'Brave' New Character (datamined)

[Teeb147]

Just wait until Nintendo reveals that they are playing 4D chess by making everyone believe they are playing 4D chess.

Real talk, I feel that they could have just named the characters DLC01-DLC05 if they were just trying to prevent leaks from datamining. If name is dummy, stats could be dummy data as well. Whole situation is fun due to people trying to have their picks fit the stats rather than seeing which characters could fit the stats better but, situation can change one day to the other.

Because Piranha Plant only had one filler stat. There isn't anything that seems absurdly low or high about Brave or Joker's stats.

DQ is sales are decent at best in the West, and putting it over other JRPGs is definitely noteworthy, however it's worth taking into account that a JRPG character has already been added into Smash. You could argue Sora is a JRPG character, but I think it's fair to say he's more resembling of a Disney character than a JRPG one. You bring up good points about Joker being added and his sales, but I think the difference here is that DQXI is already out. Unless a new game is being released, I see no reason for Nintendo to promote the game. Persona 5 will inevitably come to the Switch and I think it was good on Nintendo to announce a character from a GOTY nominee with a staunch following.

I really don't have time to argue my points, so sorry if I take long to respond again (midterms week, I fell asleep), but I still don't think Erdrick would be a good choice. He's likely, but I think he'll turn out to be an unprofitable addition on our side of the country.

Don't forget that they are using codenames, likes jack, and it's not overly complicated, but still ambiguous without hindsight.
Also, don't forget that brave's landing data is entirely a copy-paste of joker's at the moment, which easily shows just how a lot more could be placeholder data.

Tetrin, both persona 5 and DQ11 are out, and coming to the switch too. It's silly to use the same excuse in a negative way for dq and positive for persona.
Everything you say is extremely silly, purely biased.
Persona doesn't do better in sales than dq, and is only recently rising more in the west. DQ can have a rise too. Just chill.

 

[Deleted member]

Because Piranha Plant only had one filler stat. There isn't anything that seems absurdly low or high about Brave or Joker's stats.

DQ is sales are decent at best in the West, and putting it over other JRPGs is definitely noteworthy, however it's worth taking into account that a JRPG character has already been added into Smash. You could argue Sora is a JRPG character, but I think it's fair to say he's more resembling of a Disney character than a JRPG one. You bring up good points about Joker being added and his sales, but I think the difference here is that DQXI is already out. Unless a new game is being released, I see no reason for Nintendo to promote the game. Persona 5 will inevitably come to the Switch and I think it was good on Nintendo to announce a character from a GOTY nominee with a staunch following.

I really don't have time to argue my points, so sorry if I take long to respond again (midterms week, I fell asleep), but I still don't think Erdrick would be a good choice. He's likely, but I think he'll turn out to be an unprofitable addition on our side of the country.

Issue with PP is that it was revealed when it looked being far into development, so a few stats being filler makes sense. If the other characters are in less advanced steps of development, there is the possibility of more of the stats being placeholders even if not being all over the place.

Regarding characters belonging from particular genres or looking like JRPG characters, I don't think it matters for Nintendo in the least. Sm4sh had 4 original DLC characters that were all humans, with one being from a tactical RPG (Corrin) and one from a JRPG (Cloud). Nintendo is going to go for characters they think they would sell, and what my previous argument made me realize is that pretty much Nintendo can get away with mostly everything as long as they push it correctly.

Regarding about no DQ game coming. DQXI S is a Switch port of XI and is coming this year (it is rumored to be a global release), it was formally announced last December. P5 is in a worse situation here, since we have to wait for the announcement of a Switch version of P5 as only the PS4 version of P5R was announced. I don't think Nintendo particularly cares about if certain games are coming to their console, as I personally see that Nintendo choosing the DLC for more reasons than simple marketing for upcoming games. DQ has story and close relation with Nintendo, importance to the genre, multi-generational entries, and the cultural impact in Japanese pop culture.

I could see Nintendo choosing a DQ rep if they think it can sell, same as if they go with Sora, Sephiroth, Crono, Agnes, 2B, or even Rayjack from that crappy NES Squaresoft game. You can think whatever you want regarding Erdrick being a good or bad choice, but I feel you're looking at patterns that most likely would get broken and like my main idea referring to Joker: a character being niche even in the context of Smash doesn't mean it wont sell, it all depends on how Nintendo handles it.

 

[Bobthealligator]

Okay just said this on the Sora thread but, Square have sent Zero a preview copy of Kingdom Hearts. Team Sora: 1 Team Erdrick:0

 

[Teeb147]

Okay just said this on the Sora thread but, Square have sent Zero a preview copy of Kingdom Hearts. Team Sora: 1 Team Erdrick:0

That's 9 month old news. Might be worth checking whatever's been said around it, but I think Zero is just a really big KH fan and happens to have a big number of followers.

Sora would definitely be a big hit. It wouldn't be a bad character for smash at all. Not my own preference for an SE character tho

 

[Deleted member]

Okay just said this on the Sora thread but, Square have sent Zero a preview copy of Kingdom Hearts. Team Sora: 1 Team Erdrick:0

He stated he's a KH fan and is a frequent and popular Twitch streamer. Of course he would get an early copy. We're not keeping score here, mate.

 

[MyDude213]

He stated he's a KH fan and is a frequent and popular Twitch streamer. Of course he would get an early copy. We're not keeping score here, mate.

Normally I would agree with that and to some degree still do cause it is grasping at straws not denying that. But there's also the fact that Zero was also the only Smashtuber who got invited to the KH3 invitational for the first official demo of the game last year. So clearly he's at least seen as more special in terms of Smashtubers by Square in that regard. Again I personally do still agree it's probably nothing but it's not impossible for it to actually mean something.

 

[Luigifan18]

Just wait until Nintendo reveals that they are playing 4D chess by making everyone believe they are playing 4D chess.

Real talk, I feel that they could have just named the characters DLC01-DLC05 if they were just trying to prevent leaks from datamining. If name is dummy, stats could be dummy data as well. Whole situation is fun due to people trying to have their picks fit the stats rather than seeing which characters could fit the stats better but, situation can change one day to the other.

The benefit of the irony approach is that it invites dataminers and leakers to try to figure out who the DLC character is, and when their guesses turn out to be nowhere even remotely close to being correct, their credibility is completely and utterly destroyed. This, in turn, will cause the community to brush off future leaks and datamines as inaccurate hogwash, protecting company secrets by making sure that any that do get leaked out are dismissed as fake news.

 

[Teeb147]

The benefit of the irony approach is that it invites dataminers and leakers to try to figure out who the DLC character is, and when their guesses turn out to be nowhere even remotely close to being correct, their credibility is completely and utterly destroyed. This, in turn, will cause the community to brush off future leaks and datamines as inaccurate hogwash, protecting company secrets by making sure that any that do get leaked out are dismissed as fake news.

Yeah nintendo doesn't think that far at all.
Not just with data but pr stufff too, I think they should've done something with the grinch leak, to help people not set their expectations so high, and instead they just completely ignored it. I dont think they delve into it much at all.

 

[Deleted member]

Normally I would agree with that and to some degree still do cause it is grasping at straws not denying that. But there's also the fact that Zero was also the only Smashtuber who got invited to the KH3 invitational for the first official demo of the game last year. So clearly he's at least seen as more special in terms of Smashtubers by Square in that regard. Again I personally do still agree it's probably nothing but it's not impossible for it to actually mean something.

Right. It's not impossible, but let's consider Zero's status of Smash 4's best player and of course he'll be a celebratory. He even mentioned publicly in an official Nintendo tournament he'd like Sora after taking first.

It's tricky. I can't say how much it means yet.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Because Piranha Plant only had one filler stat. There isn't anything that seems absurdly low or high about Brave or Joker's stats.

DQ is sales are decent at best in the West, and putting it over other JRPGs is definitely noteworthy, however it's worth taking into account that a JRPG character has already been added into Smash. You could argue Sora is a JRPG character, but I think it's fair to say he's more resembling of a Disney character than a JRPG one. You bring up good points about Joker being added and his sales, but I think the difference here is that DQXI is already out. Unless a new game is being released, I see no reason for Nintendo to promote the game. Persona 5 will inevitably come to the Switch and I think it was good on Nintendo to announce a character from a GOTY nominee with a staunch following.

I really don't have time to argue my points, so sorry if I take long to respond again (midterms week, I fell asleep), but I still don't think Erdrick would be a good choice. He's likely, but I think he'll turn out to be an unprofitable addition on our side of the country.

Just saying, if Sora being a JRPG character doesn’t matter because he looks more like a Disney character then Erdrick also looks more like a DBZ character.

Okay just said this on the Sora thread but, Square have sent Zero a preview copy of Kingdom Hearts. Team Sora: 1 Team Erdrick:0

Errr, who is Zero and why does that matter?

 

[Teeb147]

Normally I would agree with that and to some degree still do cause it is grasping at straws not denying that. But there's also the fact that Zero was also the only Smashtuber who got invited to the KH3 invitational for the first official demo of the game last year. So clearly he's at least seen as more special in terms of Smashtubers by Square in that regard. Again I personally do still agree it's probably nothing but it's not impossible for it to actually mean something.

Right. It's not impossible, but let's consider Zero's status of Smash 4's best player and of course he'll be a celebratory. He even mentioned publicly in an official Nintendo tournament he'd like Sora after taking first.

It's tricky. I can't say how much it means yet.

I havent looked into it, but I figured he must've asked or presented something to have the chance for it. That or other smashtubers weren't really vocal about KH enough, if at all.

 

[Deleted member]

I havent looked into it, but I figured he must've asked or presented something to have the chance for it. That or other smashtubers weren't really vocal about KH enough, if at all.

Ehhh Alpharad is bigger than Zero and he's been fairly vocal about Sora. Granted, he never won a Nintendo official tournament to really make an onstage announcement. I'm wary on what this means. Checking Zero's twitter, it sounds like he's been keeping this secret so something backstage was going on.

 

[Teeb147]

Ehhh Alpharad is bigger than Zero and he's been fairly vocal about Sora. Granted, he never won a Nintendo official tournament to really make an onstage announcement. I'm wary on what this means. Checking Zero's twitter, it sounds like he's been keeping this secret so something backstage was going on.

People knew about it 9 months ago. Unless you mean the details, like if he talked to an SE rep or something.

Edit: You know what, I think I messed up in thinking it was guaranteed he'd get a review copy, my bad. He was chosen to play the game early last year, but it didn't have to do with getting a review copy.

But anyway, I think his excavation last year explains the review copy..

 

[SmashChu]

For height, besides the data being early, it depends what they're going for, including for sora. He can look tall with his more grown up look.
It really depends how they scale them, and also maybe they'd have a reason to go with a certain style.
Dragon quest characters can be all sorts of size.

Spoiler

Here's some art that could give another idea. This could be around sora's height:

Edit: The site isn't letting me fix the images. Just click reply and you should be able to see them in the reply box.

With height, the issue is they can be taller than Ness and Lucas but must be shorter than Mario. It makes me less confident of it being a DQ character or Sora since both would likely be at least Mario's height.

 

[Swaggy-G]

Are people still thinking that this is Edrick or Sora? I'm sorry, but after the treatment that Final ****ing Fantasy got I just can't see us getting another Square Enix character.

With height, the issue is they can be taller than Ness and Lucas but must be shorter than Mario. It makes me less confident of it being a DQ character or Sora since both would likely be at least Mario's height.

Height is size a modifier for the model. It doesn't mean anything without it.


EDIT: Okay I read the last few pages and I've seen pretty much everyone speculating based on the height so here's a PSA.

HEIGHT DOESN'T MEAN JACK. STOP SPECULATING USING IT. SEE https://twitter.com/_Mizumi/status/1084557161810874369

 

[Teeb147]

Are people still thinking that this is Edrick or Sora? I'm sorry, but after the treatment that Final ****ing Fantasy got I just can't see us getting another Square Enix character.

Height is size a modifier for the model. It doesn't mean anything without it.


EDIT: Okay I read the last few pages and I've seen pretty much everyone speculating based on the height so here's a PSA.

HEIGHT DOESN'T MEAN JACK. STOP SPECULATING USING IT. SEE https://twitter.com/_Mizumi/status/1084557161810874369

Yes but mizumi's post is also old news because regardless of what the height value 'does', it's still information that tells us something.
In example, ness or lucas is 13 too, mario is taller and his stat is 14 i think, while the tall heavies have a stat of around 24, etc.

It's not info to rely on, but it's still possibly telling.

 

[SmashChu]

Are people still thinking that this is Edrick or Sora? I'm sorry, but after the treatment that Final ****ing Fantasy got I just can't see us getting another Square Enix character.

Height is size a modifier for the model. It doesn't mean anything without it.


EDIT: Okay I read the last few pages and I've seen pretty much everyone speculating based on the height so here's a PSA.

HEIGHT DOESN'T MEAN JACK. STOP SPECULATING USING IT. SEE https://twitter.com/_Mizumi/status/1084557161810874369

He was wrong. Height values do matter. A character with a lower higher value can not be taller than a character with a higher one. From what we know, it's a range. This means if Brave is 13 and Mario is 14, Brave can not be taller than Mario but could be taller than another 13. This is why I'm less confident in the DQ guy because he'd be pretty short, even for a chibi character. See attached for an infograph

 

[PhantomShab]

Errr, who is Zero and why does that matter?

The guy who beat HungryBox at the Smash 4 invitational by stalling the clock out.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Y'all still sleeping on the obvious.

Spoiler

 

[Teeb147]

He was wrong. Height values do matter. A character with a lower higher value can not be taller than a character with a higher one. From what we know, it's a range. This means if Brave is 12 and Mario is 13, Brave can not be taller than Mario but could be taller than another 12. This is why I'm less confident in the DQ guy because he'd be pretty short, even for a chibi character. See attached for an infograph

Thanks for bringing that up. I will say though that while it's mostly true, there are a few other anomalies that aren't explained like that too but i dont remember what they were. I feel like panda or someone should've just shared the values of everyone. It'd help to have an easily accessible list of all of them. But we at least know that it roughly does reflect the heights.

I think it's also hard to say how much it matters because we dont know how much work they've done on the model. 13 is pretty much in the middle of the values so it could be a default.

Of course, I'm not discounting that it could be a small charaacter, the stat points to that for now.

 

[perfectchaos83]

Not the one used in Dragon Quest.
Yeah! They use YUUSHA as HERO.
Why translate it rong in the files?

It's not wrong. Yuusha literally translates to Brave and is often localized as Hero. This is an absolute fact. If you want a clear example, The Hero class in Fire Emblem is called "Yuusha" in Japan and all the Brave weapons are literally "Yuusha no X" in Japan. In this instance, the Brave weapons have more literal translations than the class name does. Japanese is a context heavy language and that's why Yuusha is typically translated as "Hero" because in English "Brave" often times doesn't make sense in context.

He was wrong. Height values do matter. A character with a lower higher value can not be taller than a character with a higher one. From what we know, it's a range. This means if Brave is 13 and Mario is 14, Brave can not be taller than Mario but could be taller than another 13. This is why I'm less confident in the DQ guy because he'd be pretty short, even for a chibi character. See attached for an infograph

Without a model and Idle stance, the height literally means nothing. Ridley and Samus have the exact same height of 18, but Ridley's model is much taller than her because his idle stance is hunched over. Of course, the height value only matters if it's final, which it's possible it isn't.

 

[Teeb147]

It's not wrong. Yuusha literally translates to Brave and is often localized as Hero. This is an absolute fact. If you want a clear example, The Hero class in Fire Emblem is called "Yuusha" in Japan and all the Brave weapons are literally "Yuusha no X" in Japan. In this instance, the Brave weapons have more literal translations than the class name does. Japanese is a context heavy language and that's why Yuusha is typically translated as "Hero" because in English "Brave" often times doesn't make sense in context.



Without a model and Idle stance, the height literally means nothing. Ridley and Samus have the exact same height of 18, but Ridley's model is much taller than her because his idle stance is hunched over. Of course, the height value only matters if it's final, which it's possible it isn't.

Well the height does mean something. We just dont know fully if it does because we dont know how far they've developped with it or the model.
And as for the hunching over, that's why some people think sora could work, from a hunched battle stance

 

[Graizen]

It's not wrong. Yuusha literally translates to Brave and is often localized as Hero. This is an absolute fact. If you want a clear example, The Hero class in Fire Emblem is called "Yuusha" in Japan and all the Brave weapons are literally "Yuusha no X" in Japan. In this instance, the Brave weapons have more literal translations than the class name does. Japanese is a context heavy language and that's why Yuusha is typically translated as "Hero" because in English "Brave" often times doesn't make sense in context.



Without a model and Idle stance, the height literally means nothing. Ridley and Samus have the exact same height of 18, but Ridley's model is much taller than her because his idle stance is hunched over. Of course, the height value only matters if it's final, which it's possible it isn't.

Rong.
Yuusha literally translates to HERO and is often localized as "A brave guy".
And in Dragon Quest it's literaly used as HERO.

 

[GoodGrief741]

The guy who beat HungryBox at the Smash 4 invitational by stalling the clock out.

So a Smash player got an early copy of KHIII. That’s it?

Seems kinda stupid to assume ‘Sora in’ if so, and I’m a Sora fan.

Rong.
Yuusha literally translates to HERO and is often localized as "A brave guy".
And in Dragon Quest it's literaly used as HERO.

You know it was Dragon Quest that invented the whole Yuusha=Hero right?

How would you know, you can’t even spell wrong.

 

[perfectchaos83]

Rong.
Yuusha literally translates to HERO and is often localized as "A brave guy".
And in Dragon Quest it's literaly used as HERO.

https://smashboards.com/threads/spo...support-threads.464600/page-153#post-22891037

I'll listen to a person who shows actual knowledge of the japanese language over a guy who can't spell wrong right.

 

[fogbadge]

and its devolving into a slagging match

 

[Fell God]

Need...Piranha...Plant...need...Piranha...Plant...

Oh and by the way are we still under the impression that Brave is a DQ (sadly not Dairy Queen) character or has public opinion shifted? I still don't know what to think other than that I need some angry lettuce to play as...

 

[KingofUSA85]

It's almost certainly Agnes from BRAVEly default. It makes the most sense. You can argue the English to Japanese translations all you want but Brave was the actual word used not "Yuusha."

 

[Deleted member]

Need...Piranha...Plant...need...Piranha...Plant...

Oh and by the way are we still under the impression that Brave is a DQ (sadly not Dairy Queen) character or has public opinion shifted? I still don't know what to think other than that I need some angry lettuce to play as...

Its hard to say, current stats would be weird for Erdrick unless child-like form. Unless they change quite a bit next patch I feel its possible its not Erdrick and may be any other character altogether.

 

[MyDude213]

I havent looked into it, but I figured he must've asked or presented something to have the chance for it. That or other smashtubers weren't really vocal about KH enough, if at all.

According to him he didn't even know why he got the invite he just got it. My guess though is probably because of that interview when he was asked if there was one character he'd like to see who would it be and he said Sora.

 

[MyDude213]

With height, the issue is they can be taller than Ness and Lucas but must be shorter than Mario. It makes me less confident of it being a DQ character or Sora since both would likely be at least Mario's height.

Normally I'd agree with that sentiment except for the fact that stance of the character is also a factor in size for model heights in Smash. Take Ridley as proof of that his model appears smaller than he actually is because he's constantly slouching almost crouching. Erdrick seems to stand pretty straight at least going off his own game granted he's an 8bit character so hard to tell with him. As for Sora his fighting stance is a low the ground squat so even if he's canonically taller then some characters going off his own series. In Smash his model height would appear smaller than it actually is compared to when he's actually standing fully straight up.

 

[Jboy1010]

According to him he didn't even know why he got the invite he just got it. My guess though is probably because of that interview when he was asked if there was one character he'd like to see who would it be and he said Sora.

When did he say this? Is there a link? Because some people are saying that he was chosen due to streaming the KH collection

 

[Teeb147]

One thing I have trouble reconciling is general with the stats is a character that's short like Ness, but is heavy.
No way they're making Sora as heavy as (well heavier than) Cloud.

Megaman is heavy too but he's a robot. So what kind of character is this?

 

[ccllr]

I want this ride to end

 

[shocktarts17]

So what kind of character is this?

probably a slimy one

Spoiler

/s

 

[SmashChu]

Normally I'd agree with that sentiment except for the fact that stance of the character is also a factor in size for model heights in Smash. Take Ridley as proof of that his model appears smaller than he actually is because he's constantly slouching almost crouching. Erdrick seems to stand pretty straight at least going off his own game granted he's an 8bit character so hard to tell with him. As for Sora his fighting stance is a low the ground squat so even if he's canonically taller then some characters going off his own series. In Smash his model height would appear smaller than it actually is compared to when he's actually standing fully straight up.

Ridley is the exception, not the rule. Ridley is more hunched but his features stop at 18 units. I don't think Sora would be Ness's height crouched. I don't see it being Sora. Fall speed is probably too high for that as well as Sora would have below average fall speed. Brave's is average I believe.

 

[Deleted member]

I want this ride to end

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Brave could very well be Agumon

Didn't you make a congratulatory picture assuming Erdrick was "Brave" alongside ost rumour characters? Changing your stance?

 

[Deleted member]

It's almost certainly Agnes from BRAVEly default. It makes the most sense. You can argue the English to Japanese translations all you want but Brave was the actual word used not "Yuusha."

No, it's BRAViary. Get it right.

-It literally has "brave" in the name.

-It can learn the move BRAVE Bird.

-PokeDex entries talk about how BRAVE it is:
"The more scars they have, the more respect these brave soldiers of the sky get from their peers."
"For the sake of its friends, this brave warrior of the sky will not stop battling, even if injured."
"With its brave disposition, it fears nothing—not even death. Ancient Alolan people respected it, referring to it as "the hero of the sky." "
"Known as “the hero of the skies,” this Pokémon is so proud and so brave that it will never retreat, even when it's injured."

-One of the available Pokémon Natures is BRAVE.


No one can say it's NOT Braviary. It's too damn obvious!

EDIT: I should point out to everyone that I bring up Braviary all the time as satire in response to all the half-baked reasons why their character is "Brave".

 

[Graizen]

Didn't you make a congratulatory picture assuming Erdrick was "Brave" alongside ost rumour characters? Changing your stance?

No , i realy think Erdrick is the one.

But if not him , i think it will be Agumon.