Character Discussion Thread

[JaidynReiman]

Yeah man. If you haven't played Awakening and Chrom in Smash is only going to serve as a painful memory for you, then that feeling is what you're going to associate Chrom with. That's how things get ruined.

I'd suggest trying to lift their spirits instead of letting it brings yours down though.


Understandably so. They got quite the shaft. Not even getting one AT is pretty ridiculous.

I do think we'll be getting more DK content via DLC though.

I kinda think it'd be neat to have a full DKC DLC pack with Dixie, K. Rool, an AT a stage, and maybe several more trophies. Mainly I think such a thing could be created to promote an upcoming DK game. I blatantly think Diddy Kong Racing U is happening and I'm betting it'd most likely have K. Rool as well.

I heard that you can do the Pit codecs without Pit, but I don't know if that's true.

That was from when we saw a while back where Pit was not apparently visible on the stage and the codec was going on, but I think Pit was there and he was just hidden in some corner where we couldn't see him.

 

[False Sense]

Because I feel bad for his supporters. I'm indifferent about Chrom himself, but a disconfirmation consisting of him looking like a total loser couldn't have been an easy pill to swallow. Now we have another reminder that you can't play as him, no matter how much you want to, which is worse than complete absence in my opinion.

Just imagine how Viridi fans feel.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

I kinda think it'd be neat to have a full DKC DLC pack with Dixie, K. Rool, an AT a stage, and maybe several more trophies. Mainly I think such a thing could be created to promote an upcoming DK game. I blatantly think Diddy Kong Racing U is happening and I'm betting it'd most likely have K. Rool as well.

Yeah I think that game is happening too, but I think Dixie is much likelier to be in it than K. Rool. I mean she was in the remake, on what I believe was Nintendo's behest, and she's more closely associated with Diddy.

Makes sense though. Dixie DLC to promote DKR, Wolf DLC to promote SF Wii U, I could see both of those happening.

That was from when we saw a while back where Pit was not apparently visible on the stage and the codec was going on, but I think Pit was there and he was just hidden in some corner where we couldn't see him.

I see. Well I guess we'll find out for sure in the next little while.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Yeah I think that game is happening too, but I think Dixie is much likelier to be in it than K. Rool. I mean she was in the remake, on what I believe was Nintendo's behest, and she's more closely associated with Diddy.

Makes sense though. Dixie DLC to promote DKR, Wolf DLC to promote SF Wii U, I could see both of those happening.


I see. Well I guess we'll find out for sure in the next little while.

Dixie is basically a guarantee if DKRU is happening. My point is, though, Nintendo can't reuse the older characters, so I'd say K. Rool has a pretty decent shot at returning as the new main antagonist for the game.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

Dixie is basically a guarantee if DKRU is happening. My point is, though, Nintendo can't reuse the older characters, so I'd say K. Rool has a pretty decent shot at returning as the new main antagonist for the game.

Didn't that article that prompted all the rumors about DKRU in the first place state how Nintendo was trying to obtain the rights to the DKR characters minus Banjo and Conker?

Even if they don't manage to, K. Rool is still only one possibility. The lineup could still go many ways.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Didn't that article that prompted all the rumors about DKRU in the first place state how Nintendo was trying to obtain the rights to the DKR characters minus Banjo and Conker?

Even if they don't manage to, K. Rool is still only one possibility. The lineup could still go many ways.

There've been a variety of different rumors, but the latest rumors I heard is that they couldn't get the rights to them and instead were going to go with adding characters from other of Nintendo's lesser known franchises, such as Dillon. Although there was one other rumor from 2012 that stated Nintendo did get the rights to Timber (and he's probably the only one I imagine Nintendo would be more interested in trying to get, because Timber is the secondary main character of the original; the other characters didn't do much or were featured/referenced in other Rare games, such as Tiptup).

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

If it's in development as long as the rumors suggest I hope we finally hear about it at least some time this upcoming year.

Though I can understand if they don't want to announce it until the MK stuff is done with.

 

[JaidynReiman]

If it's in development as long as the rumors suggest I hope we finally hear about it at least some time this upcoming year.

Though I can understand if they don't want to announce it until the MK stuff is done with.

Yeah, the most recent rumor stated they were ready to show it off at E3, but didn't want it to conflict with MK8. I was mixed on it happening before, but I was dead sure it was happening after MK8 DLC came and there was no sign of Diddy Kong anywhere. Yet in Mario Golf: World Tour Diddy Kong is still present.


Then I became further sure of it when either Iwata or Miyamoto (I think it was the latter) mentioned that they're creating a lot of spinoff games for their core franchises that will be released this coming year.

 

[Burruni]

Just to say, here's who I see as viable/"probable" DLC when it comes to the currently represented franchises.
Mario: N/A, tapped out until further notice.
Yoshi: N/A
Wario: N/A
DK: Dixie, King K. Rool
Zelda: Tetra, Ganon, maybe Impa
Metroid: N/A
Kid Icarus: N/A (Sorry Hades & Medusa fans)
Fire Emblem: ....Anna?
Kirby: Bandanna Dee
Star Fox: Wolf, Krystal
Pokemon: ....Sceptile?
F-Zero: N/A
Mother: Lucas
Pikmin: N/A
Animal Crossing: N/A
Wii Fit: N/A
Punch-Out!: N/A
Retro: Ice Climbers, maybe another surprise character but it's too much of a wildcard in this "field" and Sakurai
3rd Party: I doubt any third party DLC. There's possibilities, but I don't see it coming around.

I'm in no way saying all these are getting in, but these are the "contenders" left for the series with a character already on the roster.

 

[BluePikmin11]

You need to be a little more open-minded than just those choices.

 

[Kriven]

There've been a variety of different rumors, but the latest rumors I heard is that they couldn't get the rights to them and instead were going to go with adding characters from other of Nintendo's lesser known franchises, such as Dillon. Although there was one other rumor from 2012 that stated Nintendo did get the rights to Timber (and he's probably the only one I imagine Nintendo would be more interested in trying to get, because Timber is the secondary main character of the original; the other characters didn't do much or were featured/referenced in other Rare games, such as Tiptup).

Tiptup is the only character that appeared in any other Rare games. Pipsy, Taj, Wizpig, Bluey, Bubbler, Smokey, T.T., Drumstick, Bumper, and Timber should all be attainable characters. Krunch and Tricky should technically already be owned by Nintendo since Krunch is a Kritter (although not showing up in Barrel Blast calls this into question) and Tricky eventually became the Tricky from Star Fox. If they really do make a sequel, I'm hoping they can acquire at least some of these characters.. it really won't be the same without them. Even DKRDS felt a little naked with Tiny and Dixie replacing Banjo and Conker.

Although Dillon showing up in a future DKR game is an exciting prospect, and a call back to the way the original game used Rare's other animal characters.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Tiptup is the only character that appeared in any other Rare games. Pipsy, Taj, Wizpig, Bluey, Bubbler, Smokey, T.T., Drumstick, Bumper, and Timber should all be attainable characters. Krunch and Tricky should technically already be owned by Nintendo since Krunch is a Kritter (although not showing up in Barrel Blast calls this into question) and Tricky eventually became the Tricky from Star Fox. If they really do make a sequel, I'm hoping they can acquire at least some of these characters.. it really won't be the same without them. Even DKRDS felt a little naked with Tiny and Dixie replacing Banjo and Conker.

Although Dillon showing up in a future DKR game is an exciting prospect, and a call back to the way the original game used Rare's other animal characters.

Tiptup appeared in the Banjo-Kazooie games, and Bumper was alluded to in Conker Live and Reloaded. It would be nice if they could get a lot of them, but its questionable. None of them particularly played much of a role except Timber, Taj, and Wizpig. Wizpig, Taj, and T.T. could plausibly be replaced by other characters (Wizpig by K. Rool, Taj and T.T. plausibly by Professor Chops). Honestly I never really had much of a connection to the characters, although I'd rather have them back than not.

As far as I'm aware, Krunch is owned by Nintendo, since he's a Kremling. It is odd they didn't opt to use Krunch in Barrel Blast instead of just a generic Kritter, though.


Honestly, the other characters never really fazed me that much. I felt like it was just called Diddy Kong Racing for the heck of it and the only connections it has to DK at all is one Kritter sent by K. Rool, and Diddy Kong himself. Otherwise, the cast was completely unrelated to DK whatsoever, and it really bothered me. I just feel the original cast should've at least had a couple more Kongs.


Either way, we'll have to see how things go, but again, I'm pretty sure its happening and it could be tied to Smash DLC later down the road.

 

[Kriven]

Allusions don't make red tape. They make legally safe homages, the same kind that has Donkey Kong's 25m showing up in Minecraft.

 

[theenlightenedone]

The top 6 characters I want for DLC are:
Ice Climbers
Sceptile
Sukapon
Isaac
Ray (Custom Robo)
Andy (Advanced Wars)

 

[theenlightenedone]

Also who do you guys think should be the Project Codename S.T.E.A.M. rep?

 

[Spazzy_D]

If Diddy Kong Racing does happen, I hope the rumor of it using B and C list Nintendo stars happens. Just put the entire cast of Captain Rainbow on there. Little Mac, Birdo, Takamaru, Lip, etc. Add that to a Diddy, Dixie, K. Rool and we have could have a fun roster.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

Also who do you guys think should be the Project Codename S.T.E.A.M. rep?

I don't know about should but I think Fleming would be the character chosen.

He does seem to be the mc and all.

 

[theenlightenedone]

I don't know about should but I think Fleming would be the character chosen.

He does seem to be the mc and all.

True. So Fleming for Smash bros. I guess

 

[Kriven]

Maybe "Lincoln Gets Sworn In!" was hinting at something.

 

[theenlightenedone]

Maybe "Lincoln Gets Sworn In!" was hinting at something.

I was wondering when I saw the miis get revealed why they choose Lincoln of all people but once I heard about S.T.E.A.M. it all made sense.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

Lincoln and the other random Miis were chosen due to requests on Miiverse. Sakurai said as much.

 

[Burruni]

You need to be a little more open-minded than just those choices.

Well who do you believe should be on this list that is not there currently?
Mario's only remotely feasible character is Captain Toad, whom I don't see that plausible to get in.
Yoshi's games really don't have much to choose from in the first place.
As Wario's entire structure revolves around WarioWare instead of his actual platforming games, who would be to choose from there? As much as I'd like to see the creativity around Ashley and Waluigi (whom Sakurai now dubs a Wario property), they're confirmed AT's and I don't see any current AT's getting an alternate playable character.
Likewise, Ridley finally ultimately and inarguably being confirmed as a boss put an end to any debate for him as a playable character in my eyes.
As a big fan of Kid Icarus: Uprising and even rarer, someone who played through the original, I don't see anyone else that could be and should be turned playable. Sakurai's getting enough harassment about the Uprising content as is.
Fire Emblem's characters have been Marth and Ike, the two characters to be Lord-tier in multiple games, Roy as a last-minute choice of a clone to promote his upcoming game, Robin who was a protagonist who technically represents a concept that was also in FE12 and was WILDLY asked for, and then Lucina whom was originally meant to be just an alt. Anna is the only other character who has put forth a big role in multiple games (In fact, being present in 12 of the 13) unless you count the minor appearances of Eliwood and Hector as middle-aged fathers for about a chapter each.
Pokemon with a full 6 feels justified, being a full party. The only "missing" feature is a pokemon from either gen 3 or 5, and a grass starter. With OR/AS on the horizon, Sceptile is really the last choice for a newcomer.
F-Zero, Pikmin, WiiFit, Animal Crossing, and Punch-Out!! feel complete in representation where they are at... and there's not much in the source material, if anything, that could be put into a new character. Black Shadow's one big hope was taking Falcondorf's moveset for a complete revamp for Sakurai's main.
Retro I left open because it's too unpredictable in the first place.
Third Party characters... I just can't see happening via DLC. I'm namely looking at DLC as what is being done to finish what wasn't capable during the development time. I stated that because of the circumstantial nature of how overhauled and reworked Mewtwo would have to be, he would take an immense amount of manpower and time. Judging by the "Spring 2015" deadline, that seems to be true. As such, if there was another 3rd Party character planned, I don't see them being unfinished and needed to be accomplished via DLC. There'd likely be some contractual issue if so.

Series who will have a character appear as its first newcomer, Isaac from Golden Sun (Barring him being a WiiU exclusive A.T.) being the perfect example, are open territory in regards to the list.

 

[theenlightenedone]

Well who do you believe should be on this list that is not there currently?
Mario's only remotely feasible character is Captain Toad, whom I don't see that plausible to get in.
Yoshi's games really don't have much to choose from in the first place.
As Wario's entire structure revolves around WarioWare instead of his actual platforming games, who would be to choose from there? As much as I'd like to see the creativity around Ashley and Waluigi (whom Sakurai now dubs a Wario property), they're confirmed AT's and I don't see any current AT's getting an alternate playable character.
Likewise, Ridley finally ultimately and inarguably being confirmed as a boss put an end to any debate for him as a playable character in my eyes.
As a big fan of Kid Icarus: Uprising and even rarer, someone who played through the original, I don't see anyone else that could be and should be turned playable. Sakurai's getting enough harassment about the Uprising content as is.
Fire Emblem's characters have been Marth and Ike, the two characters to be Lord-tier in multiple games, Roy as a last-minute choice of a clone to promote his upcoming game, Robin who was a protagonist who technically represents a concept that was also in FE12 and was WILDLY asked for, and then Lucina whom was originally meant to be just an alt. Anna is the only other character who has put forth a big role in multiple games (In fact, being present in 12 of the 13) unless you count the minor appearances of Eliwood and Hector as middle-aged fathers for about a chapter each.
Pokemon with a full 6 feels justified, being a full party. The only "missing" feature is a pokemon from either gen 3 or 5, and a grass starter. With OR/AS on the horizon, Sceptile is really the last choice for a newcomer.
F-Zero, Pikmin, WiiFit, Animal Crossing, and Punch-Out!! feel complete in representation where they are at... and there's not much in the source material, if anything, that could be put into a new character. Black Shadow's one big hope was taking Falcondorf's moveset for a complete revamp for Sakurai's main.
Retro I left open because it's too unpredictable in the first place.
Third Party characters... I just can't see happening via DLC. I'm namely looking at DLC as what is being done to finish what wasn't capable during the development time. I stated that because of the circumstantial nature of how overhauled and reworked Mewtwo would have to be, he would take an immense amount of manpower and time. Judging by the "Spring 2015" deadline, that seems to be true. As such, if there was another 3rd Party character planned, I don't see them being unfinished and needed to be accomplished via DLC. There'd likely be some contractual issue if so.

Series who will have a character appear as its first newcomer, Isaac from Golden Sun (Barring him being a WiiU exclusive A.T.) being the perfect example, are open territory in regards to the list.

Who should be the Fire Emblem Newcommer who represents the Laguez? Also I would like to see Ice Climbers return and Sukapon added as well as Ray (Custom Robo) added for the same reasons as Isaac.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

Who should be the Fire Emblem Newcommer who represents the Laguez? Also I would like to see Ice Climbers return and Sukapon added as well as Ray (Custom Robo) added for the same reasons as Isaac.

And what reasons would those be? A large part of Isaac's inclusion would be due to popularity, which the other two can't really claim to have. At least not enough to be noticed because of it.

Also we most definitely don't need and I can't imagine we'll get another FE character.

 

[Burruni]

Who should be the Fire Emblem Newcommer who represents the Laguez? Also I would like to see Ice Climbers return and Sukapon added as well as Ray (Custom Robo) added for the same reasons as Isaac.

A) None, for two reasons. 1) Transformation characters, which any Laguz/Taguel/Manakete character would be, were removed due to issues. This is what caused ZSS and Sheik being seperate characters and Charizard returning solo. 2) There's nobody of those races that meet the credentials of the other playable characters. Tiki would be the closest thing but since Anna is a stretch herself to be considered, Tiki is an even farther reach.
B) Isaac is in a league above either of those two but all three of them would be the first playable characters of their series/game and thus would not be on my list as that pertained to only additions to already represented series.

 

[theenlightenedone]

And what reasons would those be? A large part of Isaac's inclusion would be due to popularity, which the other two can't really claim to have.

Also we most definitely don't need and I can't imagine we'll get another FE character.

Well they should stop the fire emblem clone thing and add the last logical FE class of character to represent with a Laquez representative.
Also Sukapon is from Nintendo's second fighting game and the first with a roster greater than just the two in Urban Champion if you count that as a roster. The roster was 36 the largest in the genre for a long time and wasn't topped until Brawl I believe. Lastly he would make a nice retro character and Joy Mech Fight deserves to be on the Virtual console and get a remake and/or sequel.
Ray (Custom Robo) is in the same boat as Isaac because they both are the representatives of their respective franchises who both didn't return as Assist Trophies and are both very popular and Both franchises were great and deserve another game.

 

[theenlightenedone]

A) None, for two reasons. 1) Transformation characters, which any Laguz/Taguel/Manakete character would be, were removed due to issues. This is what caused ZSS and Sheik being seperate characters and Charizard returning solo. 2) There's nobody of those races that meet the credentials of the other playable characters. Tiki would be the closest thing but since Anna is a stretch herself to be considered, Tiki is an even farther reach.
B) Isaac is in a league above either of those two but all three of them would be the first playable characters of their series/game and thus would not be on my list as that pertained to only additions to already represented series.

I know so basically they have to create two characters. I was asking though who would be the best choice. Also Ray is equal to if not at least close to Isaac.

 

[Burruni]

I know so basically they have to create two characters. I was asking though who would be the best choice. Also Ray is equal to if not at least close to Isaac.

So you're saying for the VIABLE list of characters, I didn't choose a Laguz that would be split into two characters which is far too improbable to happen and wish to know who would be chosen? Then it would be Ranulf as the only one to active be in combat and play a big role in both games. However, this isn't going to happen.
Sukapon is significantly below Ray, Custom Robo's last game was in 2007 with no planned sequel and... it wasn't that well received. There has been no new material to be pulled from for him to make him any more important than he was in Brawl unlike Isaac because of Dark Dawn being a 2010 release with a far more predominant popularity. Certain people would argue that Chibi-Robo has more on the table than Ray.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

Well they should stop the fire emblem clone thing and add the last logical FE class of character to represent with a Laquez representative.

We've only got one FE clone, that's not that bad.

Also you must be kidding, there are plenty of FE classes left that would be interesting, but none of them are logical to include on the sole basis of the class itself.

Also Sukapon is from Nintendo's second fighting game and the first with a roster greater than just the two in Urban Champion if you count that as a roster. The roster was 36 the largest in the genre for a long time and wasn't topped until Brawl I believe. Lastly he would make a nice retro character and Joy Mech Fight deserves to be on the Virtual console and get a remake and/or sequel.

That's definitely a reason different than Isaac. I'm not even sure it's a reason as much as it's just describing the game.

Ray (Custom Robo) is in the same boat as Isaac because they both are the representatives of their respective franchises who both didn't return as Assist Trophies and are both very popular and Both franchises were great and deserve another game.

I think the only factor there that actually effects inclusion is popularity, of which Ray had a whole lot more several years ago...

Don't get me wrong, they are both cool characters. They'd both be cool in Smash. But they're not exactly in the same position as Isaac.

Also Ray is equal to if not at least close to Isaac.

No... not even close.

 

[Kriven]

If a Laguz were to be added, I'd say it should be Ranulf. He would only be a quasi-transformation character as well, considering how useless most Laguz are when in human form... Make his transformation a punishment instead of a boon. Every so often, if he's used all his energy or whatever, he's going to have to recharge... During that period he's human, has no recovery, all of his specials are "Attempt Transformation", he has no Smash Attacks or Grabs, and all of his basic attacks are easily dodged claw swipes. The longer he's human, the longer his cat transformation can last.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Well who do you believe should be on this list that is not there currently?

These guys:

Most of these are really unlikey, but they are plausible.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

"Plausible" is pushing it for some of those choices.

 

[False Sense]

These guys:

Most of these are really unlikey, but they are plausible.

Why exactly is Tharja on there?

I mean, I could say that about a lot of these characters, but that one stands out for some reason.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Why exactly is Tharja on there?

I mean, I could say that about a lot of these characters, but that one stands out for some reason.

She's one of the most popular FE:A characters (above Gaius if I recall) that's not one of the main characters in the game.
That's why I think her as a possible candidate.

 

[False Sense]

She's one of the most popular FE:A characters (above Gaius if I recall) that's not one of the main characters in the game.
That's why I think her as a possible candidate.

I thought you said popularity didn't matter much? And aside from that, she has next to nothing going for her.

 

[BluePikmin11]

In some cases is what I think I said.
A decent amount of popularity can give the candidate a form of consideration, but that's only the first step. Like what Sakurai said when he chooses newcomers. I tried not make any popular candidates left out in the list, for your and others' sake.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

You should really remove Tharja. She brings the whole credibility of your selections down. Above average popularity isn't going to compensate for the fact that she's a supporting character in a game that already got two characters in a series where four characters is more than adequate representation. Not to mention Robin already uses the same attacks she does.

You're really overestimating her. Either that or your bias is clouding things. Just because Tharja is more popular than most of the supporting characters in Awakening doesn't mean that level of popularity is akin to the level of popularity it takes to actually get into Smash primarily on popularity. Characters that get in mostly due to popularity have a huge amount of popularity, otherwise they need other points in their favour as well, which apart from Tharja's above average but still unremarkable popularity, she doesn't have.

 

[theenlightenedone]

So you're saying for the VIABLE list of characters, I didn't choose a Laguz that would be split into two characters which is far too improbable to happen and wish to know who would be chosen? Then it would be Ranulf as the only one to active be in combat and play a big role in both games. However, this isn't going to happen.
Sukapon is significantly below Ray, Custom Robo's last game was in 2007 with no planned sequel and... it wasn't that well received. There has been no new material to be pulled from for him to make him any more important than he was in Brawl unlike Isaac because of Dark Dawn being a 2010 release with a far more predominant popularity. Certain people would argue that Chibi-Robo has more on the table than Ray.

Ok first off I never said Sukapon was around the same popularity as Ray what I meant by what I said was the Ray is equal to Isaac and that they are in the same boat and Also Nintendo marketed that game wrong but, still he comes from a popular series which is that developers flagship series and their most popular so to represent that developer would be best in making Ray a playable character and also Ray is from a fighting game that is all around customization it makes perfect sense to add him to the roster now because customization is now in SSB. Sukapon in my opinion is equal in popularity if not greater than Takamaru and definitely should be in because of reasons I previously stated.

We've only got one FE clone, that's not that bad.

Also you must be kidding, there are plenty of FE classes left that would be interesting, but none of them are logical to include on the sole basis of the class itself.


That's definitely a reason different than Isaac. I'm not even sure it's a reason as much as it's just describing the game.


I think the only factor there that actually effects inclusion is popularity, of which Ray had a whole lot more several years ago...

Don't get me wrong, they are both cool characters. They'd both be cool in Smash. But they're not exactly in the same position as Isaac.
The Laguez are the most logical last representative left and if you guys say ranulf then it should be ranulf.

If a Laguz were to be added, I'd say it should be Ranulf. He would only be a quasi-transformation character as well, considering how useless most Laguz are when in human form... Make his transformation a punishment instead of a boon. Every so often, if he's used all his energy or whatever, he's going to have to recharge... During that period he's human, has no recovery, all of his specials are "Attempt Transformation", he has no Smash Attacks or Grabs, and all of his basic attacks are easily dodged claw swipes. The longer he's human, the longer his cat transformation can last.

No... not even close.

 

[theenlightenedone]

If a Laguz were to be added, I'd say it should be Ranulf. He would only be a quasi-transformation character as well, considering how useless most Laguz are when in human form... Make his transformation a punishment instead of a boon. Every so often, if he's used all his energy or whatever, he's going to have to recharge... During that period he's human, has no recovery, all of his specials are "Attempt Transformation", he has no Smash Attacks or Grabs, and all of his basic attacks are easily dodged claw swipes. The longer he's human, the longer his cat transformation can last.

Remember transformations are no longer in the game and so two characters will need to be created.

 

[Dizzy_Fool]

The Laguez are the most logical last representative left and if you guys say ranulf then it should be ranulf.

You seem to have missed where Kriven said if a Laguz was to be added. Not that one should be added.

Also saying a class is the most logical representation is like saying a certain Pokemon type is the most logical representation. Smash doesn't work like that. We don't get types because they're that type, we don't get classes because they're that class, we get characters who happen to be from a certain type or class.