), shines (1 frame) so it's just something you have to consider against various characters and bait/punish accordingly

 

[ParanoidDrone]

What I was sort of hinting at but failed to explicitly state is that instead of mashing airdodge, one of those one-frame moves could be used instead, although that has its own problem of being character-specific despite a given combo not necessarily applying to the entire cast.