Can we talk about Sonic's decent kill setup at 85-90%?

[MERPIS]

It's a side-b into Uair, then following the opponent using a spring, then killing with a Nair or a Uair. It shows the sparks up top and it works on everyone at 60-100 depending on weight, fall speed, and stage. The only one I couldn't get this to work on is Jigglypuff, but it is irrelevent anyways. So why does no top Sonics use this? Is it killed by DI or something?

 

[Camalange]

DI and airdodge pretty much invalidates it.

I think at specific percents or with certain amount of rage it can true combo but it's very rarely something you can rely on.

You should run the same simulation but have player 2 DI the first Uair, and if it still connects, have that person do the same thing but also trying to airdodge.

I get it here, but John claimed his airdodge came out. I'm not entirely sure if it was true or not, but definitely was a tighter window.

 

[MERPIS]

DI and airdodge pretty much invalidates it.

I think at specific percents or with certain amount of rage it can true combo but it's very rarely something you can rely on.

You should run the same simulation but have player 2 DI the first Uair, and if it still connects, have that person do the same thing but also trying to airdodge.

I get it here, but John claimed his airdodge came out. I'm not entirely sure if it was true or not, but definitely was a tighter window.

It works on level 9's, and they have that jank-ass frame 1 air dodge thing. If they DI then follow their DI with spring and Uair should catch them with the very few pixels that it's horizontal hitbox has.

 

[SageLynch]

It is true combo when with specific % you land on a platform fastfalling , you cancel your up air lag and immedialty up-b+up air (reading the DI of course). This set up dosent kill anybody at any % if not on a platform or with an air dodge/DI read ; Up-b +up air is true combo at 40-50% on medium size char. but it dosent kill if not on the top platform of stages like battlefield or dream land.

 

[jaimex2]

DI and airdodge pretty much invalidates it.

This + it puts you in danger of getting killed early with some characters. It's not worth the 50/50 risk unless you are one up.

As for 85% - 90% kill setups, there are non you can fish for with Sonic that wont be obvious. Pretty much everything we have is on reaction to a mistake.

Stale nair to bair on a ledge get up /jump is the closest I can think of.

 

[MarKO X]

I've been dabbling with Dtilt > jab lock > Fsmash.

So at certain percent ranges, which varies between different weights and gravities and stuff, Sonic can hit a dtilt and they'll land on the ground on their back. You can run up, screech stop, hit a jab (or two? I only go for one) to lock them, then charge up an fsmash for the stock.

Of course, they can tech the landing on their back and invalidate this completely. They can probably also double jump, making the actual percent range where this can potentially work even tighter than I would think. I don't go to tourneys, so I've only ever done this online.

But maybe it's something?

 

[Camalange]

I've been dabbling with Dtilt > jab lock > Fsmash.

So at certain percent ranges, which varies between different weights and gravities and stuff, Sonic can hit a dtilt and they'll land on the ground on their back. You can run up, screech stop, hit a jab (or two? I only go for one) to lock them, then charge up an fsmash for the stock.

Of course, they can tech the landing on their back and invalidate this completely. They can probably also double jump, making the actual percent range where this can potentially work even tighter than I would think. I don't go to tourneys, so I've only ever done this online.

But maybe it's something?

Yeah, it's a thing.

If they get the spinning animation it's untechable. DI + double jump can sometimes save them though I think? Dtilt sends pretty low so maybe not. You can also hard read a standard get-up tech or tech roll back with a running charged Usmash.

 

[da K.I.D.]

If you get the untechable you can just charge running upsmash.

Also the side b up air spring up air thing israge dependent and usually doesn't work.

But what DOES work is full jump up air to spring up air.
If you have a Rosalina at 85 percent next to you on the ground full jump and immediately up air. You'll scoop her off the ground and you'll rise so far that the spring up air will actually be a combo

 

[Camalange]

If you get the untechable you can just charge running upsmash.

Yes yes, that's what I meant.

Also the side b up air spring up air thing israge dependent and usually doesn't work.

^

But what DOES work is full jump up air to spring up air.
If you have a Rosalina at 85 percent next to you on the ground full jump and immediately up air. You'll scoop her off the ground and you'll rise so far that the spring up air will actually be a combo

Is this easier on characters like Rosa who are floatier?

 

[da K.I.D.]

I have a chart that im working on with this info on it.

Basically it working on anybody tall enough/in the air in the area, and in the right percents.
Rosa is easier to set it up because they love landing on people with nairs, and shes super tall otherwise anyway. it works on heron fd around 85-90

but ive done it to cloud too, though that is much harder to space and time properly. but on him it has to be like 120 or something with limit.

im still in the beginning phases of mastering it, and Ive only done it once in a match. full jump immediate up air is generally difficult because if you do it too fast, youll get jump canceled up smash or SH up air with tilt stick, and if you do it too slow the up air will just miss.